Fallout: New Vegas Revealed

MCV has word that Bethesda Softworks has unveiled Fallout: New Vegas, a new RPG set in the Fallout universe being developed by Obsidian (Star Wars: Knights of the Old Republic 2, Never Winter Nights 2, Alpha Protocol). Details are scant for now: Word is the game will use the Fallout 3 engine, but will not be a Fallout 3 sequel, and will be released for PC and consoles next year.
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53 Replies. 3 pages. Viewing page 1.
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53.
 
Re: Fallout: New Vegas
Apr 22, 2009, 10:27
53.
Re: Fallout: New Vegas Apr 22, 2009, 10:27
Apr 22, 2009, 10:27
 
I'm a huge fan of the old Troika and Blackisle games, I don't really see the problem here. Obsidian has a fair number of those developers and they have a decent engine that can do open world games. It's been around for awhile and is slightly aging but still more than capable. It's had tons of patching and Q/A, the community is fairly familiar with it. This is pretty much a dream come true for many gamers who thought we'd never get a game from these guys.

So what exactly are you guys arguing about? This is just win through and through.
52.
 
Re: Fallout: New Vegas
Apr 22, 2009, 01:39
52.
Re: Fallout: New Vegas Apr 22, 2009, 01:39
Apr 22, 2009, 01:39
 
Sounds more like nostalgia goggles to me.

That's a good theory except I played FO1, FO2, Planescape: Torment and Arcanum for the first time all within the last year. I don't think nostalgia really applies in this case. Simply put, those RPGs are better than any RPGs that have come since. Better writing, better choice and consequence, better character development options, etc. The only advantage new games have over the old ones is in presentation.

They can and do support their games, do I need to link patch histories here?

Sure, why not? Please link the Bethesda patch that fixes the game-breaking bug in Oblivion where animations start slowing down and stopping if you've played the game for 200+ hours. Please find me the Bethesda patch that fixes the 1000+ bugs fixed by the community patch. Please find me the Bethesda patch that fixes the 250+ Shivering Isles bugs fixed by the community patch. How about a FO3 patch to fix the VATS pausing issues and broken accuracy perks introduced by the official 1.1.035 patch?

You also cannot foresee every potential problem or bug.

I agree. However, the more QA you have, the more likely you are to find rare issues. Also, once the community finds a game-breaker or broken quest, there's no excuse not to fix it. But Bethesda doesn't. That's why the community patches exist.

Really the bottom line is you just want to bitch.

No, the bottom line is that Bethesda's games are not polished because they have broken quests, game-breaking bugs and various stability issues. In addition, Bethesda does not have good support because it does not fix the broken quests, game-breaking bugs and various stability issues that players encounter.
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51.
 
Re: Fallout: New Vegas
Apr 22, 2009, 00:16
51.
Re: Fallout: New Vegas Apr 22, 2009, 00:16
Apr 22, 2009, 00:16
 
The key difference between the buggy games of the past and the buggy games of the present is that the buggy games of the past were simply better games, making it easier to overlook the general lack of polish.

That's your opinion maybe. Sounds more like nostalgia goggles to me. Great memories of old games do not make them any better or worse than current games.

It's also easier to forgive when you consider that these games had much smaller dev teams, dev cycles and budgets. Bethesda has more money and resources than Black Isle or Troika ever did. They can afford more/better QA and they can afford to support their games.

They can and do support their games, do I need to link patch histories here? Your comparisons are ridiculous by the way given the technical complexity in making games today versus back then. You can't simply hire infinite bodies to solve a problem, there are some things money can't buy. You also cannot foresee every potential problem or bug. You acknowledge this but go on to fault them anyways. Really the bottom line is you just want to bitch.
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50.
 
Re: Fallout: New Vegas
Apr 21, 2009, 22:58
50.
Re: Fallout: New Vegas Apr 21, 2009, 22:58
Apr 21, 2009, 22:58
 
I often see you defending older products which had similar problems and lamenting how newer generations don't measure up while you simultaneously hammer newer titles for having some of the same problems.

I have no idea what you're talking about. I've never said the classics aren't buggy. Pretty much every Black Isle and Troika game was a buggy mess. StingingVelvet claimed that Bethesda's games are very polished and I disagreed because their games have a history of broken quests, instability and numerous other bugs.

The key difference between the buggy games of the past and the buggy games of the present is that the buggy games of the past were simply better games, making it easier to overlook the general lack of polish. It's also easier to forgive when you consider that these games had much smaller dev teams, dev cycles and budgets. Bethesda has more money and resources than Black Isle or Troika ever did. They can afford more/better QA and they can afford to support their games.

This comment was edited on Apr 21, 2009, 23:00.
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49.
 
Re: Fallout: New Vegas
Apr 21, 2009, 17:55
49.
Re: Fallout: New Vegas Apr 21, 2009, 17:55
Apr 21, 2009, 17:55
 
I won't say to forgive the bugs but I'd challenge you to show me another sandbox game on the scale of Fallout or Oblivion that does it with less. When you ask for complexity in games, you get scripting to help accomodate the various resolutions in gameplay situations. Sometimes that scripting breaks due to unforeseen problems, players are very clever and figure out ways to do things that you might never have dreamed of.

If I wanted every game on the PC to be entirely bug free then I wouldn't be doing much gaming. I think your demands are a bit unrealistic Jerykk. For instance I can think of several situations to break Deus Ex which was still an outstanding product and experience despite having many bugs relating to unforeseen script events. I often see you defending older products which had similar problems and lamenting how newer generations don't measure up while you simultaneously hammer newer titles for having some of the same problems.

tl;dr: Basically I think you're just being choosy and picking on titles you didn't enjoy while excusing others you did.

This comment was edited on Apr 21, 2009, 17:57.
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48.
 
Re: Fallout: New Vegas
Apr 21, 2009, 15:10
48.
Re: Fallout: New Vegas Apr 21, 2009, 15:10
Apr 21, 2009, 15:10
 
For the kind of game Bethesda makes, they are the most polished in the business.

I don't really change my definition of "polished" based on the genre of game. If a game has broken quests, crashes and crappy pathfinding, I don't consider that polished. It might be more polished than other RPGs but that isn't saying much.

Bethesda is also pretty good about patching their titles.

Disagreed. The issues I mentioned in my previous post were never fixed by Bethesda. They were fixed by the community. The community was the one to first fix the FormID game-breaker in Oblivion and the animation-stopping game-breaker too. Bethesda never fixed the latter.

This comment was edited on Apr 21, 2009, 15:12.
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47.
 
Re: Fallout: New Vegas
Apr 21, 2009, 13:20
47.
Re: Fallout: New Vegas Apr 21, 2009, 13:20
Apr 21, 2009, 13:20
 
Given the scope of their games I think Bethesda does a good job polishing their releases. If they were making little adventure games or something then I wouldn't be so forgiving but in something so big it's pretty hard to rigorously test everything.

Exactly. Most of the complaints from Jerykk are pretty minor in a game this huge and open. The original Fallout games had a TON more bugs, as do almost all releases of this size. For the kind of game Bethesda makes, they are the most polished in the business.
Avatar 54622
46.
 
Re: Fallout: New Vegas
Apr 21, 2009, 12:50
46.
Re: Fallout: New Vegas Apr 21, 2009, 12:50
Apr 21, 2009, 12:50
 
Given the scope of their games I think Bethesda does a good job polishing their releases. If they were making little adventure games or something then I wouldn't be so forgiving but in something so big it's pretty hard to rigorously test everything.

Bethesda is also pretty good about patching their titles. There are other developers far more worthy of the PC community's scorn.
45.
 
Re: Fallout: New Vegas Revealed
Apr 21, 2009, 10:12
nin
 
45.
Re: Fallout: New Vegas Revealed Apr 21, 2009, 10:12
Apr 21, 2009, 10:12
 nin
 
Bethesda knows how to make a polished PC release at this point.

AH-hahahahaha! Good one!

This comment was edited on Apr 21, 2009, 10:12.
44.
 
Re: Fallout: New Vegas Revealed
Apr 21, 2009, 04:07
44.
Re: Fallout: New Vegas Revealed Apr 21, 2009, 04:07
Apr 21, 2009, 04:07
 
I often wonder whether Bethesda actually takes any feedback from their testers.

Only positive ones.
43.
 
Re: Fallout: New Vegas Revealed
Apr 21, 2009, 02:28
43.
Re: Fallout: New Vegas Revealed Apr 21, 2009, 02:28
Apr 21, 2009, 02:28
 
Bethesda knows how to make a polished PC release at this point.

I wouldn't say that. Bethesda hasn't really made anything polished. In Morrowind, you'd often fall through the floor. Oblivion and Shivering Isles had numerous quest-breaking and even game-breaking bugs. For example, in SI, there's an NPC who goes around stealing forks. Unfortunately, he sucks at it so when he inevitably gets caught, he'll get beaten to death and you'll never get the quest from him. Another quest required me to trap a bunch of creatures so an NPC could examine them. Unfortunately, the NPC decided to stay in her house and never leave.

In FO3, I think I may have broken a quest that involves keys because an action I performed earlier resulted in a quest-essential NPC dying and his body disappeared before I could loot it. I managed to break another quest that involved voting. I've also encountered numerous freezes when indoors. Aside from that, the pathfinding in the game is truly awful. Dogmeat will often pull a 180 and run a mile in the opposite direction for no apparent reason.

And if you include balance under polish, Bethesda is a complete failure. They can't balance their games worth crap. FO3 has so many poor balance choices, it boggles the mind. Stims, drugs and ammo can be found about every 10 feet and have no weight so you carry thousands of each. Sleeping for an hour instantly heals all wounds, including injured limbs, rendering the Medicine skill and Doctors completely worthless. Radiation doesn't do any damage unless it is extremely high. Your attributes aren't very important. Most skills aren't important except for the ones with arbitrary usage limits like science and repair. Perks are mostly worthless. VATS basically makes you invincible. Food is completely and utterly useless. Repairs can only be done with the same weapons and items, rendering all the junk you find useless.

I often wonder whether Bethesda actually takes any feedback from their testers. It's pretty much impossible that none of them would complain about how crappy the balancing is.

This comment was edited on Apr 21, 2009, 02:36.
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42.
 
Re: Fallout: New Vegas Revealed
Apr 20, 2009, 23:31
42.
Re: Fallout: New Vegas Revealed Apr 20, 2009, 23:31
Apr 20, 2009, 23:31
 
There is always some random idiot who thinks because the game works perfectly for him that it works fine for the majority. The game crashes constantly. Who are you fooling?

There's always some idiot who thinks forums are an accurate representation of the user base, when it actuality most people only go to forums to complain.

I would bet less than 10% of users have actual serious bugs with Fallout 3. Bethesda knows how to make a polished PC release at this point.
Avatar 54622
41.
 
Re: Fallout: New Vegas Revealed
Apr 20, 2009, 22:31
41.
Re: Fallout: New Vegas Revealed Apr 20, 2009, 22:31
Apr 20, 2009, 22:31
 
LoL, thanks for the laughs guys. I've been slaving in the yard most of the day and just got the J.E. Sawyer post then read this one after it.

I'm very happy to hear this. I agree most of Obsidian's games have not been great but still better than the last three Bethesda games. I'm hoping they nail it. And would like to thank Bethesda for farming out games.

I have a better idea why not buy some small studios that can actually make great games and write good stories and then use Bethesda to polish and help them along in development?

I lmao at CJ... but then he has always been an extremist. I stopped playing F3 on the PC because of the sporadic crashes and corrupt saved games. I never went back since the exploration was the only thing keeping me half-ass focused on playing it.
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40.
 
Re: Fallout: New Vegas Revealed
Apr 20, 2009, 22:09
40.
Re: Fallout: New Vegas Revealed Apr 20, 2009, 22:09
Apr 20, 2009, 22:09
 
Yeah. But 99.684% of those "bugs" were just spelling mistakes and very minor cosmetic issues. There are dozens upon dozens of fan-made patches that sport a similarly incredible number of "bug" fixes. That's because of the spelling and the cosmetic stuff. Fans are like that. They like to fix every little thing. It doesn't surprise me all that much though that a simpleton like you is easily blinded by the BIG numbers. "OMG 1000!!!!!!1111 buuuuuugggggzzzzzzzz!!!!11"

Whoa, didn't mean to offend you. But I guess I should have known seeing how Bethesda's dick is in both your ass and your mouth. Now we know why Bethesda doesn't even bother fixing their crap: "If it's good enough for CJ Parker, it's good enough for he rest of the mindless drones out there."
39.
 
Re: Fallout: New Vegas Revealed
Apr 20, 2009, 21:39
39.
Re: Fallout: New Vegas Revealed Apr 20, 2009, 21:39
Apr 20, 2009, 21:39
 
There's always Random Dude #39842 who has a problem with ANY PC game, but Fallout 3 is pretty stable and smooth for the vast majority of people.

There is always some random idiot who thinks because the game works perfectly for him that it works fine for the majority. The game crashes constantly. Who are you fooling?
38.
 
Re: Fallout: New Vegas Revealed
Apr 20, 2009, 20:34
38.
Re: Fallout: New Vegas Revealed Apr 20, 2009, 20:34
Apr 20, 2009, 20:34
 
I just hope development has been going on for sometime now, and that Obsidian doesn't only have a year to get this done: they simply are not good at scheduling and working within short development cycles. Anyway, I really dislike Beth's approach to Fallout 3, but if Obsidian's take is more in line with the originals gameplay-wise then I'm willing to forgive a lot.

Holiday 2010 would be a year and a half from now, so even if they have only been in development for 6 months that's two years of dev time with an already completed engine and game to build off of.
Avatar 54622
37.
 
Re: Fallout: New Vegas Revealed
Apr 20, 2009, 20:14
37.
Re: Fallout: New Vegas Revealed Apr 20, 2009, 20:14
Apr 20, 2009, 20:14
 
Hmm, interesting, very interesting. Obsidian's only great game so far has been Mask of the Betrayer -- the others have been merely flawed but good. Nevertheless I vastly prefer their old-school style cRPGs to what Bethesda does. I guess there are 4 devs who worked on the originals working at Obsidian today, so that's a little bit of encouragement I guess. I just hope development has been going on for sometime now, and that Obsidian doesn't only have a year to get this done: they simply are not good at scheduling and working within short development cycles. Anyway, I really dislike Beth's approach to Fallout 3, but if Obsidian's take is more in line with the originals gameplay-wise then I'm willing to forgive a lot.

Chris Jones (1&2)
Feargus Urquhart (2, credited for first game as a division director)
Chris Avellone (2)
Scott Everts (1&2)
36.
 
Re: Fallout: New Vegas Revealed
Apr 20, 2009, 19:32
36.
Re: Fallout: New Vegas Revealed Apr 20, 2009, 19:32
Apr 20, 2009, 19:32
 
It might be worth dealing with bugs if we get a less sterile game than Fallout 3.

Funny, I thought post apocalyptic wastelands were supposed to be "sterile".

Most of the humans are... ; )
35.
 
Re: Fallout: New Vegas Revealed
Apr 20, 2009, 19:12
35.
Re: Fallout: New Vegas Revealed Apr 20, 2009, 19:12
Apr 20, 2009, 19:12
 
fallout 3 did have bugs. i've read of people who haven't been able to even play the game 6 months after release. i personally have had to abandon 2 games with ~75 hours of gameplay in them because of bugs. the first game was ~15 hours long and gfwl fucked something up. the second game was ~60 hours long and the 1.4 patch (which was supposed to do almost nothing) managed to change my stable, unmodded, working game into crash-to-desktop-within-2-minutes of entering the game world. saves wouldn't work, new games wouldn't work, nothing would last more than a couple of minutes. and since it was a steam purchase, i can't even go back to 1.3 and play my game unless i torrent it.

so to the dumbass who stated that it was a fact that the game was nearly flawless, you wanna tell me the story of the main quest? i'm still at the part where the guy in megaton wants you to go to the galaxy radio station.

There's always Random Dude #39842 who has a problem with ANY PC game, but Fallout 3 is pretty stable and smooth for the vast majority of people. I have played it since lauch day through every patch, every DLC and ever nvidia driver and never had any problems what-so-ever.
Avatar 54622
34.
 
Re: Fallout: New Vegas Revealed
Apr 20, 2009, 17:01
Bet
 
34.
Re: Fallout: New Vegas Revealed Apr 20, 2009, 17:01
Apr 20, 2009, 17:01
 Bet
 
If Chris Avellone is doing the writing, I'm automatically preordering this.


Edit: The Fallout 3 design docs were some of the most fun things I've ever read. Makes up for not playing the Van Buren vision of Fallout 3. Sorta.

This comment was edited on Apr 20, 2009, 17:03.
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