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1.
 
Bungie
Sep 27, 2008, 14:57
1.
Bungie Sep 27, 2008, 14:57
Sep 27, 2008, 14:57
 
Yeah, Ford should be able to pocket money from used car sales, too. And all those companies that produce recycled paper? pfft, pay up to the original producer of that product!

2.
 
Re: Bungie
Sep 27, 2008, 15:22
2.
Re: Bungie Sep 27, 2008, 15:22
Sep 27, 2008, 15:22
 
By the same token, record companies should get a cut of used CD sales, movie studios should get a cut of used DVD sales and book publishers should get a cut of used book sales. What is this guy smoking?
3.
 
Re: Bungie
Sep 27, 2008, 19:24
3.
Re: Bungie Sep 27, 2008, 19:24
Sep 27, 2008, 19:24
 
Consumer: Game companies will soon profit from no sales with attitudes like that.

4.
 
No subject
Sep 27, 2008, 19:51
4.
No subject Sep 27, 2008, 19:51
Sep 27, 2008, 19:51
 
id like to pocket money from that guys wallet
5.
 
Re: No subject
Sep 27, 2008, 20:19
Prez
 
5.
Re: No subject Sep 27, 2008, 20:19
Sep 27, 2008, 20:19
 Prez
 
It is shocking to see otherwise intelligent, well-read, business-minded individuals display such painful ignorance on how capitalism works.

The assertion that developers and publishers are somehow entitled to money beyond that of the original sale is so asinine that it would be funny if it weren't so sad. The sense of entitlement to something that's not theirs is astounding.
“The greatness of a nation and its moral progress can be judged by the way its animals are treated.”
- Mahatma Gandhi
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6.
 
Re: No subject
Sep 27, 2008, 20:44
NKD
6.
Re: No subject Sep 27, 2008, 20:44
Sep 27, 2008, 20:44
NKD
 
I'm pretty sure every time the issue of used stuff has appeared in court here in the US, they have decided that a company has no right to control it or profit from it once they've sold it to someone else.

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7.
 
No subject
Sep 27, 2008, 21:54
7.
No subject Sep 27, 2008, 21:54
Sep 27, 2008, 21:54
 
I don't see GM crying that there's a healthy used car market that they don't get a cut of.

My respect for Bungie just dropped a couple of pegs.
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"Both the “left” and the “right” pretend they have the answer, but they are mere flippers on the same thalidomide baby, and the truth is that neither side has a clue."

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8.
 
Re: No subject
Sep 27, 2008, 21:55
8.
Re: No subject Sep 27, 2008, 21:55
Sep 27, 2008, 21:55
 
It's called the Doctrine of First Sale and it's been upheld time after time after time. Once purchased, you are free to resale it, there are almost no exceptions to this other than products involving medicine and/or hygiene concerns.

I don't always drink carbonated Mexican rat piss, but when I do, I prefer Dos Equis.
9.
 
GTA4
Sep 28, 2008, 00:37
9.
GTA4 Sep 28, 2008, 00:37
Sep 28, 2008, 00:37
 
While many who hoped to take advantage of expanded multiplayer options in Grand Theft Auto IV for the PC might bemoan the lack of its availability on Steam or as a standalone title, the Windows Live rollout puts Microsoft in a strong position to bring new gamers into the fold by making access to a phenomenal title that much easier.
That is either poorly worded or reveals that GTA4 won't be making it to Steam; I'm gonna assume the former.

I'm pretty sure every time the issue of used stuff has appeared in court here in the US, they have decided that a company has no right to control it or profit from it once they've sold it to someone else.
The rulings against restricted licences keep getting struck down on appeal, so the situation is far from clear - the AutoDesk ruling is currently the one everyone is paying attention to. However, I've read developers/publishers stating that if the ruling is upheld they'll simply switch to a subscription service that doesn't require additional payments - it gets around the issue but actually gives end users even less control.

- - - - - - - - - - - - - -
Founder of the "I Hate Smiley Fitz" society

Remember: Riley has autism. He has trouble communicating, and in an overstimulating
environment, he can get frightened and run away, leaving his parents frantic. - Auburn
"The price of freedom is eternal vigilance."
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10.
 
No subject
Sep 28, 2008, 00:51
10.
No subject Sep 28, 2008, 00:51
Sep 28, 2008, 00:51
 
I think we'll see less and less physical disc products, just so they can tie a sale to a customer forever.

11.
 
Re: GTA4
Sep 28, 2008, 00:54
NKD
11.
Re: GTA4 Sep 28, 2008, 00:54
Sep 28, 2008, 00:54
NKD
 
The rulings against restricted licences keep getting struck down on appeal, so the situation is far from clear - the AutoDesk ruling is currently the one everyone is paying attention to. However, I've read developers/publishers stating that if the ruling is upheld they'll simply switch to a subscription service that doesn't require additional payments - it gets around the issue but actually gives end users even less control.

Yeah, we are also starting to see this stuff in the games market. EA is already getting around it with the limited activation stuff. They may not legally be able to keep you from reselling the game itself, but there is nothing stopping them from crippling people from being able to use it after you're done.

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12.
 
No subject
Sep 28, 2008, 01:06
12.
No subject Sep 28, 2008, 01:06
Sep 28, 2008, 01:06
 
its pretty fucking ridiculous that corps have to resort to implementing fascist type control over the "rights of use" aspect of games in order to increase their precious profitsss.. rather than trying to create more volume of better games, increase productivity and so forth

this kind of philosophy WILL bite them in the ass, guaranteed

the commercialized economic system is reaching its limit for unchecked greed - time to start stockpiling ammo and heading to the vaults, my friends
13.
 
...
Sep 28, 2008, 01:26
13.
... Sep 28, 2008, 01:26
Sep 28, 2008, 01:26
 
They may not legally be able to keep you from reselling the game itself, but there is nothing stopping them from crippling people from being able to use it after you're done.
They are crippling the games for legitimate users; preventing reselling is just a bonus.

- - - - - - - - - - - - - -
Founder of the "I Hate Smiley Fitz" society

Remember: Riley has autism. He has trouble communicating, and in an overstimulating
environment, he can get frightened and run away, leaving his parents frantic. - Auburn
"The price of freedom is eternal vigilance."
Avatar 22891
14.
 
Broken Economic Outlook
Sep 28, 2008, 02:16
14.
Broken Economic Outlook Sep 28, 2008, 02:16
Sep 28, 2008, 02:16
 
Banning reselling of games is such a broken way of approaching a market. A game company that doesn't recognize that you can only sell as many games as there are people who want the game at a single point in time is too stupid to participate in a capitalist market.
I eat pasta!
15.
 
easy as writing an IOU
Sep 28, 2008, 02:35
15.
easy as writing an IOU Sep 28, 2008, 02:35
Sep 28, 2008, 02:35
 
yeh! lets add a 700 billion dollars more to the national debt! that will save the day! yeh, thats the ticket!
16.
 
the right to fail... or suceed..
Sep 28, 2008, 05:08
16.
the right to fail... or suceed.. Sep 28, 2008, 05:08
Sep 28, 2008, 05:08
 
If he wants to pursue that business model, that's his business, as long as its legal. But every action has a reaction. If the value of the game is less because you can't sell it, then there's less incentive to buy it.

The auto manufacturers often hark on resale value. It helps them over their competitors, if its true. Somewhere i have copy of Alternate Reality for the Atari8bit, which I'm pretty sure is worth much more than what I paid for it (hah, it was a gift!).

Perpetual debt is slavery.
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17.
 
overstanding
Sep 28, 2008, 05:42
17.
overstanding Sep 28, 2008, 05:42
Sep 28, 2008, 05:42
 
the question of value directly affecting sales doesnt always hold true, thats where marketing comes in - playing to the weakness of the human mind, and the manipulation of psychological aspects

at the end of the day, there are certain things you can never take with you - money is one of them.. however the idea of the power that money can give you is always an enticing proposition, especially for those who fail to see the impending cessation of their own little personal sphere

time is precious, its not just money - unless one is willing to trade that ineffable reality for an ephemeral substitute.. and in that case there are those who are willing to pick up all the slack - post no bills and poot no guff - and not to waste it looking at the shiny, shiny things, comparing gold to diamonds and so forth
18.
 
Royalties for used games
Sep 28, 2008, 07:44
18.
Royalties for used games Sep 28, 2008, 07:44
Sep 28, 2008, 07:44
 
Why not? The game re-seller is making money off of used games, why shouldn't the people who put the time and effort into actually making the game make money as well?

1 person buys a brand-new game for $60. They play it, take it into Game-Stop, and get $15 for it. Game-Stop turns around and sells it to someone else for $45 dollars. Game-stop has just made a profit of $30 and the developer/publisher of the game has lost 100% of the revenues from a missed new copy sale and gets nothing from the used copy sale. That process can repeat over and over with the same copy of the game. Each time, the re-seller is making money while the developers get nada.

Thinking they should get a portion of that revenue is not an unreasonable viewpoint to have about their livelihood.

I'm shocked sometimes at the pure vitriole you guys have for people who make games for a living.
This comment was edited on Sep 28, 08:03.
19.
 
Re: Royalties for used games
Sep 28, 2008, 08:46
19.
Re: Royalties for used games Sep 28, 2008, 08:46
Sep 28, 2008, 08:46
 
Royalties for used games why not?

Then what about books, movies, CDs, art, ect..
Can you really formulate a logical reason why video games are different then every other product ever created when it comes to second-hand sales?


20.
 
...
Sep 28, 2008, 09:30
20.
... Sep 28, 2008, 09:30
Sep 28, 2008, 09:30
 
Thinking they should get a portion of that revenue is not an unreasonable viewpoint to have about their livelihood.

I'm shocked sometimes at the pure vitriole you guys have for people who make games for a living.
So why should they get a cut for second-hand sales when no car manufacturer, music label, movie studio, house builder or computer build does? They just want more money.

- - - - - - - - - - - - - -
Founder of the "I Hate Smiley Fitz" society

Remember: Riley has autism. He has trouble communicating, and in an overstimulating
environment, he can get frightened and run away, leaving his parents frantic. - Auburn
"The price of freedom is eternal vigilance."
Avatar 22891
34 Replies. 2 pages. Viewing page 1.
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