Ha ha what a load of anal droppings! Corporations cannot afford to fix a product that they offered for sale in a damaged or faulty state and that is the fault of someone else?

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If you would die tomorrow...what then? John 3:16
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HELL wasn't introduced until Jeebus showed up and condemned everyone to it unless they plant their tongue firmly up the cult-leaders ass.

This comment was edited on Jun 16, 21:52.

consoles are great fun but not all games work well on a console. the recent 360 demo for the new version of civilization is a perfect example. They've rather ingeniously built a Civ game that works on a controller but it still has me repeatedly wanting to reach for a mouse. Some games belong on a PC or gameplay is lost in the process.

"I don't give a shit if people watch American Idol or not, nor will I go out of my way to proclaim how low they are, much like what people have been doing here recently with the PC, which is what my original post was making fun of: the fanatic obsession to some loose set of ideals that compose PC gaming today/recent past.

I'll be over here playing games because I have fun with them, not because of some poorly defined superiority complex."

Then why do you even play PC games on a rig that likely cost three or four times as much as the four or five-hundered dollar consoles? So you can play at a higher resolution than the console gamers do on their bigscreens?

If it doesn't bug you that all your future games are going to be designed with gamepads (and their handful of buttons) in mind, then good for you! To see games like Operation Flashpoint, the older Rainbow 6 games etc..., the shooters with a gazillion functions, commands and the need to use strategy disappear from the radar because the corporate weasels who see nothing but the bottom line release the same thing on all platforms, totally sucks for those who want more depth in their gaming than what's on the consoles. The original Ghost Recon, again, a shooter with a fantastic and unique way to play (multiple teams/waypoint map/ability to directly control any team-member at will) was another great example...boy did that concept go down the toilet with the "sequel" who's gameplay, in absolutely no way, resembled the original and was a clear example of a PC game being designed with the console in mind. Then you've got all your sim fans (Silent Hunter submarine series and other naval sime, flight sims etc...) who may be looking at being cast to the side, again, in favor of the bottom line by a bunch of greedy corporate assholes. Those who used to get off on flying in the cockpits of F-16s SU-27s each with their unique flight characteristics etc...can look forward to the latest Jet-Plane-Go-Boom-Boom third-Person jet-shooter that they're slapping Tom Clancy's name on. Tom Clancy! That used to mean you're in for a deep experience modelled after reasonably realistic warfare. Now his name means some corporation owns it and can put it on anything they damned well want to put it on. You think people who like simulations and games with depth have no right to complain that the future of PC gaming doesn't include their favorite types of games?! Losing their favorite types of games so that corporations can just release their console games on the PC and ignore all the complexity the PCs human interface can offer is just something we should shut up about because you don't like hearing it?!

To accuse those who used to enjoy having to spend some time learning a game and having to think about what they were doing while playing it of having a superiority complex is narrow-sighted, self-important and petty. Sorry you felt so slighted! I don't mind a romp through bad-guy land and taking out 300-1000 trained and fully armed soldiers/Gangters/Aliens all by myself once in a while, but hating that the main reason I'm a PC gamer is going away doesn't make me an asshole, no matter how threatened or offended you are that alot of people prefer other types of games than you do.

You can play Atari's Pong if you want....I won't hate you for it or think any less of you. I just don't wanna be told I should play it too and forget about what I enjoy.

This comment was edited on Jun 12, 00:28.

"I enjoyed dinner last night, besides the part where it was substandard!"

I think that's where the misunderstanding is. I don't like Gears of War. I didn't find it entertaining, for the reasons I mentioned. You may have found it entertaining but remember, that doesn't make the game "good" by universal standards.

As you stated, your interest in games has shifted away from the games themselves and more towards the social experience. That's fine and that explains why you found Gears of War entertaining. On the other hand, I still very much care about games themselves and I still want them to be at least as deep, challenging, complex, innovative, etc, as they were ten years ago.

Unfortunately, games are going in the complete opposite direction that I (and many other PC gamers) want. This is a result of multiplatform development with consoles being the lead SKUs. With this in mind, you should be able to understand, if not necessarily agree with, why we take the matter so seriously.

huh? I guess I can understand lashing out when your hobby has become niche, but that argument seems a bit silly.

That's the thing: I loved it when gaming was niche. Developers and publishers took risks, tried new things and made games for gamers. They didn't care about appealing to the broadest audience possible or selling 10 million units. It was all about the games.

Now games are mainstream and everything I loved about gaming is being sacrificed for the bottom line. Imagine if the official rules of basketball were changed to accommodate a wider audience. Imagine if they lowered the hoop so anyone could dunk or if they allowed you to run around with the ball without dribbling. Imagine if they banned players from stealing or intercepting the ball. Congratulations, basketball is now accessible to all and you're probably going to sell a lot more basketballs. However, the integrity of the game is gone and everything that made it great is but a memory. This is what is happening to PC gaming.


This comment was edited on Jun 12, 04:43.

If you still have fun with crappy games, hey, that's good for you.

That doesn't make much sense at all. I'd love to see you at restaurants.

"I enjoyed dinner last night, besides the part where it was substandard!"

..huh? I guess I can understand lashing out when your hobby has become niche, but that argument seems a bit silly.

I don't give a shit if people watch American Idol or not, nor will I go out of my way to proclaim how low they are, much like what people have been doing here recently with the PC, which is what my original post was making fun of: the fanatic obsession to some loose set of ideals that compose PC gaming today/recent past.

I have no problem with substandard entertainment as long as it doesn't affect the entertainment I enjoy. I had no problem at all with consoles when they were their own distinct platform. Consoles and PC used to exist in their own separate spheres and that was fine. However, multiplatform development now means that the spheres have merged for the worse and the entertainment I once enjoyed is compromised for an inferior control scheme and an audience with a shorter attention span and lower standards.

Games are becoming increasingly social events for me, how complex they are plays but a very small part for much of my judgement of a game nowadays.

In other words, you've lowered your standards. You choose to be complacent, I choose to be passionate. If you still have fun with crappy games, hey, that's good for you. But you shouldn't be so surprised when other people aren't so forgiving of inferior games.

I'll be over here playing games because I have fun with them, not because of some poorly defined superiority complex.

Nicely put!

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Grand Theft Auto IV.....what else is there?

PSN ID= Puscifer73
"Blues News" Steam Community... http://steamcommunity.com/groups/bluesnews/

Here, Here, Old_Geezer. My sentiments exactly.

And Blues News will always rock, and will always command my attention, looking for that elusive, worthy PC game.

However, I don't believe all opinions hold equal merit nor do I feel any need to respect those opinions I consider weak.

If you want to lead your life thinking you're superior in anyway just because you watch some nerdy sci-fi shows, or play Tribes or whatever, be my guest. Just don't be surprised when people/companies/whatever stop catering to you.

I don't give a shit if people watch American Idol or not, nor will I go out of my way to proclaim how low they are, much like what people have been doing here recently with the PC, which is what my original post was making fun of: the fanatic obsession to some loose set of ideals that compose PC gaming today/recent past.

I'll be over here playing games because I have fun with them, not because of some poorly defined superiority complex.

(that is, unless it makes me better than you that I play GoW with friends, AND enjoy games like Tribes!) Games are becoming increasingly social events for me, how complex they are plays but a very small part for much of my judgement of a game nowadays.

I completely agree with you. I am sick and tired of hearing pirates rationalize their actions. They could ignore the consequences when they were pirating music but now we can clearly feel the effects of pirating PC games and it hurts.

stop being a thoughtless sheep. those of us who pay money for our games are entitled to whatever opinion we choose on the subject.

the entire argument and views on this subject seem to revolve around two types of people. those that are aware there is a grey area in life, and those that are not.

the grey area applies to any situation, person, etc..

and yes, we spell it that way where i live.

I completely agree with you. I am sick and tired of hearing pirates rationalize their actions. They could ignore the consequences when they were pirating music but now we can clearly feel the effects of pirating PC games and it hurts.

Buy your games! Read reviews before you buy them, support what you love, but don't kill what you think is only mediocre. Let the free market decide what's good and not your smug sense of self satisfaction.

Console piracy is simple to do on the 360, DS, PS2, and PSP. Dont believe every what game executives says to the media about PC piracy. We arent getting the whole story.

apparantly pirates cause crap game ideas, crap gameplay, crap scripts and voice acting, and a mass of ww2 clone games too ?



Yes they do!Work for years on a title and then go online and see half the people playing did not buy what you worked on!!! Think of others you selfish anuses! Turn the table and stop thinking about yourself, think about it guys! I remember game companies patching the heck out of their games, now they cannot afford to because 2/3 the people try to warez the games first. You can justify it all you want, but in the end we lose! Enough said! Well not enough! Like I said before I was in the warez scene years ago and I also stopped because I seen young companies go under because of it. You want awesome games,pay the price! I hope every single game goes mmorpg and monthly fee so you cheap mothers will get burned!Ok I feel better!:)

If you would die tomorrow...what then? John 3:16
God gave man dominion--the pains you see are because of our decisions--not His!

apparantly pirates cause crap game ideas, crap gameplay, crap scripts and voice acting, and a mass of ww2 clone games too ?

_________________________________________________
NO COOP = NO PURCHASE
NO MULTICORE SUPPORT = NO BUY
NO NATIVE WIDESCREEN SUPPORT = NO CASH FOR YOU
CRITICAL PATCH released within 2 weeks = RETURN TO STORE
IN GAME ADVERTISING = GO ***** YOURSELVES

Bleah... this is a load of horsehockey. Yes piracy is bad but they've been using the "piracy ups development costs by x amount so thats why we don't make as many pc games" argument (its the same load that the riaa AND mpaa both used about film, both of which were fallacious arguments as they didn't include simple things like RENTALS or PEOPLE BORROWING MOVIES FROM A FRIEND).

If most console game sactually had an engrossing storyline, realistic characters, and a fair degree of difficulty, I'd be satisfied with ports. The only exceptions to the boring, insipid and lifeless cross platform/ports were mass effect, kotor and pop:sot (and i still went with the gc version ultimately just for ease of playing >.> ).

I really hate to say this but Jerykk is right. Console games right now feel like boxed wine compared to a 60 year old savignon. Sometimes you find an amazing gem, but most of it is cheap, kind of bland, and doesn't leave you feeling well after you're done.

"That's something that people need to get their heads around - the console is a baseline, the PC is going to be an improved version."

That's something I have no problem with. I've played quite a few PC versions of "console games" that I've had a blast with. As long as it's not a straight port that still tells you to "press the A button!" in a tutorial mission (and then doesn't let you go on because you're not pressing A), I'm alright with it.

I've been playing Lego Star Wars on my 360 with my buddies, and it's been an absolute blast. I love the co-op design in it. Before that, I was playing GTA4, and before that Mass Effect. I don't think I've actually bought a new PC game this year.

I did get an old one. The Battle for Middle Earth compilation. 3 games for 20 bucks! Awesome, right? Yeah. Except not a single one of them works. They all crash out on the splash screen with "game.dat access violation."

There's 900000000 message threads about that error on the Internet. EA just fucking ignores it. That has been absolutely my last EA game fucking ever. Cocksuckers.

It's hard to see why more and more people just go to a console... {/sarcasm}

Creston

speaking of fantastic gameplay and innovation withou requiring a super computer - while still keeping the graphics nice and tidy.

Natural Selection 2

www.unknownworlds.com/ns2

_________________________________________________
NO COOP = NO PURCHASE
NO MULTICORE SUPPORT = NO BUY
NO NATIVE WIDESCREEN SUPPORT = NO CASH FOR YOU
CRITICAL PATCH released within 2 weeks = RETURN TO STORE
IN GAME ADVERTISING = GO ***** YOURSELVES

Perhaps we'll just get better gameplay without the graphics. I still play Wolf: Enemy Territory.

Although the consoles can cream it for graphics, can they come close to the gameplay, depth and hitscan?

Or maybe I'm wrong, apparently Quake Wars is available for the 360. Is it actually the same experience?

It feels like people truly believe that they are somehow intellectually superior over people who like Gears of War, etc.

I don't really see the issue with that. Standards are important. There Will Be Blood is a better movie than Jackass. Battlestar Galactica is a better show than American Idol. There's little question that the former require greater intellect than the latter.

Same applies to Gears of War. You have a third-person cover system which completely offsets the natural risk v.s. reward balance of cover. You have regenerating health. You have grenade trajectory indicators. You have linear, predictable and highly scripted levels. The gameplay is shallow and formulaic. As a whole, the game clearly caters to the lowest common denominator with short attention spans and low standards.

You can argue that everyone is entitled to their own opinion and I agree completely. However, I don't believe all opinions hold equal merit nor do I feel any need to respect those opinions I consider weak.

I've already acquired a V8 Interceptor and removed a few body panels to slash at their delivery truck drivers with a large exhaust pipe. That'll show them.

........i'll drive that tanker... FLOL

_________________________________________________
NO COOP = NO PURCHASE
NO MULTICORE SUPPORT = NO BUY
NO NATIVE WIDESCREEN SUPPORT = NO CASH FOR YOU
CRITICAL PATCH released within 2 weeks = RETURN TO STORE
IN GAME ADVERTISING = GO ***** YOURSELVES