So who thinks the 'next' 1up review of NWN2 will be > 7/10?

Sure they 'stand by' their reviewer and only pulled the review because it was not up to the high editorial standards us scholarly types have come to expect from 1up ... sure ...

Give it at least an 8 out of 10 or Atari (and/or their partners) will stop paying you for 'advertising' and such

This comment was edited on Nov 4, 04:39.

What's the difference between a review like this (where the reviewer supposedly doesn't like the D&D system), and now a future one where the reviewer probably likes the game style and such? Exactly that. He likes the game.

You're missing the point. He doesn't have to like the game. He can think the game is a piece of shit (and it might be). But ragging on a game because you don't like the model that was used is just stupid. If you don't like cars, you shouldn't be reviewing a racing game. If you don't like sports, you shouldn't be reviewing a football game.

The whole damn point of a review is to review the game. He didn't review the game, he reviewed D&D.

hahaha fucking classic:

Well, they say there is a first time for everything. And this would be another one of those first times. Yesterday (Nov 3) we posted online a review of Neverwinter Nights 2 by contributing editor Matt Peckham. Today we are pulling that review down and retracting it. The reason for this is simple. The review was not up to our regular editorial standards, and it was our mistake to publish it in the first place. I stand by Matt Peckham completely, as he has done great work for our magazine and this website. And we will continue to publish his works going forward. So this is not being done to either punish him or to disavow ourselves from him. The blame for this particular mistake falls entirely upon the editors of the magazine, and, in particular, me. It is my job as editor-in-chief to ensure that all of the articles--and in particular, the reviews--meet a certain standard of fairness, that every game gets its "fair shake." After listening to the comments of readers, and after reviewing the matter internally with the other GFW and 1UP editors, we have come to the conclusion that this was not a fair review--or at least, it can be perceived as not a fair review, which is just as bad. And we are not so stupid or arrogant that we can't admit our mistakes here. To publish this review without further edits was a mistake, and for that we apologize. The review has been retracted, the score has been retracted, and it will not appear in our print magazine. We sincerely regret the error, and we will be back next week with a new review.

Jeff

so PJ, get your ass over to 1up and defend your buddy, tell that staff to "get off his back, hes just doing his fucking job!!" .. i bet if you whine really hard they will listen

________________________
music from space captain:
http://www.soundclick.com/bands/6/errantways_music.htm
http://www.soundclick.com/bands/4/invisibleacropolis_music.htm

And for the record I tend to love D&D-based games. Will I get NWN2? Probably. Will I enjoy it? I hope so. But this reviewer clearly didn't, and he described why. Get off his fucking back.

since you dig him so much, how about you get together and have a little circle jerk with the guy?

anyways, screw him - who gives a flying fuck what his job is? the review is a peice of shit, therefore he sucks balls at doing his job - he needs to find a better one

________________________
music from space captain:
http://www.soundclick.com/bands/6/errantways_music.htm
http://www.soundclick.com/bands/4/invisibleacropolis_music.htm

so basically, this comes to prove that reviewing games isn't exactly a science, although they try to make it (with a numeric result), but art.

What's the difference between a review like this (where the reviewer supposedly doesn't like the D&D system), and now a future one where the reviewer probably likes the game style and such? Exactly that. He likes the game.

So his perception will obviously be different than the original reviewer. They clearly perceive the game differently, but why is the one that favors the game getting to review the game instead? Just the way one bashes, the other oversells. There is no in-between.

Perception is reality.

I guess the best way to see what's up is to lurk NW2 forums, where people are crying on with the bugs and such; and, obviously, try the game for yourself.

Either way, this shit happens all the time, but occasionally 'editor's give a crap because of the bonds with publishers/developers.

Jeff Green rocks my world. I still love him.

http://www.1up.com/do/blogEntry?bId=7589456&publicUserId=5380367

Sets a bad precedent, I think.

The point is the guy didn't do his job. You're right, his job is to review the game and offer some insight into the gameplay. Except, he added little or no content about NWN2 itself.. only generalities about D&D gaming and a couple crumbs about small zones.

EDIT: LOL, the 1UP review was pulled.. link no worky.


This comment was edited on Nov 3, 16:33.

I don't like fucking FINAL FANTASY

Not even close to the same thing. It's not about whether he (or you) like a specific game line. Here's a more relevant example: Let's say the reviewer is reviewing a tennis game, and starts talking about how boring tennis is, how the scoring system is stupid, etc. Is that a useful review? Hell no. The point of a review is not to determine whether someone likes the model the game was built on. Nor should someone who dislikes that model be reviewing it. I don't give a shit if his job is to "review games". There are plenty of games he could review. And I'm sure there are other people who aren't inherently biased against the model that could review this one.

I want to know if the fucking game is good. I don't want to know if the reviewer likes D&D.

Get off his fucking back.

Nice comment for someone who made a grand speech about how it's a free country and he can say what he wants... Guess you are selective on who you apply that to.

If you don't like D&D, why would you expect to like the game? Moreover, why are you reviewing such a game? If I dislike racing games, it's both stupid and pointless to have me reviewing them.

He wasn't expecting to like the game, that much is evident.

He reviewed the game because IT'S HIS FUCKING JOB TO REVIEW GAMES. If every fucking fanboy in the world reviewed his own game we'd see nothing but 10/10 across the fucking board; as evidenced here there is a SPECTRUM of OPINION, and BOTH SIDES NEED TO BE EQUALLY ADDRESSED. He doesn't like D&D? FANTASTIC. Me? I don't like fucking FINAL FANTASY. FFVII? FFVIII? FFxxxxxx? I've played them. They suck. Yet other people insist on crusading for the supreme recognition that Final Fantasy and all its iterations apparently deserve, many reviewers included. But you don't see me blasting my head off about how everybody else is wrong and just "doesn't get it." If it was my JOB to do so, like this man's, I'd be more than happy to voice my opionion.

And for the record I tend to love D&D-based games. Will I get NWN2? Probably. Will I enjoy it? I hope so. But this reviewer clearly didn't, and he described why. Get off his fucking back.

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"Oh how awful. Did he at least die peacefully? To shreds you say. Well, how's his wife holding up? To shreds you say."

It's a free country; if he doesn't like the game he is more than welcome to say so.

Speaking of which, where's Beamer? He's usually chiming in with the harder core RPG-vet appraisal of these games.

I rate the reviewer a 3 out of 10. He probably played 10 minutes of it and wrote what he thinks is a review. totally biased. what ev

"I fart in your general direction!"

And you are right, those negative comments seem more geared toward D&D than the game itself. And considering the game *is* D&D, he is more than appropriately using his arguments against the game.

Appropriately? NWN2 is designed to be a D&D simulator. If you don't like D&D, why would you expect to like the game? Moreover, why are you reviewing such a game? If I dislike racing games, it's both stupid and pointless to have me reviewing them.

I hate Madden 2007, it's too much like football. Next, we'll have Riley review the next Valve release on steam...

It's a free country; if he doesn't like the game he is more than welcome to say so. Especially considering it is his job.

And you are right, those negative comments seem more geared toward D&D than the game itself. And considering the game *is* D&D, he is more than appropriately using his arguments against the game.

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"Oh how awful. Did he at least die peacefully? To shreds you say. Well, how's his wife holding up? To shreds you say."

Indeed it's kind of funny that every other website is giving the game 90% or higher (4.5 stars/9 stars/etc) and this guy who clearly hates the D&D system has been justifying his review (which btw will be in a magazine, a really bad one but still.)

Interesting conversation about it can be found here;

http://www.quartertothree.com/game-talk/showthread.php?t=30526

Wonder who pissed in his Cheerios. This guy just seems angry.

I'm cruising for a bruising (don't I know it), but NWN2 is a splash of cold water to the face: A revelatory, polarizing experience that -- in the wake of newer, better alternatives -- makes you question the very notion of "RPG by numbers."

What exactly is he referring to here? I'd love to know which games he considers to be sooo much better. I certainly haven't seen any lately.

NWN2's levels feel pint-sized: Peewee zones inhabited by pull-string NPCs with no existence to speak of beyond their little playpens. Wander and you'll wonder why the forests, towns, and dungeons are like movie lots with lay-about monsters waiting patiently for you to trip their arbitrary triggers.

And Oblivion was different how? Oh, right, cause you can walk around a big area before tripping triggers and entering even smaller dungeons. Oblivion still felt like a big empty place.

The dungeons feel especially stale, so linear and inorganic they might as well be graph-paper lifts filled with room after room of pop-up bogeymen (Doom put them in closets; NWN2 just makes the closets bigger). Maybe you'd rather chat with the dumb NPCs that speak and sound like extras in a bad Saturday morning cartoon?

Again, this is different from other games how?

All in all, he just makes a lot of complaints that could be leveled at any RPG in recent years, even Fable. If he's just gonna randomly select some game to rip apart because he doesn't like the general state of things, then he's just not a good reviewer.

Information doesn't want to be free, it wants to be tied up and spanked. It told me so itself, in a naughty little whisper.

That NWN 2 review on 1UP is going to annoy a lot of people.

Especially since he gave Fable: The Lost Chapters (PC) 4/5 stars on gamespy a year ago. In any case, I read this as someone who is just sick of D&D centric games. Maybe he did it to significantly impact the gamerankings score. I think that review lowered it around 5%. If you're looking for a new D&D based RPG game with a party system and single/multi player options plus editor and future module content.. you aren't going to find any alternatives anyways.


This comment was edited on Nov 3, 12:17.

That NWN 2 review on 1UP is going to annoy a lot of people.

Yeah, that review was really bad. That I can admit to even though I agree with him 110% on third edition DnD which is unplayable and Eberron just makes things worse. There's just way too much shit. Oh well I still want to get my hands on NWN2 though!

korean mmo=level grinding.