hmmm... 18... what's 6x3? what's 666? SiN? maybe?

well, if it's 17 tomorrow, then there goes that theory

here's hoping it'll happen! i loved that game, despite all it's initial bugs.

Hmmmm LegionPharma....ilovebees.com anyone?

i loved that game, despite all it's initial bugs.

Yes, that would be because of this:

launching a playtester program open to those 18 years or older

We'll stop having such buggy games when companies that don't want to spend money (or don't have money to spend) stop bringing in pimply teenagers for free to do "playtesting" instead of hiring a staff of quality assurance professionals to do "actual testing." You know, people who actually know how to do the job.

But that won't happen. Not as long as "faster, cheaper, crappier" is the ruling paradigm.
This comment was edited on Jun 17, 10:45.

We'll stop having such buggy games when companies that don't want to spend money (or don't have money to spend) stop bringing in pimply teenagers for free to do "playtesting" instead of hiring a staff of quality assurance professionals to do "actual testing." You know, people who actually know how to do the job.

Um... you do realise playtesting is an entirely seperate issue to actual testing-for-bugs anyways?

It's not due to not hiring people that we get buggy games, it's due to time as much as money.

Freespace 2: Lost Souls
http://www.sectorgame.com/aldo/

Yeah, since I work in the field, I think I know the difference. That's probably the reason for my post, in fact, huh?

If you think it's not due to not hiring people, you're mistaken. A QA professional, with say, 5 or 10 years experience in software testing, probably even with a BS or higher in computer science or engineering or a similar field, has a *bit* more know-how when it comes to finding and identifying problems (and in more than a "bug vs. not bug" nature - also problems with design, with approach, with marketing... it's called Quality Assurance, not "bug finder") than a kid out of high school who was turned down by Wendy's, and wants to brag to his friends that he "works for a game company" when he's not busy smoking pot or "just hangin out, dude."

Also, to assume it's so much an issue of time is also a fallacy, any more than it's an issue of time for the developers. QA is not some process to be tacked on at the end of the development cycle. It's an ongoing process which is engaged since day one. Read up on the software development life cycle and you'll see how it goes in companies that deal with things other than laser rifles.

"Dude. I was like, firing this gun or something? And it liked, crashed. Whoa."

This comment was edited on Jun 17, 11:13.

If you think it's not due to not hiring people, you're mistaken. A QA professional, with say, 5 or 10 years experience in software testing, probably even with a BS or higher in computer science or engineering or a similar field, has a *bit* more know-how when it comes to finding and identifying problems (and in more than a "bug vs. not bug" nature - also problems with design, with approach, with marketing... it's called Quality Assurance, not "bug finder") than a kid out of high school who was turned down by Wendy's, and wants to brag to his friends that he "works for a game company" when he's not busy smoking pot or "just hangin out, dude."

And which one will be cheaper to hire (and in turn, who do you think they'll go with)?





--------------------------------------------------------------
GW: Nilaar Madalla, lvl 18 R/Mo / Xylos Gath, lvl 6 W/Mo

If you look at your reflection, is that all you want to be? http://www.nin.com

And which one will be cheaper to hire (and in turn, who do you think they'll go with)?

Given that I'm their paid quality assurance manager with over five years of experience, go ahead and make your guess...

For playtesting, we need a continual stream of new eyes. For regular testing, we dedicate trained eyes to the cause.

Michael Russell / QA Manager, Ritual Entertainment

As if Sin 1 wasn't bad enough. Sin 2? Fuck that.

Thank goodness. Michael (assuming you are who you say you are) - how many QA staff do you have working for you? Since you didn't jump down my throat for my post, it's possible you agree with me, and realize that the post wasn't directed AT Ritual, but AT all game companies that don't hire QA. Ultima IX had a QA person, for instance. For that HUGE game, one person, "Binky." Argh, indeed!

So I'm wondering - does Ritual have adequate QA?

If you look at the alt text for some of the links then it's for sure a viral marketing site.

One says the numbers are important, one says 'first is key' and then another has a list of numbers. Now WHERE you stick this number I have no idea, but no legit site would do that.

For where we are in the projects now, yes. We will need more in the future, but we have enough for now.

And yes, I do agree with you. Quality assurance is a critical part of the development process, but so is a team reacting to the feedback from QA.

You can toss all the testers you want at a product, but if the team doesn't care, it doesn't matter.

Fortunately, Ritual has proven to me through their actions that they truly care about quality. If they didn't, I wouldn't have uprooted my family from Utah and moved them over a thousand miles to Texas. In the last six months, we've made major strides in getting products playable faster and stabilizing them early.

Stable early, playtest early, fun early, polish for a long time...you'll like what you see.

Michael Russell / QA Manager, Ritual Entertainment

Could be quite cool to see a Sin 2 game... I quite liked the original. Although the first patch (18mb I seem to remember!) was out pretty much on day of launch, kinda put me of playing the game as I had a crap connection at the time and couldn't be arsed downloading a load of fundamental fixes that should have been addressed.

Of course, the HL1 OEM demo was out around the same time and followed by its retail release which really meant Sin dropped off the radar.

===
My heroes are Chorlton and The Wheelies, Captain Caveman and A Town Called Malice.

TrexaTrim? LOL.

Look who owns www.legionpharma.com..

SiN Rocked, unfortunatly the long loading times earned it its bad reputation, and ofcourse the bomb that was Half-life went off around the same time. Apart from that the game kicked ass, one of the most underrated and ignored titles ever.

I hope SiN II will kick ass.. any hints to what engine it might be using? Source maybe?, or are they still developing their Quake3 based engine?

http://www.thebrpage.net

I thought Sin 1 was a disappointment and it was about as bad as a diappointment as Daikatana. Those two games are kind of in the same league of suck.

Wasn't ritual hiring a while back for Doom III exp' ppl ?

===
My heroes are Chorlton and The Wheelies, Captain Caveman and A Town Called Malice.

Comparing to Ilovebees is a bit unfair. MSFT probably spent as much on that site alone as Sin 2 would spend on all their marketing, if not more.


P12-66/P1-13/P2-3/P6-39/P3-9/P4-4/P5-8/P7-14/P8-45/P9-6/P10-12/P11-45

Seems like a code, paragraph/letter position. I don't feel like counting out 66 letters, anyone want to crack it?
http://www.nhlbi.nih.gov/new/press/oberel4f.htm

According to the Legion Pharma site, the company was founded by "Sherilyn Palmer". According to Ritual's site, SiN's John Blade's mother was "Sherilyn Palmer Blade ... (deceased, died in chemical plant fire while saving her staff)".

QED? Not quite but...

Also note a robotics scientist and former marine on the staff.


Can you say boss characters?

SiN Rocked, unfortunatly the long loading times earned it its bad reputation, and ofcourse the bomb that was Half-life went off around the same time. Apart from that the game kicked ass, one of the most underrated and ignored titles ever.

I hope SiN II will kick ass.. any hints to what engine it might be using? Source maybe?, or are they still developing their Quake3 based engine?

Well said. I just replayed SiN and the Wages of SiN expansion a month or so ago and found them to still be very enjoyable. I'd be very much interested in playing a sequel.