Half-Life 2 EULA Legal Issues?

Is the Half-Life 2 EULA illegal? on the Inquirer (thanks Ant) describes possible legal issues surrounding the End-User License Agreement for Half-Life 2 and the Steam service. Here are a couple of hefty excerpts:
...The German Consumer Association has recently found that the packaging on Half-Life 2 is misleading. In a report made following complaints from the public, they said that the mere listing of an internet connection under the 'other' category in system requirements did not accurately describe the true extent of the internet tie-in with the game, and ordered Vivendi to amend the packaging and untie Steam from HL2 or face a hefty fine. See this page. How far other consumer associations will agree with the Germans is yet to be seen, but it seems a no-brainer that Steam should be mentioned on the retail pack.

The return of software has traditionally been a bugbear for gamers. Most shops, at least in the UK, have a policy not to allow the return of opened software because of piracy risks. However, most consumers are not aware that, in some cases at least, this is in breach of their statutory legal rights, which cannot be infringed. This page at the UK's Office of Fair Trading conveniently notes an example of when goods can be returned as faulty:...

It is quite conceivable that any gamer not being able to connect to Half-Life 2 is entitled to a legal refund in the UK. The case would hinge around whether or not the inability to play the game without persistent net connection, or the previous hacking of the CD Key rendering it unplayable, makes the game unfit for the purpose described on the box. This could well be a winner.

The last issue is the most interesting and relates to a number of other cases that have come up over the last couple of years. According to US and UK law, under the principle known in the US as 'First Sale', a consumer buying a game takes absolute title to it; that is, they own it. ...

But, arguably, you can't transfer the CD Key without paying the $10 Steam charge, because otherwise it's still registered to you at Valve, meaning you haven't truly transferred ownership to the buyer.

However, here's something else. No mention of the Steam software is made in the EULA for Half-Life 2. This means that the terms of the Steam EULA that you agree to when installing that software are almost certainly not incorporated into the contract you agree to when installing Half-Life 2. Consequently, the $10 transfer fee would not be enforceable because it isn't in the HL2 contract, and Valve would be acting illegally in blocking any sale of the game from one person to another.
View : : :
171 Replies. 9 pages. Viewing page 1.
Older [  1  2  3  4  5  6  7  8  9  ] Newer
1.
 
Re: No subject
Feb 7, 2005, 10:48
1.
Re: No subject Feb 7, 2005, 10:48
Feb 7, 2005, 10:48
 
finally, somone hops off Valve's dick long enough to realize they are getting fucked

______________________________________________
"They come as men, as graven images, as the White Stone, as a whirlwind and as a cloud;
it is a fire unfolding itself, the color amber; they are now in the Heavens looking over thee."
______________________________________________
"When the bomb drops it'll be a bank holiday
Everybody happy in their tents and caravans
Everybody happy in their ignorance and apathy
No one realizes until the television breaks down..."

- SUBHUMANS
2.
 
Let's hear it for Deutschland..
Feb 7, 2005, 11:00
2.
Let's hear it for Deutschland.. Feb 7, 2005, 11:00
Feb 7, 2005, 11:00
 
HA HA


Well put.

I never agreed with Vavle's method of forcing me to connect to the internet to activate a game after which I've paid for. And further more if I don't feel the need to run updates I shouldn't be forced into the malware STEAM constantly trying to append their needs ("their" being Valve).

And what gets my goat the most is the total dickless faggots out there that agree with this kind of surreptitious policy.

I agree though, something needs to be done about blatant piracy. But FUCK this horse shit. If I decide to install this app on another system, which I am about to do. Due to the incessant need to upgrade my fucking hardware and redeploy MS Windows XP Pro to another box from my RIS server running M$.

I think as a courtesy... Wait!" I mean as an OBLIGATION, Valve needs to send us quote:"legal responsible owners" of Half Life 2 a link to a binary that we can download and activate our product offline as we need.

End of story

This comment was edited on Feb 7, 11:58.
-The Dude-

Vic B.
3.
 
EULA
Feb 7, 2005, 11:01
3.
EULA Feb 7, 2005, 11:01
Feb 7, 2005, 11:01
 
ouch! Someones legal team didn't do enough research when writing up the EULA......

a "sticky wicket" old chap

----------------------------------------------------------------------
"Sometimes I dream about....cheese. Here, have a medkit"
- Half Life 2 NPC
----------------------------------------------------------------------
"Both the “left” and the “right” pretend they have the answer, but they are mere flippers on the same thalidomide baby, and the truth is that neither side has a clue."

- Jim Goad
Avatar 10137
4.
 
No subject
Feb 7, 2005, 11:02
4.
No subject Feb 7, 2005, 11:02
Feb 7, 2005, 11:02
 
You know, I love HL2 (Especially DM) but I'm glad someone is finally standing up to Valve on this subject. I see a lot of blind sheep on this board acting as if Steam is the best thing since sliced bread...but they are only fooling themselves. I couldn't play HL2 for three days last week all because Steam went down...and what's funny is that they didn't even hit their max users limit...they had a good 10,000 "slots" free and it still crashed. Locked me out of a game I legitimately paid for. It wouldn't be a problem if offline mode was permanent and didn't revert to online mode everytime you turn your modem back on. (Having to completely remove your network connection from your PC is too much for ANY game)

All I know is that when I pay (90 dollars for HL2 Collectors Edition) for a game I should be allowed to play the single player offline version anytime I want to. I can understand a game like EQ or UO being down periodically...but not the single player version of a game.

Maybe I'll buy the Steam-free German version of the game.

Avatar 13929
5.
 
Re: No subject
Feb 7, 2005, 11:04
nin
 
5.
Re: No subject Feb 7, 2005, 11:04
Feb 7, 2005, 11:04
 nin
 
Somebody page Riley...

May 3rd, 2005 - "We are preparing to destroy you." http://www.nin.com

http://www.beck.com/news/ ? Hell Yes!
6.
 
No subject
Feb 7, 2005, 11:04
6.
No subject Feb 7, 2005, 11:04
Feb 7, 2005, 11:04
 
fucking good.

im in australia and i was expecting a 'requires an internet connection to play' big sticker or something slapped on the front. but nothing except in the 'required system specs'.

go the germans. fuck them in the arse i say!

---------------------------------------------------
"im not supposed to be here, im not supposed to be"
7.
 
Way to go Germany!
Feb 7, 2005, 11:06
7.
Way to go Germany! Feb 7, 2005, 11:06
Feb 7, 2005, 11:06
 
Fantasic news, force membership to a high security risk like Steam is obscene.

‘What is this bullshit that you people are doing?’
The worst criminal in human history, undeniably.
Beating and Gassing Americans for Jesus!
Ain't no tweetin, in jail jammies!
Avatar 1858
8.
 
Re: Let's hear it for Deustchland..
Feb 7, 2005, 11:07
8.
Re: Let's hear it for Deustchland.. Feb 7, 2005, 11:07
Feb 7, 2005, 11:07
 
Ahh yes, the Inquirer is such a reputable news site.

This thread is gonna bring out all the whiners, babies, idiots and morons. Everyone knew HL2 required Steam, it was no secret and never was. This is just some (German) hacks just trying to make a name for themselves. Just like that shitty UK site a couple days ago trying to make it sound like selling 1.7mil retail copies is a bad thing.

----------------------------------------------------
Zero Tolerance Games Counter-Strike: Source server.
http://www.ztgames.com
9.
 
Re: Let's hear it for Deustchland..
Feb 7, 2005, 11:13
9.
Re: Let's hear it for Deustchland.. Feb 7, 2005, 11:13
Feb 7, 2005, 11:13
 
Dagok:

I knew it required Steam and a net connection, as did every other gamer who wasn't living in a cave last year. However, I WASN'T aware that to keep Steam in offline mode, I would have to disconnect my DSL modem and actually go as far as to remove my network in windows...and then never dare put it back or else the next time I run Steam, it reverts to online mode and attempts to connect (Whether the modem is on or not).

A LOT of people have discovered this problem. What, have you been living in a cave, Dagok?

Avatar 13929
10.
 
Re: No subject
Feb 7, 2005, 11:13
10.
Re: No subject Feb 7, 2005, 11:13
Feb 7, 2005, 11:13
 
but nothing except in the 'required system specs'.

So you and everyone else were too stupid to read and comprehend that an Internet Connection was required in the system requirements? Even the stupid article pointed out that the warning was there, but appearently that isn't enough for the illiterate morons.

What's funny is everyone that bitches about Steam, knew full well it was required before they purchased it. If you didn't like it, it's your mistake not anyone elses that you still bought it.

----------------------------------------------------
Zero Tolerance Games Counter-Strike: Source server.
http://www.ztgames.com
11.
 
Re: Way to go Germany!
Feb 7, 2005, 11:15
11.
Re: Way to go Germany! Feb 7, 2005, 11:15
Feb 7, 2005, 11:15
 
I can see it now. Someone at the German Consumer Association tries to play and his office doesn't allow him to have internet. "Well I planned on slacking off and playing some HL2 today, but looks like I WILL be doing SOMETHING today." as he sets about shutting down steam and basically slapping Valve back down to the land of logic. Although I do believe the non-mention of steam has a lot to do with the Vivendi vs. Valve conflict. Vivendi put the game in the box not knowing too well what they were really doing. "Hmm, Half-Life2, looks like a shooter! Stick it in the box make it $50 and slap on the default EULA."

#define "game" = "Half-Life 2"
#define "company" = "Valve"

Avatar 17249
12.
 
Re: Let's hear it for Deustchland..
Feb 7, 2005, 11:15
nin
 
12.
Re: Let's hear it for Deustchland.. Feb 7, 2005, 11:15
Feb 7, 2005, 11:15
 nin
 
However, I WASN'T aware that to keep Steam in offline mode, I would have to disconnect my DSL modem and actually go as far as to remove my network in windows

Why didn't you just right click on your network adapter and select "disable"?



May 3rd, 2005 - "We are preparing to destroy you." http://www.nin.com

http://www.beck.com/news/ ? Hell Yes!
13.
 
Re: Let's hear it for Deustchland..
Feb 7, 2005, 11:19
13.
Re: Let's hear it for Deustchland.. Feb 7, 2005, 11:19
Feb 7, 2005, 11:19
 
and then never dare put it back or else the next time I run Steam, it reverts to online mode and attempts to connect (Whether the modem is on or not).

So why dont you do something proactive about it and contact Valve? They fixed the other Offline mode problems very quickly before. I really havent messed with offline mode because I don't need it. I have never not been able to connect to Steam and if sometime I ever couldn't...I'd just do something else, it's not the end of the world.

But this isnt what the article is about now is it? The game requires an Internet Connection, it says so on the box. Offline mode is not something they owe you.

----------------------------------------------------
Zero Tolerance Games Counter-Strike: Source server.
http://www.ztgames.com
14.
 
Re: Let's hear it for Deustchland..
Feb 7, 2005, 11:20
14.
Re: Let's hear it for Deustchland.. Feb 7, 2005, 11:20
Feb 7, 2005, 11:20
 
Well Dagok,

I for one didn't realize Steam was embedded/ Binded into the product and the game engine. I was under the impression systems was an alternative delivery system that you/ I the user had a choice in the matter of installing or not.

So, to be honest I don't think of myself as a whiner or a baby. But I can certainly categorize you as a YESMAN.

You probably are the type of person who agrees without question to policy that you don't care are trite, incompusing and flagrant.

"The meek are indeed having their way with the world!"

And beside, from most conversations I have with typical Americans they always say negative things about the English anyway. So why would you entertain what some shitty UK site says.
-The Dude-

Vic B.
15.
 
No subject
Feb 7, 2005, 11:21
15.
No subject Feb 7, 2005, 11:21
Feb 7, 2005, 11:21
 
Nin, you know that doesn't work. All evidence of a connection, including the wiring itself, has to be removed from the PC to prevent Steam from trying to log in.

Go read their boards, you'll find others who have to go that far too.

Avatar 13929
16.
 
Re: Let's hear it for Deustchland..
Feb 7, 2005, 11:23
16.
Re: Let's hear it for Deustchland.. Feb 7, 2005, 11:23
Feb 7, 2005, 11:23
 
Somebody page Riley...
I have been summoned. LOL

Why didn't you just right click on your network adapter and select "disable"?
He may not be using Windows XP. Half-Life 2 doesn't require it according to the system requirements.

This comment was edited on Feb 7, 11:25.
17.
 
Re: Let's hear it for Deustchland..
Feb 7, 2005, 11:27
17.
Re: Let's hear it for Deustchland.. Feb 7, 2005, 11:27
Feb 7, 2005, 11:27
 
double post.
This comment was edited on Feb 7, 11:30.
18.
 
Re: Let's hear it for Deustchland..
Feb 7, 2005, 11:27
18.
Re: Let's hear it for Deustchland.. Feb 7, 2005, 11:27
Feb 7, 2005, 11:27
 
This thread is gonna bring out all the whiners, babies, idiots and morons.

Well you're here, so that's a start


19.
 
Re: Let's hear it for Deustchland..
Feb 7, 2005, 11:29
19.
Re: Let's hear it for Deustchland.. Feb 7, 2005, 11:29
Feb 7, 2005, 11:29
 
I for one didn't realize Steam was embedded/ Binded into
the product and the game engine. I

That is absolute bullshit and you know it. You were involved in the HL2 news threads prior to the release.

BTW, Who said I'm American you twit? Keep flapping those gums, maybe you will get the bullshit out eventually.

----------------------------------------------------
Zero Tolerance Games Counter-Strike: Source server.
http://www.ztgames.com
20.
 
Re: Let's hear it for Deustchland..
Feb 7, 2005, 11:29
nin
 
20.
Re: Let's hear it for Deustchland.. Feb 7, 2005, 11:29
Feb 7, 2005, 11:29
 nin
 
I have been summoned. LOL





edit:
Nin, you know that doesn't work. All evidence of a connection, including the wiring itself, has to be removed from the PC to prevent Steam from trying to log in.

I guess I've been lucky with modem use. Never had a problem...but that doesn't mean others haven't had a problem...



May 3rd, 2005 - "We are preparing to destroy you." http://www.nin.com

http://www.beck.com/news/ ? Hell Yes!
This comment was edited on Feb 7, 11:30.
171 Replies. 9 pages. Viewing page 1.
Older [  1  2  3  4  5  6  7  8  9  ] Newer