Mac to PC Gaming in Jeopardy

Yahoo! News - New GameSpy terms threaten Mac to PC online gaming is a story following up on recent reports (story) expressing concern over the future of Mac support from the gaming software middleware provider/journalism hybrid. The report describes the end of discounts based on lowered sales in Mac products coming to an end, making Mac to PC multiplayer interoperability economically unfeasible:
GameSpy's fee still ran into thousands of dollars per game, but Mac publishers were willing to pay it to put their customers on a level playing field with their PC counterparts. But now, with that discount gone, GameSpy licensing costs have skyrocketed for Mac publishers.

GameSpy is now asking for an amount that, in some cases, is the equivalent of 50 to 100 percent of the total Mac development budget, according Adams. Doubling the cost of development just to make the game play with PC users isn't something that Aspyr can afford to do, she added.

"What GameSpy is asking for now is more than what I'd pay up front for a game license," said MacSoft general manager Al Schilling. Like Aspyr, Mac game publisher MacSoft has seen its discount with GameSpy evaporate in recent months, according to Schilling.
View : : :
22 Replies. 2 pages. Viewing page 1.
Newer [  1  2  ] Older
22.
 
Re: This is no big deal.
Dec 9, 2004, 16:30
22.
Re: This is no big deal. Dec 9, 2004, 16:30
Dec 9, 2004, 16:30
 
The SDK and master servers are already there and paid for.
LOL! From your comments it is obvious that you have no idea what it really takes to run and support a large Internet server network like Gamespy's or to develop and support software which enables that network.


21.
 
Re: Ahhh, the joys of owning a Mac
Dec 9, 2004, 09:40
DG
21.
Re: Ahhh, the joys of owning a Mac Dec 9, 2004, 09:40
Dec 9, 2004, 09:40
DG
 
seems a little odd to me, though my online gaming has been almost exclusively something on a Quake engine so maybe it wouldnt.

I used to think gamespy actually paid the devs, because exclusive rights was the only reason i could fathom for people actually paying for gamespy, which i have regarded as shit ever since it stopped being a new little quake app (QuakeSpy was it?). And yes i am willing to pay for a server browser, i paid for ASE as it has been excellent for RTCW and ET.

TBH i dont see why serives for Mac games should be any less than they are for PC games with similar numbers of users, seems common sense that they should not do this - but surely they do charge less for any games that cost relatively little to support?

Avatar 14793
20.
 
Re: Ahhh, the joys of owning a Mac
Dec 9, 2004, 09:34
20.
Re: Ahhh, the joys of owning a Mac Dec 9, 2004, 09:34
Dec 9, 2004, 09:34
 
the gfx drivers and everything else are in a pretty poor state, most people estimate about 50%-70% of the framerate you get in windows

Uh... riiight.

The ATI drivers are crap. No question. The nVidia drivers, however, are not, and are at most a couple weeks behind the Windows versions (and generally much less than that; simultaneous releases are not uncommon). And people regularly report equal or greater framerate in Linux as compared to Windows.

Not that I would recommend Linux for gaming. I'm a Unix developer, have been for over a decade, and Linux on the desktop is still massively frustrating.

19.
 
Re: This is no big deal.
Dec 9, 2004, 09:32
19.
Re: This is no big deal. Dec 9, 2004, 09:32
Dec 9, 2004, 09:32
 
Traditionally discounts are based upon sales volume

That depends on your market and your product. And, frankly, in this case the market cannot bear the charges being levied -- it's a fucking stupid move on the part of Gamespy. You simply cannot charge a niche market the same price as the primary market -- the niche market doesn't have enough sales and profit to bear the burdon.

And it's not "subsidizing". Please. The SDK and master servers are already there and paid for. Yes, each additional game and gamer add some to the burdon on the network, but that's a fairly trivial incremental cost. I'm all for Gamespy licensing their tech and making a profit, but this move smacks of some upper level exec making a decision without understanding their market.

18.
 
Re: Ahhh, the joys of owning a Mac
Dec 9, 2004, 05:38
18.
Re: Ahhh, the joys of owning a Mac Dec 9, 2004, 05:38
Dec 9, 2004, 05:38
 
how do the Linux gamers cope?
The only games which get ported to Linux are major ones like Quake, Doom, and UT which don't use Gamespy to provided the master list and authentication services.

This comment was edited on Dec 9, 05:42.
17.
 
Re: Erm..
Dec 9, 2004, 05:36
17.
Re: Erm.. Dec 9, 2004, 05:36
Dec 9, 2004, 05:36
 
so by effectively denying Macs licenses to use it
Gamespy is not denying Macintosh publishers and developers licenses. It is simply now charging them the same price as their Windows brethren.


I simply stated that IGN is trying to jack up their profit margin.
But, you are wrong. Gamespy is simply no longer subsidizing Macintosh game development by offering discounts to Macintosh developers.

their license costs are close to the entire cost of porting a game)
That is only because porting a game from the PC to the Macintosh is so inexpensive. Since these Macintosh game publishers are reusing almost all of the source code and absolutely all of the art and media assets from the Windows games, porting these games to the Macintosh is a relatively cheap proposition. So, why should Gamespy subsidize it by giving Macintosh publishers and developers a discount?

PC users haven't been subsidizing Mac users either
I said PC game publishers and Gamespy have, not users.

GameSpy isn't doing much of any work these days on the backend
Gamespy has to keep its network of master list servers up and running as well as keep its CD key authentication servers updated and working properly so users can join games and hackers and pirates can't exploit them. That is no small proposition. I have played a lot of games online over the years and Gamespy provides more reliable master list servers than the developers and publishers who run their own. Gamespy's authentication servers do go down regularly but that actually is a good thing.

The article cited for this thread was badly slanted towards the Macintosh developers and publishers. You only got to read their side of the story.

This comment was edited on Dec 9, 05:50.
16.
 
Re: Ahhh, the joys of owning a Mac
Dec 9, 2004, 03:34
Duc
16.
Re: Ahhh, the joys of owning a Mac Dec 9, 2004, 03:34
Dec 9, 2004, 03:34
Duc
 
Apparently they don't, the gfx drivers and everything else are in a pretty poor state, most people estimate about 50%-70% of the framerate you get in windows.

15.
 
Re: Ahhh, the joys of owning a Mac
Dec 9, 2004, 03:31
15.
Re: Ahhh, the joys of owning a Mac Dec 9, 2004, 03:31
Dec 9, 2004, 03:31
 
Drugs, I suspect.

Usually from huffing the toner off their freshly printed Yellowdog changelog.

14.
 
Re: Ahhh, the joys of owning a Mac
Dec 9, 2004, 03:28
14.
Re: Ahhh, the joys of owning a Mac Dec 9, 2004, 03:28
Dec 9, 2004, 03:28
 
So.... how do the Linux gamers cope? Or are they mainly id engine ports?

13.
 
Ahhh, the joys of owning a Mac
Dec 9, 2004, 03:04
13.
Ahhh, the joys of owning a Mac Dec 9, 2004, 03:04
Dec 9, 2004, 03:04
 
Before the self-righteous Macoholics jump all over my ass, I have purchased severl Macs in my lifetime.

Usually to give them to people too stupid and ignorant to learn how to use a PC.

The Mac is a niche market, at best, and has some of the worst support for developing games from the manufacturer.

Hence why consoles and PC gaming is far more popular.

Well, that, and I don't have to spend 6000 dollars on a machine that I can build just as easily in the PC world for a third of the cost.

12.
 
Re: Erm..
Dec 9, 2004, 01:21
12.
Re: Erm.. Dec 9, 2004, 01:21
Dec 9, 2004, 01:21
 
#11, it's not the server browser that's the issue, it's the master server. GameSpy's package includes the ability to use their master server network, which most games are doing. However, you need a license for your game to use it, so by effectively denying Macs licenses to use it, they can not connect to the server lists PCs use, and are cut off from the crowd. Besides Valve's games, there are a lot of other games out there that use GameSpy as their master server.

#10: I never said that GameSpy wasn't a for-profit corporation; I simply stated that IGN is trying to jack up their profit margin. I have never heard of someone complaining about GS's rates or service, nor have I heard of the service costing GS money, so I would be highly surprised if they're not already making a good deal of cash on it(especially when you take in to consideration their license costs are close to the entire cost of porting a game). PC users haven't been subsidizing Mac users either; few Mac users means few new users on the Master, so there's little extra load, hence no need to charge a good deal for the license. As the Macworld article stated, GameSpy isn't doing much of any work these days on the backend, and all the Mac stuff is handled by the licensee, so there's no Mac-specific work GameSpy is putting in that needs to be subsidized.

11.
 
Erm..
Dec 9, 2004, 00:49
11.
Erm.. Dec 9, 2004, 00:49
Dec 9, 2004, 00:49
 
Call me a fool, but is this really an issue?

Does Gamespy somehow own the patent on multiplayer gaming? I'm pretty sure they dont.

I used Gamespy once or twice in the Quake days, its nothing special, its great that its included inside lots of games, but please, dont try and tell me a server browser is really that hard to implement in-house.

Get Server list, Ping the list, End.

I must be missing something, because this hardly seems like its putting Mac gaming in jeopardy.

10.
 
This is no big deal.
Dec 8, 2004, 23:53
10.
This is no big deal. Dec 8, 2004, 23:53
Dec 8, 2004, 23:53
 
PC Game developers and publishers have been in-effect subsidizing Macintosh game development since all of these affected Macintosh games are ports of completed PC games. The Macintosh game license fees from GameSpy are simply now on par with their PC breathren. The problem is that not enough Macintosh games are sold to justify the expense of licensing the various GameSpy SDK's. Macintosh game publishers will now either have to raise the price of their games to compensate for the smaller sales or go with another solution.

Traditionally discounts are based upon sales volume. The higher the sales, the higher the discount. The notion that Macintosh publishers and developers should get a price break because they sell relatively few copies of their games is ridiculous.

By the way, those of you below who think that GameSpy hasn't been a for-profit enterprise up until it was bought by IGN need to think again. The various Gamespy SDK's have have not been free or even cheap for the past few years since Gamespy developed and started licensing them to developers.

This comment was edited on Dec 8, 23:55.
9.
 
This Is Huge
Dec 8, 2004, 21:35
9.
This Is Huge Dec 8, 2004, 21:35
Dec 8, 2004, 21:35
 
Well, this is going to be huge. I've wondered for some time now how IGN would take advantage of owning the GameSpy Master System(I say this because IGN always seemed like the more profit motivated company), and this is it. By targetting the Mac market first, they're flexing their muscles, as the Mac MP market will crumble without GameSpy(there aren't enough Mac players to do Mac-only games; they'd never be enough people on a server), effectively holding the Mac companies hostage. The next target: the PC market, ripe for the picking. Many PC game makers have used GameSpy far too long to use something else, and will simply absorb the higher costs rather than do something different.

IGN is going to make a killing on this, and we're going to be the ones stuck paying for it.

8.
 
A Real Shame
Dec 8, 2004, 21:18
8.
A Real Shame Dec 8, 2004, 21:18
Dec 8, 2004, 21:18
 
I'm a PC gamer who has a Mac gamer girlfriend... so I guess she's getting an Xbox and XBL subscription for Christmas. Well, "It's good to play together!" : )

7.
 
No subject
Dec 8, 2004, 20:50
7.
No subject Dec 8, 2004, 20:50
Dec 8, 2004, 20:50
 
http://www.roosterteeth.com/archive/

and watch the Mac Gamer Switch Parody.

But honestly I cannot think of any game that I ever played on a Mac that I wanted on a PC. I mean the only games that come out now for Mac are PC converted games.

Avatar 12670
6.
 
gamespy
Dec 8, 2004, 20:36
6.
gamespy Dec 8, 2004, 20:36
Dec 8, 2004, 20:36
 
..didnt they used to be a free little app for loading quake games?

and now theyre demanding huge licensing fees?

5.
 
Re: No subject
Dec 8, 2004, 20:15
nin
5.
Re: No subject Dec 8, 2004, 20:15
Dec 8, 2004, 20:15
nin
 

I read the title, and thought the game show Jeopardy.

CURSE YOU KEN JENNINGS!


Am I the only one who thought they should fire Alex and hire Ken as the new host?

That'd wipe that smug look right off of Alex's face...



http://tds.nin.com/
4.
 
woe is mac
Dec 8, 2004, 20:14
4.
woe is mac Dec 8, 2004, 20:14
Dec 8, 2004, 20:14
 
I don't even know if that's how you spell "woe", but you know what i mean. America's Army was so cool! I don't see why GameSpy would want to cut off a source of revenue for themselves. If the mac companies can't pay it, nothing will convince them to.

3.
 
No subject
Dec 8, 2004, 19:50
3.
No subject Dec 8, 2004, 19:50
Dec 8, 2004, 19:50
 
Oooo. Smooth move Gamespy.

22 Replies. 2 pages. Viewing page 1.
Newer [  1  2  ] Older