#8 Malakai

So how come you are not playing Operation Flashpoint.

All these arcadey kiddy shooters with friggin' laser beams are bull.

I might point out that Raven Shield was PC only. The consoles got "Rainbow Six 3" instead, and it was a rather different game, delivered significantly later after its own extended development cycle.
I know you should wait until a game is released to bash it, but it's really hard when they release videos like the R6:4 trailer.

I'd have been happy paying for Raven Shield with upgraded graphics, weapons and physics, but with the same core gameplay.

This seems to be a continuing trend in the gaming industry.
Heck, I still vividly remember my disappointment with the I'76 to I'82 transition.

While we're on the subject - what if there was a Raven-Shield-like game where one man in the squad was responsible for carrying "the bag". If you wanted to swap weapons or get more ammo (aside from what you were carrying), you'd have to go to the bag and get it.
Or perhaps the bag is just an item (albeit a large and cumbersome one), and anyone on the team can carry it and drop it, but while they're carrying it, they're slower, noisier, and can only use a sidearm. Imagine the tactics. (Ooh...covert bag stealage for crippling the opposing team...)

I didn't mean that we needed more of the "Sum" John Clark, just more John Clark. The dude's the closest thing to James Bond the US has, and then some.

Uh, Warhawk I said I liked the film version of Clear and Present Danger, not The Sum of All Fears.

I realize that, I guess I should have clarified it was a general statement on books->movies ("Sum" as an example, though, since it was mentioned by someone else).


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* Warhawk *
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Please! This is supposed to be a happy occasion. Let's not bicker and argue about who killed who.

Maybe it's not right to go one about the fact aht it'll be available on consoles. Fair enough that it is. What i'm worried about is if it's a damn console-port ot the PC. THAT is something to get annoyed about. A game that should be realistic and wonderful in every way was dumbed down to allow the console people to play the game. I hate that. Intensely. I'm drunk...

Uh, Warhawk I said I liked the film version of Clear and Present Danger, not The Sum of All Fears.

I agree completely, the games they've made since switching to the Unreal engine just do not feel as good as the older ones. They are clunkier..but fun in their own way. Just not as fun as the original series.

Haha, nice.

I don't know, but the original R6 and Rogue Spear really did it for me. They were just fun, you know? SWAT 3 was a great title as well with a different angle to play. Since then, while the R6 games have added more features I used to want (like viewable weapons), they just feel worse to me. I don't know. Maybe I'm nostalgic but I sort of liked the streamlined interfaces, easy to use multiplayer, smooth/fast action that was unforgiving and violent and coop that made your eyes bleed.

Does anyone remember the Defend coop gametype from one of RS's addons? (I think it was the Urban Ops addon). Each regular map in this gametype had a central location selected with a big red button added into it. You spawned in around it and the AI basically had a "get to the button and hit it at all costs" mentality. They would assault from all sides, toss grenades... Great stuff, and the only way to win would be to prevent them from breaching the room and killing them all off.

How is it that since then we get more patches, less gametypes, slower and more annoying interfaces and braindead stuff like Black Arrow? Hell, R6 was faster-paced than Black Arrow without sacrificing gameplay options.

True, but the series has always been a PC tactical shooter ported to console months after it's PC release.
This press release sounds as though they're building a console game that will also be released on the PC.

Well, Raven Shield was announced on PC and Xbox:

http://www.bluesnews.com/cgi-bin/board.pl?action=viewthread&threadid=33315

Mobygames, however, suggests that the PS2 version was launched simultaneously with the PC version:

http://www.mobygames.com/game/versions/gameId,8721/

Call me crazy, but I think I'll wait to play the game before I trash it.

True, but the series has always been a PC tactical shooter ported to console months after it's PC release.
This press release sounds as though they're building a console game that will also be released on the PC.]

Ah, you got to it before me.. yes, the difference here is that they specifically announced to be developing it with the consoles in mind.

We don't need that, they can port it to the consoles AFTER it's out for PC , thank you very much.

So what do we get? Dumbed down gameplay, and though that's arguable, definitely dumbed down graphics.

wonder if they have started to work on the patches yet...

True, but the series has always been a PC tactical shooter ported to console months after it's PC release.
This press release sounds as though they're building a console game that will also be released on the PC.

So they made it compatible with console losers... Hurray for us I think or something.

This has been said, but maybe not clearly enough.

Rainbox Six was available on the Playstation, N64, Dreamcast and Gameboy Color.

Rogue Spear on the PS, DC and GBA.

Raven Shield was launched on all 3 of the current major consoles.

There are reasons to be leery about RS4, but this isn't one of them. The series has been console compatible for five years now. The time for "OMFG their making it go to consoles" was back when we were all using Win98. Come on, people.

So they made it compatible with console losers... Hurray for us I think or something.

You dumb french bastards!

when R6: Rogue Spear was out (I think that was the one). I was looking for a good tactical shooter, tried SWAT 3: CQB and R6:Rogue Spear. I ended up choosing SWAT 3 and was not disappointed with my decision. The "physics" of R6 and how it felt playing (felt way too fluid for a tactical shooter) didn't impress me at all.

I konw a lot of years have past since then (played SWAT 3 as recently as this past summer), so I was wondering if the R6 series has gotten better. I'd be willing to try the demo for this one, but have already got SWAT 4 on my list.

"This time It's Personal!" (line from the teaser trailer)

*groans*

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"Sometimes I dream about....cheese. Here, have a medkit"
- Half Life 2 NPC

I actually liked Clear and Present Danger the movie quite a bit, and yes I have read the book. It certainly deviated from the book quite a bit but you have to if you're going to squeeze 850 pages into two hours.

I've read every Clancy novel (in order even - geek, I know) and many of the OpCenter/Politica/Ruthless.com/PowerPlays/Net Force books in addition to SSN, Marine, etc. As a big Clancy fan, I never even saw "Sum of All Fears" - I was too pissed about all the changes to the story to even care about it.

From Reel.com:

The novel The Sum of All Fears (written in 1991) was a gripping portrayal of how a group of Arab terrorists detonate a tactical nuclear warhead at the Super Bowl, killing everyone in attendance, including the president. Paul Attanasio and Daniel Pyne's screenplay abandons that more realistic setup in favor of a somewhat goofy scenario. Their Fears is about how a Jörg Haider-like Austrian industrialist (Alan Bates) uses a loose nuke to pit Russia and America against each other, hoping their mutually assured destruction will clear the way for the Fourth Reich.

Yeah, real similar to the book.

You know, if you want to make a movie witha certain plot, make it, but don't slap the name of an author/title on it when the movie doesn't follow the story in the fucking book. Damn that shit pisses me off.

/rant off


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* Warhawk *
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Please! This is supposed to be a happy occasion. Let's not bicker and argue about who killed who.

"I'm getting sick of fairy tale shooters now. I want realism"

I agree 200% , Ghost Recon 2 for the XBOX is a Joke, AI sucks. I am cosnidering reinstalling Rogue Spear back on my PC for a little more realism...
Maybe even, gasp..Operation Flashpoint!!.. Dare I say a game where you could walk through the bushed if you wanted or even steal a tractor and ride off into the sunset!!!

The other R6's were released on consoles, too. Why are people so scared all of a sudden?

Not that I think this will be any good, Ubi has shown no interest in making a game with modern graphics, and the gameplay will be dumbed down (not because this is being developed for consoles, but because that's what they've done with each new installment).