Dear Hpankin. Please shut the fuck up and go away. I was not talking to you with any of my posts, so mind your own damn business. Thank you.

Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former.

-Albert Einstein

Oh, and my vid card question was this: where can I find a GeForce 6800 Ultra? No one has this card in stock! Are they making each of these cards by hand or something? I have the image of a guy with a soldering iron, a stack of unfinished 6800's next to him, and pot of black coffee.

Newegg has them here:
http://www.newegg.com/app/ViewProductDesc.asp?description=14-130-196&depa=0

You're right though, they are very hard to find.

Here also:
http://www.compucare.com/asp/viewitem.asp?idproduct=vidgai025

This comment was edited on Aug 13, 10:55.

I don't know where you live (US or UK) Hpankin, but scan.co.uk have a load of the 6800 Ultra cards. I bought an XFX Ultra card myself. Bloody good card that is. Playing it at 1280x1024 4xAA Ultra High graphics, and not a single slowdown. I love the heat shimmer effects too. Never seen those done (if at all) so well in any other game.

Show me a SINGLE review on a major website or magazine that gives Doom 3 less than 60% or 6/10. You can't. Because what you say about Doom 3 has no basis in fact.

Firstly, you're placing way too much importance on printed reviews. Sure, it's the reviewer's job to see and experience games with a more critical eye than the rest of us, but the skills required for being a critic are not handed out on Critic Graduation Day. I'm sure you don't agree with Peter Travers or Roger Ebert about all their movie reviews, right? Some of those game reviewers' opinions may be overstated. Or they may have a hidden agenda. Hey, just like our opinions can!

Secondly, everyone's opinion about Doom 3 is actually 100% true. For them. Facts enter into it, of course, but everyone has their own opinion about those facts.

For example, you say that one of the reasons Doom 3 is a great shooter is because it feels more creative than a WWII shooter. Fair enough. But many would disagree that this element can be argued on merit. All those WWII shooters are based on an actual event so their content carries the kind of weight behind it that a sci-fi suspense game can't have.

My point is that some people may say Doom 3 isn't a great game because it lacks this weight.

One thing is certain, though. No matter what's being argued on this or any other forum, you can count on minimal civility.

Oh, and my vid card question was this: where can I find a GeForce 6800 Ultra? No one has this card in stock! Are they making each of these cards by hand or something? I have the image of a guy with a soldering iron, a stack of unfinished 6800's next to him, and pot of black coffee.

Dunno if it has been posted here yet since I am too lazy to go through all of these flame infested posts, but anyway here it is:

http://www.forumplanet.com/gamespy/topic.asp?fid=1422&tid=1445961

Roger, Bravo Delta, this is Sitting Duck. I have Bogie Queen in my sights, and I'm, uh, going to shoot bullets at it now.
- Unknown Soldier

1. Per-polygon hit detection
2. Advanced physics engine
3. Good Soundtrack that does not spoil the mood of the game.
4. Dark, creepy atmosphere
5. well designed levels with a lot of interesting machines and neat looking technology
6. Simplicity and elegance of Design
7. Really good Art/Design work in general.
8. Doom 3 feels more creative than just another WW2 shooter. And it goes way beyond the original Doom, so it is more than just a remake.

Fair enough. I disagree, but I have never actually seen someone list off why they thought the game was so great.

As far as not coming up with something, I have checked this page about once every two hours. Because I don't live on this message board unlike some people. And I'm not sure why I take the time to respond to you.

Well, my guess is that we both like arguing and gaming so this is just a natural place for the two to meet. That and I am extremely bored.

But I don't understand this mindless negativity you spew everywhere about it. Especially when the vast majority of people who have reviewed it like it. You state your negative opinions as though they were fact, and they are not.

I don't think it's mindless negativity, or at least didn't intend it to come off that way. I gave a laundry list for why I thought Doom 3 was a good but not great shooter. Most reviewers disagree with me, and many gamers do too. And I don't think the game sucked at all, but it was very forgettable...the bite didn't match the bark. If I had to review it I would give it 80-85%, 4/5 stars, or whatever that equates to. The fact that alot of other gamers on this forum and elsewhere agree with me underscores the divide between what reviewers like and what the public likes.

Wow. You came up with one semi-negative review out of 35 positive reviews. I'd say Doom 3 is still winning by a VERY LARGE MARGIN.

And another thing. Those games you mentioned that are supposed to be superior to Doom 3 in some way, HAVE NOT BEEN RELEASED YET. (As you said yourself.)

You know nothing about those games except for previews and hype. So to compare them to a game like Doom 3 that has been released, tested, played, and reviewed is utterly ridiculous.

As far as not coming up with something, I have checked this page about once every two hours. Because I don't live on this message board unlike some people. And I'm not sure why I take the time to respond to you.

As far as my list is concerned:

1. Per-polygon hit detection
2. Advanced physics engine
3. Good Soundtrack that does not spoil the mood of the game.
4. Dark, creepy atmosphere
5. well designed levels with a lot of interesting machines and neat looking technology
6. Simplicity and elegance of Design
7. Really good Art/Design work in general.
8. Doom 3 feels more creative than just another WW2 shooter. And it goes way beyond the original Doom, so it is more than just a remake.

I realise that you will do your best to pick apart these thngs, but let me state in advance that I don't care.

Also, PC Gamer is one of the best selling and most widely read gaming magazines around, and yet you think their reviews and opinions are inferior to your own. Another example of how ridiculous your statements are.

And maybe if you are really feeling into this pointless argument, you can refute every single one of the reviews I mentioned in my earlier post.

I have never said Doom 3 was perfect. There have been better games made. There will be better games made in the future, possibly one of the games you mentioned. I respect your opinion for not liking the game.

But I don't understand this mindless negativity you spew everywhere about it. Especially when the vast majority of people who have reviewed it like it. You state your negative opinions as though they were fact, and they are not.


Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former.

-Albert Einstein

1. No use key
2. 5.1 audio
3. It's dark (as opposed to being bright...like Farcry)
4. It's not a WW2 theme
5. The support by id and community. Mods,levels,sounds etc.

Not bad. You've come up with something, and that's more than I can say for our friend Celestial Toad. Plus, you made me laugh, which is always a bonus

This comment was edited on Aug 12, 23:05.

"Ok, give me 5 reasons, other than graphics, that Doom 3 is the best FPS to come out in the last 3-4 years"

1. No use key
2. 5.1 audio
3. It's dark (as opposed to being bright...like Farcry)
4. It's not a WW2 theme
5. The support by id and community. Mods,levels,sounds etc.

ok..so u might think those aren't good reasons. I do love Farcry though. The perfect scenario would be the outdoor graphics of Farcry combined with the indoor graphics of Doom 3. Now that's an engine! Personally i'm waiting for a new Hexen or Heretic with a new engine. The new Doom engine would do just fine with those themes.

Cheers
<wasp>

Show me a SINGLE review on a major website or magazine that gives Doom 3 less than 60% or 6/10. You can't. Because what you say about Doom 3 has no basis in fact.

Here ya go buddy: http://www.gamesfirst.com/reviews/08.10.04/Doom3/Doom3.html

3/5 stars = 60%.

I don't know when 60% became out cutoff point, but there's your proof.

Oh and by the way, I don't exactly spend a lot of time reading your meaningless posts, as you have invalidated yourself already.

Well, I will repeat this part since you seem to mysteriously only read the parts of my post that you have (in your warped mind) a valid comment for. So, here it is again in case you 'missed' it:

Ok, give me 5 reasons, other than graphics, that Doom 3 is the best FPS to come out in the last 3-4 years. Why does it deserve a better score (94%) than any other FPS during that time?

This will be the third time this text has been posted in the last five responses. Hey, that's 3/5 or 60%. You should be familiar with those numbers by now. And if you don't respond because you can't defend your position, don't worry, you wouldn't be the first to draw a blank when asked a real question about Doom 3.

The vast majority of people who play Doom 3 love it. Every single review I've seen for Doom 3 has been very favorable. You are just one person who expresses mindless hatred for a game, and you can't back up anything you say.

Show me a SINGLE review on a major website or magazine that gives Doom 3 less than 60% or 6/10. You can't. Because what you say about Doom 3 has no basis in fact.

Oh and by the way, I don't exactly spend a lot of time reading your meaningless posts, as you have invalidated yourself already.

Doom 3 is an amazing game.

Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former.

-Albert Einstein

I've already given up waiting for responses to my vid card question so I may as well watch this debate unfold.

What's your video card question? Maybe we can help out.

Ok, give me 5 reasons, other than graphics, that Doom 3 is the best FPS to come out in the last 3-4 years. Why does it deserve a better score (94 than any other FPS during that time?

Now that's a good question. I've already given up waiting for responses to my vid card question so I may as well watch this debate unfold.

For what it's worth, every message board I've been on features very similar opinions on Doom 3: a majority of "great engine, bad game" and at the same time, a vast minority of "a classic FPS, the best shooter in years."

And 94% is higher than two of the games you mentioned. Half-Life 2 has not been released yet so do not be so pretentious as to mention that.

You really are dense. None of those games have been released yet. That's why I said "bring on the real FPS games of '04" as in "I am waiting for these games to come out because they aren't out yet". Of course 94% is higher than any of those games have gotten...they aren't done yet! And btw, I stopped giving PC Gamer any respect long ago when all of their talented writers (and the editor-in-chief) left and they revamped the magazine. Sometimes change isn't a good thing.

I can prove my claim that Doom 3 deserves respect with a list of reviews. Here is a partial list of Doom 3 reviews, all of which hold the game itself, including the engine in high favor.

First off, that doesn't prove a damn thing. Black and White was praised by every publication and website ever and almost universally hated in the gaming community. And guess what score PC Gamer gave it...94%. In fact, that ridiculous review of a very lame 'game' was the reason I canceled my subscription (actually it was just the straw that broke the camel's back so to speak). Despite all that, I think that Black and White deserves much more respect than Doom 3. That 'game' at least tried to do something new.

So tell me why, 8 years after the 3d FPS genre was created, that this game deserves so many accolades when it: has less than 20 hours of gameplay, has weak AI, offers no replay value, has very limited multiplayer support, AND doesn't offer a speck of new gameplay?

The exact same damn thing happened with Warcraft 3 (except it actually added something new to the RTS genre with the 'hero' characters AND it has pretty substantial multiplayer support). It was endlessly hyped and then got rave reviews from all the magazines and websites. Then gamers responded with a resounding 'meh'. Both games have a very "been there, done that" feel to them. This is the influence that companies with heavy pedigrees like Blizzard and Id have on games.

Doom 3 is an amazing game.

Ok, give me 5 reasons, other than graphics, that Doom 3 is the best FPS to come out in the last 3-4 years. Why does it deserve a better score (94%) than any other FPS during that time?

The engine deserves my respect, and it gets it. The game deserves none and gets none. I give Id credit for making a gorgeous game engine and nothing more. Bring on the real FPS games of '04: HL2, SW Battlefront, MOH Pacific Assault, et. alia.

This is amazing. There are major magazines like PC Gamer giving Doom 3 a 94% rating, and yet you say it deserves no respect as if your opinion matters at all.

And 94% is higher than two of the games you mentioned. Half-Life 2 has not been released yet so do not be so pretentious as to mention that.

I can prove my claim that Doom 3 deserves respect with a list of reviews. Here is a partial list of Doom 3 reviews, all of which hold the game itself, including the engine in high favor.


PC Gamer 94 %
Gamespy - 4.5/5
FileFront - 5/5
3DAvenue (92%)
Primotech (92%)
Gameguru Mania (91%)
GameMethod (89%)
HomeLAN Fed (88%)
modDB (85%)
PixelRage (82%)
The Wasteland (4/10)
Game Over Magazine - 89%
Speeed's Review - 9.3/10
Forbes - 4/5
CounterFrag - 95%
Inside Gamer Online - 9/10
Warcry News Network - 10/10
eToyChest - 95%
PGNx - 9.4/10
OzForces Gaming Nation - 9.3/10
Mansteaks Quarterly Gaming Groove (95%)
Full Spectrum Gaming - 9/10
2404.org - 9.8/10
ModDB - 8.5/10
Primotechnology - 92%
RedAddedBaboon.com
Eurogamer - 9/10
Gamehelper - 9.3/10
ToTheGame - 9/10

I believe the above reviews speak for Doom 3 better than I ever could. Doom 3 is an amazing game.


Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former.

-Albert Einstein
This comment was edited on Aug 12, 20:02.

To put it simply, you're a fucking idiot. Doom 3 is a damn fine game. It is not perfect, but it deserves respect. And to not give Id any credit AT ALL for it just shows your own ignorance regarding first person shooters in general.

The engine deserves my respect, and it gets it. The game deserves none and gets none. I give Id credit for making a gorgeous game engine and nothing more. Bring on the real FPS games of '04: HL2, SW Battlefront, MOH Pacific Assault, et. alia.

Suck it Toad.

Only one thing is infinite, Celestial Toad's stupidity.

- Several anonymous sources

This comment was edited on Aug 12, 19:53.

Besides, what have you done for us lately Id?

Doom 3.
Exactly. Not much.

To put it simply, you're a fucking idiot. Doom 3 is a damn fine game. It is not perfect, but it deserves respect. And to not give Id any credit AT ALL for it just shows your own ignorance regarding first person shooters in general.

Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former.

-Albert Einstein

I don't mean to hijack this thread but what is the deal with the lack of GeForce 6800 Ultra inventory? It's been this way since the cards became available! I'd even pay a little extra to get the ones they hide under the counter. Specifically looking for BFG, since they rock like a cockfight.

Besides, what have you done for us lately Id?

Doom 3.

Exactly. Not much.

Besides, what have you done for us lately Id?

Doom 3.

Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former.

-Albert Einstein