Out of the Blue

Well I managed to burn out the motor in my cheapo replacement coffee grinder in one day (my fault - I overloaded it)... so in desperation I managed to get the older (but now actually less-broken) grinder to work again. It's a little flaky still, but the balky safety device has not been circumvented, so I am safe for the time being from grinding myself up along with my coffee beans.

R.I.P. Richard Biggs.

Stories of the Day: Swedish elk steals bicycle.
Where the coming attractions are the trailers themselves.
Books get interactive makeover. Soon we'll update those boring paintings.
Science!: Disease fear in doctors' ties.
Army Reboots GIs' Tired Fatigues.
Electric Shocks to Fight the Flab.
Image of the Day: Fumbling Crook. Thanks Ant.
Media of the Day: Witness the Cheatar!
Thanks Mike Martinez
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49 Replies. 3 pages. Viewing page 1.
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49.
 
Re: Slightly off topic
May 26, 2004, 09:08
nin
 
49.
Re: Slightly off topic May 26, 2004, 09:08
May 26, 2004, 09:08
 nin
 
Better that than the vibrating broom they were selling awhile ago. Some Harry Potter thing that I think Blue linked to. The buyer comments were pretty funny...

'I bought this Harry Potter Broom for my daughter. I can't get her to stop riding it.'

Something along those lines. Anybody else remember this?


Yep. That was funny as hell...

Jesus...built my car. It's a love affair (mainly Jesus and my hotrod).
48.
 
Re: No subject
May 25, 2004, 23:14
48.
Re: No subject May 25, 2004, 23:14
May 25, 2004, 23:14
 
Fascinating that this just popped up after my 9/11 post.

http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&u=/ap/20040526/ap_on_re_mi_ea/al_qaida&cid=540&ncid=716

Report: al-Qaida Ranks Swelling Worldwide

The Bush junta has done a great job fomenting terrorism. Who profits from that?

Who wants to bet me that between now and the election we'll see another major "terrorist" attack and we'll also see OBL pulled out of hat?


"If you're not ready to die for it, put the word 'freedom' out of your vocabulary."
- Malcolm X
"And then, suddenly and without warning, it turned into a real-life case of hungry, hungry hippos."
- Stephen Colbert
47.
 
Re: No subject
May 25, 2004, 21:33
47.
Re: No subject May 25, 2004, 21:33
May 25, 2004, 21:33
 
Hell, I'll go you one better than that. This book is the bible on CIA coups.

http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/1567512526/qid=1084823071/sr=2-1/ref=sr_2_1/104-2363293-2125524

The next thing I'm looking to pick up is this book....

The Other Side of Deception: A Rogue Agent Exposes the Mossad's Secret Agenda

http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/0060176350/qid=1085533822/sr=1-4/ref=sr_1_4/104-2363293-2125524?v=glance&s=books

I've worked with a few ex-Mossad guys. The company I worked for was based in Ra'anana, Israel. They dealt primarily with threat analysis, surveillance and public safety. These guys build spectral listening systems and all manner of scary shit. While they never got into any details about the sort of stuff they did, they did drop some interesting info in a general sort of way about stuff like cell phone bombs. Take a look at the following article, (http://www.newsfactor.com/perl/story/6163.html), it's kind of ironic that it was Mossad that first developed and utilized these things. Anyway, should be an interesting read.



"If you're not ready to die for it, put the word 'freedom' out of your vocabulary."
- Malcolm X
This comment was edited on May 25, 21:34.
"And then, suddenly and without warning, it turned into a real-life case of hungry, hungry hippos."
- Stephen Colbert
46.
 
Re: Slightly off topic
May 25, 2004, 20:56
46.
Re: Slightly off topic May 25, 2004, 20:56
May 25, 2004, 20:56
 
There's something wrong here isn't there?

All it tells me is the mothers of the girls that get these dolls are overweight.

Better that than the vibrating broom they were selling awhile ago. Some Harry Potter thing that I think Blue linked to. The buyer comments were pretty funny...

'I bought this Harry Potter Broom for my daughter. I can't get her to stop riding it.'

Something along those lines. Anybody else remember this?

Trying to get off the doom cloud,



-TPFKAS2S
http://www.braglio.com

There is a tragic flaw in our precious Constitution, and I don’t know what can be done to fix it. This is it: Only nut cases want to be president. -- Kurt Vonnegut
-TPFKAS2S
Avatar 10139
45.
 
No subject
May 25, 2004, 20:47
45.
No subject May 25, 2004, 20:47
May 25, 2004, 20:47
 
anyone who thinks the USA wasnt involved in coordinating 9/11 needs to take a look into the documents on Operation: Northwoods

http://abcnews.go.com/sections/us/DailyNews/jointchiefs_010501.html

_____________________________________________
Give me slack. Or kill me.
______________________________________________
"When the bomb drops it'll be a bank holiday
Everybody happy in their tents and caravans
Everybody happy in their ignorance and apathy
No one realizes until the television breaks down..."

- SUBHUMANS
44.
 
Slightly off topic
May 25, 2004, 20:45
WarPig
 
44.
Slightly off topic May 25, 2004, 20:45
May 25, 2004, 20:45
 WarPig
 
So I'm shopping online at Amazon for a birthday present for my six year old niece who's lately into Mary Kate and Ashley stuff. As I'm about to purchase a couple dolls I notice in the Customers who bought this item also bought these books: section that this book was second on the list:

The Ultimate Weight Solution: The 7 Keys to Weight Loss Freedom by Phil McGraw

There's something wrong here isn't there?

Anyway, I ended up getting her some Gameboy game instead.

-------------------------------------------------------
WarPig's link of the week:
http://www.lostandfrowned.com/eightball.html
________________________________

GO SEAHAWKS!
Avatar 1750
43.
 
Re: 9-11 revealed
May 25, 2004, 20:12
43.
Re: 9-11 revealed May 25, 2004, 20:12
May 25, 2004, 20:12
 
A firend of mine is a structural engineer, and he said the buildings did exactly what they were designed to do - collapse like accordians. Otherwise they fall like a tree, and you can well imagine the collateral damage in falling like that. As for the original poster, he makes some interesting points, but it doesn't really mean a great deal overall. That sort of thing is the dog and pony show. Donald Sutherland's character in Stone's J.F.K. said it best...

Jim Garrison: I never realized Kennedy was so dangerous to the establishment. Is that why?

X: Well that's the real question, isn't it? Why? The how and the who is just scenery for the public. Oswald, Ruby, Cuba, the Mafia. Keeps 'em guessing like some kind of parlor game, prevents 'em from asking the most important question, why? Why was Kennedy killed? Who benefited? Who has the power to cover it up? Who?

Jim Garrison: I don't, I can't... I can't believe they killed him because he wanted to change things. In our time. In our country.

X: Well they've been doing it all through history. Kings are killed, Mr. Garrison, politics is power, nothing more! Oh, don't take my word for it, don't believe me. Do your own work, your own thinking.

In strategic political analyis there is always one question that always presides over anything else, cui bono. Who benefits? I always find it amusing that people don't understand what real power is and what some people will do to achieve it and maintain it. You can look at psych studies from the AMA going back 50 years and they'll all tell you the same thing about real power hungry people, most of them are literal psychopaths. Most aren't overtly violent, but the behaivour manifests itself in many different forms. Whether it's a mob boss, despot or CEO of a huge multinational, they're a lot more similar psychologically than most people would suspect.

Was AQ responsible for 9/11? Possibly. Drawing the U.S. into heightened and extended conflict in the Middle-East is good for them because it helps polarize the entire Middle-Eastern problem. The longer and bloodier it is, the more successful in recruiting people to their cause (which is getting the west and western interests out of the Middle-East entirely and getting rid of Israel as well).

However, there are power cabals out there which probably knew, if not actively fomented and encouraged (subversively) groups like the AQ to commit to something big, knowing full well it would be the catalyst that could both greatly increase their own wealth and power. Hell, the Project for the New American Century called it themselves.

Further, the process of transformation, even if it brings revolutionary change, is likely to be a long one, absent some catastrophic and catalyzing event – like a new Pearl Harbor.

http://www.newamericancentury.org/RebuildingAmericasDefenses.pdf

9/11 was most definitly a conspiracy - on several levels. There are simply too many points that don't jibe about the whole affair. The entire thing smacks of a classic Machiavellian ploy. My personal belief is that AQ was responsible for 9/11 directly. I also believe that there were certain powers that be that new and let it happen because they knew they stood to benefit immensely from it.

When you look at the history of coup d'etats, you understand that these sorts of things will always succeed in the short term, but fail in the long term. Regardless, they'll continue to happen so long as the vast majority of people are politically illiterate and apathetic. Just look at some of the responses from the small sample of posts on this board. The ignorant dismiss any conspiratorial possibility simply because they lack the background knowledge to understand that these sorts of events can or even would be engineered by those in power to increase and maintain that power. They simply cannot believe anyone would go to those lengths for power. Yet, by the same token they have zero problem with accepting that the mob or street gangs will kill people without batting an eyelash for considerably less. And that, is how coup d'etats succeed.

Anyway, I've long since given up railing about those sorts of injustices because most people simply won't believe it. Sometimes I wish I lacked a moral compass because it would be incredibly easy to acquire power otherwise.

Terry Pratchett has an incredible grasp on the whole issue of governance with his character, Havelock Vetinari.

The Patrician steepled his hands and looked at Vimes over the top of them.

'Let me give you some advice, Captain,' he said.

'Yes, sir?'

'It may help you make some sense of the world.'

'Sir.'

'I believe you find life such a problem because you think there are the good people and the bad people,' said the man. 'You're wrong, of course. There are, always and only, the bad people, but some of them are on opposite sides.'
He waved his thin hand towards the city and walked over to the window.

'A great rolling sea of evil,' he said, almost proprietorially. 'Shallower in some places, of course, but deeper, oh, so much deeper in others. But people like you put together little rafts of rules and vaguely good intentions and say, this is the opposite, this will triumph in the end. Amazing!' He slapped Vimes good-naturedly on the back.

'Down there,' he said, 'are people who will follow any dragon, worship any god, ignore any iniquity. All out of a kind of humdrum, everyday badness. Not the really high, creative loathsomeness of the great sinners, but a sort of mass-produced darkness of the soul. Sin, you might say, without a trace of originality. They accept evil not because they say yes, but because they don't say no. I'm sorry if this offends you,' he added, patting the captain's shoulder, 'but you fellows really need us.'

'Yes, sir?' said Vimes quietly.

'Oh, yes. We're the only ones who know how to make things work. You see, the only thing the good people are good at is overthrowing the bad people. And you're good at that, I'll grant you. But the trouble is that it's the only thing you're good at. One day it's the ringing of the bells and the casting down of the evil tyrant, and the next it's everyone sitting around complaining that ever since the tyrant was overthrown no-one's been taking out the trash. Because the bad people know how to plan. It's part of the specification, you might say. Every evil tyrant has a plan to rule the world. The good people don't seem to have the knack.'

'Maybe. But you're wrong about the rest!' said Vimes. 'It's just because people are afraid, and alone—' He paused. It sounded pretty hollow, even to him.

He shrugged. 'They're just people,' he said. 'They're just doing what people do. Sir.'

Lord Vetinari gave him a friendly smile.

'Of course, of course,' he said. 'You have to believe that, I appreciate. Otherwise you'd go quite mad. Otherwise you'd think you're standing on a feather-thin bridge over the vaults of Hell. Otherwise existence would be a dark agony and the only hope would be that there is no life after death. I quite understand.'

This comment was edited on May 25, 20:17.
"And then, suddenly and without warning, it turned into a real-life case of hungry, hungry hippos."
- Stephen Colbert
42.
 
Coffee Grinder
May 25, 2004, 19:39
42.
Coffee Grinder May 25, 2004, 19:39
May 25, 2004, 19:39
 
Let us know if you purchase a new grinder, Blue. I for one would be interested in the recommendation.

41.
 
Re: 9-11 revealed
May 25, 2004, 19:07
41.
Re: 9-11 revealed May 25, 2004, 19:07
May 25, 2004, 19:07
 
meh, couple of points:

- My oven cooks at a higher tempreture than the jet fuel in that post.

- When they blow buildings up, dont they drill holes into the support wals and then pack explosives into the hole?

maybe its just me, but im still in the 'terrorists with planes' school of thought.


On a lghter note as requested by Bronco and commented on by Dan:

Ive proved my theory multiple times by watching a trailer and then watching the film, predicting most of what happens

Now i jsut try and go by word of mouth and watch the film knowing as little as possible, same with games, i try and stay away from pre-release media.

------
Bullets taste like chicken!
------
Diablo & Diablo 2 for the DS, it makes sense Blizzard!
40.
 
No subject
May 25, 2004, 18:43
40.
No subject May 25, 2004, 18:43
May 25, 2004, 18:43
 
I'm suprised no one has commented on the fact that today is Towel Day. I just want to say that the Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy series is utterly brilliant. I read all of them recently and found them to be some of the funniest and most amazing books I have ever read. Classic stuff. Douglas Adams is sorely missed


Lose it? I didn't lose it. It's not like, "Whoops! Where'd my job go?" I QUIT.
This comment was edited on May 25, 18:50.
Who knows but that, on the lower frequencies, I speak for you?
http://citizenb.com/ - Now at v1.1
39.
 
mkay
May 25, 2004, 18:11
39.
mkay May 25, 2004, 18:11
May 25, 2004, 18:11
 
WTC - Some people haven't upgraded their tinfoil hats, so just a reminder to those in need...make sure you use proper materials!

www.stopabductions.com

RIP Richard Biggs -

Wondering if EB or BestBuy will have Thief 3 today or tomorrow...

38.
 
Re: RIP
May 25, 2004, 17:59
38.
Re: RIP May 25, 2004, 17:59
May 25, 2004, 17:59
 
Mr. Biggs was definately one of THE reasons for watching B5. He was a great performer and a true credit to his peers. His work will be missed. I'd like to express my condolences to his family and friends. Rather than goodbye, let's just say...'till we meet again!

Cpl Hans C. Varn USMC
Semper Fidelis!

This comment was edited on May 25, 18:00.
37.
 
Re: 9-11 revealed
May 25, 2004, 17:51
indiv
 
37.
Re: 9-11 revealed May 25, 2004, 17:51
May 25, 2004, 17:51
 indiv
 
Again, I'm not ruling out a demolition of the towers. But so far all I've seen is bad journalism and really bad science. So I think I'll stay skeptical until some real proof is brought forth.

Oh, come on. You're leaving yourself an opening just in case the crackpot conspiracy theorist is right? Just in case "Geronimo Jones" has brought us the most valuable information we've ever heard? (actually google search and you'll find that controlled demolition isn't an original idea by this guy)

Let me get this straight, now. The owner of the towers is motivated by a huge insurance payout to destroy the towers, so he rigs up explosives. It all works out perfectly, and nobody suspects a thing! But then in a PBS interview he ADMITS that he "pulled" the building, where "pull" clearly must only mean he destroyed the building? Surely I'm not the only one who sees something wrong with this.

Further, the firefighters who provide their anecdote in the .mpg video about how it looked like there were demolition charges (let's assume they weren't just providing an analogy as to what it looked like) clearly show in the video using their hand movements that the charges were going off from the top floor to the bottom. Go ahead, watch the video and come back, I'll wait. So that means that the entire building was wired with explosives, not just the basement! And nobody noticed the hundreds (perhaps thousands) of man hours necessary to wire every floor of a building of that size????? Gee, the firefighters just couldn't have been providing an analogy to describe what the building collapsing in on itself looked like.

The Bill Biggart photograph showing a "clearly explosive event" must be conclusive evidence. Except that this explosion has not affected the side of the building that Biggart is looking at. So "they" must have wired up the building to collapse it, but only the explosives on one side of the building went off? Further, that's a horrible controlled explosion--look at that debris fly everywhere. Also, that photo is copyright. Did the author really get permission to use it?

I could go on and on, but I can't sit here all day. The sad part is that if you search for scientific 911 analysis or something similar on Google, all the top hits are a bunch of conspiracy-theory sites. Probably the most rediculous thing about the site though is that the author appeals to common sense a lot. HOWEVER, unless you're some sort of scientist in a field related to the article or someone with massive experience in the field, you can't use common sense because you have no scientific intuition on which common sense is formed. What the hell makes you think that your common sense about the tensile strength of steel at some temperature and the behavior of a collapsing building is correct? "Oh, because it's common sense!" WELL IT'S NOT COMMON SENSE. Yeesh.

36.
 
Re: 9-11 revealed
May 25, 2004, 16:58
36.
Re: 9-11 revealed May 25, 2004, 16:58
May 25, 2004, 16:58
 
I'm not really gonna buy into this. It's a lot of uncited information, unacreditted witnesses, MSPaint drawn documents, and general silliness. Lots of unsubstantiated evidence.

If you believe that this is all a big conspiracy maybe you should start wearing a tin foil hat SO THE GOVERNMENT CAN'T READ YOUR THOUGHTS. As Zathrus said, governments can't govern right, much less weave a tangled web of intrigue. Hell, our current president can't even eat a pretzel without nearly choking to death. Conspiracies don't work because at some point someone will ALWAYS say something, someone will always happen on something by accident. Conspiracies are nice because they make for a good story but real life is more chaotic and less interesting. I suppose I could be wrong. Satanic industrialists could be ruling the world in secret. But I doubt it.

Lose it? I didn't lose it. It's not like, "Whoops! Where'd my job go?" I QUIT.
Who knows but that, on the lower frequencies, I speak for you?
http://citizenb.com/ - Now at v1.1
35.
 
Re: 9-11 revealed
May 25, 2004, 16:54
35.
Re: 9-11 revealed May 25, 2004, 16:54
May 25, 2004, 16:54
 
What happened that day. What really happened that day, the whos, the whys, the whatevers....

At this point it doesn't matter to me. It's one great big huge cluster fuck no matter how you look at it.

The politicians, terrorists, CEOs, whoever...they flushed the toilet.

Now we all get to go down the drain.

Can we talk about coffee grinders instead? Hell, I'll talk about someones testicle if improves the mood today.

-TPFKAS2S
http://www.braglio.com

There is a tragic flaw in our precious Constitution, and I don’t know what can be done to fix it. This is it: Only nut cases want to be president. -- Kurt Vonnegut
-TPFKAS2S
Avatar 10139
34.
 
Re: 9-11 revealed
May 25, 2004, 16:00
Enahs
 
34.
Re: 9-11 revealed May 25, 2004, 16:00
May 25, 2004, 16:00
 Enahs
 
That's my main issue, along with the other unsubstantiated "proof". Too many people believe whatever they read, as long as it's phrased in a believable way. Even with modern information tools (aka Google) people are unwilling to do even the slightest amount of fact checking for a questionable source.


What ever happen to trust?
come on people
It's what we need
Stop confusing the issues with facts
Cuz me for one,
I still believe

I believe in the written word
if it's on paper it's true
it's all gospel as far as I'm concerned
if somebody wrote it
it's good enough for me

why be so suspicious of the ones
who tried to keep you informed?
they give you the things you need
that's why I believe



_____
Enahs If you can read this - congratulations - You have won!!! Just e-mail with your CC# to claim your prize!
I am free of all prejudice. I hate everyone equally.
- W. C. Fields
Avatar 15513
33.
 
Yes, sorry
May 25, 2004, 15:54
33.
Yes, sorry May 25, 2004, 15:54
May 25, 2004, 15:54
 
I meant, Shining Path, sorry :).

My Mistake

32.
 
Re: 9-11 revealed
May 25, 2004, 15:42
32.
Re: 9-11 revealed May 25, 2004, 15:42
May 25, 2004, 15:42
 
Well, first of all, the Earth's core and mantle contain large amounts of molten metals. Pressure (due to gravity) can do a lot towards keeping something hot and liquid.

Yes, but pressure is a form of continuous energy input. But, as you said, there wasn't that much stuff on top of it. The buildings weren't even half a kilometer tall when standing, and while a good bit of the materials was denser than rock the majority of it was empty space.

If he just wants everyone to jump on an anti-Bush bandwagon

Shrug, I don't see this as necessarily being anti-Bush, unless you want to start talking about some vast governmental conspiracy. In which case I'm going to slowly back away while nodding my head. Frankly, the government has been far too divisive to hide anything like this. I also find it humorous at how well the government hides massive conspiracies while being woefully incompetent at so many other things (never attribute to malice that which can be explained by incompetence). I'm certainly not a Bush supporter at this point, but if I were to blame anyone it would be the owning corporation (not individual, contrary to the claims in the post) of the WTC site for insurance fraud (demolition is not the same as destruction... and willfully demolishing a building without consultation from engineers would be fraud. Not to mention mass murder in this case).

resorting to garbage pseudoscience

That's my main issue, along with the other unsubstantiated "proof". Too many people believe whatever they read, as long as it's phrased in a believable way. Even with modern information tools (aka Google) people are unwilling to do even the slightest amount of fact checking for a questionable source.

31.
 
Re: WTC
May 25, 2004, 15:19
31.
Re: WTC May 25, 2004, 15:19
May 25, 2004, 15:19
 
He was in Peru, where the Shinning Path "terrorists" are now respected

Don't you mean "shining"?

Shhhh! Do ye want te get sued?!


30.
 
Re: On a lighter note...
May 25, 2004, 15:13
nin
 
30.
Re: On a lighter note... May 25, 2004, 15:13
May 25, 2004, 15:13
 nin
 
I'M RICH, BIIIIIATCH!

Jesus...built my car. It's a love affair (mainly Jesus and my hotrod).
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