FBI Half-Life 2 Raids

A weblog post mentioned in a Slashdot story apparently gives the account of a San Francisco native's encounter with the FBI as the fed's raided his home looking for evidence in connection with the theft of the Half-Life 2 source code (story). According to Slashdot (since the site has been, naturally enough, Slashdotted), the blog includes a scan of the FBI's search warrant. Thanks Captain Trips.
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137 Replies. 7 pages. Viewing page 4.
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77.
 
Re: Quick observation
Jan 20, 2004, 02:14
indiv
 
77.
Re: Quick observation Jan 20, 2004, 02:14
Jan 20, 2004, 02:14
 indiv
 
Guilt is not the same as the concept of feeling bad for someone.

Revenge is not the same as justice.

And if just "copying data" isn't bad, and you wouldn't prosecute anyone if they "copied data" from you, post your credit card numbers, social security number (or equivalent), name, address, and phone number here in the forum. Obviously copying data isn't a big deal to you, so what's the harm if you put that data out for us to copy? Is it really a big deal if anyone gets your "secrets"?

76.
 
Re: Quick observation
Jan 20, 2004, 01:59
76.
Re: Quick observation Jan 20, 2004, 01:59
Jan 20, 2004, 01:59
 
I dont really see how its revenge just because Valve reported that their source code was stolen. The FBI are doing their job by enforcing the law. Last time I checked - theft of intellectual property IS A CRIME in which case the person who commited the crime should be prosecuted. If we should ignore it like you believe - Why shouldnt we let someone go who holds up a bank?

Coincidentally, How would you like it if someone stole the work you'd been doing for the past 5 years?

This comment was edited on Jan 20, 02:03.
75.
 
Re: Quick observation
Jan 20, 2004, 01:47
75.
Re: Quick observation Jan 20, 2004, 01:47
Jan 20, 2004, 01:47
 
"By your logic if I kill your mother, you shouldn't report it because there is a chance the police might investigate a suspect other than me."


And by your logic, revenge so important to you that it is worth risking the death, or lifelong incarceration, of an innocent man.

Of course, I don't expect someone to not report a murder. I'm just playing devils advocate, because your examples are extreme.

Someone took some source code. Valve did NOT need to delay the game. The game would be pirated anyhow. And you know as well as I do that most people who pirate games can't afford them, and most people want to play the game online and Valve's Steam system protects them against this. I'm sure it did not take them six months to modify the key generator. More like a few hours.

So, why is Valve seeking these pirates? Revenge. It's not like someone stole your TV, and you want it back because your insurance doesn't cover it. Nothing was stolen. Data was copied. People may have gotten ahold of some of their "secrets", but the cat's out of the bag.

So this is only motivated by a thirst for revenge. They can get nothing else from this. I'm sure the guy doesn't have much money.

If this happened to me, and I contacted the FBI and they found out who did it, I would drop the charges. I have no desire for revenge. If the person was wealthy I might make them pay restitution, but I'm not going to put a lowly pirate in hundreds of thousands of dollars of debt for taking some source code. If you think that the folks at Valve have never pirated anyhting, then you are a fool. And if they have, then it's pretty damn hypocritical of them to then get mad when someone else does it to them. There is not one person on this planet who uses a PC and has never violated a software license agreement. And the FBI shouldn't be wasting taxpayer money on a small time criminal like this.

74.
 
Re: Anybody with...
Jan 20, 2004, 01:45
74.
Re: Anybody with... Jan 20, 2004, 01:45
Jan 20, 2004, 01:45
 
"I still thinks HL2 would've been delayed and wasn't as near ready as valve let on."

we are all intitled to our opinions but obviously ati thought it was near ready seeing as how they gave valve 6mill for a packageing deal and i think ati was in a much better postion to access the situation than you.

73.
 
Re: Anybody with...
Jan 20, 2004, 00:17
indiv
 
73.
Re: Anybody with... Jan 20, 2004, 00:17
Jan 20, 2004, 00:17
 indiv
 
9 computers in their home office is doing something the law doesn't like.

Probably just a hard-core Everquest player.

72.
 
Re: pointless raid
Jan 20, 2004, 00:11
72.
Re: pointless raid Jan 20, 2004, 00:11
Jan 20, 2004, 00:11
 
The length of his hair, and his "I Love Linux" t-shirt.

-tAE-

Avatar 473
71.
 
Re: Quick observation
Jan 20, 2004, 00:10
71.
Re: Quick observation Jan 20, 2004, 00:10
Jan 20, 2004, 00:10
 
Would you feel guilty if you found out they arrested the wrong person and threw them in jail for 10 years? Or ruined them financially by taking all the data and equipment they need to run their business, as happened to Steve Jackson Games?

Are you suggesting that Valve should not have reported the theft? That they should have ignored the fact that a crime had been committed against them? Unbelievable.

By your logic if I kill your mother, you shouldn't report it because there is a chance the police might investigate a suspect other than me.

70.
 
Well...
Jan 19, 2004, 23:43
70.
Well... Jan 19, 2004, 23:43
Jan 19, 2004, 23:43
 
How much money did Half Life 1 Make to date? With all the repackaging, multi consoles, and the people who bought it just for the mods they could play?

Imagine if HL1 was in the same situation, I mean for software that may have costed 500,000 to make how much revenue was made on the first Half Life? If that was stolen and put onto the market via other country's low lifes how much money would Valve loose?

If the pictures are to beleived, Half Life 2 is already on shelves in Russia and anyone who has purchased it is not giving any of the money to Valve that they deserve for the time and effort to produce the game.

Theft is Theft, and it's already costing Valve money, maybe not alot of money but it's still costing them. Not to mention the money I'm sure they've spent into not working on the game and completeting it and new networking security etc.

Find the bastards that did it and use them for a real world display of physics Like say... when a person is pushed off a 10 story building lands on a car and then bounces off onto the street.

Avatar 12670
69.
 
Re: Quick observation
Jan 19, 2004, 23:38
69.
Re: Quick observation Jan 19, 2004, 23:38
Jan 19, 2004, 23:38
 
"If someone breaks into my home, and the police accidentally arrest the wrong person, is it my fault?"


Would you feel guilty if you found out they arrested the wrong person and threw them in jail for 10 years? Or ruined them financially by taking all the data and equipment they need to run their business, as happened to Steve Jackson Games?

If it's not your fault, why feel guilty?

68.
 
You May Be Next@
Jan 19, 2004, 23:34
B M
68.
You May Be Next@ Jan 19, 2004, 23:34
Jan 19, 2004, 23:34
B M
 
They may come for YOU next and you will still buy Valve's Software to support their actions!

67.
 
Re: Quick observation
Jan 19, 2004, 23:25
67.
Re: Quick observation Jan 19, 2004, 23:25
Jan 19, 2004, 23:25
 
"9 computers in their home office is doing something the law doesn't like."

Yeah because everyone knows hackers type on two keyboards at once, and have nine video displays surrounding them so they can see six banks and three military installations they're hacking into all simultaneously.

You watch too many movies.

66.
 
Re: Quick observation
Jan 19, 2004, 23:21
66.
Re: Quick observation Jan 19, 2004, 23:21
Jan 19, 2004, 23:21
 
>This makes VALVE the bad guys in my book.

Valve didn't raid this guy.


Valve reported a crime, as all people should.


If someone breaks into my home, and the police accidentally arrest the wrong person, is it my fault?

65.
 
Re: Quick observation
Jan 19, 2004, 23:20
65.
Re: Quick observation Jan 19, 2004, 23:20
Jan 19, 2004, 23:20
 
Even if this guy is guilty, and he sure doesn't talk like he is worried they'll find anyhting, they raided a ton of other people. They can't all be guilty. And that means that innocent people have had all their important files taken from them, and it may take 2 years to get them back, or they may never get them back. My entire life is on my PC. Emails from family and freinds, photographs of family which are irreplaceable, and my entire buisiness is contained on it, and on backups. If the FBI took my PC I'd lose my only source of income, my only way to support myself, and I'd lose years worth of memories contained in emails and photos, as well as countless peices of artwork I have produced, and code, both of which I would need to get another job.

This makes VALVE the bad guys in my book.

64.
 
Re: No subject
Jan 19, 2004, 23:20
64.
Re: No subject Jan 19, 2004, 23:20
Jan 19, 2004, 23:20
 
>The source codes stolen are valueless, and the incident should have been covered up and treated like any of the other hundreds of "leaked betas".

Valueless? How is hundreds of hours of work valueless? Can it be compiled well? No, but that's not much of a concern. Intellectual property is a much, much bigger problem.

As for other leaked betas, they weren't stolen as much as misplaced. This was an organized, well thought-out hacking. Other leaks are simply demo or beta CDs getting out. This was breaking and entering, by someone likely doing it to other companies. Costs thousands to repair that damage. And no one stole the code to sell, they stole it to teach Valve a lesson and devalue their work. In other words - industrial sabotage.

You have the balls to call someone else a moron?


63.
 
Anybody with...
Jan 19, 2004, 23:14
63.
Anybody with... Jan 19, 2004, 23:14
Jan 19, 2004, 23:14
 
9 computers in their home office is doing something the law doesn't like.

-----------------------------------------
http://users.ign.com/collection/Cyberfury
Currently playing: Jagged Alliance 2, Day of Defeat, Star Wars: Knights of the Old Republic
Currently playing: ARMA 3 mods and DayZ
62.
 
Anybody with...
Jan 19, 2004, 23:14
62.
Anybody with... Jan 19, 2004, 23:14
Jan 19, 2004, 23:14
 
*double post*

-----------------------------------------
http://users.ign.com/collection/Cyberfury
Currently playing: Jagged Alliance 2, Day of Defeat, Star Wars: Knights of the Old Republic
This comment was edited on Jan 19, 23:14.
Currently playing: ARMA 3 mods and DayZ
61.
 
Kinda like..
Jan 19, 2004, 23:13
61.
Kinda like.. Jan 19, 2004, 23:13
Jan 19, 2004, 23:13
 
that guy who tried to save lives at the Atlanta Olympics who was pretty much determined guilty for a long time but turns out he had nothing to do with it? Richard Jewel I think his name was, doing security when a explosive went off and he was nearby trying to help people. His life is ruined cause of the FBI and SS and he didn't do anything but try to help people.

Next time you judge someone by a pic, wake up first thing in the morning and look in the mirror and use that for people's first impressions of you, as he had just woken up.

Avatar 12670
60.
 
Re: No subject
Jan 19, 2004, 23:01
60.
Re: No subject Jan 19, 2004, 23:01
Jan 19, 2004, 23:01
 
He looks guilty in his blog photo. That's good enough for me. The FBI wouldn't have raided him specifically if they weren't damn sure he had something to do with it.
Hope he gets jail time.

I still thinks HL2 would've been delayed and wasn't as near ready as valve let on.

59.
 
No subject
Jan 19, 2004, 23:00
PHJF
 
59.
No subject Jan 19, 2004, 23:00
Jan 19, 2004, 23:00
 PHJF
 
Any of you people backing government involvement in this are morons.

What the hell do you think this code is going to get anybody? If I ran over to your yard and stole a blade of grass, that's a theft. What the hell am i gonna do with it though? Sell it for the millions its worth?

Getting the FBI to waste power on meaningless operations like this is helpful in no way. The source codes stolen are valueless, and the incident should have been covered up and treated like any of the other hundreds of "leaked betas".

------
“The closer you get to being a pro, the closer you can get to the client. The knife, for example, is the last thing you learn. Ok?"
Steam + PSN: PHJF
Avatar 17251
58.
 
Re: No subject
Jan 19, 2004, 22:47
58.
Re: No subject Jan 19, 2004, 22:47
Jan 19, 2004, 22:47
 
Hey dumb a$$.... The richest Americans aren't corporations. :-)

Anyways, I think everyone should be taxed at the same rate, including corporations.

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