UT2004 in 2004

Though Epic Games' official policy regarding release dates has been "when it's done" since long before Unreal Tournament 2004 was announced, Atari sends along a note acknowledging that they were targeting the UT2003 follow-up for release before the end of this year, but that this goal has slipped. Here's what they have to say:
Atari and Epic Games announced today that the release date for Unreal Tournament 2004, the highly anticipated follow-up to last year's smash Unreal Tournament 2003, has been moved to February 2004.

The game was previously slated for release during the 2003 Holiday season.
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39.
 
Not only release-dates bug me
Oct 30, 2003, 22:13
39.
Not only release-dates bug me Oct 30, 2003, 22:13
Oct 30, 2003, 22:13
 
I am truly heartily sick and tired of endless patches to the engine being the norm in the gaming industry.
According to the Games developers themselves, the design and coding of the engine occurs early in a project, typically under a very small team lead by a guru.
All the rest of the time is content development with a much larger team working on it.
And, just maybe, the occasional engine tweak to support something the content designers can argue loudly enough for.
What typically happens is that the programmer finishes (pretty much) the engine very early in the piece, then goes off to invent the next generation engine, while the artists and level designers create the content.
Then the game is finally released, only to be found to need maybe a series of 20 bug-fix releases.
Wouldn't the programmer be better off being stuck with the one project until it's finished, then they might spend time getting the code right instead of leaving a mess while they go have fun elsewhere.
Sometimes they get a test group to do beta testing, a thinly disguised way of shirking the responsibility for setting up a proper in-house test environment.
And it shows, they still ship faulty produce because they haven't paid for or used professional methodologies or testers (or anybody at all) who will be held accountable for letting bugs through.
I'm looking forward to great advances in software quality if/when the class action against selling faulty software eventuates against M$, as this will affect ALL developers.
About time they got serious about verifiably correct code, and took the theory into practice!
(I code for a bank by day, embedded Telecoms and freight industry by night and weekends, if I turned out code like so-called guru-programmers ID and Epic, I wouldn't have enough hours in the day to fix it!)


38.
 
Re: Release Dates
Oct 30, 2003, 22:06
38.
Re: Release Dates Oct 30, 2003, 22:06
Oct 30, 2003, 22:06
 
My point is that if they made a cushion for themselves, then we wouldn't think they were incompetent asses because they delayed the game. We might even think them heroes because they finished "ahead of time".

37.
 
Re: No subject
Oct 30, 2003, 22:00
37.
Re: No subject Oct 30, 2003, 22:00
Oct 30, 2003, 22:00
 
There is no need to be insulting, just because you disagree.

36.
 
Re: No subject
Oct 30, 2003, 21:43
36.
Re: No subject Oct 30, 2003, 21:43
Oct 30, 2003, 21:43
 
Making movies is way easier than making games?


What are you smoking? That's like saying writing a novel is easier than making a game.

Making a game is definitely no harder. Especially if you already have an engine.


The reason movies come out earlier is movies are typically done MONTHS in advance of their date. They go into review stages, they need approval for ratings, they need final copies to go to marketing agencies to make trailers, they need final insignificant stuff like sound tweaking, and they're released when they'll make the most money, not when they're done. Movies that get pushed back get pushed back almost exclusively because they're awful. Good movies are very rarely delayed, only the worst are.

Games are released "when they're done" (or close to it). Games aren't held back a few months until the right time, they're sent to pressing plants and stores immediately after going gold, and in stores a few weeks later. The process of releasing them is entirely different.


And entirely more complicated, more difficult, and harder. Games are much, much easier to make. Making a playable game is so much easier than making a watchable movie. Making a great game, however, is every bit as difficult as making a great movie, and slightly easier than writing a great novel.

Ageless Stranger comes across as very, very bias with his first idiotic statement. Idiotic. I hope he's not making games, because they've probably got the maturity level of BMW XXX.

35.
 
No subject
Oct 30, 2003, 21:17
35.
No subject Oct 30, 2003, 21:17
Oct 30, 2003, 21:17
 
Making games is way the fuck harder than making movies.

When you make a film, you can throw people at the problem. Adding more CGI people, gaffers, whatever to a late film makes it less late. Adding programmers to a late game makes it later.

Also, we've been making films for 100 years now. We've been making large-scale games for less than twenty.

We have a LOT to learn about scheduling game development, especially on projects that involve a lot of R&D like the leading-edge titles you mention.

Think you can do a better job? Head over to GamaSutra and start answering some of the help-wanted ads.

34.
 
Release Dates
Oct 30, 2003, 20:59
34.
Release Dates Oct 30, 2003, 20:59
Oct 30, 2003, 20:59
 
What the hell is so difficult about getting a game done on time? Look at cutting edge movies like Jurassic Park, which at its time revolutionized CGI graphics. I don’t remember hearing anything about that date being pushed back. While its true that movies are pushed back, Timeline was pushed back, but will be in theaters very soon now, most of the time that isn’t the case. Part of the reason is that they aren’t stupid enough to make unrealistic goals. Lord of the Rings gave themselves years before the first movie, and 2 more years for the other two movies so that they could reshoot some scenes, complete editing, and incorporate time for CGI. Star Wars films take 3 years each. But you know what, these films get done on time.

If the good folks at Epic said that UT2k4 would be out March 1st, 2004, then we would have been fine with that.
If the stellar group from ID said Doom3 would be done on April 29th, 2004, then we would surrender to the wait.
If the bungling fools at Valve told us that HL2 would be available in June 2005, then we would still thought they were awesome.

I think that game developers need to think about what they are doing, how long it will take, then add 25% more time to it. I mean let’s look at the public reaction to this. Let’s say Valve had said from the start, in May of this year at E3, that Half-Life 2 would be available in June 2005. We would have been resigned to wait, and then check this out, they release it a whole year early in June 2004. Instead of being bozos, they would have been heroes! We would be attacking other developers for promising dates & falling through, saying you guys suck, look at Valve, they got their game done a whole year early! You guys suck ass!

I’m really sick of these assholes falling through on their promises. Telling us that it uses this & this architecture and such & such brand new original features and incredible lifelike AI. Then after you wait through two delays, you get the game & wonder what the fuck they did with the extra time. You discover that for the most part, nothing’s new. In some cases you see the blatent greed of a company that is releasing an expansion pack as an original product (ala Jedi Knight Academy).

All I can say is that it’s a damned good thing the movie industry isn’t like this. Otherwise we might be watching Jurassic Park 4 and everything is going good, but then that damned bug creeps back in & we have to wait until a patch comes out before we can see the movie as it was meant to be seen. Or, we might have to wait until March 22nd to see Return of the King. Or we might not even know when it was coming out because at every interview Peter Jackson would say, when it’s done.


33.
 
Re: No subject
Oct 30, 2003, 20:08
33.
Re: No subject Oct 30, 2003, 20:08
Oct 30, 2003, 20:08
 
I'm a long time instagibber, I even remember [LM]Wowbagger down there from UT instagib. Anyway, UT2K3, while I did play it some, sucked big time compared to UT. I think they should take all the time they need and make a real farking sequel.

Anyway, FragOps will be out tomorrow, and the trailer looked pretty nice IMO. http://www.frag-ops.com

32.
 
Re: No subject
Oct 30, 2003, 20:02
32.
Re: No subject Oct 30, 2003, 20:02
Oct 30, 2003, 20:02
 
No surprise that it has been pushed back...

Hump I agree, it does seem like every server is a lowgrav instagib. I got sick of the triple jump thing too. It was damn near impossible to find a default deathmatch/ctf/bombing run server. I traded my copy in last week and put it toward purchasing Mafia.

Anyway, I am kinda anxious to see how the vehicles will impact the gameplay.

the best part about life is knowing you put it together
31.
 
No subject
Oct 30, 2003, 19:10
31.
No subject Oct 30, 2003, 19:10
Oct 30, 2003, 19:10
 
The only time I enjoy instagib is while playing Bombing run. Because its more of a sport oriented game it works keeping your mind on getting a goal rather than searchiing for yur preferred weapon. But its now to the point where EVERY gametype is played in instagib.

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"Both the “left” and the “right” pretend they have the answer, but they are mere flippers on the same thalidomide baby, and the truth is that neither side has a clue."

- Jim Goad
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30.
 
Re: Games worth playing while we wait...
Oct 30, 2003, 18:57
30.
Re: Games worth playing while we wait... Oct 30, 2003, 18:57
Oct 30, 2003, 18:57
 
I can't tell you how many times I've died right near the goal because of a solid shot with the InstaGib.

I thought u only had to clip them and they died?

brings a whole new meaning to 'solid shot' methinks!

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29.
 
Re: Games worth playing while we wait...
Oct 30, 2003, 18:31
29.
Re: Games worth playing while we wait... Oct 30, 2003, 18:31
Oct 30, 2003, 18:31
 
I like instagib for a change, yes only as that.


I'd like 60% instagib, 40% regular.

28.
 
Re: Games worth playing while we wait...
Oct 30, 2003, 18:05
28.
Re: Games worth playing while we wait... Oct 30, 2003, 18:05
Oct 30, 2003, 18:05
 
*Srhugs* I guess it is personal preference, but I love instagib... Gives a whole new, extra hard feeling to the BR and CTF maps. I can't tell you how many times I've died right near the goal because of a solid shot with the InstaGib.

You should play the "Basketball" map on BR. Talk about crazy... IF you have more than 5 on each time, you're lucky to move ten feet!

27.
 
Re: Games worth playing while we wait...
Oct 30, 2003, 18:04
27.
Re: Games worth playing while we wait... Oct 30, 2003, 18:04
Oct 30, 2003, 18:04
 
Instagib was the most popular UT1 game too. It's just tradition. I'm an instagib junky myself It's just so much more fun for me than weapons...

Edit: Although I do play instagib CTF mostly, cause without the challenge of getting the flag, it's not nearly as much fun.


Supporter of the "a happy fredster is a wet fredster with jumper cables attached to his nads" fanclub.
This comment was edited on Oct 30, 18:05.
"The whole problem with the world is that fools and fanatics are always so certain of themselves, but wiser people so full of doubts." -- Bertrand Russell (I think...)
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26.
 
Re: Games worth playing while we wait...
Oct 30, 2003, 17:44
26.
Re: Games worth playing while we wait... Oct 30, 2003, 17:44
Oct 30, 2003, 17:44
 
insta-gib low grav mutator

Tell me about it!

I love a good game of CTF or bombing run (which, let's face it, is just one flag CTF and you can't shoot) but you can't play it unless you wanna play insta-gib. I mean, insta-gib is kinda cool, but why is every damn server running it?

I only seem to find a decent BR server about 1 time in a 100 so when I do I play for hours on end.

25.
 
Re: Games worth playing while we wait...
Oct 30, 2003, 17:21
Enahs
 
25.
Re: Games worth playing while we wait... Oct 30, 2003, 17:21
Oct 30, 2003, 17:21
 Enahs
 
I won a free copy of that, some how I don't think I will get it, cause the people who did the compertion don't work there anymore and chances of them remebering it are very very slim.
Yes, I had also won a free copy of the "soon to be released" Duke Nukem Forever.....but uhh, three years later, where I won it from is no longer in business.......yeah

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24.
 
Re: Games worth playing while we wait...
Oct 30, 2003, 17:20
24.
Re: Games worth playing while we wait... Oct 30, 2003, 17:20
Oct 30, 2003, 17:20
 
Halo's faults have made me desire UT2K4 a bit more, despite hating all things Unreal outside of the original UT.


Wouldn't a 2004 release make it UT2K5? Haha.



And who said DNF switched engines again?

23.
 
Re: Games worth playing while we wait...
Oct 30, 2003, 17:14
23.
Re: Games worth playing while we wait... Oct 30, 2003, 17:14
Oct 30, 2003, 17:14
 
I uninstalled it last month because the only servers that seem to be populated with warm bodies are the sniper arena (on Xtra-Xtra fast setting) and insta-gib low grav mutator.

Uhg, I know. The game shipped with, what, ten fairly interesting weapons? Why does everyone play it with only one (instagib) enabled? I can only take about fifteen minutes of zipping around an arena making people explode with one click.

22.
 
Unreal 2: Expanded Multiplayer
Oct 30, 2003, 16:48
22.
Unreal 2: Expanded Multiplayer Oct 30, 2003, 16:48
Oct 30, 2003, 16:48
 
Unreal 2 XMP will be out soon. I suggest playing that. It's very fun. Besides, it'll be a free download...so long as you have a copy of Unreal 2.

The release of XMP has nothing to do with UT 2004.

@ Quan - Duke Nukem Forever has a whole new game engine now. The game is being worked on...as it has...well...forever. It's coming though.

This comment was edited on Oct 30, 16:51.
21.
 
Re: Games worth playing while we wait...
Oct 30, 2003, 16:44
21.
Re: Games worth playing while we wait... Oct 30, 2003, 16:44
Oct 30, 2003, 16:44
 
Instead of " when its done " why can't it be " You won't know anything about this game until its Done "

Then thats what happened to Duke Whatever happened.

I won a free copy of that, some how I don't think I will get it, cause the people who did the compertion don't work there anymore and chances of them remebering it are very very slim.

20.
 
Re: Games worth playing while we wait...
Oct 30, 2003, 16:34
20.
Re: Games worth playing while we wait... Oct 30, 2003, 16:34
Oct 30, 2003, 16:34
 
why bother with other games when we've got Red Orchestra for UT2003?

is it REALLY worth re-installing 3 CD's worth of data to play that mod? I uninstalled it last month because the only servers that seem to be populated with warm bodies are the sniper arena (on Xtra-Xtra fast setting) and insta-gib low grav mutator.

----------------------------------------------------------------------
PAH!
----------------------------------------------------------------------
"Both the “left” and the “right” pretend they have the answer, but they are mere flippers on the same thalidomide baby, and the truth is that neither side has a clue."

- Jim Goad
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