DOOM 3 & DX9

[Sep 17, 2003, 7:08 pm ET] - Share - Viewing Comments

With all the discussion lately about how Half-Life 2 will run on ATI hardware compared with NVIDIA accelerators, BonusWeb.cz shot off an email to id Software's John Carmack to ask how DOOM 3 and other games are likely to be impacted by the difference between the two graphics platforms running DirectX 9. Here's how he responded:

Unfortunately, it will probably be representative of most DX9 games. Doom has a custom back end that uses the lower precisions on the GF-FX, but when you run it with standard fragment programs just like ATI, it is a lot slower. The precision doesn't really matter to Doom, but that won't be a reasonable option in future games designed around DX9 level hardware as a minimum spec.

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101.

Re: the truth... is out there....

Sep 18, 2003, 17:09

banksie

No matter how you approached it the initial 3Dmark03 results told us precisely what has been discovered today. Namely that the FX series was strongest in GT1 which was the largely DX7 style rendering, it could have been stronger there because the FX does multi-texturing two pass stuff well and that was one of nVidia's complaints - namely that the test was only a single texture one for the most part. As you increase the level of shader useage the FX's performance dropped off. When you got to GT4 the 5800 displayed performance equivalent to a 9500 (which was ATi's medium performance card of the time.). That was reflected in the scoring with the 5800 Ultra getting around 2600 3Dmarks and the 9700 Pro scoring around 4300. Wanna guess what a 9500 scored? About 2300 as I recall. Remember it was the rectification of this quite large performance gap along with the noticeable image quality drop in 3Dmark03 that kicked a lot of the investigation off into precisely what drivers are doing. We have had a pretty clear indication with 3Dmark03, code creatures, Shadermark and the like all telling the same story - shader performance was lacklustre in the extreme on the NV3x series.

		Date	Subject	Author
	1.	Sep 17, 19:19	Target Sighted! Fire!!!	Rigs
	4.	Sep 17, 19:24	Re: Target Sighted! Fire!!!	PiG
	7.	Sep 17, 19:28	Re: Target Sighted! Fire!!!	Rigs
	9.	Sep 17, 19:30	re: Target Sighted! Fire!!!	Nexus
	12.	Sep 17, 19:36	Re: Target Sighted! Fire!!!	Brick
	23.	Sep 17, 20:03	Re: Target Sighted! Fire!!!	Rigs
	2.	Sep 17, 19:22	No subject	Xero
	3.	Sep 17, 19:22	No subject	ReDeeMeR
	5.	Sep 17, 19:24	Re: No subject	Enahs
	6.	Sep 17, 19:28	Re: No subject	quazz
	16.	Sep 17, 19:39	No subject	ReverendTed
	20.	Sep 17, 19:53	Re: No subject	kyleb
	21.	Sep 17, 19:56	Re: No subject	ReDeeMeR
	24.	Sep 17, 20:03	Re: No subject	Tony!!!
	55.	Sep 17, 22:40	Re: No subject	Maskirovka
	56.	Sep 17, 22:48	Re: No subject	Hellbinder
	60.	Sep 17, 23:05	Re: No subject	HBringer
	81.	Sep 18, 05:37	Re: No subject	Belly Flop
	8.	Sep 17, 19:29	Re: No Subject	Bunko
	10.	Sep 17, 19:33	No subject	D4rkKnight
	13.	Sep 17, 19:37	Re: No subject	Enahs
	14.	Sep 17, 19:38	Re: No subject	PoopieMoopie
	15.	Sep 17, 19:38	Re: No subject	Brick
	11.	Sep 17, 19:35	who cares at this point?	PoopieMoopie
	18.	Sep 17, 19:49	Re: who cares at this point?	fallguy
	17.	Sep 17, 19:48	Re: wakey wakey!	red_420
	19.	Sep 17, 19:53	Re: wakey wakey!	Maskirovka
	22.	Sep 17, 20:00	Re: wakey wakey!	eunichron
	25.	Sep 17, 20:04	Re: wakey wakey!	beaves
	40.	Sep 17, 21:50	Re: wakey wakey!	Ryan
	27.	Sep 17, 20:31	Re: wakey wakey!	kyleb
	32.	Sep 17, 21:13	Re: wakey wakey!	fallguy
	33.	Sep 17, 21:25	Re: wakey wakey!	eunichron
	38.	Sep 17, 21:44	Re: wakey wakey!	mbmonk
	26.	Sep 17, 20:09	No subject	Cynic9
	30.	Sep 17, 20:51	26 WRONG	schraube
	31.	Sep 17, 21:03	Re: 26 WRONG	TangledThorns
	62.	Sep 17, 23:38	Re: 26 WRONG	Marksman
	64.	Sep 17, 23:52	Re: 26 WRONG	OneNightStand
	96.	Sep 18, 14:55	Re: 26 WRONG	Fang
	83.	Sep 18, 06:31	Re: 26 WRONG	vacs
	36.	Sep 17, 21:42	Re: 26 WRONG	Cynic9
	39.	Sep 17, 21:45	Re: 26 WRONG	mag
	45.	Sep 17, 21:57	Re: 26 WRONG	Ryan
	63.	Sep 17, 23:42	Re: 26 WRONG	Marksman
	28.	Sep 17, 20:32	mondovoodootunabonecurse	speedbacon
	29.	Sep 17, 20:36	Re: mondovoodootunabonecurse	nomar
	35.	Sep 17, 21:35	Re: mondovoodootunabonecurse	Pineapple Ferguson
	37.	Sep 17, 21:43	Re: mondovoodootunabonecurse	mag
	41.	Sep 17, 21:51	Re: mondovoodootunabonecurse	Pineapple Ferguson
	47.	Sep 17, 21:59	Re: mondovoodootunabonecurse	mag
	48.	Sep 17, 22:02	Re: mondovoodootunabonecurse	Enahs
	42.	Sep 17, 21:52	???	TimothyB
	44.	Sep 17, 21:56	Re: ???	Enahs
	50.	Sep 17, 22:07	Re: ???	TimothyB
	46.	Sep 17, 21:58	Re: mondovoodootunabonecurse	richcz3
	109.	Sep 19, 13:22	Re: mondovoodootunabonecurse	CyberNutz
	110.	Sep 19, 15:23	Re: mondovoodootunabonecurse	MindTrigger
	111.	Sep 20, 06:04	Re: mondovoodootunabonecurse	mbmonk
	115.	Sep 22, 15:34	Re: mondovoodootunabonecurse	Guano
	116.	Sep 22, 17:59	Re: mondovoodootunabonecurse	MindTrigger
	34.	Sep 17, 21:32	Blah blah blah...	Ray Marden
	43.	Sep 17, 21:56	ARGUE!	Bunko
	49.	Sep 17, 22:04	nVidia needs to be honest	OCed_5150
	51.	Sep 17, 22:25	No subject	OneNightStand
	61.	Sep 17, 23:09	the truth... is out there....	Shataan
	65.	Sep 18, 00:00	Re: the truth... is out there....	mbmonk
	66.	Sep 18, 00:06	Re: the truth... is out there....	KaRRiLLioN
	67.	Sep 18, 00:10	Re: the truth... is out there....	Waldo555
	79.	Sep 18, 04:39	Re: the truth... is out there....	banksie
	80.	Sep 18, 05:31	Re: the truth... is out there....	Waldo555
>>	101.	Sep 18, 17:09	Re: the truth... is out there....	banksie
	84.	Sep 18, 06:40	Re: the truth... is out there....	Stinky_Toe
	85.	Sep 18, 08:38	Re: the truth... is out there....	Waldo555
	86.	Sep 18, 09:05	Re: the truth... is out there....	Waachi
	87.	Sep 18, 09:12	Re: the truth... is out there....	nin
	88.	Sep 18, 09:21	Re: the truth... is out there....	Waldo555
	90.	Sep 18, 09:38	Re: the truth... is out there....	Belly Flop
	94.	Sep 18, 13:58	Re: the truth... is out there....	m00t
	52.	Sep 17, 22:27	HL2 & D3: hard to compare	oliversl
	53.	Sep 17, 22:31	Re: HL2 & D3: hard to compare	ReDeeMeR
	54.	Sep 17, 22:32	Re: HL2 & D3: hard to compare	Enahs
	82.	Sep 18, 06:27	Re: HL2 & D3: hard to compare	vacs
	57.	Sep 17, 22:52	Re: ADOLESCENT CONSOLES	Hellbinder
	59.	Sep 17, 22:59	Re: ADOLESCENT CONSOLES	OneNightStand
	58.	Sep 17, 22:57	No subject	OneNightStand
	68.	Sep 18, 00:14	PCI Express	OneNightStand
	69.	Sep 18, 00:16	The vidcard market	CrowFeather
	70.	Sep 18, 00:27	Re: The vidcard market	Creston
	97.	Sep 18, 15:31	Re: The vidcard market	CrowFeather
	71.	Sep 18, 02:16	No subject	Acleacius
	72.	Sep 18, 03:13	The Impact Effect	Learned Hand
	73.	Sep 18, 03:33	Re: The Impact Effect	TimothyB
	75.	Sep 18, 03:37	Re: The Impact Effect	Wilf
	76.	Sep 18, 04:06	Re: The Impact Effect	Waldo555
	78.	Sep 18, 04:25	Re: The Impact Effect	Anvil
	74.	Sep 18, 03:37	Re: The Impact Effect	HBringer
	77.	Sep 18, 04:07	Re: The Impact Effect	mbmonk
	89.	Sep 18, 09:34	No subject	_Pablo
	91.	Sep 18, 10:25	Phew	Creston
	92.	Sep 18, 10:55	Re: Phew	ReDeeMeR
	93.	Sep 18, 13:07	Hrm ...	whatever
	95.	Sep 18, 14:00	Re: Hrm ...	kanniballl
	98.	Sep 18, 15:42	Some Thoughts	Liquid
	99.	Sep 18, 16:47	Re: Some Thoughts	TimothyB
	106.	Sep 18, 21:41	Re: Some Thoughts	Liquid
	107.	Sep 18, 21:56	Great article related to DX9 ATI vs Nvid	mbmonk
	108.	Sep 18, 22:04	Re: Some Thoughts	TimothyB
	100.	Sep 18, 17:05	No subject	Hellbinder
	102.	Sep 18, 17:27	"Standards"	HBringer
	103.	Sep 18, 17:58	Re: Hardware	Zoner
	104.	Sep 18, 19:06	Re: Hardware	HBringer
	105.	Sep 18, 21:08	Re: Hardware	Zoner
	112.	Sep 20, 07:12	Re: SOUR GRAPES	vajbern
	113.	Sep 21, 08:27	Re: SOUR GRAPES	zamfear
	114.	Sep 21, 18:14	Re: SOUR GRAPES	vajbern
	117.	Sep 23, 17:04	Will mine work?	Mopap
	118.	Oct 22, 21:11	RE: good thread	4Eyez

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