I'm a little behind.... At least HL2 will be out September 30th.

lol DrEvil arent you just smart one haha, ofcourse every developer will give me the same answer, because they do want everyone to believe that, I remember the Metal gear solid 2 PC thing when devs said it was very hard to make ATi support, they gave some bullshit arguments hwy and then it was proved they were just clueless how to do it.

Moog Operator if you're a decent dev/publisher ATi or Nvidia will help you to achieve that in no time and drivers do not differ as much as you would think, atleast Nvidia ones do not, you could pretty much take .dll's and mix them to suit your own needs, that's what Omega's doing.

Yet again I'll have to tell ya, optimizations are nothing but BUG elimination, you cant make 100% bugless game run faster without removing poly count or reducing lod quality.

Especialy when Xbox is your typical PC, there's no extra memory, no extra cache.

I wonder how much will Doom 3's multiple paths for Nvidia and ATi will pay off and how really different they are?


This comment was edited on Jul 29, 19:01.

The other thing redeemer, is in order to optimize for say, Radeon series cards, you have to know the secret handshake with the dirvers. While, yes, every card (pretty much) is able to render Direct3d and OpenGl, things like vertex shading, photon mapping, volumetric shadows, are not not NOT inherent opengl function, erego, the secret handshake necessary to not only begin thinking of optimization, but to even get advanced OpenGl function in the first place. I'd say Dr. Evil knows a bit more than someone like you.

"lol DrEvil, you dont have to explain? Maybe because you dont know shit? "

Because I've been around forums long enough to know that no amount of explanation is going to wake trolls like you up.

Heres an idea. Email any developer, your choice, and ask them if optimizing for 1 target platform would yield a good boost in performance. Email valve, they are really good about replying to email. Ask them, and then when they tell you exactly what I told you maybe you can pull your head out of your ass and stop pretending to know everything. But I know you wont, because you are here just for the sake of argument, if you really cared about knowing the truth you would have done some research yourself.

This comment was edited on Jul 29, 15:46.

PCs only have to do as much as you tell them. If you read your windows docs, you can actually tell windows to use a game as your shell, instead of explorer.exe (or is it systray?). This will enhance some games performance by 75%, especially if you are in a limited ram environment. PCs are only as "inefficiant" as the user employing them.

lol DrEvil, you dont have to explain? Maybe because you dont know shit? Bullshitting about what you do for living wont help either.

SirAnthony they work faster because they work in different ways, but sure it's easier to make less buggy software for one setup rather then for all driver combinations. But that's not optimization.

All hardware is the same because they can run opengl/directx? Thats some outstanding evidence there. Get a clue.

Not that I want to get involved with the bitch slapping here. But he is right. Xbox can do what it does because it only has to do one thing. And it is optimized very well. PC"s have to be able to do a million different things. With a million differen't combinations of hardware. Thats the wonderfull thing about PC's. But really they are pretty inefficiant because of it. Thats why a mac is faster at lower clock speeds because it is (for the most part) a closed system. It can be optimized better. But look in the PC sore shelves. Everywhere you look there is PC stuff. Millions of products. Look for the Mac section. Theres like one bookcase.

Maybe when they said they're porting to the xbox they ment they'll turn it into a 2d side scroller like splinter cell on the gameboy, i can see it runnin good then

I'm new to the boards here and I'd have to agree w/DrEvil...Everything Redeemer has said so far has been a string of completely irrelevant info with a "know it all" approach to make it sound somewhat believable to,perhaps, a console user?? Stop contaminating Blues w/this nonsense

You go right ahead pretending you know what you are talking about. I program for a living. I don't have to explain software design to some know it all punk on a message board.

All hardware is the same because they can run opengl/directx? Thats some outstanding evidence there. Get a clue.

I've read somewhere before that a port of DoomIII is extremely viable on the Xbox. Technically, it should run DoomIII with most stuff on at least 30FPS. Remember a console has a closed environment, no overhead. I'm sure id can port it well enough if they want. I truely doubt however that this delay has anything to do with a port. If id could ship before Christmas, I'm sure they would. Don't expect to see a dual release of the PC and XBox versions. Id said it themself, it's the art content creation that is taking so long. I mean, 5 steps to create a single texture, thats a lot of work. All you console fanatics I can assume can rest assure that a port is coming at some point, just don't expect it for for at least another year post launch. Remember the ports of Doom, and the Quake series to other consoles? They didn't show up for a good year or more since the orginal release. And remember, they made Quake III run great on a Dreamcast, who ever ported it. That being said, everyone should be able to relax and realize at some point they will play the game, on some machine. It's all a matter of time now.

lol DrEvil am I an idiot just because you're a clueless lil teenie prick who only listens to what greedy game companies tell ya?

How do you "optimize" for the most popular desktop cpu's or motherboards eh genius? There is no way, unless you have different architecture, but todays hardware does not differ, all cpu's are x86 all graphics cards work under directx/open gl.

You might want to make different path's for each video card/cpu/sound card but then again if developer/publisher's are all greedy they'll just cry and release crap in beta state.
I can undirstand when small devs have probs with funding, but this goes to big ass companies who really dont have problems with $$$ like EA.

All the crap they bable about "optimizations" is just amount of bugs they remove, just like drivers, they wont magically "optimize" them for all games, but few and most of the time quality suffers, because you cant have faster without sacrifising anything, unless there was a big and you kill it and make the process go faster.

This comment was edited on Jul 28, 20:11.

Doom3? Is that like quake?

Redeemer, you're an idiot. Any game company that is able to optimize an application for 1 specific target platform is going to be able to squeeze a good amount of extra performance by adjusting techniques to accomodate that platforms strong points, and removing catch-all code that helps it to run on such a wide range of PC's. I guarantee the Xbox will be able to run Doom 3 a hell of alot faster than the p3-700 w/geforce 3 everyone is comparing it to for that reason alone.

Well, here we go ID Software knows Doom 3 won't add any innovative single player stuff, it will be just all new graphics engine etc...yet they still delay it zzz. Well, not that it matters, Half Life 2 will be out before Doom 3 and to me thats a big blow to Doom 3, not that it would have mattered anyways.

Yikes!!!

I didn't realize it only had 64 MB total SYSTEM memory (GPU + system). After reading that, I checked some websites, and sure enough ReDeeMeR is right.

Now I'm not 100% sure about the XBox handling DOOM3. I always assumed that it was set up like a moderate PC, with an ok video card and THEN an adequate amt of RAM.

It should be interesting to see if JC can pull this off without gutting all of the high tech features.

But then again, he's done some cool stuff in the past. And the current games do run well. I guess only time will tell.

This comment was edited on Jul 28, 13:32.

Yup, but that Geforce 3 only has 64 ram of memory and memory is being shared by the whole system, so if a shitty celeron(coppermine) 733 + 64 shared memory will run it and something like XP1700 + GF4Ti4200 + 512 wont then I'll gladly pirate the fucking thing, the whole "optimizations for xbox" thing is bullshit, all they have now are 2(AMD Intella) cpu companies and 2 main gpu companies and 3-4 audio, you dont have to get Savage4 support because the fucking thing wont run it anyway... optimizing isnt the problem it's just companies dont want to hire any testers and lose couple dollars because of the fucking greed.

I'm just wondering if Microsoft didnt slip a few million dollars to Id just to get Doom 3 posponed so xbx version can go gold sooner??

Yea, it's a Gforce 3 with an extra vertex shader. Gforce 2? LOL


-Tony!!!;)
This comment was edited on Jul 28, 05:31.

The biggest trick for an Xbox port will likely be getting that CPU to do the sick physics while still having enough cycles to do the scene set-up for 4 player split screen...the GPU can probably handle what is required of it.

it is a geforce3 with an extra shader unit in the xbox, but the processor is really just a celleron at 5.5x133.