The Phantom Menace?

NewsForge has a story up with new information about the Phantom console system, Infinium Labs' upcoming PC games system, offering new insights into its nature. Here's a bit:
The truth is, it is neither vaporware nor purely a set-top box, but part of an online PC game retailing system designed to protect game publishers' intellectual property while increasing profits for broadband ISPs. The promise for consumers is the availability of more games, for less money, than ever before. Will Infinium be able to pull this off? At least $25 million worth of venture capital is betting "yes."

Really, the only thing that differentiates this 'game console' from a standard, Windows-running PC is that it has no way to get data on or off of it except through a dedicated connection to Infinium Labs' own servers via your broadband ISP, plus the fact that if you try to open it up or modify it or grab data from the hard drive, bad things will happen, starting with violation of the terms under which you will lease or purchase the Phantom.
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63 Replies. 4 pages. Viewing page 1.
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63.
 
Re: No subject
Jul 17, 2003, 17:45
63.
Re: No subject Jul 17, 2003, 17:45
Jul 17, 2003, 17:45
 
I wanna milk some investors now. Lets come up with something tasty for the corps, shall we?

I got one! The Virtual Reality Mega-Segway Game!

62.
 
No subject
Jul 17, 2003, 14:51
62.
No subject Jul 17, 2003, 14:51
Jul 17, 2003, 14:51
 
Exactly, the product seems to be based on a "you'll like what we tell you to like" philosophy that marketing "gurus" are so apt to adopt. From a corporation's (anti-piracy) standpoint, the concept is a gem of an idea. From about every other standpoint, including the engineers and the end users - its a total bust. The mistake of these bloated ego executives is to think they can push crap down gamers throats.

I wanna milk some investors now. Lets come up with something tasty for the corps, shall we?

______________________________________________
"When the bomb drops it'll be a bank holiday
Everybody happy in their tents and caravans
Everybody happy in their ignorance and apathy
No one realizes until the television breaks down..."

- SUBHUMANS
61.
 
No subject
Jul 17, 2003, 13:59
LSD
61.
No subject Jul 17, 2003, 13:59
Jul 17, 2003, 13:59
LSD
 
As post #53 says, you'd need silly bandwidth to make anything playable. Compare this to popping in a disc and playing, well, I don't think people are going to be as eager to download everything as some people seem to think. Even on a broadband connection, downloading a full sized game (anyone try playing some of the betas of the latest mmorpgs???) takes a hell of a long time.
They ship games on DVDs for consoles already, and many pc games come on multiple cdroms. Think it out... this concept, whatever its merit, is too soon for its time because the connectivity is not there, and the speed is just not there.
Don't let me get started on the whole annoying copyright thing... this is entirely the wrong direction as far as that is concerned. No I/O except an internet hookup??? Forget it...

This comment was edited on Jul 17, 14:01.
60.
 
Re: the future....
Jul 15, 2003, 16:18
60.
Re: the future.... Jul 15, 2003, 16:18
Jul 15, 2003, 16:18
 
For me, this is right up ther with all these stupid music sites trying to sell me crappy sounding, proprietary music files that I can only play on one machine, or for a limited amount of time.

Frankly, I hope the POS does fly, cause then all the game companies that turn out CRAP game after CRAP game can flock to it to satisfy the masses, while the rest of us hardcore gamers can play games on our own machines that actually cater to our tastes.

Something to keep in mind though; as the "general gamer" population rises, so does the "hardcore gamer" population. of course theire will always be far less of us, but there will ALWAYS be a market for us. After all, we are the ones willing to shell out big money to have the best hardware and best games available.

Console Demos: Yes they have demos. I pick up Xbox mag every month to check out the demos on the disk...

--
He cut the possum's face off then cut around the eye socket. In the center of the belt buckle, where the possum's eye would be, he has placed a small piece of wood from his old '52 Ford's home made railroad tie bumper. Damn, he misses that truck.
59.
 
Re: the future....
Jul 14, 2003, 06:35
59.
Re: the future.... Jul 14, 2003, 06:35
Jul 14, 2003, 06:35
 
Consoles already have demos, right? Playstation magazines have had cover discs on them for years.

I could be wrong, as I've never owned a Playstation but that's sure what they looked like.

58.
 
Re: the future....
Jul 13, 2003, 12:06
nin
 
58.
Re: the future.... Jul 13, 2003, 12:06
Jul 13, 2003, 12:06
 nin
 
What makes previous consoles so great?

Gameplay.



If there is not a sharp twist towards distribution directly into the home and new original games then the games market is a has been within 5 years. s

Game sales have steadily increased, year after year. How can you claim the market will be a "has been" in 5 years?



Maybe the Phantom is the way forward. Does it upset you when I say that? Why?

No, it upsets us that you (weather you mean to or not) come off sounding like a PR chimp for the company, and then deny it.



I also like the idea of being able to demo a game for a few minutes, so I can decide whether it's worth renting or buying.

Demos have been around for years, and aren't going anywhere. Why would playing them on a console make these demos so much better?



I like the idea of renting a game for the week for a few dollars.

So you like giving money away and having nothing to show for it at the end of the week? I bet the MPAA and the RIAA will just LOVE you! Oh, and if all you do is rent from your console, how will the devs who made those games be paid? Do you have some "secret inside information" even though you don't work for the company, detailing how devs will be paid? They tried this with the RIAA. Artists are supposed to get "their share" from radio airplay, blank media sales, and webcasting. Guess what? They don't get jack.

Oh, and we'd love to hear your answers to (I believe it was) Creston's questions below. He brought up some good points also.

edit: f$%*ing [ ] system...

Supporter of the "A happy fredster is a muted fredster" fanclub.

http://www.originaltrilogy.com/


This comment was edited on Jul 13, 12:12.
57.
 
Re: the future....
Jul 13, 2003, 07:38
AJ
57.
Re: the future.... Jul 13, 2003, 07:38
Jul 13, 2003, 07:38
AJ
 
What makes previous consoles so great?

All the games are similar within the 5 or 6 different genres.

With the only difference being the water looking more like water, or the snow looking more like snow ???

Its the same stuff over and over and over, under a new name or part or version 2, 3 etc etc

If there is not a sharp twist towards distribution directly into the home and new original games then the games market is a has been within 5 years.

You guys may be prepared to play the same rubbish over and over at the moment but something new is required.

Maybe the Phantom is the way forward. Does it upset you when I say that? Why?

I like the idea of renting a game for the week for a few dollars. I also like the idea of being able to demo a game for a few minutes, so I can decide whether it's worth renting or buying.




AJ

56.
 
the future....
Jul 12, 2003, 04:28
Xil
 
56.
the future.... Jul 12, 2003, 04:28
Jul 12, 2003, 04:28
 Xil
 
AJ has a few valid points I feel. Broadband is higher in western europe in % of internet users, digital stuff (tv,s the new mobiles with all the stuff they can do) are really big.

AJ feels strongly enough to post his opinions on this, good for him. And he has done so in a polite normal way.

Do I want to get my PC games online on a PC I do not own, nope, will it ever happen, I am pretty sure it will, will it be Infinium labs that does it... time will tell, maybe they are to early, maybe they are right on time.

One of the posters here was right, they seem to be using a normal PC, maybe with some VPN software or whatever, they are not creating a new platform, in that view $25 million is not that foolish, it's still not much

anyways, how many people have bought a console because of that one game.... how many have bought the X-box for Halo, how many have bought the gamecube for Zelda or Metroid Prime, I know I have done that last thing. (and I don't regret it)

The company that -in the future- can get titles like Half Life 3 or Doom 4 or (fill in your most played game) on a deal like this, so only available on a "you pay as you play" basis and you will never own the game will be the one that will make the "general" gamer join.

Of course the "hardcore" gamers will go to forums and bitch about it and of course they again won't see that for every hardcore gamer there are a few 100 general gamers... you know, those people that help keep the Sims on the best selling games list...

like it or not, the future for the general gamer will not include building his own pc to specs and going to stores buying games.... when it will start... I dunno, but probably sooner then we think

-Xil
Avatar 12935
55.
 
Re: -Phantom chat-
Jul 11, 2003, 16:25
55.
Re: -Phantom chat- Jul 11, 2003, 16:25
Jul 11, 2003, 16:25
 
AJ,

First off, I noticed that you didn't actually ANSWER any of my questions. You really should go into politics.

Second, you're talking research and articles and evidence. Where is it? Talking smack without actually linking ANYTHING seems a lot like what Infinium is doing. Microsoft has already agreed? Really? Funny that The Register never mentioned anything about it, and Microsoft can't blow wind without the Register having an article about it. Funny that I can't find ANYTHING on Microsoft's website about it either.

So go ahead, oh paragon of computing wisdom, show me the links for your proclaimed :

1) I have done a little research into who is actually involved

2) Then have a look at where the main growth of the games market is expected over the next 8 years and it will point to on-line.

3) From the research I have gathered for the European market, I also found that the relationship with Microsoft is already negotiated and in place. It seems Microsoft are backing them.

4) In europe and the Far East pay per play, broadband systems are breaking the trend and becoming standard home options
Really? I actually lived in Europe for thirty years, and didn't move here until last year. So either Europe has REALLY gotten its act together in one year's time, or you're just making shit up. Something tells me I know what it is.

5) as the major publishers are prooving by getting behind the idea.
Major publishers? I haven't seen anything from Activision, EA, Infogrames, Eidos, Sega or anyone saying that they're going to be releasing content on this 'thing'.

I eagerly await your links.

Creston


Avatar 15604
54.
 
Hmm... interesting.
Jul 11, 2003, 16:24
54.
Hmm... interesting. Jul 11, 2003, 16:24
Jul 11, 2003, 16:24
 
Is it me or does the Infinium website look like those sites that sell "software" that allows you to make illegal copies of DVDs.

I just wonder if anyone has signed up to be a beta tester for the Phantom.

53.
 
think it out
Jul 11, 2003, 13:36
53.
think it out Jul 11, 2003, 13:36
Jul 11, 2003, 13:36
 
The concept is retarded unless they plan on imlpementing an OC3 connection on each box.

______________________________________________
"When the bomb drops it'll be a bank holiday
Everybody happy in their tents and caravans
Everybody happy in their ignorance and apathy
No one realizes until the television breaks down..."

- SUBHUMANS
52.
 
Re: -Phantom-
Jul 11, 2003, 10:48
52.
Re: -Phantom- Jul 11, 2003, 10:48
Jul 11, 2003, 10:48
 
Aside from the fact that you will need a high-speed connection to have the content streamed to you, you also get none of the side functionality that the standard consoles offer such as a DVD/CD player.

Also, many games have issues just running off a DVD, and have to be cached to a harddrive to work well. The last thing I want is to wait 45 minutes for a game to stream and cache to the Phantoms harddrive before I can play it without there being delays and jerky gameplay.

No Thanks!

51.
 
Re: -Phantom-
Jul 11, 2003, 10:37
51.
Re: -Phantom- Jul 11, 2003, 10:37
Jul 11, 2003, 10:37
 
AJ,

You were so *OWNED* by Creston's post (#22) that you either need to actually answer his questions (not spout ambigous nonsensical crap that doesn't actually say anything) or STFU!

P.S. Creston, you da man.

P.P.S. The Phantom is too expensive, doesn't offer the consumer the any tangible benefits, will be hacked, might not have any good games, runs on a competitor's operating system and all in all, is an excellent gaming system FOR ME TO POOP ON.

P.P.P.S The ONLY way they might succeed is in the corporate market. Start putting these things in hotel rooms, airports, etc, and maybe work from there. But not if they need 1,000,000 users just to break even. HAHAHAHAHA!

-----------------------------------------------------
http://nicebreakers.gotdns.com
Cry 'havoc', and let slip the dogs o' war!
-----------------------------------------------------
"Oh that's blue. He's an old navy vet that hangs around my store a lot. But don't worry about it, he's legit."
50.
 
Re: -Phantom-
Jul 11, 2003, 10:30
50.
Re: -Phantom- Jul 11, 2003, 10:30
Jul 11, 2003, 10:30
 
And what advantage does this Phantom have over this DISCover thingy that was talked about a bit ago:

http://www.hardwareaccelerated.com/content/interviews/discover/index.php

49.
 
Re: -Phantom-
Jul 11, 2003, 10:22
49.
Re: -Phantom- Jul 11, 2003, 10:22
Jul 11, 2003, 10:22
 
I researched the Phantom for a European broadband supplier, so when it comes up on the u.k games news site mvcuk.com it links you to this page.

I know quite a lot about it so I thought I would discuss it.

However you don't seem to know much about the UK broadband market or you would know it isn't mature, isn't widely available and isn't reliable.

Oh and mvcuk.com doesn't exist. neither does mvcuk.co.uk.

As far as the product goes, it may be easy to convert PC games to a PC with custom copyright protection and a broadband link. That doesn't mean that there will be an advantage over a home made PC where the end-user gets to own the games and, should they so desire can keep up with the Graphics market cheaply and easily so they can play games 3 years down the line without buying a new system and throwing the old one out.

Doeas that make me an employee of Infinium Labs? I live in Spain, there bassed in America somewhere.
You don't really have a point do you? Are you American by chance?

Your point seems to be that leasing games over the net is they way forward. Unlikely I feel.

I'm not - I'm a British IT worker.

Anvil
Anvil - from the land of warm beer and mad cattle.
48.
 
Idea
Jul 11, 2003, 10:14
48.
Idea Jul 11, 2003, 10:14
Jul 11, 2003, 10:14
 
Maybe if you try to open it, it fries the mobo.

47.
 
Re: broadband only?
Jul 11, 2003, 10:01
47.
Re: broadband only? Jul 11, 2003, 10:01
Jul 11, 2003, 10:01
 
I think they forget that only 10-20% of househoulds in the world have high speed and not all of them play games.

How many non-broadband users have bought a PS2, XBOX or GC...

46.
 
Re: You think its easy to make a console ?
Jul 11, 2003, 09:09
nin
 
46.
Re: You think its easy to make a console ? Jul 11, 2003, 09:09
Jul 11, 2003, 09:09
 nin
 
See AJ run!

We need a "marketing gimp" filter for the site...

And $25 million is a drop in the bucket...


Supporter of the "A happy fredster is a muted fredster" fanclub.

http://www.originaltrilogy.com/
45.
 
No subject
Jul 11, 2003, 09:04
45.
No subject Jul 11, 2003, 09:04
Jul 11, 2003, 09:04
 
Vaporware is vaporware... theres not much our discussion will do to sway the Phantoms success one way or the other, although I could see an employee of the company being concerned by lack of positive response from the target market.

As far as that bullshit "bad things will happen", it reminds me of stories of fire and brimstone, of santa claus "knowing whos bad and good". Its about as hollow as my bong. Anyone who underestimates the hacking community will SURELY be bitten so very hard on their ass. Those cats take shit PERSONALLY.

______________________________________________
"When the bomb drops it'll be a bank holiday
Everybody happy in their tents and caravans
Everybody happy in their ignorance and apathy
No one realizes until the television breaks down..."

- SUBHUMANS
44.
 
You think its easy to make a console ?
Jul 11, 2003, 08:57
44.
You think its easy to make a console ? Jul 11, 2003, 08:57
Jul 11, 2003, 08:57
 
All you people ripping on The Phantom should grow up and try to make their own console system if they think its that....errrrr...Nevermind.

"I like to play female characters in MMORPGs to trick men into homosexual chat." - space captain, June 18th, 2009.
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