More on JK3

Jedi Knight II.Net has posted some tidbits on Jedi Knight III from Raven's Michael Chang Gummelt from this and this forum posts on the subject. Here's a bit:
And it's called Jedi Knight III right now for lack of a better name, I, personally, would not call it a "sequel" to JK2 since I think a DF/JK game should always be about the Katarns (maybe a true JK3 could be about Kyle and Jan's child, who perhaps shows a particularly strong adeptness with the Force...?) So I wouldn't be surprised if the name doesn't stay "Jedi Knight III" (but who knows).
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54.
 
Re: Postal 2 Perfect 10\10
Apr 5, 2003, 03:49
54.
Re: Postal 2 Perfect 10\10 Apr 5, 2003, 03:49
Apr 5, 2003, 03:49
 
RainWolf, you're a dipshit.

This guy posted the same message something like five or six times all over the BN boards in different threads. What a moron. Buddy, let us talk about Jedi Academy and leave the Blue's News Boards alone.

53.
 
No subject
Apr 4, 2003, 22:43
53.
No subject Apr 4, 2003, 22:43
Apr 4, 2003, 22:43
 


This comment was edited on Apr 5, 05:22.
52.
 
Re: Random Thoughts
Apr 4, 2003, 13:14
52.
Re: Random Thoughts Apr 4, 2003, 13:14
Apr 4, 2003, 13:14
 
Mouse force selection would suck, guys.

Think about it...is's over 2000ms of selection time compared to a worst case 500ms on a key bind. Looks cool in theory, but in practice it would stink.

Example: how many times did you get capped in Splinter Cell because of the weapon slection system? Multiply that by a factor of 5 or so (Splinter Cell isn't nearly as fast and furious as JK/Quake/UnReal), and you'll start to see what I mean.

You'd toss that away in multiplayer combat faster than a retreating Republican Guard Brigade.

You're better off with keypad/mouse button bindings.

Or, better yet, get a Belkin Nostromo n50 and save your hand some walking

<|FeaR|>Lisa
"Did you ever consider that there is nothing wrong with the world, and that it might be you with a problem? Remember, the only constant in all your bad relationships is you."
51.
 
Re: Random Thoughts
Apr 4, 2003, 08:33
51.
Re: Random Thoughts Apr 4, 2003, 08:33
Apr 4, 2003, 08:33
 
The mouse menu idea (sounds similar to the circular menus in The Sims, or that Mozilla Add-in) could be translucent. Would be slick without blocking chunks of display.

I'd be down with perhaps (gasp) using my mousewheel to toggle force powers. Perhaps have a modifier key, and if I'm holding it scrolling selects a power, rather than a weapon. <shrug> Since after a certain point, it'd probably be all saber for me anyways...

phuck write of ewe type-o crytics
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50.
 
Jedi Knight: Jedi Academy
Apr 3, 2003, 14:09
50.
Jedi Knight: Jedi Academy Apr 3, 2003, 14:09
Apr 3, 2003, 14:09
 
The game is Jedi Knight: Jedi Academy, and you can check out the new LucasArts site at: http://www.lucasarts.com/products/jediacademy/ . Nice to know the game's official now.

49.
 
Re: Random Thoughts
Apr 2, 2003, 23:56
49.
Re: Random Thoughts Apr 2, 2003, 23:56
Apr 2, 2003, 23:56
 
Well, the mouse menu would (ideally) be in addition to the current control scheme. For the fans of each group, they can use whichever version they like. For somebody like myself, I would use both ways.

I don't know about nin, but I would like the mouse menu for the simple, non-combat instance. Things like jumping to a higher level, pulling the crate blocking the entrance, etc.

Skeptical, but hoping for improvements (or a different style) in the next game,
Ray (being good, avoiding the obvious Jedi jokes)

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"Reminder: Personal attacks = nono" Be nice.
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Currently playing: IGI 2, Raven Shield, Tenchu 3, and Wind Waker.
Everything is awesome!!!
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48.
 
Re: Random Thoughts
Apr 2, 2003, 23:45
48.
Re: Random Thoughts Apr 2, 2003, 23:45
Apr 2, 2003, 23:45
 
The advantage to the force power selection that JK2 has is that you can continue to fight. With the pop-up menu you describe, you take away your mouse aiming, and block part of the screen. Plus, I can't see it being much quicker than being able to scroll through a half dozen force powers. I learned the order of the powers when I played the game, and so switching back and forth was effortless. It's oppinion, I realize, and so you or I aren't "right" in any sense. I'm sure there is a better way to handle the force powers, but I'm not sure that, in the heat of battle, a pop-up menu is the best way to go.

I do have to agree that the force power growth was a little arbitrary in JK2. I'd love to see a system where using the powers increases your skill, while neglecting others sees those powers dwindle. So say if you use heal, push, and pull the most, then they become your strongest abilities. If you use choke and lightning the most, then THEY become your strongest ones. I chose those for offensive/defensive examples, not force allignment.

And though I do agree that the SW universe is much more than combat, and games should reflect this, you're a JEDI for God's sake. You want the universe, then play the part! Jedi's going around blowing stuff up with a rocket launcher is a little off the mark.

47.
 
Re: Random Thoughts
Apr 2, 2003, 22:44
nin
47.
Re: Random Thoughts Apr 2, 2003, 22:44
Apr 2, 2003, 22:44
nin
 
It was my belief that the one-button force menu is intended as being a mouse-based interface. Hold down the quick key, the force menu pops up, you move your cursor in the direction of the force power, and you then let go of the one button. In essence, the action would take less than a second and, with only one button, give you access too all (or just the most common) force powers. Likewise, I viewed this as being in addition to having the ability to map each and every force power to a button.

Bingo! Ya got it! Just a quicker way to switch to another force power...

And don't get me wrong, I'll buy the game anyway, even if they keep the powers as they were in the last game.

46.
 
Re: Random Thoughts
Apr 2, 2003, 22:26
46.
Re: Random Thoughts Apr 2, 2003, 22:26
Apr 2, 2003, 22:26
 
It was my belief that the one-button force menu is intended as being a mouse-based interface. Hold down the quick key, the force menu pops up, you move your cursor in the direction of the force power, and you then let go of the one button. In essence, the action would take less than a second and, with only one button, give you access too all (or just the most common) force powers. Likewise, I viewed this as being in addition to having the ability to map each and every force power to a button.

The rest of this is really just personal preference:

- I think that the lightsaber is cool, but certainly not the entire basis of the Star Wars universe. I thought that the first game focused primarily on the lightsaber, disregarding the other weapons in the process, and I am wondering how much farther they can/will stretch this. Again, I enjoy Star Wars for its universe more than as a straightforward hack-and-slash world. If you want to focuse solely on lightsaber combat, I think that the story suffers a bit and there are other, much older games that have far superior swordplay.

- I think that a Star Wars RPG could be really neat (hurry up, Bioware! :)), but I do not think that is what people are referring to in this discussion. Simply put, JKII effectively dropped what little RPG/character growth aspects which were there from the first game. After having somewhat-direct control over your character's growth in JK, I ended up having to beat a level so that I could see which power Raven's designers would decide that I had magically improved in or upgraded. In a more abstract way, this alludes to the less dynamic level design in JKII; instead of playing in a world with certain laws/design rules, we played levels based around our latest Raven-given power.

Shrugging - wanting the game...now! ;P,
Ray

---------------------------------------
"Reminder: Personal attacks = nono" Be nice.
http://users.ign.com/collection/RayMarden
Currently playing: IGI 2, Raven Shield, Tenchu 3, and Wind Waker.
Everything is awesome!!!
http://www.kindafunny.com/
I love you, mom.
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45.
 
Random Thoughts
Apr 2, 2003, 21:42
45.
Random Thoughts Apr 2, 2003, 21:42
Apr 2, 2003, 21:42
 
I don't see how pressing one button to open up the force power menu, and then pressing one of the number keys to select a power (taking your hand off the WASD controls) is quicker than scrolling through the force powers with only one button while you can still move. You'd still have to press a second button to use your force power, as it is now.

I'm not sure why people want less lightsaber action. It's the weapon of a Jedi, and it's fun. I only WANTED to use a gun in JKII when I needed to snipe someone, or blast them with a rocket. Otherwise, it was chop chop.

I don't want RPG elements mixed into the game too much. Just have the game branch at some point depending on whether you've chosen the light or dark side. The only RPG inclusion that I DO want is the character customization.

I get the feeling that the lightsabers have become the stances. Two sabers is yellow, one is blue, and the double-bladed saber is red. With two sabers, you can strike quicker, but since each is one handed, there would be less power behind each. The one lightsaber is normal. The double-bladed saber would be harder to handle, and slower, but your grip and swings would mean that there'd be more force behind the blows. Yellow, blue, and red.

No communications array puzzle. Please.

44.
 
It's all about Styyyyyyyle, baby!
Apr 2, 2003, 16:20
44.
It's all about Styyyyyyyle, baby! Apr 2, 2003, 16:20
Apr 2, 2003, 16:20
 
Midnight--

I'd bet my new Radeon AIW 9700 Pro that they will rock-paper-scisors styles and stances.

believe it or not, I *would* like to see some of the uber-moves de-nerfed (Like backswing-- gawd, not only was it anchored, but the damage was castrated). BUT all special moves should have counters. As I mentioned in the other Thread, red DFA-ers can be pushed away or thwacked on the back when their saber is hilt-deep in the dirt, and you can ROLL under a Yellow DFA (Butterfly), and have no damage. People that get hit with a blue lunge, well, they're just slow...

Kicking is OK as-is. People that b***h about it obviously haven't learned the defensive tricks you can use on pull-kick spammers.

Click on my name in the upper right corner of this post if you don't know these counters).

<|FeaR|>Lisa
PS: Kenn-- Screenies? Are you kidding? I have a montage of them as my backdrop already! LOL! Love ya babe! WE WANT MORE!!! LOL!!

PPS: NO GOGGLES, DAMMIT!!!! (*Lisa checks Kenn's memory )


This comment was edited on Apr 2, 16:24.
"Did you ever consider that there is nothing wrong with the world, and that it might be you with a problem? Remember, the only constant in all your bad relationships is you."
43.
 
No subject
Apr 2, 2003, 06:33
43.
No subject Apr 2, 2003, 06:33
Apr 2, 2003, 06:33
 
Thanks for the shots Kenn.

My reacion is mixed, as a long-term DF player. Sabre fighting was always my favourite aspect of JK2 - especially in solo play, it was so cinematic and rewarding. The problem with "more emphasis" is that I almsot never took out a gun in solo play once my skills had advanced a little, 95% of my kills were from the sabre. How can you get 'more' than that?!?

I hope there's a Deus Ex style character customization for developing force powers and sabre skills.

Nonlinearity always makes me smile, it makes a beautiful game when executed sucessfully, but a tedius when when not.

I've noticed three sabre modes so far - single weapon, double weapon and twin-bladed. I hope that each will have different strengths and weaknesses, instead of them being a simple progresion in power.

Oh, and I love the ability to customize my character's appearance - really helps me get into the game

42.
 
Re: Random thoughts:
Apr 2, 2003, 00:46
42.
Re: Random thoughts: Apr 2, 2003, 00:46
Apr 2, 2003, 00:46
 
I remember the days where a lightsaber combat was pretty much limited to run into the guy, well timing a slash and back away. Repeat if necessary.

If they do go for the rpg elements, I surely hope they take the time to make them right and not just give us the ability to change the look of our guy.
"I know not with what weapons World War III will be fought, but World War IV will be fought with sticks and stones."
-Albert Einstein
41.
 
Random thoughts:
Apr 2, 2003, 00:31
41.
Random thoughts: Apr 2, 2003, 00:31
Apr 2, 2003, 00:31
 
Edit: Let me note that my opinions are biased as heck. I play very few online games, only the select few that interest me (TFC, DoD, BF1942) and I primarily look at the single-player aspect.

1. Whatever they call it, I hope that it is not a continuation of the Jedi Knight/Dark Forces series. I feel that series should still focus on Katarn or, if they absolutely must change it, continue some other epic story/quest in the same line. Heck, make it "JKII:Blah blah side story blah blah" if you have to.

2. I am mixed over JKII. Although it was a rather good Raven game, it was far better than 1337 Force, I thought that it was a letdown from JK or even DF (for the time.) Although much improved, it did feel like another Raven game; nice looking, but ultimately shallow and limited.

3. Let this game be something different; even with having to appease the Lucas god ;), there are a lot of different things that can be done within its confines. The graphics, especially the character models, give me flashbacks of the dull, generic JKII NPCs.

4. I am wary of the lightsaber emphasis. Although this is the one thing that Raven did really improve, I felt that the previous game already focused quite a bit on this. Likewise, I enjoyed the lightsaber combat as much as any other Star Wars fan boi, but the secondary reason that I used it so much was how broken the non-lightsaber weapons were. It concerns me that this new game will actively take this same route.

5. I would like to see a number of things in this new game, most/all of which seem to have been covered in the "preview" or from Kenn's own statements: a populated world, weapon balance, varied enemies, increased level interaction, less linearity, improved story flow, improved interface (force powers - quick menus, possibly a general use key like Zelda), a true experience system controlled by the player, light and dark sides of the force, etc.

6. Yeah, I will buy it. Shut up!

Obviously including references to the other story items,
Ray


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Don't eat the Menchi!11111
http://users.ign.com/collection/RayMarden
Currently playing: IGI 2, Raven Shield, Tenchu 3, and Wind Waker.
This comment was edited on Apr 2, 00:44.
Everything is awesome!!!
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40.
 
Pics
Apr 1, 2003, 18:23
40.
Pics Apr 1, 2003, 18:23
Apr 1, 2003, 18:23
 
No offense Kenn but if I was developing a game I would display some higher quality pics to your fans. Or supply them to high quality site like Blues to display.

39.
 
Re: While You're Here
Apr 1, 2003, 18:09
39.
Re: While You're Here Apr 1, 2003, 18:09
Apr 1, 2003, 18:09
 
WRT to "closed" architecture = no cheating.

Hardly. Look at Il-2. It's a flight sim that allowed little but plane skins to be altered and people found ways to cheat there. The worst was when people took advantage of the predictor code by intentionally cutting off their net connect then reconnecting a couple of seconds later. You'd think you were on a guy's six, then magically he's on yours and blowing you away! While he was disconnected he did a loop then reconnected in time to shoot you down.
Personally, I thought the old European Air War did it the best. It had a comprehensive file checker that worked quickly determine if host and client matched up in files like damage and performance and extra planes. If the 2 didn't match, no connect. If the two did, even if it meant both had P-51s that could fly Mach 2 and had 20,000lbs of bombs, they could. Mods allowed, but only if everyone has the same. This meant you had to be current with the files to play, and not only add but remove files when necessary ie put the burden on the player. But it did cut down on cheaters quite a bit.
The Q3 engine of course allows autodownloading of files, and the mod support means you can use different files without conflict. I see no trouble with a cheat IF everyone has access to it. Level the playing field. If everyone is indestructible, the cheaters won't have fun as they couldn't kill anyone either!

Wouldn't it be easier to make the game support a bunch of cheats in multiplayer, like God mode, UL ammo, all weapons, etc, and make them server-controlled? I would think if the cheat was already there but off it would be harder to hack one in then if they're trying to enable an SP-only cheat or something?

Heh, or built-in cheat punishment like making all their weapons (and Force powers in this case) instantly impotent? They can shoot you or anyone all they want, but you won't get hurt while you could kill them easily. But then I am a vengeful Master.


The Jedi Master

38.
 
Re: While You're Here
Apr 1, 2003, 17:49
38.
Re: While You're Here Apr 1, 2003, 17:49
Apr 1, 2003, 17:49
 
Quote: "Aren't those embargoed magazine shots? Oh well, even if they are, I guess that's Kenn's business."

Once something's out there, it's out there... Other sites have posted that link as "news" and there's not much I can do to stop them. I figure if they're out there (even if they're not supposed to be) then people should take a look at them.

--Kenn

This comment was edited on Apr 1, 17:50.
37.
 
Hmmm screenshots
Apr 1, 2003, 17:46
37.
Hmmm screenshots Apr 1, 2003, 17:46
Apr 1, 2003, 17:46
 
Kenn, you shameless plugger
Those look pretty dang good to me, even if a bit too much sand colored.. Please tell me there are going to be some star destroyer white levels

As for the WASD setup, I guess for me it boils down to this. I'm righthanded, meaning my mouse is to the right side of the keyboard. I don't happen to have a 9 feet wide desk, so space is limited. If I were to use the numpad for controlling my movements (which I'd have to do with my left hand), and then use the mouse with my right hand, I'd look like I have leprosy and it is VERY uncomfortable for my shoulders to sit that way (all bunched up). When using WASD it's a much more comfortable position, and in fact I have more keys to bind stuff to than I'd have on the numpad (which REALLY comes in handy for some games, where you want to rebind 20 or so keys to suit you better).

I really wish that developers would also start realising that permabinding keys (those that you cannot rebind) far away from the WASD setup is stupid and it really pisses me off. I then ALWAYS have to move my hand over to the other side of the keyboard (I have one of those split thingies for similar reasons as the WASD + Mouse setup), which breaks up the action, sometimes quite nastily.
Either put everything together, or make EVERYTHING rebindable. Probably the biggest annoyance I get in most games is when the quickload and quicksave buttons are once again on different keys, and I can't rebind them..


But I hear ya nin, Raven can keep doing JK games, and they'll be bought the second they come out (well, ALL of Raven's games get bought the second they come out, to be honest. ).

Kenn, is that Wolverine game going to come to PC?

Creston

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36.
 
Re: While You're Here
Apr 1, 2003, 17:40
36.
Re: While You're Here Apr 1, 2003, 17:40
Apr 1, 2003, 17:40
 
Aren't those embargoed magazine shots? Oh well, even if they are, I guess that's Kenn's business.

Weee!
Stephen "Blue" Heaslip
Blue's News Publisher, Editor-in-Chief, El Presidente for Life
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35.
 
Re: While You're Here
Apr 1, 2003, 17:33
35.
Re: While You're Here Apr 1, 2003, 17:33
Apr 1, 2003, 17:33
 
I assume you fellas (and ladies) have seen these?
http://www.pcgameshots.com/screen.php?i=c81e728d9d4c2f636f067f89cc14862c

--Kenn


54 Replies. 3 pages. Viewing page 1.
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