Kxmode wrote on Dec 12, 2024, 14:13:

The Watcher wrote on Dec 12, 2024, 10:20:

Zerg wrote on Dec 12, 2024, 09:15:

BobDenvers69 wrote on Dec 12, 2024, 08:47:

Kxmode wrote on Dec 12, 2024, 06:22:
It’s been the ultimate platform for PC gamers since day one

You have absolutely no fucking clue at all of what you are talking about. Steam fucking sucked the first few years.

Absolutely true. People HATED the idea of having to install Steam in order to play Valve's games.

My first time I had to install steam was when I purchased a hard copy of Left 4 Dead. Despite having the ENTIRE game content on the DVD, I had to download everything through Steam after activating the CD key. With a crappy and capped internet bandwidth.

20 year Steam vet here...people have serious rose colored glasses in regards to Steam. People hated it when it was released.

I didn't. And I'm not speaking about it from the perspective of EVERY PC GAMER. I'm only speaking about Steam from the perspective of me. I really don't care what others thought about Steam when it launched.

Come on, man. Day 1 Steam account here (moi) due to Counter-Strike and Steam was a complete piece of shit for the first YEARS. That's an undebatable fact. You saying you liked it is your prerogative, of course. Heck, people pay money in RL to get abused by dominatrixes so it's fine. You like abuse. Most of us don't. Cool. Whatever tickles yo fancy.

Steam was also completely uninteresting as a store in the first few years due to the non-aggression pact with retail. Games on Steam were ALWAYS much more expensive. I'm in EU (DE) and I ordered the vast majority of my games from Amazon.co.uk back then.
Two birds, one stone since I like to play the original English versions of games instead of the shitty German ones and new games from the UK were usually priced at ~€35-ish. Sometimes a little closer to €40, sometimes closer to €30.

Looking at my Steam account history, I bought/activated my first 3rd party games (i.e. except for Valve's own games which I activated on day 1 of Steam) in mid 2007.
The first non-Valve game I activated via a retail key was Dark Messiah of M&M on June 29th 2007. The first game I bought on Steam ($23.74) was the Deus Ex Collection in August 2007.
The "real" purchasing activity, however, did not pick up until the Xmas (oops, Winter) sale in 2009 when Steam must have had the first "serious" sales/discounts including flash sales and whatnot. I bought a whole bunch of games in December 2009 and from then on more games than I could play until today .

But... all of that was more than SIX years after Steam launched. Until then it was just an annoying, wonky launcher for Valve games, a DRM system for 3rd party games, and a useless store with shitty prices due to publishers being locked into their pricing by the still relevant brick & mortar faction.
All the nice features we are used to today came much later. Steam forums in 2012, reviews in 2013 etc.

The Watcher wrote on Dec 12, 2024, 10:20:

Zerg wrote on Dec 12, 2024, 09:15:

BobDenvers69 wrote on Dec 12, 2024, 08:47:

Kxmode wrote on Dec 12, 2024, 06:22:
It’s been the ultimate platform for PC gamers since day one

You have absolutely no fucking clue at all of what you are talking about. Steam fucking sucked the first few years.

Absolutely true. People HATED the idea of having to install Steam in order to play Valve's games.

My first time I had to install steam was when I purchased a hard copy of Left 4 Dead. Despite having the ENTIRE game content on the DVD, I had to download everything through Steam after activating the CD key. With a crappy and capped internet bandwidth.

20 year Steam vet here...people have serious rose colored glasses in regards to Steam. People hated it when it was released.

I didn't. And I'm not speaking about it from the perspective of EVERY PC GAMER. I'm only speaking about Steam from the perspective of me. I really don't care what others thought about Steam when it launched.

Argonius the 3rd wrote on Dec 12, 2024, 13:48:

Jivaro wrote on Dec 12, 2024, 12:45:
Steam, like every product ever, will only get better with market competition. So far their compeitition has been thin and comparatively inferior. MS jumping in neck deep is what I would expect if their goal is to be out of the console market, or HW in general, in the next 5 years. Why make hardware when you can just put the software on everything and let the hardware determine which games it can run?

Because you get to be innovative with custom hardware. Nintendo does it to some extend, but it can be much much more.... like technology that's freed from low powered hardware and the x86 architecture. Personally I'd love to see an Arm based console or even Risc V, with full hardware RT and AI, that performs 5x better than the current x86 architecture.

Thats a good point. Has MS actually been innovative though? I am not sure I would agree that they have been or really shown the willingness to be. I see Sony and Nintendo out there taking risks on hardware and accessories, not MS.

Jivaro wrote on Dec 12, 2024, 12:45:
Steam, like every product ever, will only get better with market competition. So far their compeitition has been thin and comparatively inferior. MS jumping in neck deep is what I would expect if their goal is to be out of the console market, or HW in general, in the next 5 years. Why make hardware when you can just put the software on everything and let the hardware determine which games it can run?

Because you get to be innovative with custom hardware. Nintendo does it to some extend, but it can be much much more.... like technology that's freed from low powered hardware and the x86 architecture. Personally I'd love to see an Arm based console or even Risc V, with full hardware RT and AI, that performs 5x better than the current x86 architecture.

Jivaro wrote on Dec 12, 2024, 12:45:
Steam, like every product ever, will only get better with market competition. So far their compeitition has been thin and comparatively inferior. MS jumping in neck deep is what I would expect if their goal is to be out of the console market, or HW in general, in the next 5 years. Why make hardware when you can just put the software on everything and let the hardware determine which games it can run? XBOX TVs, XBOX for your phone, XBOX for your PC...hell...maybe even XBOX for Playstation and Switch. Make XBOX the gaming OS of choice for mainstream hardware. It's what I would try to do anyway if I was MS.

Yes, yes and a thousand times yes. This is the main point of me rooting for competition. I am not interested in having 20 launchers or storefronts (just like I'm not interested in one big monopoly), but without competition Steam will begin to stagnate or even potentially regress. Because why try when there's no competition that could take customers away?

Steam, like every product ever, will only get better with market competition. So far their compeitition has been thin and comparatively inferior. MS jumping in neck deep is what I would expect if their goal is to be out of the console market, or HW in general, in the next 5 years. Why make hardware when you can just put the software on everything and let the hardware determine which games it can run? XBOX TVs, XBOX for your phone, XBOX for your PC...hell...maybe even XBOX for Playstation and Switch. Make XBOX the gaming OS of choice for mainstream hardware. It's what I would try to do anyway if I was MS.

The Watcher wrote on Dec 12, 2024, 10:20:

Zerg wrote on Dec 12, 2024, 09:15:

BobDenvers69 wrote on Dec 12, 2024, 08:47:

Kxmode wrote on Dec 12, 2024, 06:22:
It’s been the ultimate platform for PC gamers since day one

You have absolutely no fucking clue at all of what you are talking about. Steam fucking sucked the first few years.

Absolutely true. People HATED the idea of having to install Steam in order to play Valve's games.

My first time I had to install steam was when I purchased a hard copy of Left 4 Dead. Despite having the ENTIRE game content on the DVD, I had to download everything through Steam after activating the CD key. With a crappy and capped internet bandwidth.

20 year Steam vet here...people have serious rose colored glasses in regards to Steam. People hated it when it was released.

Yes, steam was like the AOL and was ignored until brick and mortar stores stopped selling PC games. I avoided it like plague for as long as I could l, but here I am today.

Despite considering myself a gaming vet that started on a Vic 20, I still only use steam to buy and launch games plus look at the fps (not using fraps like before). I just enjoy the title the way I want without getting guided by achievements or daily whatever used in modern games. Not using gear I hate to get an achievement, but that's just me. I don't see those like high scores on arcade machines, not even close.

_Cory wrote on Dec 12, 2024, 12:14:
This is something I never understood. I snatched a sealed copy of Wolfenstein: The New Order at the thrift store a while back and when I put it in my PC it just automatically downloaded the game on Steam. Is it even possible to install from disc? I couldn't find a way to do it.

Not easily. You would have to have a way to extract only the game files off the DVD, activate the game on Steam via CD key, and then you would have to tell Steam where you extracted the game (or just extract it into steamapps) and prompt Steam to scan for games.

Then MAYBE it would work. I never tried though.

Zerg wrote on Dec 12, 2024, 09:15:

BobDenvers69 wrote on Dec 12, 2024, 08:47:

Kxmode wrote on Dec 12, 2024, 06:22:
It’s been the ultimate platform for PC gamers since day one

You have absolutely no fucking clue at all of what you are talking about. Steam fucking sucked the first few years.

Absolutely true. People HATED the idea of having to install Steam in order to play Valve's games.

My first time I had to install steam was when I purchased a hard copy of Left 4 Dead. Despite having the ENTIRE game content on the DVD, I had to download everything through Steam after activating the CD key. With a crappy and capped internet bandwidth.

This is something I never understood. I snatched a sealed copy of Wolfenstein: The New Order at the thrift store a while back and when I put it in my PC it just automatically downloaded the game on Steam. Is it even possible to install from disc? I couldn't find a way to do it.

sauron wrote on Dec 12, 2024, 11:46:

RedEye9 wrote on Dec 12, 2024, 11:37:

Reactor wrote on Dec 12, 2024, 11:21:

The Watcher wrote on Dec 12, 2024, 10:20:
20 year Steam vet here...people have serious rose colored glasses in regards to Steam. People hated it when it was released.

Very true, although, can we not use the term vet to describe something that isn’t that far back compared to when I started playing games? I’m not even that old, but you make me sound like a gaming grandfather.

lol Reactor
You signed on in 2003, that makes you the olds. 🧓
Unless of course you made the account when you were 18, and then I apologize.

Here are some alternate definitions for vet ( I gotta admit the first thing I think of when I see that word is military service, my mind still thought that even after reading his post and knowing the context )
"a person who has had a lot of experience of a particular activity"
"having been involved in a particular activity for a long time"

I signed up to Blues in 2001, but had been gaming since 1981 (starting with the BBC B, Sharp MZ80K and Sinclair ZX81). I signed up to Steam as late as possible, but these days at least it works. I'm also OK with GOG, Epic (kinda) and Nintendo. Anything else is not welcome.

It's impossible to have a discussion about age with a lesser Maiar, who as we all know are both ageless and immortal.

RedEye9 wrote on Dec 12, 2024, 11:37:

Reactor wrote on Dec 12, 2024, 11:21:

The Watcher wrote on Dec 12, 2024, 10:20:
20 year Steam vet here...people have serious rose colored glasses in regards to Steam. People hated it when it was released.

Very true, although, can we not use the term vet to describe something that isn’t that far back compared to when I started playing games? I’m not even that old, but you make me sound like a gaming grandfather.

lol Reactor
You signed on in 2003, that makes you the olds. 🧓
Unless of course you made the account when you were 18, and then I apologize.

Here are some alternate definitions for vet ( I gotta admit the first thing I think of when I see that word is military service, my mind still thought that even after reading his post and knowing the context )
"a person who has had a lot of experience of a particular activity"
"having been involved in a particular activity for a long time"

Haha I'm not that old! But fair enough with the definitions.

I don't think I was gaming in '81. Maybe '82? It was Atari 2600, C64 and Amiga, back in the day...

RedEye9 wrote on Dec 12, 2024, 11:37:

Reactor wrote on Dec 12, 2024, 11:21:

The Watcher wrote on Dec 12, 2024, 10:20:
20 year Steam vet here...people have serious rose colored glasses in regards to Steam. People hated it when it was released.

Very true, although, can we not use the term vet to describe something that isn’t that far back compared to when I started playing games? I’m not even that old, but you make me sound like a gaming grandfather.

lol Reactor
You signed on in 2003, that makes you the olds. 🧓
Unless of course you made the account when you were 18, and then I apologize.

Here are some alternate definitions for vet ( I gotta admit the first thing I think of when I see that word is military service, my mind still thought that even after reading his post and knowing the context )
"a person who has had a lot of experience of a particular activity"
"having been involved in a particular activity for a long time"

I signed up to Blues in 2001, but had been gaming since 1981 (starting with the BBC B, Sharp MZ80K and Sinclair ZX81). I signed up to Steam as late as possible, but these days at least it works. I'm also OK with GOG, Epic (kinda) and Nintendo. Anything else is not welcome.

Reactor wrote on Dec 12, 2024, 11:21:

The Watcher wrote on Dec 12, 2024, 10:20:
20 year Steam vet here...people have serious rose colored glasses in regards to Steam. People hated it when it was released.

Very true, although, can we not use the term vet to describe something that isn’t that far back compared to when I started playing games? I’m not even that old, but you make me sound like a gaming grandfather.

lol Reactor
You signed on in 2003, that makes you the olds. 🧓
Unless of course you made the account when you were 18, and then I apologize.

Here are some alternate definitions for vet ( I gotta admit the first thing I think of when I see that word is military service, my mind still thought that even after reading his post and knowing the context )
"a person who has had a lot of experience of a particular activity"
"having been involved in a particular activity for a long time"

The Watcher wrote on Dec 12, 2024, 10:20:

Zerg wrote on Dec 12, 2024, 09:15:

BobDenvers69 wrote on Dec 12, 2024, 08:47:

Kxmode wrote on Dec 12, 2024, 06:22:
It’s been the ultimate platform for PC gamers since day one

You have absolutely no fucking clue at all of what you are talking about. Steam fucking sucked the first few years.

Absolutely true. People HATED the idea of having to install Steam in order to play Valve's games.

My first time I had to install steam was when I purchased a hard copy of Left 4 Dead. Despite having the ENTIRE game content on the DVD, I had to download everything through Steam after activating the CD key. With a crappy and capped internet bandwidth.

20 year Steam vet here...people have serious rose colored glasses in regards to Steam. People hated it when it was released.

Very true, although, can we not use the term vet to describe something that isn’t that far back compared to when I started playing games? I’m not even that old, but you make me sound like a gaming grandfather.

Zerg wrote on Dec 12, 2024, 09:15:

BobDenvers69 wrote on Dec 12, 2024, 08:47:

Kxmode wrote on Dec 12, 2024, 06:22:
It’s been the ultimate platform for PC gamers since day one

You have absolutely no fucking clue at all of what you are talking about. Steam fucking sucked the first few years.

Absolutely true. People HATED the idea of having to install Steam in order to play Valve's games.

My first time I had to install steam was when I purchased a hard copy of Left 4 Dead. Despite having the ENTIRE game content on the DVD, I had to download everything through Steam after activating the CD key. With a crappy and capped internet bandwidth.

20 year Steam vet here...people have serious rose colored glasses in regards to Steam. People hated it when it was released.

While I hate all these separate store logins, at least the Xbox one often means you can buy a game on your console and play it on your PC, or vice versa. It even means one purchase can allow two people to play the game at the same time on different devices, using different accounts. Even Steam purchases don't allow for that much flexibility.

I'm not saying I *like* having multiple logins just to play games, I'm saying the Xbox one offers more than most. Not a single Playstation game that came to PC is a freebie if you'd purchased it on the Playstation originally, despite requiring the same login (for zero benefit to the end user).

It's why I buy Xbox first-party games like the Gears and Forza series on the Microsoft store instead of Steam. I can buy one copy and play it with my wife, who prefers to play on the tv (on the xbox), while I'm at my PC.

Beamer wrote on Dec 12, 2024, 09:16:

RogueSix wrote on Dec 12, 2024, 08:07:

Argonius the 3rd wrote on Dec 12, 2024, 07:33:

RogueSix wrote on Dec 12, 2024, 06:53:


Yep. Thanks for bringing up the double standards and the pure hypocrisy. So, when have we last seen a review-bombing circus even remotely similar to the circus around Sony's PSN account requirements when a Micro$oft game demanded an Xbox account (they almost all do btw)?


[...]

Mate, are you alright ? There is no Xbox account, what are you talking about ? You use your microsoft account login credentials, the same you use in Windows, Office365, Azure, Teams, Visual Studio... etc..

Bruuuuhhhh...

Straight from the Micro$hit Flight Simulator store page:

Requires 3rd-Party Account: Xbox Live

^ Yes. I am quite alright, tyvm!

Just because it is the same login as the fucking M$ account, does not change the fact that these muppets are calling it a fucking "Xbox Live" account on their game pages (same for e.g. Forza ... them assholes are calling it a "Xbox Live" account consistently).

Yes, the same as how most games released by publishers require an account with that publisher.
Hell, 90% of games these days require a Steam account. If you don't have one, and you're lucky, it may be found with a GoG or an Epic account. Damn near every single game out there requires some account.

The asshole ones are the ones released not requiring an account they later do require.

Cool lecture and way to miss the point, dude. The point (my point) in the beginning of the thread was that I dislike Micro$hit's tendency to label everything that has to do with gaming on Windows PCs "Xbox-something" as Mr. Blue also insinuated in the article (my first post in the thread including the quote from the newsbit).

Then that @Orogogus dude showed up and accused me of being a hypocrite because I was singling out M$ which is not true at all. As I stated in a previous post, I have no probs with any account requirements per se but I have a problem with M$ labeling it fucking "Xbox Live" (or Xbox GameBar, Xbox App, Xbox GamePass for PC or Xbox-whatevertheshit). Again: I have a PC, not an Xbox. If I wanted an Xbox, I'd buy one. Simples.

That is the issue at hand. I have (almost) no problem using Steam, EGS, UbiSoft Connect, EA Play, Battle.net, Rockstar Social Club (that one is really shit tho) or to link my account to PSN or any other service if a game so requires.

The only gaming service/store I boycott fully for the reason stated before (GFWL debacle) is the Microsoft Store and any associated M$ services like GamePass. I never want to "own" (yeah, rent) a game on a M$ service ever again because M$ have broken the no. 1 rule (TRUST) when they flushed GFWL down the shitter and stole my game(s).

The only M$ crap I'm (barely) willing to endure is the "Xbox Live" (= Microsoft) account requirement because it is an inevitable necessity if you want to play certain games. It is disgusting to be forced to use an Xbox service but such is life. Can't have everything. I want to play M$F$ (among potentially other M$ games) so gotta play by the rules of the asshole company.

RogueSix wrote on Dec 12, 2024, 08:07:

Argonius the 3rd wrote on Dec 12, 2024, 07:33:

RogueSix wrote on Dec 12, 2024, 06:53:


Yep. Thanks for bringing up the double standards and the pure hypocrisy. So, when have we last seen a review-bombing circus even remotely similar to the circus around Sony's PSN account requirements when a Micro$oft game demanded an Xbox account (they almost all do btw)?


[...]

Mate, are you alright ? There is no Xbox account, what are you talking about ? You use your microsoft account login credentials, the same you use in Windows, Office365, Azure, Teams, Visual Studio... etc..

Bruuuuhhhh...

Straight from the Micro$hit Flight Simulator store page:

Requires 3rd-Party Account: Xbox Live

^ Yes. I am quite alright, tyvm!

Just because it is the same login as the fucking M$ account, does not change the fact that these muppets are calling it a fucking "Xbox Live" account on their game pages (same for e.g. Forza ... them assholes are calling it a "Xbox Live" account consistently).

Yes, the same as how most games released by publishers require an account with that publisher.
Hell, 90% of games these days require a Steam account. If you don't have one, and you're lucky, it may be found with a GoG or an Epic account. Damn near every single game out there requires some account.

The asshole ones are the ones released not requiring an account they later do require.

BobDenvers69 wrote on Dec 12, 2024, 08:47:

Kxmode wrote on Dec 12, 2024, 06:22:
It’s been the ultimate platform for PC gamers since day one

You have absolutely no fucking clue at all of what you are talking about. Steam fucking sucked the first few years.

Absolutely true. People HATED the idea of having to install Steam in order to play Valve's games.

My first time I had to install steam was when I purchased a hard copy of Left 4 Dead. Despite having the ENTIRE game content on the DVD, I had to download everything through Steam after activating the CD key. With a crappy and capped internet bandwidth.

BobDenvers69 wrote on Dec 12, 2024, 08:47:

Kxmode wrote on Dec 12, 2024, 06:22:
It’s been the ultimate platform for PC gamers since day one

You have absolutely no fucking clue at all of what you are talking about. Steam fucking sucked the first few years.

Never mind the coding, Hobbit Torturer Simulator 8 is only available on Steam. As such, Barad-Dur only uses Morbid(TM) gaming PCs. Oh, and Switch (but only when we want to play oh-so-cute Animal Crossing).