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18.
 
Re: Morning Tech Bits
Aug 7, 2022, 00:17
18.
Re: Morning Tech Bits Aug 7, 2022, 00:17
Aug 7, 2022, 00:17
 
Railic255 wrote on Aug 6, 2022, 20:34:
Simon Says wrote on Aug 6, 2022, 15:02:
Not undervolting means TONS of wasted power nowadays, even when the GPU is not anywhere near 100% utilization.

It has all become quite stupid really. I'd never run a GPU nowadays unless it's running an UV/OC ( undervolted and overclocked, meaning a positive core offset at a particular voltage ).

Any sites or guides you would recommend to get started on finding Decent UV/OC values on cards? I did a quick search and realized maybe I should ask before just dumping myself into it. Just saw this thread and figured I should start doing this as my family runs three gaming rigs and we could really use a bit less power.

I never used a guide.

But I could type you a short one and if you want more precisions we can communicate through email for that ( click my profile name and click "send mail" ).

There are different methods, but there's one I prefer.

Download MSI Afterburner and install it.

In the settings go to the User Interface tab and User Interface skinning properties. Change it to "MSI Cyborg Afterburner skin White by Drerex Design". Just so you have the same interface as me and I can show you screenshots below.

Also in settings under "General" tab look for "Unlock voltage monitoring" and "Unlock voltage control", enable both then click apply.

If you already know what is the max frequency your GPUs operate at, note them. If not, you'll have to figure that part out, there are monitoring tools with MSI Afterburner's settings when combined with Riva Tuner Statistics Server, or you can use the features of Geforce Experience.

First you need to find a main core positive offset ( look on that pic to find it as well as the curve menu: https://imgur.com/qKaV2rO ) that will be stable for you. Example, my GTX 1060 was stable at +125, my RTX 3070 is stable at +225. Depends on the model and particular silicon lottery of your GPUs.

I found my max stable offset by adjusting it upwards and playing a game as usual. When I went from +225 to +250 I got a crash. So I dialed it down to +225.

That's the overclocking part.

Now go into the curve menu for the undervolting part.

Remember that max frequency at default settings?

Well now look at the dots, find the one that is at that frequency on your offset curve. It may fall at 900mv, 912mv, 875mv, depends on your maximum stable offset and the maximum frequency your card reaches at default settings ( unless you want to go higher than default max frequency while maintaining a lower voltage, hence UV/OC ).

Once you found that dot you need to flatten the line after that dot on its right. If done correctly it'll look something like this: https://imgur.com/tryUMUj or this: https://imgur.com/o6Cu5gc . Those are both UV/OC because the max frequency with stock settings was 1850mhz, but it was using a much higher voltage, so tons more power.

Of course you can flatten the line at a lower voltage for a lower power usage while maintaining as much performance as possible with the positive core offset. Play around with it and you can save 5 presets/profiles with MSI afterburner to use later. You can even arrange to have them apply automatically on startup by clicking the "startup" button so its surrounded by red ( for this UI ).

That works for Nvidia cards. I don't know about AMD cards, altho you can probably find what you need by doing a search on youtube. A quick search here yielded this guide for AMD which explains everything you need to know: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rU_31-Z6om4

Fiddle around a bit with it, with this basic info you can probably find other cool things to try now, have fun.

Any questions? Drop a mail, if not, good luck!
17.
 
Re: Morning Tech Bits
Aug 6, 2022, 23:16
17.
Re: Morning Tech Bits Aug 6, 2022, 23:16
Aug 6, 2022, 23:16
 
RedEye9 wrote on Aug 5, 2022, 18:49:
Steele Johnson wrote on Aug 5, 2022, 17:59:
It just boggles my mind that power consumption is going up rather than down for modern hardware. Is going from 2k to 4k all that much more? My 6 year old 1070 has no problem with 2k, the fans hardly come on in most games when played in native resolution. How is it that current cards require so much more power for 4k? Or is the focus less on gaming and more on crypto these days?
At 4K you're pushing twice as many pixels and with the additions of RTX and other hoopla the chips are larger and more complex.
I don't think the increased power usage has anything to do with mining.

Well yeah, I understand that. But it has been 6 years with 2k no problem, with little fan action. Now you need a 1,500w psu and dry ice to cool down the next gen just for 4k and bells and whistles? (exaggeration of course, but still..). Something just doesn't seem right
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16.
 
Re: Morning Tech Bits
Aug 6, 2022, 20:34
16.
Re: Morning Tech Bits Aug 6, 2022, 20:34
Aug 6, 2022, 20:34
 
Simon Says wrote on Aug 6, 2022, 15:02:
Not undervolting means TONS of wasted power nowadays, even when the GPU is not anywhere near 100% utilization.

It has all become quite stupid really. I'd never run a GPU nowadays unless it's running an UV/OC ( undervolted and overclocked, meaning a positive core offset at a particular voltage ).

Any sites or guides you would recommend to get started on finding Decent UV/OC values on cards? I did a quick search and realized maybe I should ask before just dumping myself into it. Just saw this thread and figured I should start doing this as my family runs three gaming rigs and we could really use a bit less power.
15.
 
Re: Morning Tech Bits
Aug 6, 2022, 15:02
15.
Re: Morning Tech Bits Aug 6, 2022, 15:02
Aug 6, 2022, 15:02
 
The Flying Penguin wrote on Aug 6, 2022, 14:31:
I found an even simpler way to keep my 3080 from overheating my home office when I game, without sacrificing performance when I need it. I just globally cap my framerate in the Nvidia control panel to 120 fps (my Gsync monitor tops out at 100 Hz refresh anyway). Most games that I play are older games that were roaring away at 250+ fps needlessly, making the card work at full power. Even some modern games like Deep Rock Galactic were also running way too fast.

With the cap at 120, most of my games run the card much cooler, and quieter, and I have plenty of power overhead available for more demanding games like Satisfactory.

Undervolting also helps in those scenarios. I bet you're still burning through a lot of power you wouldn't need to.

For example I cap my games at 90 ( on a 95hz monitor with freesync on ). If I let it run default, even with 50% utilization the 3070 will often suck 160-180 watts.

At 50% utilization I can use the slowest undervolt I have and it'll use 60-80 watts instead and keep the game at a steady 90fps.

Not undervolting means TONS of wasted power nowadays, even when the GPU is not anywhere near 100% utilization.

It has all become quite stupid really. I'd never run a GPU nowadays unless it's running an UV/OC ( undervolted and overclocked, meaning a positive core offset at a particular voltage ).
14.
 
Re: Morning Tech Bits
Aug 6, 2022, 14:31
14.
Re: Morning Tech Bits Aug 6, 2022, 14:31
Aug 6, 2022, 14:31
 
I found an even simpler way to keep my 3080 from overheating my home office when I game, without sacrificing performance when I need it. I just globally cap my framerate in the Nvidia control panel to 120 fps (my Gsync monitor tops out at 100 Hz refresh anyway). Most games that I play are older games that were roaring away at 250+ fps needlessly, making the card work at full power. Even some modern games like Deep Rock Galactic were also running way too fast.

With the cap at 120, most of my games run the card much cooler, and quieter, and I have plenty of power overhead available for more demanding games like Satisfactory.

I know some people will argue with me, but I've been a serious gamer for 25 years, and there is a certain point beyond which, additional framerate is of no benefit. IMO anything over 144 fps is for bragging rights only. The only possible exception is esports, but that's a whole other can worms.

- “The planet is fine. The people are fucked.” -George Carlin
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13.
 
Re: Morning Tech Bits
Aug 6, 2022, 11:46
13.
Re: Morning Tech Bits Aug 6, 2022, 11:46
Aug 6, 2022, 11:46
 
These rumors are so stupid and should just be ignored. How do you "downgrade" a rumored spec? It's just all clickbate and means nothing until something is announced.
12.
 
Re: Morning Tech Bits
Aug 5, 2022, 22:19
12.
Re: Morning Tech Bits Aug 5, 2022, 22:19
Aug 5, 2022, 22:19
 
BIGtrouble77 wrote on Aug 5, 2022, 22:03:
It's entirely about the benchmarks. Too many people live and die by getting the sickest FPS they can. Those people will also buy a $500 water cooling setup for a marginal perf boost. It's become absurd. I can't believe that I'm questioning if my 1000w platinum PSU will be enough for a next-get GPU, but they are saying we'll probably need a 1,500w PSU for some of the Nvidia cards.
$200 on sale at EVGA SuperNOVA 1600 P+, 80+ PLATINUM 1600W, Fully Modular, 10 Year Warranty
Also for $30 buck more the p2, EVGA SuperNOVA 1600 P2, 80+ PLATINUM 1600W, Fully Modular, EVGA ECO Mode, 10 Year Warranty

I doubt they’ll be getting any cheaper, tempted to get a couple and put them on the shelf. jk

Before purchase make sure it supports the new power supply standard that’s coming up.
- At this point, Windows is the OS equivalent of Stockholm Syndrome. -
Burrito of Peace
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11.
 
Re: Morning Tech Bits
Aug 5, 2022, 22:03
11.
Re: Morning Tech Bits Aug 5, 2022, 22:03
Aug 5, 2022, 22:03
 
RedEye9 wrote on Aug 5, 2022, 18:49:
Steele Johnson wrote on Aug 5, 2022, 17:59:
It just boggles my mind that power consumption is going up rather than down for modern hardware. Is going from 2k to 4k all that much more? My 6 year old 1070 has no problem with 2k, the fans hardly come on in most games when played in native resolution. How is it that current cards require so much more power for 4k? Or is the focus less on gaming and more on crypto these days?
At 4K you're pushing twice as many pixels and with the additions of RTX and other hoopla the chips are larger and more complex.
I don't think the increased power usage has anything to do with mining.
It's entirely about the benchmarks. Too many people live and die by getting the sickest FPS they can. Those people will also buy a $500 water cooling setup for a marginal perf boost. It's become absurd. I can't believe that I'm questioning if my 1000w platinum PSU will be enough for a next-get GPU, but they are saying we'll probably need a 1,500w PSU for some of the Nvidia cards.
Avatar 20018
10.
 
Re: Morning Tech Bits
Aug 5, 2022, 18:49
10.
Re: Morning Tech Bits Aug 5, 2022, 18:49
Aug 5, 2022, 18:49
 
Steele Johnson wrote on Aug 5, 2022, 17:59:
It just boggles my mind that power consumption is going up rather than down for modern hardware. Is going from 2k to 4k all that much more? My 6 year old 1070 has no problem with 2k, the fans hardly come on in most games when played in native resolution. How is it that current cards require so much more power for 4k? Or is the focus less on gaming and more on crypto these days?
At 4K you're pushing twice as many pixels and with the additions of RTX and other hoopla the chips are larger and more complex.
I don't think the increased power usage has anything to do with mining.
- At this point, Windows is the OS equivalent of Stockholm Syndrome. -
Burrito of Peace
Avatar 58135
9.
 
Re: Morning Tech Bits
Aug 5, 2022, 17:59
9.
Re: Morning Tech Bits Aug 5, 2022, 17:59
Aug 5, 2022, 17:59
 
It just boggles my mind that power consumption is going up rather than down for modern hardware. Is going from 2k to 4k all that much more? My 6 year old 1070 has no problem with 2k, the fans hardly come on in most games when played in native resolution. How is it that current cards require so much more power for 4k? Or is the focus less on gaming and more on crypto these days? I could end up going with AMD this time around. During the pandemic, my 9 year old machine sh!t the bed (the mobo), so was forced to build a new one with all the high prices. I ended up going with AMD 5600x for cpu running on an ASUS x570-e mobo, and just swapped out my old 1070 from the other machine (I actually didn't spend much money). I have to say, the 7nm is really amazing! It runs super cool and has no problems running games, editing audio and video. I do have a Corsair iCUE H150i Elite Capellix liquid cooler running on it, but it seems to be overkill because the fans never ramp up and the cpu stays in 20s even when gaming. It's so silent that it seems the computer isn't even turned on. It will be interesting to see AMD's RDNA 3 cards. They'll probably sap more power as well, but I doubt it will be as much as the 4000 series
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8.
 
Re: Morning Tech Bits
Aug 5, 2022, 16:21
8.
Re: Morning Tech Bits Aug 5, 2022, 16:21
Aug 5, 2022, 16:21
 
The only reason I got my 3090 was for Cuda. And maybe for 6 monitors some day.

Will definitely be giving a hard pass on the 4000 series.
7.
 
Re: Morning Tech Bits
Aug 5, 2022, 16:18
7.
Re: Morning Tech Bits Aug 5, 2022, 16:18
Aug 5, 2022, 16:18
 
AIs can't care about anything. That would be like a shovel caring about the dirt it moves. It is a purely human concept.

Though in an age where people believe jpgs can't be copied, they'll certainly believe neural networks are sentient.

So marketing and sales guys will say anything and everything about AI.
6.
 
Re: NVIDIA GeForce RTX 4080 rumored specs downgraded to 9728 CUDA cores.
Aug 5, 2022, 16:13
6.
Re: NVIDIA GeForce RTX 4080 rumored specs downgraded to 9728 CUDA cores. Aug 5, 2022, 16:13
Aug 5, 2022, 16:13
 
Simon Says wrote on Aug 5, 2022, 13:59:
BIGtrouble77 wrote on Aug 5, 2022, 13:20:
For my next GPU purchase, I'm pretty sure I'm going to do what I did when I bought my GTX 1080 TI for $600... I'm just going to buy the best card I can when the 4000 series is announced. I need an AMD card this time around, so hopefully the RX 6900XT is nearing $600 by then.

Even if the next gen cards are available and reasonably priced, my board from 2018 is only PCI 3.0 (so I will be leaving performance on the table) and I also don't want to deal with the absurd power requirements they are going to have.

AMD's upcoming cards are rumored to be much more frugal than Nvidia's and that PCIe 3.0 16x probably won't bottleneck much if anything at all until testing proves otherwise.

Undervolting is also always an option and can cut down almost as 3 quarters of the power consumption depending on how low you're willing to go.

For example, my current 3070 at default settings with power limits at 120% can guzzle up to 265 watts. 100% will guzzle 220W. A simple undervolt resulting in a higher than default clock ( by default it hovers around 1850mhz, the UV drops it down to ~180-190W, this "performance" focused undervolt runs at 1965mhz with a 900mv cap ).

This "performance" focused undervolt has better perf than even the 120% power default settings 265W config and basically slashed ~80W out of 265W with a slight performance bump.

You can have similar results on AMD cards ( RDNA 2 and 1 at least ).

Nvidia pushes them way too far up into inefficiency territory.

The second UV setting is at 800mv and hits 1770mhz, resulting in a barely noticeable perf drop compared to defaults, around 3 to 4%. Power consumption drops to around 140-160W, sometimes lower.

3rd UV setting is at 712mv and hits 1530mhz, perf drop is around 10% and power consumption hovers around 100 to 120W. This is basically my go to setting on hot summer days when I don't need the extra oomph. When I do, I go with setting #2.

I also have a last UV setting at 667mv ( the lowest Ampere will go ) at 1335mhz that I use when I don't game to minimize desktop power consumption or for games that aren't very demanding. Power consumption hovers in the 60 to 80W range when pushed to 100% usage and performance still kicks some serious ass. Otherwise it can go as low as 45-50W under non-100% usage ( altho not idle, idle is around 17-20W ).

For around half the power consumption, you still have 90% of the performance and for almost a quarter of the power consumption you can have about 70-80% of the default settings performance.

Hope that helps folks around here in their decision making process. Altho ofc YMMV with NV's 4000 series and AMD's 7000 series.

Nice underclocks, good to see more data out there. Undervolting is fast becoming a necessary thing as these hardware companies clock the parts as high as possible to compete on performance. Its been almost a requirement to undervolt AMD gpus since the r9 290 and especially the rx400-500 "polaris" cards as AMD would clock them high enough to guarantee stablility and performance. Much of the time, the chips when undervolted were more stable.
5.
 
Re: NVIDIA GeForce RTX 4080 rumored specs downgraded to 9728 CUDA cores.
Aug 5, 2022, 16:12
mag
5.
Re: NVIDIA GeForce RTX 4080 rumored specs downgraded to 9728 CUDA cores. Aug 5, 2022, 16:12
Aug 5, 2022, 16:12
mag
 
BIGtrouble77 wrote on Aug 5, 2022, 13:20:
For my next GPU purchase, I'm pretty sure I'm going to do what I did when I bought my GTX 1080 TI for $600... I'm just going to buy the best card I can when the 4000 series is announced. I need an AMD card this time around, so hopefully the RX 6900XT is nearing $600 by then.

Even if the next gen cards are available and reasonably priced, my board from 2018 is only PCI 3.0 (so I will be leaving performance on the table) and I also don't want to deal with the absurd power requirements they are going to have.

6900xt currently go for $700, I think you probably won't have much trouble getting one for $600 in a couple months.
4.
 
Re: NVIDIA GeForce RTX 4080 rumored specs downgraded to 9728 CUDA cores.
Aug 5, 2022, 13:59
4.
Re: NVIDIA GeForce RTX 4080 rumored specs downgraded to 9728 CUDA cores. Aug 5, 2022, 13:59
Aug 5, 2022, 13:59
 
BIGtrouble77 wrote on Aug 5, 2022, 13:20:
For my next GPU purchase, I'm pretty sure I'm going to do what I did when I bought my GTX 1080 TI for $600... I'm just going to buy the best card I can when the 4000 series is announced. I need an AMD card this time around, so hopefully the RX 6900XT is nearing $600 by then.

Even if the next gen cards are available and reasonably priced, my board from 2018 is only PCI 3.0 (so I will be leaving performance on the table) and I also don't want to deal with the absurd power requirements they are going to have.

AMD's upcoming cards are rumored to be much more frugal than Nvidia's and that PCIe 3.0 16x probably won't bottleneck much if anything at all until testing proves otherwise.

Undervolting is also always an option and can cut down almost as 3 quarters of the power consumption depending on how low you're willing to go.

For example, my current 3070 at default settings with power limits at 120% can guzzle up to 265 watts. 100% will guzzle 220W. A simple undervolt resulting in a higher than default clock ( by default it hovers around 1850mhz, the UV drops it down to ~180-190W, this "performance" focused undervolt runs at 1965mhz with a 900mv cap ).

This "performance" focused undervolt has better perf than even the 120% power default settings 265W config and basically slashed ~80W out of 265W with a slight performance bump.

You can have similar results on AMD cards ( RDNA 2 and 1 at least ).

Nvidia pushes them way too far up into inefficiency territory.

The second UV setting is at 800mv and hits 1770mhz, resulting in a barely noticeable perf drop compared to defaults, around 3 to 4%. Power consumption drops to around 140-160W, sometimes lower.

3rd UV setting is at 712mv and hits 1530mhz, perf drop is around 10% and power consumption hovers around 100 to 120W. This is basically my go to setting on hot summer days when I don't need the extra oomph. When I do, I go with setting #2.

I also have a last UV setting at 667mv ( the lowest Ampere will go ) at 1335mhz that I use when I don't game to minimize desktop power consumption or for games that aren't very demanding. Power consumption hovers in the 60 to 80W range when pushed to 100% usage and performance still kicks some serious ass. Otherwise it can go as low as 45-50W under non-100% usage ( altho not idle, idle is around 17-20W ).

For around half the power consumption, you still have 90% of the performance and for almost a quarter of the power consumption you can have about 70-80% of the default settings performance.

Hope that helps folks around here in their decision making process. Altho ofc YMMV with NV's 4000 series and AMD's 7000 series.

This comment was edited on Aug 5, 2022, 14:56.
3.
 
Re: NVIDIA GeForce RTX 4080 rumored specs downgraded to 9728 CUDA cores.
Aug 5, 2022, 13:45
3.
Re: NVIDIA GeForce RTX 4080 rumored specs downgraded to 9728 CUDA cores. Aug 5, 2022, 13:45
Aug 5, 2022, 13:45
 
BIGtrouble77 wrote on Aug 5, 2022, 13:20:
I also don't want to deal with the absurd power requirements they are going to have.

After another summer with my computer room in the upstairs of an old house, I'm with you on that one big time. It's not so bad in the winter, but I really don't want to add even more power hungry parts to my gaming space heater.

I also don't want to have drop another $150-$200 on a big power supply on top of any video card upgrade I might put in when I already have a decent 850w as it is. The 3080's were crazy enough for power as it is.
2.
 
Re: NVIDIA GeForce RTX 4080 rumored specs downgraded to 9728 CUDA cores.
Aug 5, 2022, 13:20
2.
Re: NVIDIA GeForce RTX 4080 rumored specs downgraded to 9728 CUDA cores. Aug 5, 2022, 13:20
Aug 5, 2022, 13:20
 
For my next GPU purchase, I'm pretty sure I'm going to do what I did when I bought my GTX 1080 TI for $600... I'm just going to buy the best card I can when the 4000 series is announced. I need an AMD card this time around, so hopefully the RX 6900XT is nearing $600 by then.

Even if the next gen cards are available and reasonably priced, my board from 2018 is only PCI 3.0 (so I will be leaving performance on the table) and I also don't want to deal with the absurd power requirements they are going to have.
Avatar 20018
1.
 
Re: Morning Tech Bits
Aug 5, 2022, 12:17
1.
Re: Morning Tech Bits Aug 5, 2022, 12:17
Aug 5, 2022, 12:17
 
I hear so many stories about how AI is going to destroy us but headline after headline I read leads me to believe that algorithms care more about life than people do.
18 Replies. 1 pages. Viewing page 1.
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