I dunno. Maybe Doom Eternal isn't the best game to show this off on. It looks good without it. It definitely looks great on Quake 2 though.

Bill Borre wrote on Jun 29, 2021, 12:56:
I dunno. Maybe Doom Eternal isn't the best game to show this off on. It looks good without it. It definitely looks great on Quake 2 though.

Yeah, the effects are barely noticeable in the trailer and yet the performance impact will not be. Quake II RTX was definitely enjoyable though - it got me to play through the entire game for the first time.

Age verification check: No thanks.
Maybe its time to use something other than YouTube.

Sharken wrote on Jun 29, 2021, 13:47:
Age verification check: No thanks.
Maybe its time to use something other than YouTube.

Or maybe have a google account like the rest of the planet Earth and it won’t ask you.

phinn wrote on Jun 29, 2021, 13:53:

Sharken wrote on Jun 29, 2021, 13:47:
Age verification check: No thanks.
Maybe its time to use something other than YouTube.

Or maybe have a google account like the rest of the planet Earth and it won’t ask you.

Come on in, the water is lovely.

?? I have never used a google account on youtube.

Getting age checked? Add nsfw to the youtube link, ie. https://www.nsfwyoutube.com/watch?v=f6_rMEEEY6s&ab_channel=NVIDIAGeForce

and perhaps click the additional button on that page, if the youtube video doesn't play immediately.

Disclaimer: This page occasionally breaks as youtube patches something, but the developers are pretty good about fixing it in a day or two.

Due to the lack of a RTX card on my desktop I installed the update on the Series X and, again, ray tracing just does nothing for me. You have to look very hard to spot the differences.

phinn wrote on Jun 29, 2021, 13:53:

Sharken wrote on Jun 29, 2021, 13:47:
Age verification check: No thanks.
Maybe its time to use something other than YouTube.

Or maybe have a google account like the rest of the planet Earth and it won’t ask you.

Except no. In the EU, "adult" flagged videos require your account be verified as "adult" via giving Google your credit card details; otherwise the video is blocked.

theyarecomingforyou wrote on Jun 29, 2021, 13:08:

Bill Borre wrote on Jun 29, 2021, 12:56:
I dunno. Maybe Doom Eternal isn't the best game to show this off on. It looks good without it. It definitely looks great on Quake 2 though.

Yeah, the effects are barely noticeable in the trailer and yet the performance impact will not be. Quake II RTX was definitely enjoyable though - it got me to play through the entire game for the first time.

Nah, having ray-traced reflections is like taking off the horse blinders you've been wearing your whole gaming life. Once you're used to that, it's painful to go back to looking at the smudgy placeholders so many games frequently employ. Even the nicest screen-space mirroring loses its sheen when its limitations are made to look so obvious by comparison.

Full-on ray-traced lighting would be nice, but it takes a lot of work next to flipping a switch for RT reflections. You have to strip out all the fake light sources and then make sure every level still looks the way you want with only the real lights, which isn't easy to do for any game designed with the old way of thinking about illumination.

As for performance, that's why they push DLSS along with it. Not that framerate is much of a concern in this game unless you're trying to run it on a potato. I did a quick comparison looking at the outside of a glass-covered building and measured 285-290fps with RTX off, 200-205fps with RT reflections on, 235-240fps with RT reflections and DLSS Quality, and 260-265fps with RT reflections and DLSS Balanced.

jacobvandy wrote on Jun 29, 2021, 14:53:
Nah, having ray-traced reflections is like taking off the horse blinders you've been wearing your whole gaming life. Once you're used to that, it's painful to go back to looking at the smudgy placeholders so many games frequently employ. Even the nicest screen-space mirroring loses its sheen when its limitations are made to look so obvious by comparison.

Full-on ray-traced lighting would be nice, but it takes a lot of work next to flipping a switch for RT reflections. You have to strip out all the fake light sources and then make sure every level still looks the way you want with only the real lights, which isn't easy to do for any game designed with the old way of thinking about illumination.

Personally, I think applying RT reflections should take as much work as RT lighting. Why? Because so many of the surfaces shown in the video are too mirror-like, IMO. Just as RT lighting needs to have an environment artist re-work the level in order to make sure it looks right, good RT reflections also needs an environment artist to adjust the object materials to account for how RT will affect the reflections. Industrial-looking military installations, like the ones shown in Doom, should not be covered in mirrored surfaces. For many of the scenes in the video, I prefer the "smudgy placeholders" because they look more appropriate for the environment.

phinn wrote on Jun 29, 2021, 13:53:

Sharken wrote on Jun 29, 2021, 13:47:
Age verification check: No thanks.
Maybe its time to use something other than YouTube.

Or maybe have a google account like the rest of the planet Earth and it won’t ask you.

The rest of the planet Earth is not equal. Some of the rest of the planet Earth is more equal than others . Fact is if you live in the EU then YT will require age verification even if you have an account. You have to send them a copy of your ID or enter your credit card number.

RogueSix wrote on Jun 29, 2021, 16:58:

phinn wrote on Jun 29, 2021, 13:53:

Sharken wrote on Jun 29, 2021, 13:47:
Age verification check: No thanks.
Maybe its time to use something other than YouTube.

Or maybe have a google account like the rest of the planet Earth and it won’t ask you.

The rest of the planet Earth is not equal. Some of the rest of the planet Earth is more equal than others . Fact is if you live in the EU then YT will require age verification even if you have an account. You have to send them a copy of your ID or enter your credit card number.

The funny part being that if you copy your ID without marking it as such, and without blacking info out info that is irrelevant (basically only name, picture and DOB is required to verify age) you committed a violation of the GDPR in the EU.. just FYI

RogueSix wrote on Jun 29, 2021, 16:58:
The rest of the planet Earth is not equal. Some of the rest of the planet Earth is more equal than others . Fact is if you live in the EU then YT will require age verification even if you have an account. You have to send them a copy of your ID or enter your credit card number.

Indeed, i find it a shame that the YouTube age check nonsense exists. Apparently it is this EU law that has made Google require ID or Credit Card:

Audiovisual Media Services Directive (AVMSD)

I wonder if the Steam age check would not be sufficient for the EU. If not then something is seriously wrong in Europe

theyarecomingforyou wrote on Jun 29, 2021, 13:08:

Bill Borre wrote on Jun 29, 2021, 12:56:
I dunno. Maybe Doom Eternal isn't the best game to show this off on. It looks good without it. It definitely looks great on Quake 2 though.

Yeah, the effects are barely noticeable in the trailer and yet the performance impact will not be. Quake II RTX was definitely enjoyable though - it got me to play through the entire game for the first time.

Oi. I couldn't get through the campaign without getting major motion sickness. I'm not in my teens anymore lol.

Sharken wrote on Jun 29, 2021, 17:35:
I wonder if the Steam age check would not be sufficient for the EU. If not then something is seriously wrong in Europe

Nope. Steam's AVS (simple birth date check that can be easily manipulated) is not strong enough.

It is pretty lame that Valve still has not managed to implement proper AVS in Steam after all these years (no matter for which country). The original Half-Life used to be soft-banned in Germany. Soft-ban = No advertising for the game was allowed, no sales to persons under the age of 18. A lack of a proper AVS is basically a day 1 Valve/Steam issue. It is inexplicable that Valve has not made any progress in that regard. We've had digital feature IDs in the EU for a long time now and there is a whole new European eID since 01/01/2021. Valve would only have to implement the proper interface. Porn sites have been able to pull off proper AVS since the 1990s.

Or use the same AVS as YouTube? If a Steam customer has a credit card tied to their account treat them like an adult. How about that? Or maybe we could even just use simple logic. I own a day 1 Steam account so my Steam account is 17 years old now. I doubt I would have been able to create a Steam account if I would have been under the age of 1 back in 2003 .

Flo wrote on Jun 29, 2021, 14:33:
Due to the lack of a RTX card on my desktop I installed the update on the Series X and, again, ray tracing just does nothing for me. You have to look very hard to spot the differences.

Yeah, the advantage of RTX in modern games is that it will take a lot less work to make it look nice, not that it will make it look a lot better.

jdreyer wrote on Jun 29, 2021, 19:06:

Flo wrote on Jun 29, 2021, 14:33:
Due to the lack of a RTX card on my desktop I installed the update on the Series X and, again, ray tracing just does nothing for me. You have to look very hard to spot the differences.

Yeah, the advantage of RTX in modern games is that it will take a lot less work to make it look nice, not that it will make it look a lot better.

Of course it makes it look better, much better. Reflections are actually realistic and reflect things unlike the base game. Also Ray traced global illumination is massively different in games that use it like Minecraft RTX and Metro Exodus. I'd imagine id Tech 8 will support such tech. This is just RTR, btu with RTGI too it'll be so much better looking.

jacobvandy wrote on Jun 29, 2021, 14:53:

theyarecomingforyou wrote on Jun 29, 2021, 13:08:
Yeah, the effects are barely noticeable in the trailer and yet the performance impact will not be. Quake II RTX was definitely enjoyable though - it got me to play through the entire game for the first time.

Nah, having ray-traced reflections is like taking off the horse blinders you've been wearing your whole gaming life. Once you're used to that, it's painful to go back to looking at the smudgy placeholders so many games frequently employ. Even the nicest screen-space mirroring loses its sheen when its limitations are made to look so obvious by comparison.

I haven't found that it's something that I really miss when it's turned off. Unlike more in-your-face things like HDR, it's realistic and normal enough that I often don't notice the reflections unless I think to look for them.

Control had a few anachronisms in there like film projectors that were great fun and really showed off the raytracing, but there were times coming around a corner that I was startled by my own reflection, and I'm not entirely sure that it improved my experience.

Domgrief wrote on Jun 29, 2021, 21:48:
Control had a few anachronisms in there like film projectors that were great fun and really showed off the raytracing, but there were times coming around a corner that I was startled by my own reflection, and I'm not entirely sure that it improved my experience.

That happened to me a couple times, too, but I had the opposite reaction. Just the fact that it happened is fucking awesome, because it's supposed to happen. Same with another thing that happens in Control quite a bit, where you can't see clearly through a window because of bright lighting on your side of it. Even if it might be a hindrance to gameplay, that's how reflections work, and having accurate ones is part of the next level of realism in graphics. I don't want games to stop at just showing it off like a gimmick you can toggle, I'm looking forward to the paradigm shift where ray-tracing everything is the baseline.

What about the "original" Doom (2016)?