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34.
 
Re: Saturday Tech Bits
Jun 21, 2021, 00:11
34.
Re: Saturday Tech Bits Jun 21, 2021, 00:11
Jun 21, 2021, 00:11
 
100% sticking with the 10. The new is garbage.
33.
 
Re: Saturday Tech Bits
Jun 20, 2021, 20:46
33.
Re: Saturday Tech Bits Jun 20, 2021, 20:46
Jun 20, 2021, 20:46
 
bigspender wrote on Jun 20, 2021, 03:09:
Windows 11 can f-off if they have the start menu and icons in the middle like mac os. ewwww

You can change it with a setting.
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32.
 
Re: Saturday Tech Bits
Jun 20, 2021, 20:45
32.
Re: Saturday Tech Bits Jun 20, 2021, 20:45
Jun 20, 2021, 20:45
 
Prez wrote on Jun 19, 2021, 17:53:
I'm about as hands off as I can get when it comes to Windows honestly. I've only ever upgraded to the new iterations when 1) games stop working on the current version, or 2) Microsoft ends support for the version I have, basically forcing me to upgrade.

Windows 7 (probably even XP) was pretty stable and I'd still be using that for years if it was practical.

XP was only ok for it's time, when 7 came out imo we saw how horrendous it was. Prior to 7 the first rule of support was "did you reboot?", win7 made your forget that was the first thing to try because it wasn't needed all that much, but when you found out a reboot fixed the current issue you always kicked yourself mentally in the ass.
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31.
 
Re: Saturday Tech Bits
Jun 20, 2021, 19:14
31.
Re: Saturday Tech Bits Jun 20, 2021, 19:14
Jun 20, 2021, 19:14
 
phinn wrote on Jun 20, 2021, 19:07:
. Perhaps if Gnome ever figures out (in addition to how to correctly pronounce their own software) that a bottom bar is a necessity from a usability and asthetic standpoint, if Wayland ever gets working with Nvidia, and they ever unify the package manager so anyone can grab a prebuilt package on any Linux distro and just install it... we would have a decent desktop.
Sounds like a business plan, get on it!
“Extinction is the rule. Survival is the exception.” -- Carl Sagan
30.
 
Re: Saturday Tech Bits
Jun 20, 2021, 19:07
30.
Re: Saturday Tech Bits Jun 20, 2021, 19:07
Jun 20, 2021, 19:07
 
@Verno wow an actual level-headed comment without whining and complaining on here like most people seem do. I look forward to Win11 based on your comments, Win10 has been mostly great for me. Disabled the spyware the best I could, otherwise it's been a great all around desktop OS for productivity and gaming over the past few years.

Regarding your Linux comments, I agree 100%, used it extensively over the years as well and its weaknesses on the desktop are as apparent as ever. Perhaps if Gnome ever figures out (in addition to how to correctly pronounce their own software) that a bottom bar is a necessity from a usability and asthetic standpoint, if Wayland ever gets working with Nvidia, and they ever unify the package manager so anyone can grab a prebuilt package on any Linux distro and just install it... we would have a decent desktop.
29.
 
Re: Saturday Tech Bits
Jun 20, 2021, 14:53
29.
Re: Saturday Tech Bits Jun 20, 2021, 14:53
Jun 20, 2021, 14:53
 
"In the land of the blind, the one-eyed man is king..."
“Extinction is the rule. Survival is the exception.” -- Carl Sagan
28.
 
Re: Saturday Tech Bits
Jun 20, 2021, 14:34
Jivaro
 
28.
Re: Saturday Tech Bits Jun 20, 2021, 14:34
Jun 20, 2021, 14:34
 Jivaro
 
Those are fair points. I am still the village idiot though. Don't take my sunshine dammit.
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27.
 
Re: Saturday Tech Bits
Jun 20, 2021, 13:40
27.
Re: Saturday Tech Bits Jun 20, 2021, 13:40
Jun 20, 2021, 13:40
 
Jivaro wrote on Jun 20, 2021, 12:49:
Yes, if you haven't been using Linux before now you will have a learning curve...but GUYS...I am the village idiot technologically compared to most of you.
And you're still lightyears ahead of the average user. The fact that you've ever been interested in programming languages or hardware is still far ahead of the average user, who is likely going to go blank if you even think of talking about the various internal components like memory or graphics cards. Even knowing that Blue's News is a site about gaming news (instead of being a site about music artists) marks you as someone who knows more about computers and gaming than most people.

You aren't going to think that your computer runs faster just because you got a new monitor. Yes, I've actually run into someone thanking me for making their PC faster when all I did (and was asked to do) was replace the monitor.
26.
 
Re: Saturday Tech Bits
Jun 20, 2021, 13:16
Verno
 
26.
Re: Saturday Tech Bits Jun 20, 2021, 13:16
Jun 20, 2021, 13:16
 Verno
 
Farted around with it in a VM last night.

- centered taskbar is fine and it's a single toggle to disable. Always auto hide for me regardless.

- if you hover over the maximize button on a window, you get a lot of alignment options which is nice

- Control panel to Settings is mostly transitioned over. I don't mind but they need to multiple Settings Windows opened at once. I use a powerscript for a lot of that stuff but they should do that.

- They did something with the renderer, right click on taskbar stuff is like lightning now

- Start menu is vastly improved by the clean up and aesthetic changes

Just my first impressions of the UI stuff, haven't played around much so far. This obviously is not feature complete and a lot more will change.

Re: Linux, we've done that debate to death and there aren't many tangible advantages for Windows users to switch. Windows security is mostly good enough from the end users perspective these days and few people are truly paying for Windows anymore outside of OEM licensing. At best you get a similar experience, often with reduced compatibility, especially in gaming. I feel like that's the reason Linux marketshare has barely moved for 20 years. Combine that with many people being well served by their phones and tablets. I've run *nix operating systems all of my life for work and enjoy using them in that context but at home for gaming I stick with Windows.

This comment was edited on Jun 20, 2021, 13:37.
Playing: Wildermyth, Mass Effect Legendary, Returnal
Watching: Deadwood, Dune, Evil
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25.
 
Re: Saturday Tech Bits
Jun 20, 2021, 13:14
25.
Re: Saturday Tech Bits Jun 20, 2021, 13:14
Jun 20, 2021, 13:14
 
Felt it was worth adding my experience/two cents here as well.

I switched to Linux several years ago, and have only wished I did it sooner. Back then, WINE front-ends were the best “simple” choice for gaming, DirectX 10/11 didn't work on WINE, general driver support was good but not perfect, Linux was still really more for the enthusiast. It didn't win me at first, but over time I never felt the same amount of control or security with Windows.

Fast forward today, my gaming PC is Linux, WINE is supported by Valve and BUILT INTO STEAM (still blows my mind), and it supports DirectX 10/11/12! I just confirm I want to use Steam Play and bam, I can play 95% of games with little to no hassle. Driver support is much better, and gets better all the time but YMMV.

As similarly stated in this thread and worth stating again, all games don't work, a lot of software vendors are still treating Linux as a third-class citizen, and sadly, that one or two pieces of software you really like may not have a port/alternative or work/play well with WINE. You might need a VM every now and then, but honestly I only pull it out for old (16-bit/really wonky) installers for mods, again YMMV. Even then, we have so many reversed engineered game projects like OpenMW, ScummVM, OpenRCT2, and countless others. Not to mention you now have stuff like RetroArch for managing all your emulators/games, and some of this stuff I mentioned is even on Steam, all you noobs are spoiled!

You can always try Linux out on a USB, dual-boot from another drive, or install it on another machine, and if you still don't like it, then hey, at least you gave it a shot. And if BoP says his granny can do it, well...

When I switched, I had the advantage of being much younger and had a lot more time, and it would seem hard now, but I did a similar thing back in 2019 when I decided to switch to OpenBSD for my daily driver install. Now that I wouldn't recommend to any one who games, for that I recommend Linux!

Also, in regards as to why users might feel inclined to use Windows despite having the time/skill-set to switch, it's because we like familiar systems/designs (we already have comments here hating on Windows 11's small changes): https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Imprinting_(psychology)#Baby_duck_syndrome
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24.
 
Re: Saturday Tech Bits
Jun 20, 2021, 12:49
Jivaro
 
24.
Re: Saturday Tech Bits Jun 20, 2021, 12:49
Jun 20, 2021, 12:49
 Jivaro
 
Yes, if you haven't been using Linux before now you will have a learning curve...but GUYS...I am the village idiot technologically compared to most of you. I stopped paying attention to new programming languages, hardware races, etc back in 2002 and I have kept up on gaming related things only since...and barely that.

I have installed 2 different distros of Linux just to mess around and play with. If you are using the "average person couldn't do this" argument.....all I can say is for over 17+ years that has not been the case in slightest. Can't say anything about before that as it wasn't my thing, but I still have my Redhat box around here somewhere that was a retro gaming/browsing/email workhorse for my household with ZERO issues for years. I think some of you should do yourself a favor and play around with it. The gaming side is better than ever and it is seriously not at all difficult.

Look back at my post history if you don't believe me...I ask the dumbest tech questions here bar none..lol. If I can do it anybody can.
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23.
 
Re: Saturday Tech Bits
Jun 20, 2021, 10:08
23.
Re: Saturday Tech Bits Jun 20, 2021, 10:08
Jun 20, 2021, 10:08
 
Burrito of Peace wrote on Jun 20, 2021, 09:45:
Mr. Tact wrote on Jun 19, 2021, 23:31:
You are right BoP I have seen you say that before. So, are all the gamers a bunch of idiots or brain-washed or what? Because I don't see a rush of gamers switching from Win10 to Linux. Hell, I worked in the IT industry for 25+ years and I haven't switched. Linux is a great OS for a ton of things, but AFAIK gaming isn't one of them.

I am well aware that gaming on Linux isn't on an equal footing with Windows. I 100%, freely admit that. I think it's getting much, much better with Proton but it isn't at equivalence.

But I think we can agree that, in terms of computer usage, it's a relatively small niche. The average PC user, worldwide, isn't going to be playing Call of Battlefield Halo Fantasy 9,147. The average user is going to do basic tasks just like my mother does. For them, there's no need to pay the Microsoft tax. There's no need to play the bullshit game of "We have six different SKUs for one OS because...reasons! We don't bother to do QA on anything we release anymore because automation solves everything!"

That's what I addressed. The average user. Because this is a gaming related board, we have the bias prejudice that all systems must be gaming machines first and foremost. Above everything else. Well, most of us. I know I am the weird one who builds his machines to be useful, functional tools that also happen to game as a second or tertiary objective.
The Average User is going to ask the salesman for a system that works out of the box, which means they're almost certainly getting a Windows installation unless they go to an Apple store. When they get home they don't want to bother figuring out how to install some other OS, even if it's super simple and free and available at this site where there's a bunch of friendly users willing to help them set it up. And they did pay for Windows when they bought a complete system, so why would they throw away that money.
22.
 
Re: Saturday Tech Bits
Jun 20, 2021, 09:45
22.
Re: Saturday Tech Bits Jun 20, 2021, 09:45
Jun 20, 2021, 09:45
 
Mr. Tact wrote on Jun 19, 2021, 23:31:
You are right BoP I have seen you say that before. So, are all the gamers a bunch of idiots or brain-washed or what? Because I don't see a rush of gamers switching from Win10 to Linux. Hell, I worked in the IT industry for 25+ years and I haven't switched. Linux is a great OS for a ton of things, but AFAIK gaming isn't one of them.

I am well aware that gaming on Linux isn't on an equal footing with Windows. I 100%, freely admit that. I think it's getting much, much better with Proton but it isn't at equivalence.

But I think we can agree that, in terms of computer usage, it's a relatively small niche. The average PC user, worldwide, isn't going to be playing Call of Battlefield Halo Fantasy 9,147. The average user is going to do basic tasks just like my mother does. For them, there's no need to pay the Microsoft tax. There's no need to play the bullshit game of "We have six different SKUs for one OS because...reasons! We don't bother to do QA on anything we release anymore because automation solves everything!"

That's what I addressed. The average user. Because this is a gaming related board, we have the bias prejudice that all systems must be gaming machines first and foremost. Above everything else. Well, most of us. I know I am the weird one who builds his machines to be useful, functional tools that also happen to game as a second or tertiary objective.

//---\\

Jonjonz wrote on Jun 20, 2021, 06:40:
If you have ever tried to install it on more than one make/model of computer you know just how finicky it is about choosing what it will run on with out breaking because some nerd never got around to writing a proper bit of code for the speakers, or the GPU, or the keyboard, or the mouse, or the printer or all of the above. Sure you might have gotten lucky with one computer that magically works 100% with whatever distro you threw on it, but after 5 or more different computers and you realize that is the exception.

Well, let me see. There are 10 machines in this house alone of various makes, models, and configurations. All of them run Linux. Dells, home built, System76, Acer, Apple, and HP. Zero issues. If I throw the Pis and Pines in the mix, that's another 14 machines also running Linux with no headaches.

At work, over the course of my employment, I would conservatively say that we have deployed Linux on hundreds of different configurations.There were probably a half-dozen that required a little intervention but those were edge cases with external hardware that was esoteric to say the least.

Outside of Nvidia, which is Nvidia's fault, can't say I've ever had to worry about "drivers" in the last decade. Speakers? You're installing drivers for speakers? Really? I just plug mine in. The same goes for keyboards. The HID model has been a standard for like two decades now. Mice, too. Mesa covers AMD and Intel GPUs. Even my Xbox controller works with zero configuration on my part.

As for distros, I've used and deployed Ubuntu, Debian, Parrot, Fedora, Manjaro, and RHEL with regularity. On my own, I have played with probably four dozen or so different distros in the last five years.

So, clearly, far more than one machine and one distro. With the luck you seem to believe that I possess, I should win the lotto without even playing it. Rolleyes
"No matter where you go, there you are." Buckaroo Banzai

There are two types of computer users: Masochists and Linux users.

If you would like help or further details on a technical discussion we're having, email me at bnhelp (at sign) keepusiel.net .
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21.
 
Re: Saturday Tech Bits
Jun 20, 2021, 07:48
21.
Re: Saturday Tech Bits Jun 20, 2021, 07:48
Jun 20, 2021, 07:48
 
Sticking with 10. The new GUI looks like crap.
20.
 
Re: Saturday Tech Bits
Jun 20, 2021, 06:40
20.
Re: Saturday Tech Bits Jun 20, 2021, 06:40
Jun 20, 2021, 06:40
 
I think it is pretty sad that the hottest thing MS can "leak" about the new OS to start the hype train is a minor GUI tweak of adding rounded corners. Any actual productivity enhancements, new applications, faster this or faster that? Nope.

Just over hyped visuals and more spying while maneuvering to get more money out of large enterprise customers. Just slap a new name on it, add some code that will break a few software products that ran on previous versions, and charge the Feds and States big bucks to upgrade.

Linux? Please that train never left the station. If you have ever tried to install it on more than one make/model of computer you know just how finicky it is about choosing what it will run on with out breaking because some nerd never got around to writing a proper bit of code for the speakers, or the GPU, or the keyboard, or the mouse, or the printer or all of the above. Sure you might have gotten lucky with one computer that magically works 100% with whatever distro you threw on it, but after 5 or more different computers and you realize that is the exception.
"Meet the new Boss, same as the old Boss." - The Who.
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19.
 
Re: Saturday Tech Bits
Jun 20, 2021, 03:09
19.
Re: Saturday Tech Bits Jun 20, 2021, 03:09
Jun 20, 2021, 03:09
 
Windows 11 can f-off if they have the start menu and icons in the middle like mac os. ewwww
_________________________________________________
"Money doesn't exist in the 24th century, the acquisition of wealth is no longer the driving force in our lives. We work to better ourselves and the rest of humanity." - Jean-Luc Picard
18.
 
Re: Saturday Tech Bits
Jun 20, 2021, 02:33
18.
Re: Saturday Tech Bits Jun 20, 2021, 02:33
Jun 20, 2021, 02:33
 
So say we all.
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17.
 
Re: Saturday Tech Bits
Jun 19, 2021, 23:31
17.
Re: Saturday Tech Bits Jun 19, 2021, 23:31
Jun 19, 2021, 23:31
 
You are right BoP I have seen you say that before. So, are all the gamers a bunch of idiots or brain-washed or what? Because I don't see a rush of gamers switching from Win10 to Linux. Hell, I worked in the IT industry for 25+ years and I haven't switched. Linux is a great OS for a ton of things, but AFAIK gaming isn't one of them.
“Extinction is the rule. Survival is the exception.” -- Carl Sagan
16.
 
Re: Saturday Tech Bits
Jun 19, 2021, 22:51
16.
Re: Saturday Tech Bits Jun 19, 2021, 22:51
Jun 19, 2021, 22:51
 
I hear you BoP. But the games, man. It all comes down to the games.
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15.
 
Re: Saturday Tech Bits
Jun 19, 2021, 22:30
15.
Re: Saturday Tech Bits Jun 19, 2021, 22:30
Jun 19, 2021, 22:30
 
RedEye9 wrote on Jun 19, 2021, 18:04:
But the new wheel is better than the old wheel. Microsoft told me so.

While reporting every mile and GPS location that wheel goes to and randomly deciding when to stop and restart the car, no matter how inconvenient it is for you?

PropheT wrote on Jun 19, 2021, 21:24:
If Windows was only as user friendly and compatible as Linux no one would want to use it.

If only. I know you tried very hard to be a smartass but I can tell you have never used a mainline Linux distro or, if you have, not very recently.

I have said on this site numerous times that my elderly mother is my barometer for the average user and Linux usage. She is quite literally the dead center, "average user". She uses the web, she occasionally watches some YouTube, she still writes letters, prints stuff off, etc. She's been on Fedora Linux since version 19 in 2013. She started off with my old hand me down which was a Q6600 and 8GB of RAM with spinning rust. That machine lasted her until 2019. Then she got a "blazing" fast 4770K with 16GB of RAM and a 500GB SSD. Throughout that entire period she upgraded the OS herself with only one input from me. It was a phone call in the beginning that literally went like this: "Sugar, my computer is telling me I need to upgrade it. What do I do?" "You hit the button that says 'upgrade', ma'am." "That's it?" "That's it." She has upgraded to every version of Fedora on her own since then*. She never calls me for support. Hell, it even supports this weird scanner/label printer thing that Windows gave up on back during Windows 7. She uses that thing to print out labels for her canning. Still works. Zero driver installs. Hell, she even got a BIOS and some firmware updates through Linux via fwupd and lvfs. They just came as updates through the GNOME Software Center. When was the last time you ever saw Windows make it simple to do a BIOS update natively via a one click update? Is Windows Update pushing down firmware for SSDs and system level devices yet? No? Ok.

*The only meltdown she had was when my father, a super Microsoft fanboi (and a former MS employee), decided to "upgrade" her machine with Windows 8. She hated it. Like cussing a blue streak hated it. Which is something as my mother is an old school Southern Belle who wouldn't say "shit" if she had a mouthful of it.So she asked me how to get back on Fedora and I lightly held her hand while she made a bootable USB stick and reinstalled the OS of her choice. Zero data loss, too

Hell, even Dell is onboard the Linux train. Last Thursday, I took possession of a Dell Precision 5550 laptop from work. Beautiful little beast of a machine. It came with Ubuntu on it. I swapped that out for Fedora but, to my surprise, I was also able to do BIOS and firmware updates from within GNOME. This machine was brand new and the updates had only been available for about two and a half weeks.

Where I work, which is by no means a niche employer, there are zero Windows machines in my entire department. Literally zero. Outside of the Windows team, everyone either runs the Ubuntu LTS release or Fedora. Even some of the Windows admins have swapped over to Ubuntu since they can now have PowerShell on Linux.

Though it's nice to see Microsoft blatantly copying Linux for new "features" in Windows 10. Virtual desktops? Been native in Linux for decades. Decades. BitLocker? A poor man's LUKS but at least they have something. Package manager? Awww....that's cute. We've had that for decades, too. Being able to update your OS without having to reboot? Well, guess Microsoft can't get it all right.

So, sure, go ahead and be a smartass but at least use the fucking OS so you know what you're actually talking about.
"No matter where you go, there you are." Buckaroo Banzai

There are two types of computer users: Masochists and Linux users.

If you would like help or further details on a technical discussion we're having, email me at bnhelp (at sign) keepusiel.net .
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34 Replies. 2 pages. Viewing page 1.
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