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15.
 
Re: Saturday Tech Bits
Feb 28, 2021, 12:11
15.
Re: Saturday Tech Bits Feb 28, 2021, 12:11
Feb 28, 2021, 12:11
 
Socal Coachman wrote on Feb 27, 2021, 19:56:
ColoradoHoudini wrote on Feb 27, 2021, 17:46:
All this for a virus with a 99.98% recovery rate for the majority of us - assuming you even get it-, but we arent allowed to self-police and need to shut down everything so they can have a great reset. YAY. Anyone seen he common cold these days? regular seasonal flu?

vaccine - couldve handed out HCQ as we all knew worked, and was safe. It's a preventative and early treatment with a good success rate, and dirt cheap! Also it's so strange that the media continues to ignore the data and even had to retract their original and misguided stances.

Congratulations, you haven't had the experience of knowing anyone who died of covid. My mother died of it along with a friend of mine. As far as HCQ, please get better advice than from some politician playing doctor. This is from the same guy who thought it was a good idea to inject bleach into the body.

There is also side effects of Covid. My cousin also had covid last march....she still says food smell/taste like charcoal at best and at worst smells/taste like shit. Maybe works as a good diet plan but takes a lot of joy out of eating.

We're at the stage where even people who know others who've died of COVID remain in denial. People who are themselves dying continue to parrot politicized misinformation.

Historically, the West has always resisted safety and health changes, hard. Vaccines, helmets & seat belts, secondhand smoke, firsthand smoke, pasteurization, washing hands before surgery. Naysayers have always dug in their heels and spouted lies to keep doing things they always have, and mere data has never swayed them. I guess antibiotics went down well, because they're one of the only times medicine has been able to present a magic wand that makes things better right away.
14.
 
Re: Saturday Tech Bits
Feb 28, 2021, 12:11
14.
Re: Saturday Tech Bits Feb 28, 2021, 12:11
Feb 28, 2021, 12:11
 
wtf_man wrote on Feb 28, 2021, 10:57:
1. Minimum wage was NEVER meant to be a "living wage"... people need to get that through their thick skulls. It's an "entry to the work force" wage.

Incorrect. FDR, the President who created the minimum wage as part of the Fair Labor Standards Act, had this to say about it:

"In my Inaugural I laid down the simple proposition that nobody is going to starve in this country. It seems to me to be equally plain that no business which depends for existence on paying less than living wages to its workers has any right to continue in this country." (Emphasis mine)

Perhaps it would be wiser for people claiming the opposite to get it through "their thick skulls" that "entry to the work force wage" is the exact opposite of what the minimum wage was created for. An understanding of history helps.

wtf_man wrote on Feb 28, 2021, 10:57:
2. I do agree that it needs to go up somewhat with inflation. That said... it's not $15. It's more like $9 if you compare 1980's (when I made $3.35 an hour minimum wage as a teenager flipping burgers) dollars buying power to today's. (1982 Dollar to 2021 = 2.71 - 2.71 x 3.35 = 9.0785)

That would be great if prices had remained a constant with inflation but they haven't. Moreover, the Consumer Price Index hasn't been updated to use modern statistics. They're still using data from the fiscal period of 1982 to 1984.

But let's go with your example of $3.35 and we'll peg the year as 1985.

Cost of a gallon of milk in 1985? $2.26

Cost of a gallon of milk today? $5.64 (pulled off H-E-B's website just now)

So, more than double the price with only a 46% increase in minimum wage from 1985 to 2021. It's not just milk, either. Let's take eggs, for example. In 1985, the cost for a dozen eggs was $.80 cents. Today? $2.55. More than triple the price. Average home price in in 1985? $100,800.00. Average home price in 2021? $340,000. Again, more than triple the price. New car prices are greater than a 300% increase as well. For basic transportation.

If we progress with the knowledge that the minimum wage was, in fact, meant to be a living wage, then we can obviously see that neither $3.35 nor $7.25 is going to cut it. Neither is $9.


wtf_man wrote on Feb 28, 2021, 10:57:
3. I don't expect my grand kids to have less buying power than I did when I entered the work force. I also don't expect them to make more.

Why not? Do you enjoy watching them suffer and struggle? Does it not concern you that buying one's first home has now become out of reach for many? At what age did you buy your first home? Are your grandchildren younger or older than that? How about your children? I mean a constructed home, not a modular or mobile home nor an apartment.


wtf_man wrote on Feb 28, 2021, 10:57:
4. Minimum wage has not been raised since 2009.

Which can, and should be, addressed along with updating the Consumer Price Index to something in this century.

wtf_man wrote on Feb 28, 2021, 10:57:
5. Many small businesses have been forced to include a benefits package, which takes away from what can be paid for entry level positions.

Which could be resolved with universal medical care for all. I mean, if we can waste 1.5 trillion dollars on a fighter jet program that can't produce a fighter that works well in any role, we can surely better spend that money on healthcare for all.
"No matter where you go, there you are." Buckaroo Banzai

There are two types of computer users: Masochists and Linux users.

If you would like help or further details on a technical discussion we're having, email me at bnhelp (at sign) keepusiel.net .
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13.
 
Re: Saturday Tech Bits
Feb 28, 2021, 12:10
13.
Re: Saturday Tech Bits Feb 28, 2021, 12:10
Feb 28, 2021, 12:10
 
wtf_man wrote on Feb 28, 2021, 10:57:
I'm in the middle on this issue.
1. Minimum wage was NEVER meant to be a "living wage"... people need to get that through their thick skulls.

I have a hard time coming to grips with working a 40 hour job not to make basic ends meet. If a full time job can't do that, it sounds like a failed job. It's a conundrum.
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12.
 
Re: Saturday Tech Bits
Feb 28, 2021, 12:09
12.
Re: Saturday Tech Bits Feb 28, 2021, 12:09
Feb 28, 2021, 12:09
 
Simon Says wrote on Feb 28, 2021, 11:50:
HorrorScope wrote on Feb 27, 2021, 22:42:
It's a f'd up sitch because the costs will go up, rent will charge more.

ColoradoHoudini wrote on Feb 28, 2021, 10:50:
15/hr in my city means every cost of living goes up to meet that bottom wage.

A study of studies about minimum wage increase VS inflation has concluded that there is no cause and effect between raising the minimum wage and inflation.

The studies collated in that study were from as far back as WW2 upto now.

And as someone else already pointed out, all the minimum wage increases experiments didn't see unemployment go up, it went down instead.

You 2 seem to be laboring out of faulty information.

But doubling it like this most likely will be measurable, that's what waiting so long to move that needle will do. The markets will adjust knowing there is more income. I'm not saying I'm against it. That is an issue with basic income, for example I'll sell my house for more, because the market will know there is greater buying power out there.
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11.
 
Re: Saturday Tech Bits
Feb 28, 2021, 12:08
11.
Re: Saturday Tech Bits Feb 28, 2021, 12:08
Feb 28, 2021, 12:08
 
wtf_man wrote on Feb 28, 2021, 10:57:
1. Minimum wage was NEVER meant to be a "living wage"... people need to get that through their thick skulls. It's an "entry to the work force" wage.

Source needed, that's a mantra I keep hearing and no ever backed it up with any evidence.

wtf_man wrote on Feb 28, 2021, 10:57:
2. I do agree that it needs to go up somewhat with inflation. That said... it's not $15. It's more like $9 if you compare 1980's (when I made $3.35 an hour minimum wage as a teenager flipping burgers) dollars buying power to today's. (1982 Dollar to 2021 = 2.71 - 2.71 x 3.35 = 9.0785)

Minimum wage had already disconnected from productivity and inflation for more than a decade in the 80's. If you want to accurately calculate this from somewhere, you have to do so at the divergence point, which is 1968 ( see bottom reply for details ).

wtf_man wrote on Feb 28, 2021, 10:57:
3. I don't expect my grand kids to have less buying power than I did when I entered the work force. I also don't expect them to make more.

They will and you have less than your father. As GDP and productivity booms while real wages remain relatively stagnant you lose buying power because assets follow GDP and productivity trends, not real wages trends. This is why it's getting harder and harder to buy a house and other assets, harder to pay rent, etc. And it will remain true as long as those trends continue.

wtf_man wrote on Feb 28, 2021, 10:57:
Edit: Since you mentions 50 years... 1971 minimum wage was $1.60 per hour... and equates to $10.47 in today's dollars
So a bit more than $9 but still way less than $15. And don't forget the forced benefit packages.

That's calculated from the new calculation of inflation which includes luxury items which by their virtue of going down every year continue to skew the inflation metric much lower than if it were had we continued to use the old method of only including basic survival necessities like shelter, food and transportation.

If you use those real inflation numbers relevant to the poorest and lower middle class who are the ones living on minimum wages, so most relevant to them, the minimum wage factoring this non skewed inflation calculation would be even higher than 15$ ( that's basically where they take their number, correctly calling bullshit on the "newflation" calcs doctored to make them look better than they really are ) and if you factor productivity decoupling in 1968, it would be almost 30$.

This comment was edited on Feb 28, 2021, 12:21.
10.
 
Re: Saturday Tech Bits
Feb 28, 2021, 11:55
10.
Re: Saturday Tech Bits Feb 28, 2021, 11:55
Feb 28, 2021, 11:55
 
Simon Says wrote on Feb 28, 2021, 11:50:
HorrorScope wrote on Feb 27, 2021, 22:42:
It's a f'd up sitch because the costs will go up, rent will charge more.

A study of studies about minimum wage increase VS inflation has concluded that there is no cause and effect between raising the minimum wage and inflation.

The studies collated in that study were from as far back as WW2 upto now.
If one can't repeat old right-wing nonsense that has been repeatedly debunked , what's one supposed to do.
- I refer to it as BC, Before Corona, and AD, After Disaster. -
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9.
 
Re: Saturday Tech Bits
Feb 28, 2021, 11:50
9.
Re: Saturday Tech Bits Feb 28, 2021, 11:50
Feb 28, 2021, 11:50
 
HorrorScope wrote on Feb 27, 2021, 22:42:
It's a f'd up sitch because the costs will go up, rent will charge more.

ColoradoHoudini wrote on Feb 28, 2021, 10:50:
15/hr in my city means every cost of living goes up to meet that bottom wage.

A study of studies about minimum wage increase VS inflation has concluded that there is no cause and effect between raising the minimum wage and inflation.

The studies collated in that study were from as far back as WW2 upto now.

And as someone else already pointed out, all the minimum wage increases experiments didn't see unemployment go up, it went down instead.

You 2 seem to be laboring out of faulty information.
8.
 
Re: Saturday Tech Bits
Feb 28, 2021, 10:57
8.
Re: Saturday Tech Bits Feb 28, 2021, 10:57
Feb 28, 2021, 10:57
 
Burrito of Peace wrote on Feb 27, 2021, 18:18:
Why read the article when you can spout right wing stupidity that has been debunked for years now?

As apposed to Left Wing stupidity? Because there's a lot of that too. Especially when it comes to finances.

Burrito of Peace wrote on Feb 27, 2021, 18:18:
As for the minimum wage, it has not kept pace with inflation for, oh, literally 50 years now. If your business can't succeed without paying people a living wage, your business deserves to fail because your business is based on exploitation. Costco, for example, can manage to run a successful business and pay people more than double the minimum wage.

I'm in the middle on this issue.
1. Minimum wage was NEVER meant to be a "living wage"... people need to get that through their thick skulls. It's an "entry to the work force" wage.
2. I do agree that it needs to go up somewhat with inflation. That said... it's not $15. It's more like $9 if you compare 1980's (when I made $3.35 an hour minimum wage as a teenager flipping burgers) dollars buying power to today's. (1982 Dollar to 2021 = 2.71 - 2.71 x 3.35 = 9.0785)
3. I don't expect my grand kids to have less buying power than I did when I entered the work force. I also don't expect them to make more.
4. Minimum wage has not been raised since 2009.
5. Many small businesses have been forced to include a benefits package, which takes away from what can be paid for entry level positions.

So, yes it needs to go up... but nowhere near what is trying to be pushed through.

Edit: Since you mentions 50 years... 1971 minimum wage was $1.60 per hour... and equates to $10.47 in today's dollars
So a bit more than $9 but still way less than $15. And don't forget the forced benefit packages.
Get your games from GOG DAMMIT!
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7.
 
Re: Saturday Tech Bits
Feb 28, 2021, 10:50
7.
Re: Saturday Tech Bits Feb 28, 2021, 10:50
Feb 28, 2021, 10:50
 
If we make 200k/yr from our business and we have 10 people at 12/hr, and now it's forced to be 15/hr and that cuts into our profits for the work we put into building this business, we will cut the low end (always liberal young morons) people to ensure we have as much profit as we had previously. Those people who are working entry level type jobs dont get to dictate how much money the rest of us who learned how to build a business get to make. Yay reddit liberals, you did this to yourselves.

15/hr in my city means every cost of living goes up to meet that bottom wage. Rent for a decent place in a decent part of town goes from 1600 to 1800, because the owners know that you and the people you share your 3bedroom with are now making at minimum 15/hr. Everything will go up, and those who think making 15/hr changes their lives will find that even the podunk towns have increased in COL.

6.
 
Re: Saturday Tech Bits
Feb 27, 2021, 22:42
6.
Re: Saturday Tech Bits Feb 27, 2021, 22:42
Feb 27, 2021, 22:42
 
I don't get why if $15 was the minimum everywhere that constitutes layoffs. What is constitutes are a raise in prices. For example McDonalds wouldn't be burdened with $15 and Burger King $8. They would all be in the same boat, so you don't layoff, everyone just raise prices. It's a f'd up sitch because the costs will go up, rent will charge more. I don't know how you really get out of the problem. FWIW there are a shit ton of jobs that can't be filled now because people don't want the jobs, so automation is needed for those.
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5.
 
Re: Saturday Tech Bits
Feb 27, 2021, 21:32
5.
Re: Saturday Tech Bits Feb 27, 2021, 21:32
Feb 27, 2021, 21:32
 
Yeah, an increased minimum wage will never work. Just ask Seattle where unemployment actually went down when they increased the minimum wage. More money in the middle and the bottom means an overall better economy than most money in the hands of a few at the top. Jesus, you can lead a conservative to water but you can't make him think.
"You have enemies? Good. That means you’ve stood up for something, sometime in your life."
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4.
 
Re: Saturday Tech Bits
Feb 27, 2021, 19:56
4.
Re: Saturday Tech Bits Feb 27, 2021, 19:56
Feb 27, 2021, 19:56
 
ColoradoHoudini wrote on Feb 27, 2021, 17:46:
All this for a virus with a 99.98% recovery rate for the majority of us - assuming you even get it-, but we arent allowed to self-police and need to shut down everything so they can have a great reset. YAY. Anyone seen he common cold these days? regular seasonal flu?

vaccine - couldve handed out HCQ as we all knew worked, and was safe. It's a preventative and early treatment with a good success rate, and dirt cheap! Also it's so strange that the media continues to ignore the data and even had to retract their original and misguided stances.

Congratulations, you haven't had the experience of knowing anyone who died of covid. My mother died of it along with a friend of mine. As far as HCQ, please get better advice than from some politician playing doctor. This is from the same guy who thought it was a good idea to inject bleach into the body.

There is also side effects of Covid. My cousin also had covid last march....she still says food smell/taste like charcoal at best and at worst smells/taste like shit. Maybe works as a good diet plan but takes a lot of joy out of eating.
3.
 
Re: Saturday Tech Bits
Feb 27, 2021, 18:18
3.
Re: Saturday Tech Bits Feb 27, 2021, 18:18
Feb 27, 2021, 18:18
 
RedEye9 wrote on Feb 27, 2021, 17:50:
Best Buy expects 40% of its sales to come from online purchases this year, up from 19% two years ago, and the company said it needed to alter its workforce in response to this shift.

Why read the article when you can spout right wing stupidity that has been debunked for years now?

"tHe ViRuS IsN't ThAt BaD!"

Meanwhile, for those of us in the real world grounded in math and science, COVID-19 has killed 524,544 people as of yesterday. Which is exactly 141,887 deaths less than every combat casualty the US has ever suffered. Yes, that includes all the wars you learned about in your history class but also many more you did not.

As for the minimum wage, it has not kept pace with inflation for, oh, literally 50 years now. If your business can't succeed without paying people a living wage, your business deserves to fail because your business is based on exploitation. Costco, for example, can manage to run a successful business and pay people more than double the minimum wage.

"But, wait, that's a multinational company!"

OK, let's go with a local gas station chain right here in central Texas, Buccee's. Buccee's minimum starting wage is $14/hr. Last year, they saw a 103% growth percentile and opened up 11 new locations.

The reality is that the wealthy, and those who are wannabes, would prefer to exploit literally everyone else in the cause of "Fuck you, I got mine."

"No matter where you go, there you are." Buckaroo Banzai

There are two types of computer users: Masochists and Linux users.

If you would like help or further details on a technical discussion we're having, email me at bnhelp (at sign) keepusiel.net .
Avatar 21247
2.
 
Re: Saturday Tech Bits
Feb 27, 2021, 17:50
2.
Re: Saturday Tech Bits Feb 27, 2021, 17:50
Feb 27, 2021, 17:50
 
Never understood how Best Buy was still in business. They have got to be one of the most shadiest operators around and won’t be missed.

If you bother to read the word parts of the article you’ll see that it has nothing to do with Covid or a living wage.
Best Buy expects 40% of its sales to come from online purchases this year, up from 19% two years ago, and the company said it needed to alter its workforce in response to this shift.
- I refer to it as BC, Before Corona, and AD, After Disaster. -
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1.
 
Re: Saturday Tech Bits
Feb 27, 2021, 17:46
1.
Re: Saturday Tech Bits Feb 27, 2021, 17:46
Feb 27, 2021, 17:46
 
RE: Best Buy just wait til the $15/hr min wage hits and people who asked for it end up jobless.
Such as the people who work for my wife and wanted for or voted for this. Ya get what ya asked for..morons. She's not taking less money while running a business.

All this for a virus with a 99.98% recovery rate for the majority of us - assuming you even get it-, but we arent allowed to self-police and need to shut down everything so they can have a great reset. YAY. Anyone seen he common cold these days? regular seasonal flu?

Local grocery store which is a giant chain just took out more cashier lanes for self checkout. Demand more money for starting jobs or transitional jobs and this happens.

vaccine - couldve handed out HCQ as we all knew worked, and was safe. It's a preventative and early treatment with a good success rate, and dirt cheap! Also it's so strange that the media continues to ignore the data and even had to retract their original and misguided stances.
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