AMD Zen 3 Announcement

Tom's Hardware summarizes today's AMD Zen 3 announcement of the Ryzen 5000, saying this promises 19% better instruction per cycle throughput and "1080p gaming dominance." In their All We Know post they say these will first be available starting November 5th: "The first four new Ryzen 5000 models come as chips for the desktop PC, and they stretch from the $299 Ryzen 5 5600X up to the $799 Ryzen 9 5950X. The chips will be on shelves on November 5th." Here's word:
Undisputed no-compromise dominance of the desktop PC market. That was AMD's long-term goal when it first began working on the Zen architecture nine years ago, and it took an unrelenting cadence of optimizations to realize that goal. AMD claims it has finally achieved that ambitious goal with the 7nm Ryzen 5000 processors that come with the Zen 3 microarchitecture. AMD says the Ryzen 5000 processors finally beat Intel in its last bastion — 1080p gaming — while maintaining Ryzen's existing lead in basically every other metric. The four new Ryzen 5000 models, which stretch from the $299 Ryzen 5 5600X up to the $799 Ryzen 9 5950X, arrive at retail on November 5th.

AMD touts its Zen 3 chips as having market-leading single-threaded performance, which comes courtesy of an overall 19% uplift to IPC (instruction per cycle) throughput. Combined with the optimized 7nm process that wrings out a 4.9 GHz boost from the flagship Ryzen 5000 'Vermeer' chips, it looks like AMD has finally swung the pendulum entirely in its favor. If AMD's benchmarks prove true in our testing, we'll have a new king at the top of the CPU benchmarks hierarchy and will be making changes to our list of Best CPUs soon.

AMD says it took a ground-up redesign of the Zen microarchitecture (we'll cover the details below) to deliver the big IPC gains, and pairing that with higher peak clock speeds delivers stunning performance improvements over AMD's previous-gen Ryzen models, not to mention Intel's Comet Lake chips.

AMD claims the Ryzen 5000 chips are now faster than Intel in gaming, single-threaded, and multi-threaded performance while also providing leading performance-per-dollar and up to 2.8X better power efficiency than Comet Lake. That covers all the bases, and the chips also offer backward compatibility with existing 500- and 400-series chipsets, meaning they'll offer a relatively inexpensive path for drop-in upgraders.
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35.
 
Re: AMD Zen 3 Announcement
Oct 10, 2020, 12:29
35.
Re: AMD Zen 3 Announcement Oct 10, 2020, 12:29
Oct 10, 2020, 12:29
 
Simon Says wrote on Oct 9, 2020, 10:08:
VaranDragon wrote on Oct 9, 2020, 10:04:
Simon Says wrote on Oct 9, 2020, 10:00:
VaranDragon wrote on Oct 9, 2020, 05:25:
Well of course its the prices holding people back it always was. As for 4k over 1080p, I really couldn't care less insofar as it translates to VR. VR requires a significant amount of horsepower, somewhat equivalent to 4k monitors at least for the majority of headsets on the market now. And it still suffers from pixel density issues and clarity compared to even 1080p monitors. So yeah, I am all for extra computing power, regardless of whether it's for 4k or VR, but mostly I am for lowering the price barrier on the mid to high range systems.

No, you could get the best gear back in late 90s and early 2000s for peanuts relative to today as far as GPU and CPU gaming loads were concerned.

Heck, I used to buy everything highend at prices that would be considered below midrange to midrange today even taking into account inflation...

Well yeah, but thats not what Im talking about. Even back in the 90s early 2000s, Intel and (later) Nvidia were sold at a premium compared to their competitors. So my point still stands, even back in the day you paid a premium on high-end parts, it's just a smaller premium compared to what you pay today.

No, there were no premiums in the GPU market, there were 5-6 competitors in the market. If a card was 10% faster it pretty much had a 10% higher price, there were no premiums. You paid for the perf and the prices were ridiculously low even taking into account inflation. There is ZERO comparison VS the pure madness we have today.

As for CPUs, I remember well when I bought a Celeron 300A and cranked it up to top of the line P3 450 speeds at a ridiculous fraction of the price.

You must've either never lived this period, or you don't remember it correctly, I don't know which, cause if you did, you would never put forward fallacious arguments like this one.

It may have been like that in the states. It sure as fuck wasn't in South Africa or Europe where I spent most of my time in the 90s. It wasn't as bad as it is today, but it sure wasn't 10% extra performance for 10% extra $. Lol dude...
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34.
 
Re: AMD Zen 3 Announcement
Oct 9, 2020, 14:51
34.
Re: AMD Zen 3 Announcement Oct 9, 2020, 14:51
Oct 9, 2020, 14:51
 
RogueSix wrote on Oct 9, 2020, 11:43:
HorrorScope wrote on Oct 9, 2020, 10:39:
After yesterday's news I'm rethinking everything. Doesn't mean I won't end up with a 5800x but I'm now looking back at Intel again (or wait until their next) and even the 5600x or 3700x/3600. Then I have to weigh that this is the last of the what's is it called the AM3 MB's. So do I change everything now to change it all again so soon (cpu/mb/ram)?

Instead of quick answers, I have a lot more questions that I thought I would have. Just writing this my brain is saying wait or go cheap for now... Damn.

I think it depends on where you are coming from. If you already have a somewhat decent six core (or more) CPU and you play at a 4K resolution anyway where you will be GPU-limited in 99.9% of games then delaying a purchase until late 2021 or even 2022 could make a lot of sense. Zen 3 is the final CPU for AM4 and most likely the final DDR4 platform. Intel's Rocket Lake (final 14nm desktop CPU) in March 2021 will be the final socket 1200 CPU (well, Intel only ever has two CPU gens per socket anyway) and also quite likely the final DDR4 platform. Both choices from AMD and Intel are a dead end at this point.

If you can wait because you have a decent system already then I'd save the money for a RTX 3080 or a RX 6xxx graphics card and wait for AM5 or socket 1700 (Alder Lake 10nm desktop) platforms with DDR5 support in late 2021 or early 2022.

On the other hand, it could also make sense to buy Zen 3 now and then wait until the second or maybe even third wave of DDR5 platforms. As usual with every DDR stepping, DDR5 will most likely start slow (especially latency) and expensive. Decent low latency modules at an attractive price will take at least a year or two to materialize. It will probably not make much sense to be an early DDR5 adopter. Socket AM5 and Zen 4 might also come with its own issues. AMD has a track record of problematic releases with many required AGESA BIOS fixes before things are finally working as intended. A new platform/socket/chipset/RAM is going to pose a challenge. It could make sense to wait for the second wave of AM5 CPUs whether that will be a Zen 4 refresh or Zen 5 to avoid any early adopter shenanigans.

Personally, I'm good thanks to a i9-9900K system, 32GB DDR4 and a 4K screen. I'm GPU bottlenecked all the time so the only upgrade I really "need" is a RTX 3080 with 20GB VRAM as soon as those become available. If I jump on the Zen 3 bandwagon then it'd be a just for fun curiosity upgrade to check out what AMD is like these days. I will more likely wait for the second or third wave of DDR5 platforms though, i.e. AMD Zen 5 or Intel Meteor Lake which should arrive by late 2022 or early/mid 2023. I hope we will have affordable 32GB DDR5-6400 or maybe even DDR5-8400 kits with low latencies by then.

Yep good stuff. I'm way outdated on my CPU, 8 year old i7.

Yeah I'm going to look at a cheap 6/12 possibility and wait for next since as you say the big changeover is coming.

Avatar 17232
33.
 
Re: AMD Zen 3 Announcement
Oct 9, 2020, 12:53
El Pit
 
33.
Re: AMD Zen 3 Announcement Oct 9, 2020, 12:53
Oct 9, 2020, 12:53
 El Pit
 
Cutter wrote on Oct 9, 2020, 12:44:
El Pit wrote on Oct 9, 2020, 06:22:
Here's hoping for a Ryzen 5700x @ 65 watt being released in a few months.

You mean the 5600X?

I was wondering about that why it's the only one at 65w and the rest jump up to 105w. Couldn't they scale power requirements a bit better? I'd still like to use less electricity for both money saving and environment saving. I may just end up getting one of those instead because of the power reqs.

No, Cutter. A 5700x. Like the 3700x with 8c/16t at 65 watt. That would be the cpu I MIGHT buy if AMD would offer it some day.
"There is no right life in the wrong one." (Theodor W. Adorno, philosopher)
"Only a Sith deals in absolutes." (Obi-Wan Kenobi, Jedi)
32.
 
Re: AMD Zen 3 Announcement
Oct 9, 2020, 12:44
Cutter
 
32.
Re: AMD Zen 3 Announcement Oct 9, 2020, 12:44
Oct 9, 2020, 12:44
 Cutter
 
El Pit wrote on Oct 9, 2020, 06:22:
Here's hoping for a Ryzen 5700x @ 65 watt being released in a few months.

You mean the 5600X?

I was wondering about that why it's the only one at 65w and the rest jump up to 105w. Couldn't they scale power requirements a bit better? I'd still like to use less electricity for both money saving and environment saving. I may just end up getting one of those instead because of the power reqs.
"Hot air hangs like a dead man, from a white oak tree. People sitting on porches, thinking how things used to be. It's a dark night...dark night."
Avatar 25394
31.
 
Re: AMD Zen 3 Announcement
Oct 9, 2020, 11:48
31.
Re: AMD Zen 3 Announcement Oct 9, 2020, 11:48
Oct 9, 2020, 11:48
 
phinn wrote on Oct 8, 2020, 21:24:
They basically pulled an Intel with pricing. Hopefully there is a big performance gain to make it worthwhile.

When I upgraded 60 days ago, AMD was no deal compared to Intel. Since I game, I bought a 6-core i5.
"I like to play female characters in MMORPGs to trick men into homosexual chat." - space captain, June 18th, 2009.
30.
 
Re: AMD Zen 3 Announcement
Oct 9, 2020, 11:43
30.
Re: AMD Zen 3 Announcement Oct 9, 2020, 11:43
Oct 9, 2020, 11:43
 
HorrorScope wrote on Oct 9, 2020, 10:39:
After yesterday's news I'm rethinking everything. Doesn't mean I won't end up with a 5800x but I'm now looking back at Intel again (or wait until their next) and even the 5600x or 3700x/3600. Then I have to weigh that this is the last of the what's is it called the AM3 MB's. So do I change everything now to change it all again so soon (cpu/mb/ram)?

Instead of quick answers, I have a lot more questions that I thought I would have. Just writing this my brain is saying wait or go cheap for now... Damn.

I think it depends on where you are coming from. If you already have a somewhat decent six core (or more) CPU and you play at a 4K resolution anyway where you will be GPU-limited in 99.9% of games then delaying a purchase until late 2021 or even 2022 could make a lot of sense. Zen 3 is the final CPU for AM4 and most likely the final DDR4 platform. Intel's Rocket Lake (final 14nm desktop CPU) in March 2021 will be the final socket 1200 CPU (well, Intel only ever has two CPU gens per socket anyway) and also quite likely the final DDR4 platform. Both choices from AMD and Intel are a dead end at this point.

If you can wait because you have a decent system already then I'd save the money for a RTX 3080 or a RX 6xxx graphics card and wait for AM5 or socket 1700 (Alder Lake 10nm desktop) platforms with DDR5 support in late 2021 or early 2022.

On the other hand, it could also make sense to buy Zen 3 now and then wait until the second or maybe even third wave of DDR5 platforms. As usual with every DDR stepping, DDR5 will most likely start slow (especially latency) and expensive. Decent low latency modules at an attractive price will take at least a year or two to materialize. It will probably not make much sense to be an early DDR5 adopter. Socket AM5 and Zen 4 might also come with its own issues. AMD has a track record of problematic releases with many required AGESA BIOS fixes before things are finally working as intended. A new platform/socket/chipset/RAM is going to pose a challenge. It could make sense to wait for the second wave of AM5 CPUs whether that will be a Zen 4 refresh or Zen 5 to avoid any early adopter shenanigans.

Personally, I'm good thanks to a i9-9900K system, 32GB DDR4 and a 4K screen. I'm GPU bottlenecked all the time so the only upgrade I really "need" is a RTX 3080 with 20GB VRAM as soon as those become available. If I jump on the Zen 3 bandwagon then it'd be a just for fun curiosity upgrade to check out what AMD is like these days. I will more likely wait for the second or third wave of DDR5 platforms though, i.e. AMD Zen 5 or Intel Meteor Lake which should arrive by late 2022 or early/mid 2023. I hope we will have affordable 32GB DDR5-6400 or maybe even DDR5-8400 kits with low latencies by then.
29.
 
Re: AMD Zen 3 Announcement
Oct 9, 2020, 11:10
29.
Re: AMD Zen 3 Announcement Oct 9, 2020, 11:10
Oct 9, 2020, 11:10
 
intel rekt kek
28.
 
Re: AMD Zen 3 Announcement
Oct 9, 2020, 11:06
28.
Re: AMD Zen 3 Announcement Oct 9, 2020, 11:06
Oct 9, 2020, 11:06
 
Simon Says wrote on Oct 9, 2020, 10:08:
No, there were no premiums in the GPU market, there were 5-6 competitors in the market. If a card was 10% faster it pretty much had a 10% higher price, there were no premiums. You paid for the perf and the prices were ridiculously low even taking into account inflation. There is ZERO comparison VS the pure madness we have today.

As for CPUs, I remember well when I bought a Celeron 300A and cranked it up to top of the line P3 450 speeds at a ridiculous fraction of the price.

You must've either never lived this period, or you don't remember it correctly, I don't know which, cause if you did, you would never put forward fallacious arguments like this one.

There are way more variables to consider.

I paid $800 for a Premium Super VGA Card (No 3D) in 1988. That was cutting edge at the time.
The first Sound Blasters were around $250
A 1 GB Full height SCSI Hard drive was $1200 (Needed that to run my BBS)
A 19200 Baud modem when it first came out was over $500, and I had 4 in my BBS machine.

Jeese I'm old. Git off maih lawn!
Get your games from GOG DAMMIT!
Avatar 19499
27.
 
Re: AMD Zen 3 Announcement
Oct 9, 2020, 10:39
27.
Re: AMD Zen 3 Announcement Oct 9, 2020, 10:39
Oct 9, 2020, 10:39
 
VaranDragon wrote on Oct 9, 2020, 02:23:
Well I guess I'll believe it when I see it. I remember the olden days of yore, when AMD Athlon kicked Intel's butt, at nearly half the cost. I lived through those days. If AMD manages to equal or beat Intel in single-threaded performance but increases it's price to match Intel's, I don't consider that a win for the consumers.

Yeah it definitely reduces the excitement. After yesterday's news I'm rethinking everything. Doesn't mean I won't end up with a 5800x but I'm now looking back at Intel again (or wait until their next) and even the 5600x or 3700x/3600. Then I have to weigh that this is the last of the what's is it called the AM3 MB's. So do I change everything now to change it all again so soon (cpu/mb/ram)?

Instead of quick answers, I have a lot more questions that I thought I would have. Just writing this my brain is saying wait or go cheap for now... Damn.
Avatar 17232
26.
 
Re: AMD Zen 3 Announcement
Oct 9, 2020, 10:17
Tom
26.
Re: AMD Zen 3 Announcement Oct 9, 2020, 10:17
Oct 9, 2020, 10:17
Tom
 
Simon Says wrote on Oct 9, 2020, 09:58:
Tom wrote on Oct 9, 2020, 09:54:
"Up to" 2.8x better power efficiency? Let's see some perf/W comparisons on actual games.

That's not where they take that metric. The 10900K can guzzles about 300W @ 100% load, 5950X is 105W @ 100% load.

300/105 = 2.857

QED

P.S.: They didn't specify that the power comparison was in games, so it's easy to figure out where they got it from, and it is accurate.

Are both CPUs in your comparison getting the same amount of work done? If so, then it could be an accurate comparison, for a workload that is completely irrelevant to me.

I'm looking forward to seeing some real perf/W comparisons for real workloads.
25.
 
Re: AMD Zen 3 Announcement
Oct 9, 2020, 10:08
25.
Re: AMD Zen 3 Announcement Oct 9, 2020, 10:08
Oct 9, 2020, 10:08
 
VaranDragon wrote on Oct 9, 2020, 10:04:
Simon Says wrote on Oct 9, 2020, 10:00:
VaranDragon wrote on Oct 9, 2020, 05:25:
Well of course its the prices holding people back it always was. As for 4k over 1080p, I really couldn't care less insofar as it translates to VR. VR requires a significant amount of horsepower, somewhat equivalent to 4k monitors at least for the majority of headsets on the market now. And it still suffers from pixel density issues and clarity compared to even 1080p monitors. So yeah, I am all for extra computing power, regardless of whether it's for 4k or VR, but mostly I am for lowering the price barrier on the mid to high range systems.

No, you could get the best gear back in late 90s and early 2000s for peanuts relative to today as far as GPU and CPU gaming loads were concerned.

Heck, I used to buy everything highend at prices that would be considered below midrange to midrange today even taking into account inflation...

Well yeah, but thats not what Im talking about. Even back in the 90s early 2000s, Intel and (later) Nvidia were sold at a premium compared to their competitors. So my point still stands, even back in the day you paid a premium on high-end parts, it's just a smaller premium compared to what you pay today.

No, there were no premiums in the GPU market, there were 5-6 competitors in the market. If a card was 10% faster it pretty much had a 10% higher price, there were no premiums. You paid for the perf and the prices were ridiculously low even taking into account inflation. There is ZERO comparison VS the pure madness we have today.

As for CPUs, I remember well when I bought a Celeron 300A and cranked it up to top of the line P3 450 speeds at a ridiculous fraction of the price.

You must've either never lived this period, or you don't remember it correctly, I don't know which, cause if you did, you would never put forward fallacious arguments like this one.
24.
 
Re: AMD Zen 3 Announcement
Oct 9, 2020, 10:04
24.
Re: AMD Zen 3 Announcement Oct 9, 2020, 10:04
Oct 9, 2020, 10:04
 
Simon Says wrote on Oct 9, 2020, 10:00:
VaranDragon wrote on Oct 9, 2020, 05:25:
Well of course its the prices holding people back it always was. As for 4k over 1080p, I really couldn't care less insofar as it translates to VR. VR requires a significant amount of horsepower, somewhat equivalent to 4k monitors at least for the majority of headsets on the market now. And it still suffers from pixel density issues and clarity compared to even 1080p monitors. So yeah, I am all for extra computing power, regardless of whether it's for 4k or VR, but mostly I am for lowering the price barrier on the mid to high range systems.

No, you could get the best gear back in late 90s and early 2000s for peanuts relative to today as far as GPU and CPU gaming loads were concerned.

Heck, I used to buy everything highend at prices that would be considered below midrange to midrange today even taking into account inflation...

Well yeah, but thats not what Im talking about. Even back in the 90s early 2000s, Intel and (later) Nvidia were sold at a premium compared to their competitors. So my point still stands, even back in the day you paid a premium on high-end parts, it's just a smaller premium compared to what you pay today.
Avatar 58327
23.
 
Re: AMD Zen 3 Announcement
Oct 9, 2020, 10:00
23.
Re: AMD Zen 3 Announcement Oct 9, 2020, 10:00
Oct 9, 2020, 10:00
 
VaranDragon wrote on Oct 9, 2020, 05:25:
Well of course its the prices holding people back it always was. As for 4k over 1080p, I really couldn't care less insofar as it translates to VR. VR requires a significant amount of horsepower, somewhat equivalent to 4k monitors at least for the majority of headsets on the market now. And it still suffers from pixel density issues and clarity compared to even 1080p monitors. So yeah, I am all for extra computing power, regardless of whether it's for 4k or VR, but mostly I am for lowering the price barrier on the mid to high range systems.

No, you could get the best gear back in late 90s and early 2000s for peanuts relative to today as far as GPU and CPU gaming loads were concerned.

Heck, I used to buy everything highend at prices that would be considered below midrange to midrange today even taking into account inflation...
22.
 
Re: AMD Zen 3 Announcement
Oct 9, 2020, 09:58
22.
Re: AMD Zen 3 Announcement Oct 9, 2020, 09:58
Oct 9, 2020, 09:58
 
Tom wrote on Oct 9, 2020, 09:54:
"Up to" 2.8x better power efficiency? Let's see some perf/W comparisons on actual games.

That's not where they take that metric. The 10900K can guzzles about 300W @ 100% load, 5950X is 105W @ 100% load.

300/105 = 2.857

QED

P.S.: They didn't specify that the power comparison was in games, so it's easy to figure out where they got it from, and it is accurate.
21.
 
Re: AMD Zen 3 Announcement
Oct 9, 2020, 09:54
Tom
21.
Re: AMD Zen 3 Announcement Oct 9, 2020, 09:54
Oct 9, 2020, 09:54
Tom
 
"Up to" 2.8x better power efficiency? Let's see some perf/W comparisons on actual games.
20.
 
Re: AMD Zen 3 Announcement
Oct 9, 2020, 09:52
20.
Re: AMD Zen 3 Announcement Oct 9, 2020, 09:52
Oct 9, 2020, 09:52
 
The main reason I stick to 1080p is longevity for my rig.

- My Motherboard and CPU is 8 Years old.
- I've only had 2 Video cards in it.. A GTX680, and a used GTX1070 I bought early last year for $230.
- Upgraded to an SSD about 4 years ago, and added another 8GB RAM to go to 16GB.

I have had zero issues playing modern games at max settings.

1080p is sufficient for me, especially with a 27" monitor 2.5 feet from my face.

That said... I definitely want to build a new rig in the spring. I may stick with the 1070 for a while after that too, and at least get a 3rd year out of it.... I haven't made up my mind on that yet.

Bottom line is 1080p gamining is sufficient (for me) and relatively inexpensive.
Get your games from GOG DAMMIT!
Avatar 19499
19.
 
Re: AMD Zen 3 Announcement
Oct 9, 2020, 08:06
19.
Re: AMD Zen 3 Announcement Oct 9, 2020, 08:06
Oct 9, 2020, 08:06
 
I have to agree with other posters in this thread. GPUs are still very limited by the state of monitor development. A good 4k monitor with 144mhz+ is still quite expensive. I have two ASUS 32" 2k 144mhz monitors and I am very happy with them. I downgraded to them from a 27" 60mhz 4k monitor which I sold. The difference in most games between 2k and 4k is very minor IMO.

Hope everyone has a great weekend.
18.
 
Re: AMD Zen 3 Announcement
Oct 9, 2020, 07:39
18.
Re: AMD Zen 3 Announcement Oct 9, 2020, 07:39
Oct 9, 2020, 07:39
 
1badmf wrote on Oct 9, 2020, 02:48:
Burrito of Peace wrote on Oct 9, 2020, 00:05:
September 2020 Steam Hardware Survey primary resolution numbers:

1080p 65.49%
1440p 6.89%
3840 ("4K") 2.27%

Seems like most gamers want to, and are happy to, play at 1080p and probably will be for the foreseeable future. Especially with monitor display tech being stagnant at the moment. Outside of very few zealots jerking off and foaming at the mouth over 4K, seems like the market has spoken. The mass majority just don't give a shit about anything higher than 1080p.

Until momentum starts seeing a significant shift, the 4K zealots are just like the whackjobs that try to corner you outside the grocery store to talk about Jesus. Annoying at the outset and just obnoxious the more they drivel on.

the thing holding people back is purely cost, but if they could see what i've seen (with your eyes), everyone would switch in a heartbeat. they just haven't because of cost. i would say ultrawide is the more dramatic improvement over 4k. but a decent ultrawide is minimum $500 at the moment. just like 1080p gained traction over older resolutions over time, so too will ultrawide as prices drop.

I prefer 1440 over 4K, just because it's the sweet spot for visuals/performance. As a middle-aged guy with glasses, the detail on 4K just doesn't seem that great to me as I can't really pick it out. The upgrade from 1080 to 2K seems amazing, but from 2K to 4K isn't all that noticeable. That said...no clue how anyone is still gaming at 1080 these days. To me, after years of 2K, it looks like 720p.

17.
 
Re: AMD Zen 3 Announcement
Oct 9, 2020, 06:22
El Pit
 
17.
Re: AMD Zen 3 Announcement Oct 9, 2020, 06:22
Oct 9, 2020, 06:22
 El Pit
 
Here's hoping for a Ryzen 5700x @ 65 watt being released in a few months.
"There is no right life in the wrong one." (Theodor W. Adorno, philosopher)
"Only a Sith deals in absolutes." (Obi-Wan Kenobi, Jedi)
16.
 
Re: AMD Zen 3 Announcement
Oct 9, 2020, 05:25
16.
Re: AMD Zen 3 Announcement Oct 9, 2020, 05:25
Oct 9, 2020, 05:25
 
Well of course its the prices holding people back it always was. As for 4k over 1080p, I really couldn't care less insofar as it translates to VR. VR requires a significant amount of horsepower, somewhat equivalent to 4k monitors at least for the majority of headsets on the market now. And it still suffers from pixel density issues and clarity compared to even 1080p monitors. So yeah, I am all for extra computing power, regardless of whether it's for 4k or VR, but mostly I am for lowering the price barrier on the mid to high range systems.
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