Horizon Zero Dawn Regional Price Spikes

The price of preordering the PC edition of Horizon Zero Dawn on Steam has gone up in many regions, in some cases quite dramatically. VG247 points to a Reddit thread highlighting the situation, which notes that the game is now cheaper on the Epic Games Store than on Steam for most users. This is explained as a reaction to so many customers using VPNs to take advantage of lower regional pricing in some areas. A couple of the most extreme examples are a 389% increase in Argentina and a 357% increase in Turkey. SteamDB has the price history for the game.
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29.
 
Re: Horizon Zero Dawn Regional Price Spikes
Jul 9, 2020, 21:31
Dev
 
29.
Re: Horizon Zero Dawn Regional Price Spikes Jul 9, 2020, 21:31
Jul 9, 2020, 21:31
 Dev
 
Beamer wrote on Jul 7, 2020, 08:45:
But even things such as cereal, gallons of milk, and loaves of bread are 33%-75% cheaper in Kiev than in Cincinnati.
I liked the rest of the post, but this doesn't have much to do with it. Because in this case it's costs of production and cost of living being lower. Milk and bread in countries like that aren't usually from global companies.
28.
 
Re: Horizon Zero Dawn Regional Price Spikes
Jul 8, 2020, 06:02
NKD
28.
Re: Horizon Zero Dawn Regional Price Spikes Jul 8, 2020, 06:02
Jul 8, 2020, 06:02
NKD
 
PHJF wrote on Jul 7, 2020, 07:56:
... or regional pricing is designed to maximize the amount of money a company can wring out of each individual market. Do you live under a rock? Do you honestly think this is generosity on the part of publishers?

Generosity? Not at all. Like I said, a full price game wouldn't see many sales in these economies, so a lower price means far more sales and more profit than they would otherwise make. The lower prices benefit the consumer, but the intention is obviously to make as much money as possible. My point is that it isn't publishers fucking over poor people in this situation, it's gamers in wealthy economies.
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27.
 
Re: Horizon Zero Dawn Regional Price Spikes
Jul 7, 2020, 14:58
27.
Re: Horizon Zero Dawn Regional Price Spikes Jul 7, 2020, 14:58
Jul 7, 2020, 14:58
 
Thanks, Beam.
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26.
 
Re: Horizon Zero Dawn Regional Price Spikes
Jul 7, 2020, 08:45
Beamer
 
26.
Re: Horizon Zero Dawn Regional Price Spikes Jul 7, 2020, 08:45
Jul 7, 2020, 08:45
 Beamer
 
PHJF wrote on Jul 7, 2020, 07:56:
NKD wrote on Jul 6, 2020, 22:27:
Regional prices are designed to make games affordable for poorer economies where a full price game would not see many sales, and where they have to compete with bootleg copies being sold openly. People in wealthy countries using a VPN to get a cheaper price from poor countries is just another way for wealthy people to ruin a good thing for poor people to benefit themselves. If you're okay with that, fine, but at least recognize it.

Piracy is arguably the lesser of two evils. Sure, it's one less full price domestic sale either way, but at least you're not shitting on some other gamer on the other side of the world just to save a buck.

... or regional pricing is designed to maximize the amount of money a company can wring out of each individual market. Do you live under a rock? Do you honestly think this is generosity on the part of publishers?

Can't it be both?

We know the cost of developing a video game. Hundreds of millions of dollars. We see the thousands of names in the credits these days.
And that's one game. Most of these developers, and absolutely publishers, have multiple games being developed at the same time. Some flop. Flop hard. They may be beloved here, but they flop. In order for that developer to stick around, the games that don't flop need to cover the ones that do.

So there's really a set amount of money they have to earn, and they have to make it from their primary regions.
In other regions, people cannot afford those prices. The average monthly income in the Ukraine is under $400. That's less than 10% of the same in the US.
In order to price the game in a way that they actually make money to keep selling games, studios need to make a certain amount of money in wealthy countries (incidentally, this is also where most of their employees are, and therefore the wages they're paying.) But places like the Ukraine can't afford that. This brings a conundrum with 3 solutions:

1) Sell the game at the western price point. This tack will bring the studio the most revenue. But in countries with more poverty, few people will be able to afford the game, despite demand not falling for the game, so more people will pirate. This will normalize piracy in that region, even as it develops, and it will increase piracy across the globe because the game is more widely available through piracy channels

2) Sell the game at the other price point. This will drastically reduce revenue. Now, people in the Ukraine that want the game can afford it, but the game is so cheap in Western countries that the studio and publisher can't recoup the costs

3) Have a pricing scale based upon what the region can afford. This is the best of all worlds. Prices are adjusted to cost of living, and therefore the western markets are still helping the product be profitable, but the poorer nations can still legally acquire the game

Everything generally adjusts in this way, particularly when the per-unit cost is low. But even things such as cereal, gallons of milk, and loaves of bread are 33%-75% cheaper in Kiev than in Cincinnati.
25.
 
Re: Horizon Zero Dawn Regional Price Spikes
Jul 7, 2020, 07:56
PHJF
 
25.
Re: Horizon Zero Dawn Regional Price Spikes Jul 7, 2020, 07:56
Jul 7, 2020, 07:56
 PHJF
 
NKD wrote on Jul 6, 2020, 22:27:
Regional prices are designed to make games affordable for poorer economies where a full price game would not see many sales, and where they have to compete with bootleg copies being sold openly. People in wealthy countries using a VPN to get a cheaper price from poor countries is just another way for wealthy people to ruin a good thing for poor people to benefit themselves. If you're okay with that, fine, but at least recognize it.

Piracy is arguably the lesser of two evils. Sure, it's one less full price domestic sale either way, but at least you're not shitting on some other gamer on the other side of the world just to save a buck.

... or regional pricing is designed to maximize the amount of money a company can wring out of each individual market. Do you live under a rock? Do you honestly think this is generosity on the part of publishers?
Steam + PSN: PHJF
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24.
 
Re: Horizon Zero Dawn Regional Price Spikes
Jul 6, 2020, 22:31
24.
Re: Horizon Zero Dawn Regional Price Spikes Jul 6, 2020, 22:31
Jul 6, 2020, 22:31
 
1badmf wrote on Jul 6, 2020, 21:45:
...everything we do at least has the morality of law...

I do not know in what country you live. I live in the United States. We have, over the course of our history, repeatedly struck down laws for being amoral. We can not use the law as a guide to morality. A simple thought exercise that is given to most college freshmen in intro philosophy: the law states that stealing is wrong. However, to feed your family and prevent their deaths, you must steal food. Is it moral to follow the law and allow others to perish or is it moral to defy the law and preserve the lives of those you love?

A free market assumes that a product can be offered by a number of merchants, at the cost of their choosing, and consumers have the liberty to patronize any merchant they wish to acquire the same product. We do not have a free market. We have a captive market, especially in the games industry where exclusives, artificial scarcity, unbalanced pricing, and lack of competition reign supreme.

One can choose to wait until the price is reduced in this captive market, that is certainly an option. I am not outright supporting piracy. However, piracy does send a message in its own right as does not buying it at all. Inherently, both send the same message and that is "Your goods are overpriced".

Looking Glass wasn't killed by piracy alone. Looking Glass was largely killed by the mismanagement of their parent company, Eidos. So much so that Eidos was purchased by Square Enix.
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23.
 
Re: Horizon Zero Dawn Regional Price Spikes
Jul 6, 2020, 22:27
NKD
23.
Re: Horizon Zero Dawn Regional Price Spikes Jul 6, 2020, 22:27
Jul 6, 2020, 22:27
NKD
 
Regional prices are designed to make games affordable for poorer economies where a full price game would not see many sales, and where they have to compete with bootleg copies being sold openly. People in wealthy countries using a VPN to get a cheaper price from poor countries is just another way for wealthy people to ruin a good thing for poor people to benefit themselves. If you're okay with that, fine, but at least recognize it.

Piracy is arguably the lesser of two evils. Sure, it's one less full price domestic sale either way, but at least you're not shitting on some other gamer on the other side of the world just to save a buck.
Thou art an artless, greasy tallow-catch.
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22.
 
Re: Horizon Zero Dawn Regional Price Spikes
Jul 6, 2020, 21:56
22.
Re: Horizon Zero Dawn Regional Price Spikes Jul 6, 2020, 21:56
Jul 6, 2020, 21:56
 
Burrito of Peace wrote on Jul 6, 2020, 13:26:
Here you and I will disagree. I don't believe that I am entitled to anything, games wise. However, if you can sell a game for $15USD in one region, and still make a profit, and then attempt to sell it in another region for $59.99USD, it should come as no surprise when people either take advantage of technology to buy it at a lower price or copy it. Capitalism has no morality and it cuts both ways. If one is going to argue that it is morally wrong to copy data, are you going to also argue that is morally wrong to fleece one demographic for the sake of the bottom line?
It seems impossible that a reasonable person could be arguing that raw materials are a significant component of software pricing.

If you sell enough copies at $60 to recoup your development costs, then you'll "still make a profit" at any price higher than 0, or whatever covers the costs of selling software online. And of course they didn't start selling to the $15 regions. Horizon Zero Dawn isn't the new hit game out of Indonesia or Kazakhstan.
21.
 
Re: Horizon Zero Dawn Regional Price Spikes
Jul 6, 2020, 21:45
21.
Re: Horizon Zero Dawn Regional Price Spikes Jul 6, 2020, 21:45
Jul 6, 2020, 21:45
 
Burrito of Peace wrote on Jul 6, 2020, 13:26:
RedEye9 wrote on Jul 6, 2020, 12:47:
Rule number one of the Entitled Gamers Creed, "If you don't like a games price, Steal it."

Remember kids, you are owed any and every game ever made.

Here you and I will disagree. I don't believe that I am entitled to anything, games wise. However, if you can sell a game for $15USD in one region, and still make a profit, and then attempt to sell it in another region for $59.99USD, it should come as no surprise when people either take advantage of technology to buy it at a lower price or copy it. Capitalism has no morality and it cuts both ways. If one is going to argue that it is morally wrong to copy data, are you going to also argue that is morally wrong to fleece one demographic for the sake of the bottom line?


everything we do at least has the morality of law. i won't go into a debate about who controls the lawmakers, but a free market should be free to find its equillibrium, with the allowance that the law forbids suppliers or consumers from unfairly tilting the balance either way. don't like the price? don't buy it. if enough people feel this way they'll lower the price or they won't make any money. if enough people do like the price to allow them to make a profit off a 3 year old game? well, sucks for us, but that's how the cookie crumbles in a free society. i'd rather swallow that pill than bankrupt the creators by pirating their shit. Looking Glass might still be around if assholes like us didn't pirate the shit out of their great games.
20.
 
Re: Horizon Zero Dawn Regional Price Spikes
Jul 6, 2020, 20:27
20.
Re: Horizon Zero Dawn Regional Price Spikes Jul 6, 2020, 20:27
Jul 6, 2020, 20:27
 
Bradley wrote on Jul 6, 2020, 17:57:
RedEye9 wrote on Jul 6, 2020, 12:47:
Rule number one of the Entitled Gamers Creed, "If you don't like a games price, Steal it."

Remember kids, you are owed any and every game ever made.

Is it theft if you drive across town to a different store to buy something cheaper than the store closest to you? Is it theft if you drive out of state instead? What about driving to a different country? Fly? How does using a VPN to virtually travel outside the country suddenly make it theft? All that does is save time and the cost of an airline ticket. It doesn't change the amount of money you're giving the developer at all.

So fly to India and pick it up for $15. Problem?
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19.
 
Re: Horizon Zero Dawn Regional Price Spikes
Jul 6, 2020, 18:52
19.
Re: Horizon Zero Dawn Regional Price Spikes Jul 6, 2020, 18:52
Jul 6, 2020, 18:52
 
RedEye9 wrote on Jul 6, 2020, 18:45:
From Valves subscriber agreement
You agree that you will not use IP proxying or other methods to disguise the place of your residence, whether to circumvent geographical restrictions on game content, to purchase at pricing not applicable to your geography, or for any other purpose. If you do this, Valve may terminate your access to your Account.
https://store.steampowered.com/subscriber_agreement/#3

Thank you. That sounds like a civil action, not a criminal action though.

I was asking my questions more from a philosophical point of view. I agree that it may not be moral to use a VPN to obtain a lower price, but I do not see it equating to theft.
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18.
 
Re: Horizon Zero Dawn Regional Price Spikes
Jul 6, 2020, 18:45
18.
Re: Horizon Zero Dawn Regional Price Spikes Jul 6, 2020, 18:45
Jul 6, 2020, 18:45
 
From Valves subscriber agreement
You agree that you will not use IP proxying or other methods to disguise the place of your residence, whether to circumvent geographical restrictions on game content, to purchase at pricing not applicable to your geography, or for any other purpose. If you do this, Valve may terminate your access to your Account.
https://store.steampowered.com/subscriber_agreement/#3

As for theft, I was referring to the eyepatch pegleg variety.
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17.
 
Re: Horizon Zero Dawn Regional Price Spikes
Jul 6, 2020, 18:31
17.
Re: Horizon Zero Dawn Regional Price Spikes Jul 6, 2020, 18:31
Jul 6, 2020, 18:31
 
RedEye9 wrote on Jul 6, 2020, 18:25:
Bradley wrote on Jul 6, 2020, 17:57:
RedEye9 wrote on Jul 6, 2020, 12:47:
...

Is it theft if you drive across town to a different store to buy something cheaper than the store closest to you? Is it theft if you drive out of state instead? What about driving to a different country? Fly? How does using a VPN to virtually travel outside the country suddenly make it theft? All that does is save time and the cost of an airline ticket. It doesn't change the amount of money you're giving the developer at all.
dude
It's not puff puff hold
It's puff puff pass
Share that shit

You didn't answer any of my questions.
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16.
 
Re: Horizon Zero Dawn Regional Price Spikes
Jul 6, 2020, 18:25
16.
Re: Horizon Zero Dawn Regional Price Spikes Jul 6, 2020, 18:25
Jul 6, 2020, 18:25
 
Bradley wrote on Jul 6, 2020, 17:57:
RedEye9 wrote on Jul 6, 2020, 12:47:
Rule number one of the Entitled Gamers Creed, "If you don't like a games price, Steal it."

Remember kids, you are owed any and every game ever made.

Is it theft if you drive across town to a different store to buy something cheaper than the store closest to you? Is it theft if you drive out of state instead? What about driving to a different country? Fly? How does using a VPN to virtually travel outside the country suddenly make it theft? All that does is save time and the cost of an airline ticket. It doesn't change the amount of money you're giving the developer at all.
dude
It's not puff puff hold
It's puff puff pass
Share that shit
A mask is not a political statement.
It's an IQ test. It's a compassion test. It's a decency test. It's a social responsibility test.
Cover Your Eyes for even more protection.
Avatar 58135
15.
 
Re: Horizon Zero Dawn Regional Price Spikes
Jul 6, 2020, 17:57
15.
Re: Horizon Zero Dawn Regional Price Spikes Jul 6, 2020, 17:57
Jul 6, 2020, 17:57
 
RedEye9 wrote on Jul 6, 2020, 12:47:
Rule number one of the Entitled Gamers Creed, "If you don't like a games price, Steal it."

Remember kids, you are owed any and every game ever made.

Is it theft if you drive across town to a different store to buy something cheaper than the store closest to you? Is it theft if you drive out of state instead? What about driving to a different country? Fly? How does using a VPN to virtually travel outside the country suddenly make it theft? All that does is save time and the cost of an airline ticket. It doesn't change the amount of money you're giving the developer at all.
Avatar 57411
14.
 
Re: Horizon Zero Dawn Regional Price Spikes
Jul 6, 2020, 17:09
14.
Re: Horizon Zero Dawn Regional Price Spikes Jul 6, 2020, 17:09
Jul 6, 2020, 17:09
 
RedEye9 wrote on Jul 6, 2020, 12:47:
Rule number one of the Entitled Gamers Creed, "If you don't like a games price, Steal it."

Remember kids, you are owed any and every game ever made.

Yeah, you do see this entitled attitude quite a lot. Not just with gamers, but any medium. Music, books, movies, games...it should all just be free. If a big-name studio made it, it's okay because they are rich, so you aren't really stealing. If it's a small studio or just one person, it's okay because they are indie and they suck anyhow, so not worth paying - this is the mentality of pirates.

Personally, if a game is too expensive, I just wait until the price comes down to what I'm willing to pay. Still support the devs, and not breaking any laws.
13.
 
Re: Horizon Zero Dawn Regional Price Spikes
Jul 6, 2020, 16:16
13.
Re: Horizon Zero Dawn Regional Price Spikes Jul 6, 2020, 16:16
Jul 6, 2020, 16:16
 
RedEye9 wrote on Jul 6, 2020, 12:47:
Rule number one of the Entitled Gamers Creed, "If you don't like a games price, Steal it."

Remember kids, you are owed any and every game ever made.

And developers/publishers are entitled to their 88%.
12.
 
Re: Horizon Zero Dawn Regional Price Spikes
Jul 6, 2020, 15:22
12.
Re: Horizon Zero Dawn Regional Price Spikes Jul 6, 2020, 15:22
Jul 6, 2020, 15:22
 
Avus wrote on Jul 6, 2020, 12:07:
The only game i will pay full price at launch in this year will by Cyberpunk 2077. I haven't bought full price game for at least 9 years.

FWIW if you're sure you're going to buy it, and are in the US, Amazon is still selling ps4/xbox/pc physical copies for just under $50.

On Topic: While I personally wouldn't do it as I can just wait for the game to get to a price I'm willing to pay (I do think $50 is a joke, $30-40 would have been far more appropriate) I get why people do. As was previously mentioned capitalism gives no shits and swings both ways.
11.
 
Re: Horizon Zero Dawn Regional Price Spikes
Jul 6, 2020, 13:55
Cutter
 
11.
Re: Horizon Zero Dawn Regional Price Spikes Jul 6, 2020, 13:55
Jul 6, 2020, 13:55
 Cutter
 
Dev wrote on Jul 6, 2020, 11:23:
Apparently it's still $15 in India. Now that I know about this, I'm tempted to go use a VPN to get it.

A global key? I'd be utterly amazed if it's not region locked.

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10.
 
Re: Horizon Zero Dawn Regional Price Spikes
Jul 6, 2020, 13:54
Cutter
 
10.
Re: Horizon Zero Dawn Regional Price Spikes Jul 6, 2020, 13:54
Jul 6, 2020, 13:54
 Cutter
 
Leper wrote on Jul 6, 2020, 12:31:
If the price isn't fair then it will quickly drop in your region. People shouldn't be pre-ordering anyway given that the port could be buggy.

That isn't remotely true. Scumbags will charge whatever they can get away with for as long as they can. And yes, it'll probably be a shitty port anyway. To note, the price went up here by $2 on both Steam and EGS. Fuck these guys and their robotic horse they rode in on.

"If you're going through Hell...keep going."
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