That Linus tech tips guy had a video where his VR expert had him try both streaming strategies and while one was improved over the other they said that both were painfully behind. This was while playing beat saber which admittedly would be extra sensitive to that, but I'd see an FPS being the same way. Also they showed moving your head quickly could outpace the stream resulting in black edges, again reduced in the newer version though.

Edit: actually I guess it wasn't beat saber, it was that archery mini game

https://youtu.be/AGScX_8plYw

I guess my original post overstated display lag, but the input seems bad to me especially for a game like this

Sepharo wrote on Mar 3, 2020, 21:04:

Dev wrote on Mar 3, 2020, 20:17:
Fortunately, you can play it with other VR systems... like the Quest that's only $400. Valve isn't keeping it exclusive to their own, because they want the VR market as a whole to grow.

I think you'll only be able to play this with the Quest via a streaming mode, of which there are two different varieties, but neither are an experience you'd want... especially for a FPS or any fast paced game. It's got a lot of display and input lag in those modes.

I think the new wired PC link should be fine.
Especially since valve themselves officially call it out as supported for Alyx:
https://half-life.com/en/alyx/vr
I've not had any latency problems with the games I've tried in the PC link version on steam
Prior to that I did the desktop sideload streamer thingy, and I did have issues with that.

If you want a technical deep dive into the Oculus link system:
Text for your Link

This comment was edited on Mar 3, 2020, 22:23.

Dev wrote on Mar 3, 2020, 20:17:
Fortunately, you can play it with other VR systems... like the Quest that's only $400. Valve isn't keeping it exclusive to their own, because they want the VR market as a whole to grow.

I think you'll only be able to play this with the Quest via a streaming mode, of which there are two different varieties, but neither are an experience you'd want... especially for a FPS or any fast paced game. It's got a lot of display and input lag in those modes.

Luke wrote on Mar 3, 2020, 05:07:
Wauw a game with floating hands, sure valve I run out buying your gear for thousands of $ .....gezz

Fortunately, you can play it with other VR systems... like the Quest that's only $400. Valve isn't keeping it exclusive to their own, because they want the VR market as a whole to grow.

Caslon wrote on Mar 3, 2020, 01:36:
Too expensive to have developed this game for both VR AND PC? How much were they paid by VR developers to make it VR exclusive?

I think you need to re-examine what valve is and how they own steam. And how they have literally billions to play around and do wtf ever they want with their flat management structure. So happens, enough of them wheeled their desks over to the VR corner, and made a new HL game. Probably because VR is a new exciting toy. Don't worry, they will get tired of it soon enough, probably before HL3. And since they never outsource their IP's for game development after they made steam, no one else will do it either. It's a pity, they could keep full creative control and have studios make all sorts of games. Studios that could actually deliver something because of that thing called Milestones.

Ive yet to feel sick in vr. Payday 2 has a good control and fire system. Akimbo weapons are great.

I got the chance to play this for 4-5 hours late last year and it really impressed me. It was also my first time using the Valve Index and the combination of the two was the best VR I had ever played.
It feels way more vulnerable and scary in VR. Perhaps a little clumsy as well since I'm not experienced at shooting hand guns in real life. Throwing a propane tank and shooting it was just awesome.

I think this game is going to make a lot of players happy. A lot of people are going to feel left out and be mad. I hope some of the people in the middle can borrow someones VR to give it a go.

Tipsy McStagger wrote on Mar 2, 2020, 22:09:
You can get very sick, very fast in VR. Your disassociation with body movement but eyes fully perceiving movement really can get you motion sick.

This is why for VR to truely take off, you need a cheap omnidirectional treadmill.

Omnidirectional treadmills have been explored quite heavily over the past few years but the consensus at this point is that:
(1) They are too large and expensive to be viable for at home gaming
(2) They are too energy intensive. It's hard enough to just get people to stand to play VR (which is why I think seated modes are critical and thankfully HLA will have one)
(3) They don't even solve the fundamental issue causing simulator sickness: the desynchronization between the movement perceived vestibularly and the movement perceived visually. To solve the problem one needs to actually stimulate the vestibular system. For some people they can slightly mitigate the issue by giving the *expectation* of movement, but they don't actually solve the fundamental problem
(4) Even if all of the above weren't problems, the experience of actually using these things is rather clunky because while they claim to simulate walking/running, the experience of the current implementations is more like "sliding", and so much of the geometry and the way these things strap you in interferes with movement. You end up using it as an abstraction for movement rather than walking/running naturally, so they're rather poor even from an immersion standpoint.

Contrary to popular belief, most people can get their VR legs (adapt to smooth locomotion) with some controlled exposure over a week or two. Once you get to that point, joystick locomotion offers a much better experience than these expensive, bulky, and clunky devices. So most people should just get their VR legs. And if they're one of the unlucky few that can't get their VR legs, unfortunately they're just going to have to accept this fact and stick to teleport (or stick with flat gaming and pray that some genius comes up with a solution to the actual problem)

Have been waiting for a new HL game since HL2 EP2, I'm ready to try VR, the hype is real! Again!

Yeah, no way is this fun without VR. Which isn't a complaint. Beat Sabre is so much fun, buy would be boring without VR.

Another locomotion video here!

Wauw a game with floating hands, sure valve I run out buying your gear for thousands of $ .....gezz

Caslon wrote on Mar 3, 2020, 01:36:
Too expensive to have developed this game for both VR AND PC? How much were they paid by VR developers to make it VR exclusive?

It just wouldn't be the same experience. If you used WASD and a mouse, then it would probably break the combat because you'd be OP. Or they would have to gimp the controls and character speed, and it wouldn't be fun anymore etc.

Having said that, I'm fairly sure you can emulate VR controls with a mouse and keyboard if you just want to play it. But honestly you're missing out the main point of playing a VR game which is the immersion you get from mainly headset and the hand controllers.

How is this awesome? I like VR and think its a thing, but teleporting from cover to cover while sniping enemies that are as blind, slow and stupid as Star Wars Stormtroopers is not my idea of a good time.

Caslon wrote on Mar 3, 2020, 01:36:
Too expensive to have developed this game for both VR AND PC? How much were they paid by VR developers to make it VR exclusive?

I don't think Valve needs cash from "VR developers" ...

Too expensive to have developed this game for both VR AND PC? How much were they paid by VR developers to make it VR exclusive?

This could be the killer app that cracks open VR to the mainstream. Looks very nice.

phinn wrote on Mar 2, 2020, 19:56:
Looks amazing wow. Wasn't interested in VR until now. The teleporting around thing to me looks meh but I guess that's for motion sickness? Pretty cool they give you the option for movement.

You can get very sick, very fast in VR. Your disassociation with body movement but eyes fully perceiving movement really can get you motion sick.

This is why for VR to truely take off, you need a cheap omnidirectional treadmill.


Edit: finished watching the videos. Man this looks awesome.

This comment was edited on Mar 2, 2020, 22:31.

Definitely looks cool. I'm definitely going to get it, but for whatever reason I can't play 3D shooters in VR for very long without VR sickness. Skyrim VR I was able to play for hours on end but that game is so slow paced and everything is spread out vast distances. Hopefully, this game is just so insanely immersive I'll just forge on.

This really looks great. I particularly liked the gun play in the 3rd video. What was up with the player in the first videos swaying around like they just drank two pitchers of beer though? I assume that's just the way we play in VR, but dang they were bobbing and weaving.

Shift is pretty cool but I'll probably try continuous.
I've already played games that weren't made for VR, with continuous movement and haven't had an issue with that. Regardless of the immersion level I'm pretty used to my view moving without my actual body moving.