Jerykk wrote on Jan 2, 2020, 16:08:

[rest snipped]

Yup. Epic's current strategy is an effective way to get people to install EGS. However, if they want people to continue using EGS when given a choice, they need to improve their actual service significantly. Case in point: Cyberpunk is available on Steam, GOG and EGS. What do you think the breakdown in sales is going to be? It's not going to be great for EGS because it offers customers no reason to choose it over its competitors.

I'm not sure, but we can use Red Dead Redemption 2 as a gauge to extrapolate a conclusion. It was simshipped on Rockstar, EGS, and Steam with a month-long head start on Rockstar and EGS. According to SuperData reports the game didn't even break 500,000 copies sold in its first month on EGS.

So based on that, I looked at the official trailer for RDR2 PC. It had 5.25 million views with 41,870 ratings and about 5,561 comments. I estimated if everyone watched the trailer around three times, 97% just viewed. The logical conclusion then is more people spend time watching videos, so it's reasonable to conclude more people buy and play games than leave ratings and reviews.

So extrapolating on that, we can find two pieces of data. First, based on the 32,583 total scores on Steam, 97% would put the number of units sold on Steam around 8-9 million. When you consider Steam's entire active monthly of over 100 million, 8-9 million for new Rockstar games is likely a reasonable estimate. However, I've noticed the Steam community tends to be more active contributors to ratings and reviews, so, for the sake of realism, it might be more accurate to adjust the totals to between 4-6 million units.

Epic Games Store = 400K (December)
Steam = 4-6 million (December)

So the conclusion is when people had a real choice between Steam or Epic Games Store, they went Steam. Based on that, it is probably safe to extrapolate that had people had an opportunity between Steam or EGS for Borderlands 3 and Metro Exodus, the simship numbers reveal most would have picked Steam.

As you, myself, and others have noted, until Epic fixes their platform and makes it a place people WANT to shop at, nothing is going to fix their numbers. Not exclusives. Not freebies. Hopefully, Epic learns this soon.

*For Beamer: A Disclaimer. The above is based on SuperData, Youtube, Steam store page data. These are my extrapolated insights and opinions.

Burrito of Peace wrote on Jan 2, 2020, 08:49:
People seem to conveniently forget what an absolute shitshow Steam was when it first launched.

Are we pretending that EGS launched in 2003 or something? Steam was a pioneer and had no precedent to build upon. EGS, on the other hand, had plenty of reference to work with and still launched with an absolutely barebones service. It's been out for about a year and it still doesn't have achievements.

Epic is clearly more interested in throwing money away (giveaways, $10 coupons, timed exclusives) than investing in features and building a competitive service.

Kxmode wrote on Jan 2, 2020, 13:32:
People expect products and services to be on parity with the industry standard. Given how much money they spent on exclusives and freebies, Epic HAD so much money from their Unreal engine licensing and Fortnite that to launch their store in its current condition is the equivalent of Google's new Pixel phone with features missing.

Oh, sure, if you offer something for free and make the Epic Games Store the only place in town to buy something, people will likely come and get it. However, that's because they were forced to or couldn't pass up a deal. That's astroturfing brand loyalty. Ultimately, it doesn't work because the platform is trash. In an apples-to-apples comparison, every other platform offers something better and something unique.

Yup. Epic's current strategy is an effective way to get people to install EGS. However, if they want people to continue using EGS when given a choice, they need to improve their actual service significantly. Case in point: Cyberpunk is available on Steam, GOG and EGS. What do you think the breakdown in sales is going to be? It's not going to be great for EGS because it offers customers no reason to choose it over its competitors.

This comment was edited on Jan 2, 2020, 16:25.

Burrito of Peace wrote on Jan 2, 2020, 08:49:

Pr()ZaC wrote on Jan 2, 2020, 08:24:
Oh I'm sure that Epic is working its ass off to improve EGS and make sure it'll be competitive with Steam. It won't happen overnight. Even Steam got where it is now update after update.

People seem to conveniently forget what an absolute shitshow Steam was when it first launched.

That doesn't mean Epic's store should be missing standard features. Imagine if Google decided to enter the phone business, and they launched the Pixel phone to compete against Apple and Samsung with standard features missing. Then they tell their current and prospective customers that they'll spend the next 5-, 10-, 15-years getting the Pixel up to standards. Their phone business would sink right quick.

People expect products and services to be on parity with the industry standard. Given how much money they spent on exclusives and freebies, Epic HAD so much money from their Unreal engine licensing and Fortnite that to launch their store in its current condition is the equivalent of Google's new Pixel phone with features missing.

Oh, sure, if you offer something for free and make the Epic Games Store the only place in town to buy something, people will likely come and get it. However, that's because they were forced to or couldn't pass up a deal. That's astroturfing brand loyalty. Ultimately, it doesn't work because the platform is trash. In an apples-to-apples comparison, every other platform offers something better and something unique.

GOG = direct ownership of files and no DRM (unique feature), freebies, constant sales, mature feature-rich platform
Steam = biggest catalog of games (unique feature) permanent download of purchased titles (even those no longer available for sale), DRM-light, freebies, constant sales, very mature feature-complete platform
Uplay = first-party Ubisoft exclusives (unique feature), constant sales, mature platform
Origin = first-party EA exclusives (unique feature), constant sales, mature platform
Battle.net = first-party Activision / Blizzard exclusives (unique feature), mature feature-rich platform

Epic Games Store = third-party exclusives (unique feature), the endless stream of freebies, nonviable minimal platform, lacking features

Luke wrote on Jan 2, 2020, 04:25:
And the peps eat it raw.......

...and wiggling!

Pr()ZaC wrote on Jan 2, 2020, 08:22:

jdreyer wrote on Jan 2, 2020, 05:26:

Luke wrote on Jan 2, 2020, 04:25:
And the peps eat it raw.......

Of course they do. No one cooks salad.

Apparently, cooked salad exists.

And apparently, there's an epidemic of women breaking out into uncontrollable laughter while eating salad. Perhaps they should switch to cooked salad.

wrlwnd wrote on Jan 2, 2020, 00:54:
So, what's the business plan here.

Give away a bunch of free games.
Then...profit?

I don't see it. I have no reason to give them my credit card info, and giving me a bunch of free games doesn't change that one iota.

I'm sure they're getting more publicity, but that's dwarfed by the publicity they already got from Fortnite.

The business plan is to try and build a brand by astroturfing loyalty. But everyone knows loyalty is only as good as the next freebie.

Burrito of Peace wrote on Jan 2, 2020, 08:49:

Pr()ZaC wrote on Jan 2, 2020, 08:24:
Oh I'm sure that Epic is working its ass off to improve EGS and make sure it'll be competitive with Steam. It won't happen overnight. Even Steam got where it is now update after update.

People seem to conveniently forget what an absolute shitshow Steam was when it first launched.

And it was only tolerated because people were told they needed it to play the highly anticipated (and overhyped) sequel to Valve's previous hit.

Burrito of Peace wrote on Jan 2, 2020, 08:49:

Pr()ZaC wrote on Jan 2, 2020, 08:24:
Oh I'm sure that Epic is working its ass off to improve EGS and make sure it'll be competitive with Steam. It won't happen overnight. Even Steam got where it is now update after update.

People seem to conveniently forget what an absolute shitshow Steam was when it first launched.

Yeah, you're right, every successful new product or service launches to compete with what was on the market 15 years ago...

Burrito of Peace wrote on Jan 2, 2020, 08:49:

Pr()ZaC wrote on Jan 2, 2020, 08:24:
Oh I'm sure that Epic is working its ass off to improve EGS and make sure it'll be competitive with Steam. It won't happen overnight. Even Steam got where it is now update after update.

People seem to conveniently forget what an absolute shitshow Steam was when it first launched.

Oh no doubt. The problem I have with EGS being in such poor shape at this stage is that Valve was breaking new ground when they launched Steam and thus there was no model to follow. They were basically making things up as they went along and fighting whatever fires popped up as they came. That doesn't excuse how shitty their customer service still is, but to me it's a good deal more understandable that Steam was a mess in 2004 than EGS is in 2020. Valve set the baseline for how a modern platform should be. If EA and Ubisoft can follow it as they did when they launched Origin and Uplay then there is no excuse for the current state of EGS. NONE.

aka_STEVE wrote on Jan 1, 2020, 21:07:
*snagged*

Oh wait, I keep forgetting, is that a bannable offence still or just highly frowned upon..??
I just can't keep it straight which side of the fence we are on....

I'm not in favor of stopping people from having fun with a topic, even if it is about a previous conflict. People being dicks to each other is when it has to end.

Burrito of Peace wrote on Jan 2, 2020, 08:49:

Pr()ZaC wrote on Jan 2, 2020, 08:24:
Oh I'm sure that Epic is working its ass off to improve EGS and make sure it'll be competitive with Steam. It won't happen overnight. Even Steam got where it is now update after update.

People seem to conveniently forget what an absolute shitshow Steam was when it first launched.

qft

Pr()ZaC wrote on Jan 2, 2020, 08:24:
Oh I'm sure that Epic is working its ass off to improve EGS and make sure it'll be competitive with Steam. It won't happen overnight. Even Steam got where it is now update after update.

People seem to conveniently forget what an absolute shitshow Steam was when it first launched.

Jerykk wrote on Jan 2, 2020, 02:50:

wrlwnd wrote on Jan 2, 2020, 00:54:
So, what's the business plan here.

Give away a bunch of free games.
Then...profit?

I don't see it. I have no reason to give them my credit card info, and giving me a bunch of free games doesn't change that one iota.

I'm sure they're getting more publicity, but that's dwarfed by the publicity they already got from Fortnite.

The giveaways, exclusivity deals and $10 coupons are all designed to increase EGS' install base. Epic is bleeding money with this strategy but they believe it will pay off in the long run. Lose some money now, earn more money later.

Unfortunately, their plan isn't going to work until they actually provide a competitive service that people use when given a choice. So if a game is available on Steam, GOG and EGS, people need to consistently choose the EGS version in order for the platform to be considered a success. Right now, there's zero reason to choose EGS over its competitors and Epic doesn't seem to be putting much effort into changing that.

Oh I'm sure that Epic is working its ass off to improve EGS and make sure it'll be competitive with Steam. It won't happen overnight. Even Steam got where it is now update after update.

jdreyer wrote on Jan 2, 2020, 05:26:

Luke wrote on Jan 2, 2020, 04:25:
And the peps eat it raw.......

Of course they do. No one cooks salad.

Apparently, cooked salad exists.

Luke wrote on Jan 2, 2020, 04:25:
And the peps eat it raw.......

Of course they do. No one cooks salad.

And the peps eat it raw.......

Yay, games I've already had on steam and not played for years. Steep was already free on Uplay a few months ago. I'm fairly sure I got a darksiders game and steep for "free" on PS+ in the last 2 years too.

But hey, free games for those who don't already have them.

wrlwnd wrote on Jan 2, 2020, 00:54:
So, what's the business plan here.

Give away a bunch of free games.
Then...profit?

I don't see it. I have no reason to give them my credit card info, and giving me a bunch of free games doesn't change that one iota.

I'm sure they're getting more publicity, but that's dwarfed by the publicity they already got from Fortnite.

The giveaways, exclusivity deals and $10 coupons are all designed to increase EGS' install base. Epic is bleeding money with this strategy but they believe it will pay off in the long run. Lose some money now, earn more money later.

Unfortunately, their plan isn't going to work until they actually provide a competitive service that people use when given a choice. So if a game is available on Steam, GOG and EGS, people need to consistently choose the EGS version in order for the platform to be considered a success. Right now, there's zero reason to choose EGS over its competitors and Epic doesn't seem to be putting much effort into changing that.

So, what's the business plan here.

Give away a bunch of free games.
Then...profit?

I don't see it. I have no reason to give them my credit card info, and giving me a bunch of free games doesn't change that one iota.

I'm sure they're getting more publicity, but that's dwarfed by the publicity they already got from Fortnite.

Bill: But I've got to save them from that epic virus!
Jon: It's too late Bill. They're been infected. It's only a matter of time before they turn into zombocoms.