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Out of the Blue

That assault in last night's Steelers/Browns game was a very ugly look. I am on record with my love of tackle football, but the league does not make it easy for me to defend that position with moments like that. Respect to Browns QB Baker Mayfield for calling this out as "inexcusable," as a lot of players would not be nearly so direct in criticizing a teammate like that.

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45. Re: Out of the Blue Nov 16, 2019, 05:21 Verno
 
Prez wrote on Nov 16, 2019, 00:07:
That's true, but so is every high sticking incident in hockey.

No it isn't. The vast majority of high sticking penalties involve the stick inadvertently making contact with the opposing player. There was a case back in 2000 when Marty McSorely performed an infamous two-handed slash to Donald Brashear's temple. Brashear fell unconscious and his head smashed onto the ice. He very easily could have died. The NHL banned McSorely indefinitely and he was tried and convicted of assault with a deadly weapon. Which is the same thing that should happen here. That wasn't just your everyday "emotions are running high" type of incident. That was one of the most ugly, shameful things I've seen in the NFL and I've been watching for 45 years.

Yeah that's a good example. Another one that comes to mind for me is the Bertuzzi incident with Steve Moore that ended his career.

And yeah Mr Tact, all good here too, we're just shooting the breeze. My mother had Lasik and swears it changed her life. 15 years later and no readjustments so far.
 
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44. Re: LASIK Nov 16, 2019, 02:19 jdreyer
 
Mr. Tact wrote on Nov 15, 2019, 18:51:
One of my sisters had LASIK back in the day. She was very happy with the results. And in fact, years later an optometrist told her whomever had done the surgery had done a very good job, that he could barely see indications of the surgery when he had examined her eyes. I considered it myself, but couldn't bring myself to do it. I just "knew" I'd be the 1 in 10,000 who had a significantly bad outcome.

If you are considering having it done, first be sure you get a thorough and complete evaluation. Second, be sure the surgeon doing your procedure has literally done the procedure many thousands of times.

Also, don't cheap out. The people I've heard of that have had issues or regression after just a few years paid $3-4K. The people without issues paid $10K. These are your eyes people. Freak
 
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43. Re: Out of the Blue Nov 16, 2019, 02:12 jdreyer
 
subx wrote on Nov 15, 2019, 15:55:
Verno wrote on Nov 15, 2019, 15:02:
He took him down, kept him pinned, had to be pulled off then wrenched him around by the helmet then hit him with the fucking helmet.

I don't get the framing of Rudolph as some kind of innocent party. He started the helmet tugging shenanigans, and then came back at Garrett while he was being pulled away. Garrett obviously massively overreacted, but it wasn't like there was no provocation.
Garrett had a late hit on Rudolph, something Garrett has been fined for in the past. It's why the refs through the flag. The provocation was Garrett's.

Given how many penalties the Browns had (121 yards!) I really blame the coaches for not policing this shit. That said, Garrett probably has some aggression issues that he needs to get under control, probably by working with a therapist.

EDIT: I'm also going to lay some blame at the feet of the refs. This game was obviously contentious throughout, but they failed to lay down the law such that things exploded in the end.
 
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42. Re: Out of the Blue Nov 16, 2019, 02:03 jdreyer
 
RedEye9 wrote on Nov 15, 2019, 12:52:
Beamer... Where do you go to get your meat on.


Phrasing!
 
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41. Re: Out of the Blue Nov 16, 2019, 01:55 jdreyer
 
Icewind wrote on Nov 15, 2019, 12:34:
It was a little rough, but I don't see the problem. Nobody was hurt in Garrett's little helmet bonking episode, and it's just two roided up teams acting like roided up teams. I think the Pedro Martinez incident where he punched out Don Zimmer on the field back in the 2000s was far worse and no one crucified him to this extent.

I dunno, I'd be surprised if Rudolph doesn't have a concussion.
 
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40. Re: Out of the Blue Nov 16, 2019, 01:41 jdreyer
 
RedEye9 wrote on Nov 15, 2019, 12:26:
Whacking a guy with his helmet will get you a multi-game suspension.

Taking a knee during the anthem gets you banned for life.

THIS.

At least Kaepernick got a settlement.

This comment was edited on Nov 16, 2019, 01:54.
 
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39. Re: Out of the Blue Nov 16, 2019, 00:07 Prez
 
That's true, but so is every high sticking incident in hockey.

No it isn't. The vast majority of high sticking penalties involve the stick inadvertently making contact with the opposing player. There was a case back in 2000 when Marty McSorely performed an infamous two-handed slash to Donald Brashear's temple. Brashear fell unconscious and his head smashed onto the ice. He very easily could have died. The NHL banned McSorely indefinitely and he was tried and convicted of assault with a deadly weapon. Which is the same thing that should happen here. That wasn't just your everyday "emotions are running high" type of incident. That was one of the most ugly, shameful things I've seen in the NFL and I've been watching for 45 years.
 
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38. Re: Out of the Blue Nov 15, 2019, 22:47 Mr. Tact
 
It is all good, at least for me. Just a friendly discussion.  



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37. Re: Out of the Blue Nov 15, 2019, 22:45 RedEye9
 

Put the shovel down and step away from the kb.

 
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36. Re: Out of the Blue Nov 15, 2019, 22:42 Mr. Tact
 
We agree on everything except the issue of if Rudolph attempted to pull off Garrett's helmet.

I spent over three hours watching coverage of this on various ESPN shows this morning (I actually recorded about 6 hours of coverage, but some if it was repeats). The clip where you can see Garrett's helmet being a third to half way off while he is laying on top of Rudolph was only shown a few times. One comment I heard concerning this was the one I relayed which came via a third party, that Rudolph's hand was stuck in Garrett's face mask and he was attempting to free his hand. Since (AFAIK) Rudolph (nor anyone else) has not addressed this specific point, it is pretty difficult to know what was going on.
 



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35. Re: Out of the Blue Nov 15, 2019, 22:19 Verno
 
Again though, I don't agree with your premise that Rudolph did anything wrong. He took a late hit that ended up being egregious and was pretty much pinned by Garrett. I don't see him trying to strip Garretts helmet in an intentional way, I see him trying to get Garrett off him and only really having access to the shoulders and up due to the way he was held down. I guess we just have different takes on it. Regardless I think this is why the NFL didn't levy anything against Rudolph ultimately. He shouldn't have popped up angry looking for a fight after the hit but I think we would all agree it's understandable given the context.

Either way Garrett showed incredibly poor sportsmanship and frankly reckless/dangerous behavior.

 
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34. Re: Out of the Blue Nov 15, 2019, 21:59 Mr. Tact
 
*ugh* Okay, from the top, I said this:
Mr. Tact wrote on Nov 15, 2019, 17:39:
Rudolph's responsibility comes first from him attempting to pull Garrett's helmet off while on the ground. Then when his teammates are pushing Garrett away he charges in like he is going to fight Garrett when HE DOESN"T HAVE A HELMET. He is escalating the situation, he is out of control. Is his reaction understandable? Yes. Does he deserve a pass? No. Much like with Pouncey, you might sympathize or possibly agree with their reactions, but that doesn't absolve them of their own actions.

I only found about this event this morning, but after about 1.5 hours of watch various talking heads on ESPN, my initial reaction was suspensions of: 1 game for Rudolph, 2-4 games for Pouncey and Ogunjobi, 8-16 for Garrett. I was close. The NFL came out with their 1 game for Ogunjobi, 3 for Pouncey and at least to the end of the season for Garrett not long after that. I'll be disappointed if Rudolph doesn't get a fine. Yeah, Garrett is the villain. But there are no innocent parties in this situation.
The additional comments were in response to Verno saying he hadn't seen Rudolph pulling at Garrett's helmet. Overall, my point was two wrongs don't make a right. But yeah, clearly Garrett committed the most egregious action. Anyone disputing that or claiming Garrett's actions were justified doesn't live in a sane world.
 



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33. Re: Out of the Blue Nov 15, 2019, 21:49 RedEye9
 
nm  
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32. Re: Out of the Blue Nov 15, 2019, 21:32 Mr. Tact
 
Darks wrote on Nov 15, 2019, 21:06:
Unbelievable that you are tying to justify his action, your no better then that dirt-bag. There is nothing, nothing at all that can justify an assault like that.

Honestly, you sound just like a Browns fan, there can t be any other reason for you to defend that bullshit.
Actually, I'm not. You are inferring things I did not say. If you had read my other comments in this topic you'll see I said Garrett was the villain, his actions are inexcusable. Garrett committed unnecessary roughness, with eight seconds left in a game which his team had already secured a victory. Among other things, he was acting like a complete idiot in the play.
 



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31. Re: Out of the Blue Nov 15, 2019, 21:06 Darks
 
Mr. Tact wrote on Nov 15, 2019, 18:09:
Verno wrote on Nov 15, 2019, 17:54:
I'm watching both angles of it and I don't see him attempting to pull his helmet off.
Then you haven't seen all the film available. There is a shot where Garrett's helmet is about a third to half way off and you can tell Rudolph is pulling at it.

Edit: I did hear one claim that Rudolph's hand was "caught" in Garrett's face mask and Rudolph was attempting to free his hand -- but it was only mentioned once and the information came through a third party...


Unbelievable that you are tying to justify his action, your no better then that dirt-bag. There is nothing, nothing at all that can justify an assault like that.

Honestly, you sound just like a Browns fan, there can t be any other reason for you to defend that bullshit.
 
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30. Re: Out of the Blue Nov 15, 2019, 19:46 Mr. Tact
 
WarPig wrote on Nov 15, 2019, 19:40:
I'm actually a lot more worried about the Steeler's receiver, Johnson, who was bleeding from his freaking ear after getting that cheap-shot from the Brown's safety (who was righteously ejected from the game). That was pretty nasty.
Yeah, although I didn't watch it, based on the coverage afterward it was an "ugly" game where Cleveland was clearly either trying to look tough, or trying to send a message, or some other macho message. Your analysis was as good as any of the talking heads on ESPN. Rudolph was frustrated, and Garrett's unnecessary roughness with eight seconds remaining in a game which was over (and which Cleveland was winning) was an inch too far for Rudolph.
 



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29. Re: Out of the Blue Nov 15, 2019, 19:40 WarPig
 
That was assault with a weapon, plain and simple.

That's true, but so is every high sticking incident in hockey.

Garrett deserves every game that he will miss, but Rudolph wasn't entirely innocent. I think Rudolph was a feeling little salty after playing what was probably the worst game of his life. That, plus I'm sure he didn't appreciate Garrett wrestling him to the ground like he did when everyone else was just trying to play out the clock. I think Rudolph mildly over-reacted by trying to pull Garrett's helmet off - which of course was followed by Garrett bringing a sledgehammer to a tickle fight.

I'm actually a lot more worried about the Steeler's receiver, Johnson, who was bleeding from his freaking ear after getting that cheap-shot from the Brown's safety (who was righteously ejected from the game). That was pretty nasty.

 
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28. Re: Out of the Blue Nov 15, 2019, 19:24 Ahumado
 
This was all set up. NFL needs some good press for a change  
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27. Re: LASIK Nov 15, 2019, 18:51 Mr. Tact
 
One of my sisters had LASIK back in the day. She was very happy with the results. And in fact, years later an optometrist told her whomever had done the surgery had done a very good job, that he could barely see indications of the surgery when he had examined her eyes. I considered it myself, but couldn't bring myself to do it. I just "knew" I'd be the 1 in 10,000 who had a significantly bad outcome.

If you are considering having it done, first be sure you get a thorough and complete evaluation. Second, be sure the surgeon doing your procedure has literally done the procedure many thousands of times.
 



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26. Re: Out of the Blue Nov 15, 2019, 18:31 Hoop
 
Verno wrote on Nov 15, 2019, 17:54:
attempting to pull his helmet off.

I just hope this was all blurred out, someone think of the children.
 
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