Sweeney: Valve Matching Epic's Commission Would End EGS Exclusives

Epic Games has taken a lot of heat from some segments of the game community over deals to make games exclusive to the Epic Games Store. In this tweet, Epic Games CEO Tim Sweeney throws down the gauntlet on this, saying that if Steam permanently lowers its commission on sales to match Epic's 12% take, this would end their pursuit of exclusives, and would even lead to Epic Games being sold on Steam (thanks DSOGaming). Here's word:
If Steam committed to a permanent 88% revenue share for all developers and publishers without major strings attached, Epic would hastily organize a retreat from exclusives (while honoring our partner commitments) and consider putting our own games on Steam.

Such a move would be a glorious moment in the history of PC gaming, and would have a sweeping impact on other platforms for generations to come.

Then stores could go back to just being nice places to buy stuff, rather than the Game Developer IRS.
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1.
 
Re: Sweeney: Valve Matching Epic's Commission Would End EGS Exclusives
Apr 25, 2019, 10:11
Cutter
 
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Re: Sweeney: Valve Matching Epic's Commission Would End EGS Exclusives Apr 25, 2019, 10:11
Apr 25, 2019, 10:11
 Cutter
 
Well I'm sure this sort of spin will work well with the chimp level intelligence crowd but it falls flat for everyone else with half a brain. What on earth does anyone's cut have to do with engaging in anti-consumer practices? And he's paying - a lot of money - to do this at that, which raises his level of douchebaggery in this much higher.
"Hot air hangs like a dead man, from a white oak tree. People sitting on porches, thinking how things used to be. It's a dark night...dark night."
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2.
 
Re: Sweeney: Valve Matching Epic's Commission Would End EGS Exclusives
Apr 25, 2019, 10:15
PHJF
 
2.
Re: Sweeney: Valve Matching Epic's Commission Would End EGS Exclusives Apr 25, 2019, 10:15
Apr 25, 2019, 10:15
 PHJF
 
Sorry but you've already poisoned the water hole. PCs are all about being open; if you want exclusivity, take your shit back to Xbox along with that awful Gears of War game.
Steam + PSN: PHJF
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3.
 
Re: Sweeney: Valve Matching Epic's Commission Would End EGS Exclusives
Apr 25, 2019, 10:38
3.
Re: Sweeney: Valve Matching Epic's Commission Would End EGS Exclusives Apr 25, 2019, 10:38
Apr 25, 2019, 10:38
 
Sweeney studied Logic at tRump University.
A mask is an IQ test
"All of humanity's problems stem from man's inability to sit quietly in a room alone." Blaise Pascal
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4.
 
Re: Sweeney: Valve Matching Epic's Commission Would End EGS Exclusives
Apr 25, 2019, 10:38
4.
Re: Sweeney: Valve Matching Epic's Commission Would End EGS Exclusives Apr 25, 2019, 10:38
Apr 25, 2019, 10:38
 
Both the hostage taker and the negotiator!
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5.
 
Re: Sweeney: Valve Matching Epic's Commission Would End EGS Exclusives
Apr 25, 2019, 10:40
5.
Re: Sweeney: Valve Matching Epic's Commission Would End EGS Exclusives Apr 25, 2019, 10:40
Apr 25, 2019, 10:40
 
If the 12% is such a major sticking point.....why is Epic having to pay massive bounties to get their exclusives? If that is the determining factor, just offering it should net them all of the sales....

Or...Epic isn't seeing the return they expected on their paid bounties and are trying to change the narrative so that they don't have to continue shoveling money out of the vault.

Tim "friend of consumers, savior of publishers" Sweeney
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Re: Sweeney: Valve Matching Epic's Commission Would End EGS Exclusives
Apr 25, 2019, 10:46
6.
Re: Sweeney: Valve Matching Epic's Commission Would End EGS Exclusives Apr 25, 2019, 10:46
Apr 25, 2019, 10:46
 
There were some twitter threads by devs I was following with a fair amount of analysis on why Epic chose this percentage. People concluded that it's actually very close to the breakeven point and that Steam's margins are nowhere near what people think they are. Once you factor in third party keys, overhead and etc, Steam can't really operate at this margin in the long term. Neither can Epic by the way, it's ability to do so now is due to its lack of equivalent features resulting in lower overhead and its Fortnite warchest. Epic did a lot of market research and sales analysis before they started this, the whole SteamSpy thing was especially telling.

Anyways I think publishers will largely take Epic's free money and then continue to move more of their IP into their own little silos (uPlay, Origin, etc) anyway, I'm not sure this is going to keep panning out much longer. This sounds like Sweeney playing the PR game and trying to come across the good guy fighting for the little consumer or developer. I'm not really convinced based on what I've seen so far but ultimately I don't really care where I buy something, I just want competitive features and pricing.
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7.
 
Re: Sweeney: Valve Matching Epic's Commission Would End EGS Exclusives
Apr 25, 2019, 11:06
7.
Re: Sweeney: Valve Matching Epic's Commission Would End EGS Exclusives Apr 25, 2019, 11:06
Apr 25, 2019, 11:06
 
Kain wrote on Apr 25, 2019, 10:46:
There were some twitter threads by devs I was following with a fair amount of analysis on why Epic chose this percentage. People concluded that it's actually very close to the breakeven point and that Steam's margins are nowhere near what people think they are. Once you factor in third party keys, overhead and etc, Steam can't really operate at this margin in the long term.
Ah the twitter pro's, god love'em. Wink
This article says the exact opposite and that Steam take is already at ~20%.
"When the revenue Valve is missing from these Steam keys is taken out, the company's average cut across these popular games hovers around 20 percent of all sales revenue rather than 30 percent"

My guess is if your base rate is 20 or lower you could not run efficiently if you got no vig from 30% of the games you host for free.

i'm not a gambler so i probably did not use vig properly
A mask is an IQ test
"All of humanity's problems stem from man's inability to sit quietly in a room alone." Blaise Pascal
Avatar 58135
8.
 
Re: etc.
Apr 25, 2019, 11:12
8.
Re: etc. Apr 25, 2019, 11:12
Apr 25, 2019, 11:12
 
some organizations do the "Price Beat Guarantee" thing.
9.
 
Re: Sweeney: Valve Matching Epic's Commission Would End EGS Exclusives
Apr 25, 2019, 11:18
9.
Re: Sweeney: Valve Matching Epic's Commission Would End EGS Exclusives Apr 25, 2019, 11:18
Apr 25, 2019, 11:18
 
I surely hope Sweeney isn't doing all of this just to wrangle cheaper rates from Valve for pushing Epic software on Steam (after he decides to can the Epic Store, of course)...;) He seems to think that "customers" aren't involved here at all, only publishers and devs! Very odd.
It is well known universally that I do not make mistakes--so, if you should happen across an error in that which I have written, please be assured that *I* did not write it!...:)
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10.
 
Re: Sweeney: Valve Matching Epic's Commission Would End EGS Exclusives
Apr 25, 2019, 12:12
10.
Re: Sweeney: Valve Matching Epic's Commission Would End EGS Exclusives Apr 25, 2019, 12:12
Apr 25, 2019, 12:12
 
Game Developer IRS

yeah, screw these stores that provide services in exchange for a portion of our revenue!
11.
 
Re: Sweeney: Valve Matching Epic's Commission Would End EGS Exclusives
Apr 25, 2019, 12:14
11.
Re: Sweeney: Valve Matching Epic's Commission Would End EGS Exclusives Apr 25, 2019, 12:14
Apr 25, 2019, 12:14
 
RedEye9 wrote on Apr 25, 2019, 11:06:
This article says the exact opposite and that Steam take is already at ~20%.
"When the revenue Valve is missing from these Steam keys is taken out, the company's average cut across these popular games hovers around 20 percent of all sales revenue rather than 30 percent"

My guess is if your base rate is 20 or lower you could not run efficiently if you got no vig from 30% of the games you host for free.

i'm not a gambler so i probably did not use vig properly

The twitter threads were in response to that older article by Kyle. I will try to dig them up at lunch, it was a bunch of industry vets talking so I assume the "twitter pros" might know a thing or two that Kyle Orland did not. But I'm not vetting the facts so /shrug, just reading things over.

Regardless, I find it very difficult to believe Epic would actually follow through on this and it reads more like a continuation of the PR war than anything else.
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12.
 
Re: Sweeney: Valve Matching Epic's Commission Would End EGS Exclusives
Apr 25, 2019, 12:29
12.
Re: Sweeney: Valve Matching Epic's Commission Would End EGS Exclusives Apr 25, 2019, 12:29
Apr 25, 2019, 12:29
 
This hilarious. "We'll stop using shitty, anti-consumer business strategies if Valve reduces their cut to an arbitrary amount!" Okay, Tim. Epic are definitely not the bad guys here. I'm sure they'd remove the sole reason to use EGS if Steam complied with their demands.
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13.
 
Re: Sweeney: Valve Matching Epic's Commission Would End EGS Exclusives
Apr 25, 2019, 12:40
13.
Re: Sweeney: Valve Matching Epic's Commission Would End EGS Exclusives Apr 25, 2019, 12:40
Apr 25, 2019, 12:40
 
I've purchased games through Amazon and they give you an immediate download link and I can go back any time and download the game.

I wonder how these services compare to Amazon
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14.
 
Re: Sweeney: Valve Matching Epic's Commission Would End EGS Exclusives
Apr 25, 2019, 13:02
Darks
 
14.
Re: Sweeney: Valve Matching Epic's Commission Would End EGS Exclusives Apr 25, 2019, 13:02
Apr 25, 2019, 13:02
 Darks
 
Kain wrote on Apr 25, 2019, 10:46:
There were some twitter threads by devs I was following with a fair amount of analysis on why Epic chose this percentage. People concluded that it's actually very close to the breakeven point and that Steam's margins are nowhere near what people think they are. Once you factor in third party keys, overhead and etc, Steam can't really operate at this margin in the long term. Neither can Epic by the way, it's ability to do so now is due to its lack of equivalent features resulting in lower overhead and its Fortnite warchest. Epic did a lot of market research and sales analysis before they started this, the whole SteamSpy thing was especially telling.

Anyways I think publishers will largely take Epic's free money and then continue to move more of their IP into their own little silos (uPlay, Origin, etc) anyway, I'm not sure this is going to keep panning out much longer. This sounds like Sweeney playing the PR game and trying to come across the good guy fighting for the little consumer or developer. I'm not really convinced based on what I've seen so far but ultimately I don't really care where I buy something, I just want competitive features and pricing.

If this is true, I would say that Epic is walking a thin rope and if they are not careful they will fall off of it.

If it wasn't for Fortnight I dont think they would be offering up those bounties and luring publishers to them. As you say, I dont know how much longer they can keep this up. I think Tim Sweeney is not telling it like it really is.

Honestly, I wouldn't mind one bit seeing Tim Sweeney fall flat on his face.
Creator of the Neverwnter Nights Eye of the Beholder Series of Mods.

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15.
 
Re: Sweeney: Valve Matching Epic's Commission Would End EGS Exclusives
Apr 25, 2019, 13:15
Kxmode
 
15.
Re: Sweeney: Valve Matching Epic's Commission Would End EGS Exclusives Apr 25, 2019, 13:15
Apr 25, 2019, 13:15
 Kxmode
 

Valve: "We don't negotiate with Terrorists who hold video games hostage."
"Hard times create strong men. Strong men create good times. Good times create weak men. And, weak men create hard times." - Those Who Remain by G. Michael Hopf
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16.
 
Re: Sweeney: Valve Matching Epic's Commission Would End EGS Exclusives
Apr 25, 2019, 13:47
16.
Re: Sweeney: Valve Matching Epic's Commission Would End EGS Exclusives Apr 25, 2019, 13:47
Apr 25, 2019, 13:47
 
People sure do have short memories. Steam is anti-consumer, monopolistic trash. I'd be happy to see the platform die ASAP. They're solely responsible for the death of right of resale for PC games. How rich that people complain about exclusives, when Steam itself already has tons of exclusives.

It's a privacy nightmare with the ability to track everything you do. It forces updates both for its own client and applications more frequently and forcefully than Microsoft ever did. It's a resource hog even when doing nothing. It's also full of DRM.

I personally try to use GOG for as many purchases as possible.
17.
 
Re: Sweeney: Valve Matching Epic's Commission Would End EGS Exclusives
Apr 25, 2019, 13:49
17.
Re: Sweeney: Valve Matching Epic's Commission Would End EGS Exclusives Apr 25, 2019, 13:49
Apr 25, 2019, 13:49
 
Kxmode wrote on Apr 25, 2019, 13:15:
Valve: "We don't negotiate with Terrorists who hold video games hostage."

This made me laugh.

Also still waiting for this to be answered:

Tipsy McStagger wrote on Apr 23, 2019, 17:50:
someone has yet to explain how Epic Games Store being in competition with Steam is good for us.. the gamers.

Currently it does nothing good for me, zero benefit. Games will not be lower cost for the savings they are getting on the overhead.

Can someone please explain how this will change everything for us? So far all it's doing to me is making it so I really don't want to install a new games store to play exclusives.
Avatar 57660
18.
 
Re: Sweeney: Valve Matching Epic's Commission Would End EGS Exclusives
Apr 25, 2019, 13:57
Cutter
 
18.
Re: Sweeney: Valve Matching Epic's Commission Would End EGS Exclusives Apr 25, 2019, 13:57
Apr 25, 2019, 13:57
 Cutter
 
Bodolza wrote on Apr 25, 2019, 13:47:
People sure do have short memories. Steam is anti-consumer, monopolistic trash. I'd be happy to see the platform die ASAP. They're solely responsible for the death of right of resale for PC games. How rich that people complain about exclusives, when Steam itself already has tons of exclusives.

It's a privacy nightmare with the ability to track everything you do. It forces updates both for its own client and applications more frequently and forcefully than Microsoft ever did. It's a resource hog even when doing nothing. It's also full of DRM.

I personally try to use GOG for as many purchases as possible.

Really? And when has Steam ever prevented anyone else from entering the marketplace? And name one exclusive to Steam because I can't recall even one. DRM is the pub/devs choice. And they don't track everything you do beyond what pertains to the client and even then they ask permission for Steam surveys etc. Yes, GOG is the best way to go but most devs and pubs don't - showing thy want some sort of DRM in place. Steam is still a metric shit ton better than Epic for myriad reasons.

"Hot air hangs like a dead man, from a white oak tree. People sitting on porches, thinking how things used to be. It's a dark night...dark night."
Avatar 25394
19.
 
Re: Sweeney: Valve Matching Epic's Commission Would End EGS Exclusives
Apr 25, 2019, 13:59
19.
Re: Sweeney: Valve Matching Epic's Commission Would End EGS Exclusives Apr 25, 2019, 13:59
Apr 25, 2019, 13:59
 
Bodolza wrote on Apr 25, 2019, 13:47:
People sure do have short memories. Steam is anti-consumer, monopolistic trash. I'd be happy to see the platform die ASAP. They're solely responsible for the death of right of resale for PC games. How rich that people complain about exclusives, when Steam itself already has tons of exclusives.

It's a privacy nightmare with the ability to track everything you do. It forces updates both for its own client and applications more frequently and forcefully than Microsoft ever did. It's a resource hog even when doing nothing. It's also full of DRM.

I personally try to use GOG for as many purchases as possible.

I've had zero impact in my life based on all what you said. Steam user since 2004.

I remember waiting 2-3 hours outside stores for midnight to get a copy of a game that had a demo 2 weeks prior that I liked. Steam solved that.

Steam has integrated what Gamespy did to quake but with every co-op game. It's simple to track friends and join in. Which is awesome.

I've never cared to re-sell games because well.. I'm not poor enough to care or ever been impacted by DRM at all... I never traded nintendo/SNES games before hand anyways.. I still have them all.

It's tracking what exactly? that my steam name owns all this shit? So what? I don't post my life on steam.. i play games. If they want to know a guy with 6000$ in games library in age range X to X is playing 4-10 hours a week of these types of games it makes NO difference to me.

There's nothing anti-consumer about it.. Getting 62 mb/sec download rates on games I want that are 40 gigs and playing them within 30 minutes of wanting is awesome.

You act like a crazy person.. do you wear tinfoil hats? Are the chem trails getting you? Vaccinations causing autism?

Your family get killed by steam developers and now you're extracting your vengence?

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20.
 
Re: Sweeney: Valve Matching Epic's Commission Would End EGS Exclusives
Apr 25, 2019, 14:01
20.
Re: Sweeney: Valve Matching Epic's Commission Would End EGS Exclusives Apr 25, 2019, 14:01
Apr 25, 2019, 14:01
 
I would love to hear some of the conversations this guy is a part of, with this whole controversy (Sweeney). Especially if the sales on EGS are hurting.

Steam is definitely not perfect, but it's done a hell of a lot more than Epic has, for gamers. EGS pays for exclusivity and we get absolutely nothing good out of it, like Tipsy McStagger says.
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