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21. Re: Apple's falling behind Google and Amazon in the smart home race. Nov 5, 2018, 21:42 Mr. Tact
 
Beamer wrote on Nov 5, 2018, 19:39:
"the majority of people are ALREADY in on this, and claiming it will go nowhere is a statement that will age poorly."
I wouldn't claim it will go nowhere, I would claim the usefulness is far more limited than you seem to think. And just because a majority of people do anything is not a valid endorsement. As I said, it will get there eventually...
 
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20. Re: Apple's falling behind Google and Amazon in the smart home race. Nov 5, 2018, 19:39 Beamer
 
Burrito of Peace wrote on Nov 5, 2018, 17:33:
Beamer wrote on Nov 5, 2018, 09:21:
Mass word spew poorly justifying blind consumerism with zero regard to personal data safety here.

Of course I'm an outlier. I'm not an idiot. I don't blindly trust companies and shiny new baubles don't tempt me because I'm not a fucking ferret.

Do I pride myself on not making myself a target for network breaches and data theft? No, but then again I'm at least aware of the possibility of both events and take steps to mitigate them as much as possible.

You keep going on about that Alexa hack I provided (which you asked for) and try to excuse it as "well people have to download an app". No fucking shit, sherlock. Yet people download shitty, malware laden apps from the Apple store and the Google Play store all the fucking time. Daily, in point of fact. Are you going to ask for examples of that, too, or can you handle a few searches on DuckDuckGo?

I know I'm being a bit antagonistic here but your entire response is "SHINY NEW BAUBLES! SHINY NEW BAUBLES! ALL THE FERRETS ARE PLAYING WITH SHINY NEW BAUBLES! SECURITY ISN'T IMPORTANT! ONLY SHINY NEW BAUBLES ARE IMPORTANT!"

You are touting home automation like it's some giant fucking revolutionary thing and it isn't. Home automation has been around since the goddamned 50s in one form or another. My grandmother had a kitchen in the 60s that would cook a meal, plate it, and autoload the pots and pans in to a dishwasher. It had rotary switches that were basically gates for wait states so you could add the dishes if you wanted to as well. That was, what, 50 years ago? My grandfather had lights that used light sensors to raise and lower the wattage of the lights in their sun room based upon the time of day. Also entirely programmable with rotary dials and simple analog logic. He could read, smoke, and chill out with just enough light to read the paper without waking my grandmother. Again, this is not new technology in any way, shape, or form.

I, too, can direct networked audio from any room in my house to any audio output capable device. Am I supposed to be impressed by that? I've been able to do that for years now. Moreover, I never have to connect to the outside world to get any of that audio which is 67.4TB in size as of right now. I literally have more audio than I can ever listen to in whatever remains in the rest of my lifetime. That's not a feature.

As more shitty IoT devices get connected to even more shitily configured home networks, you'll seen an uptick in personal data theft, device hijacking, and more malicious activity. I really hope the shiny baubles are so important that people can stomach that. Especially when their credit score gets trashed and it takes them 3-5-7 years to recover from it. Also especially when there's zero possibility of remuneration or responsibility on the part of the people shoveling out IoT devices.

So please, keep pushing the "wonders" of security hole ridden devices with no concept or care for personal safety while breathlessly touting it as the "next big thing". When you get owned, not if but when, you'll have no one to blame but yourself.

Wow, you're angry.

The initial comment was that this isn't a race worth businesses competing in. I said it was. For all of your comments, none of it says this is a bad thing for businesses to be in. You're fear-mongering, and having a very closed mind, but even in the worst case none of this says that it's bad for corporations to be chasing this.

My point was never "hey, BoP needs to get in on this!" but "the majority of people are ALREADY in on this, and claiming it will go nowhere is a statement that will age poorly."

Sorry, we're seeing home automation explode like never before. And it's going to continue. Smart companies are doing this now, in ecosystems unlike anything from the "goddamn 50s." More importantly, again, this is the fastest adoption of any technical product of the last 100 years. Nothing from the 50s had the penetration smart devices do now. Hell, more people have an Alexa or Google Home than had TVs in the 50s.
 
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19. Re: Apple's falling behind Google and Amazon in the smart home race. Nov 5, 2018, 17:33 Burrito of Peace
 
Beamer wrote on Nov 5, 2018, 09:21:
Mass word spew poorly justifying blind consumerism with zero regard to personal data safety here.

Of course I'm an outlier. I'm not an idiot. I don't blindly trust companies and shiny new baubles don't tempt me because I'm not a fucking ferret.

Do I pride myself on not making myself a target for network breaches and data theft? No, but then again I'm at least aware of the possibility of both events and take steps to mitigate them as much as possible.

You keep going on about that Alexa hack I provided (which you asked for) and try to excuse it as "well people have to download an app". No fucking shit, sherlock. Yet people download shitty, malware laden apps from the Apple store and the Google Play store all the fucking time. Daily, in point of fact. Are you going to ask for examples of that, too, or can you handle a few searches on DuckDuckGo?

I know I'm being a bit antagonistic here but your entire response is "SHINY NEW BAUBLES! SHINY NEW BAUBLES! ALL THE FERRETS ARE PLAYING WITH SHINY NEW BAUBLES! SECURITY ISN'T IMPORTANT! ONLY SHINY NEW BAUBLES ARE IMPORTANT!"

You are touting home automation like it's some giant fucking revolutionary thing and it isn't. Home automation has been around since the goddamned 50s in one form or another. My grandmother had a kitchen in the 60s that would cook a meal, plate it, and autoload the pots and pans in to a dishwasher. It had rotary switches that were basically gates for wait states so you could add the dishes if you wanted to as well. That was, what, 50 years ago? My grandfather had lights that used light sensors to raise and lower the wattage of the lights in their sun room based upon the time of day. Also entirely programmable with rotary dials and simple analog logic. He could read, smoke, and chill out with just enough light to read the paper without waking my grandmother. Again, this is not new technology in any way, shape, or form.

I, too, can direct networked audio from any room in my house to any audio output capable device. Am I supposed to be impressed by that? I've been able to do that for years now. Moreover, I never have to connect to the outside world to get any of that audio which is 67.4TB in size as of right now. I literally have more audio than I can ever listen to in whatever remains in the rest of my lifetime. That's not a feature.

As more shitty IoT devices get connected to even more shitily configured home networks, you'll seen an uptick in personal data theft, device hijacking, and more malicious activity. I really hope the shiny baubles are so important that people can stomach that. Especially when their credit score gets trashed and it takes them 3-5-7 years to recover from it. Also especially when there's zero possibility of remuneration or responsibility on the part of the people shoveling out IoT devices.

So please, keep pushing the "wonders" of security hole ridden devices with no concept or care for personal safety while breathlessly touting it as the "next big thing". When you get owned, not if but when, you'll have no one to blame but yourself.
 
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18. Re: Morning Metaverse Nov 5, 2018, 10:13 Beamer
 
I still can't understand why people found programming a VCR difficult. Hit "menu," then enter the "time to start recording" and "time to stop recording." Why was this so difficult that sitcoms and movies frequently made jokes about it?  
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17. Re: Morning Metaverse Nov 5, 2018, 10:09 Mr. Tact
 
Yes, I realize I'm in the minority. Hell, I made my living on computers and I've never logged onto Facebook, that alone puts me in a very small minority. I certainly never had a problem programming a VCR. None of the things you said you can do with smart technology holds any interest for me. I simply don't find it necessary or even useful to "play basically any song every written, ever, in any room of my home from anywhere".

This technology will be useful to me eventually, maybe. Although it might take longer to reach that point than I'll live...
 
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16. Re: Apple's falling behind Google and Amazon in the smart home race. Nov 5, 2018, 09:21 Beamer
 
You guys realize you're the minority, right?

I feel like BluesNews does this a decent amount. Does things the masses wouldn't and prides themselves upon it, but when they read a story about what the masses may do, thinks it will be a failure because they personally wouldn't. You can't pride yourself upon being different then use yourself as a measuring stick for the masses.

Right now, voice devices have the fastest adoption rate of any comparable tech product. They reached more homes and users faster than radio, faster than TV, faster than telephones, faster than cellphones, and faster than smartphones. The adoption rate is through the roof. You may not be part of it, but right now, you're in the minority.

And yes, there was that one instance of an Alexa breach. It required the user downloading an app, which is a huge step. And it recorded voice, but also made it clear there was an issue with the Alexa device that any user would notice. And it didn't give passwords, or anything most users have to worry about. It was very specific.

Otherwise, most breaches have been from shitty things, like shitty locks and shitty toys. Things from companies that aren't traditionally digital - much like how most shitty locks, physically, come from companies not traditionally physical. Personally, I would never get a lock right now, but 5 years from now? Seems foolish to think things wouldn't improve. Perhaps not to the standard of a guy who actually writes and reads code for his own router, but that's what, under 1,000 people in the entire country? If not under 200?

Right now, I can play basically any song every written, ever, in any room of my home from anywhere. I can dial it up on my phone or my desktop and send it to the much better home theater system in my room, or if I'm laying in bed falling asleep and want to hear a song stuck in my head, I can cue it up by voice without having to move or see any bright lights (also useful if you and the girlfriend are debating something a simple Google search would solve, but no one wants to reach the lights.) The lighting in my hallway, dark most mornings, will light itself very immeasurably prior to my waking up, useful since the lightswitch is on the opposite side from my bedroom. In case I forget to turn it off, it will receive a signal to turn off as soon as my phone disconnects from my wifi. Our bedroom has 4 lights, with only one switch, controlling the harsh overhead. The much warmer tone reading lights are a bitch to reach from the bed, and basically wake you up reaching for them. Voice now controls them. For the ambient lights, which my girlfriend prefers right before going to sleep, it's in a smart outlet, and on a timer.

My parents mostly have the same thing. For the lamps that are harder for their retired selves to reach, they're voice controlled, but also on timers. The TV, in particular, is great for them. They're from the generation that found VCRs hard to program (how was that a thing?!), so even changing inputs is beyond them. They also struggle to hear dialogue, partially an issue of modern TVs having no room for decent sound, so I bought them a sound bar, but that requires multiple remotes and they just end up using the TV volume as the soundbar remains off. Now they can just say "Alexa, turn on the TV" or "Alexa, turn on Netflix" or "Alexa, change the channel to CNN" and it all just works. Even better, the interface of the Fire Stick is terrible and confusing for them, so now it's just "Alexa, put on Jack Ryan" and they're good to go.

You may not have uses, but you're an outlier. And we're pretty much in Year 3 of this. What will happen for Year 6, or Year 10? Security will get better, automation will get smarter, abilities will grow. You may never find a need, but that's you, and you have to acknowledge that you're a power user and not the masses, right?
 
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15. Re: Morning Metaverse Nov 5, 2018, 08:49 Mr. Tact
 
I gotta go with BoP on this one. The closest thing to a smart device in my house is a programmable thermostat for the furnace/AC. I have never seen any advertised "advantage" of smart devices for the home which I thought would be useful to me.
 
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14. Re: Apple's falling behind Google and Amazon in the smart home race. Nov 4, 2018, 13:21 Burrito of Peace
 
RedEye9 wrote on Nov 4, 2018, 12:14:
The main takeaway I gather is that Joe Napalm needs to level up (which ain't happening) AND Manufacturers need to step up and shoulder the security burden (which I wholeheartedly agree)

Any device that connects to the "net" should have to have security built in and be tested and certified (similar to UL https://www.ul.com ) before it is allowed to send its first packet.

Thanks for the info and knowledge sharing.

I'd love to a see a security certification happen that wasn't voluntary or manufacturer owned.

Sorry about the dive in to IoT security. It's part of what I do so that has become second nature to me. Mrs. Burrito will often stop me, smile, and just say "Common English, please."

You're quite welcome. Always happy to share what I know, as little as that may be.
 
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13. Re: Apple's falling behind Google and Amazon in the smart home race. Nov 4, 2018, 12:14 RedEye9
 
Burrito of Peace wrote on Nov 4, 2018, 10:21:
RedEye9 wrote on Nov 4, 2018, 09:34:
So what, in your realm of knowledge, is gonna fix these issues. Few have the know how, money and time to buy or build/setup a pfsense router. But everyone loves gadgets (Hey Alexa, what's the weather in Barbados?)

It has to be a threefold effort to bring up network security in the average home:

1. Users have to educate themselves with hacking, identity theft, and device hijacking on an ever rising curve. However, I am going to insist that they at least learn the basics of how their firewall operates, how their network operates, and how to secure the devices they purchase. Use DuckDuckGo to find information, join Facebook groups ... If people can't make the time and educate themselves on how to protect that data, then I really don't have a lot of sympathy for them. However, I do have sympathy when their data is stolen because of the stupidity of corporations, banks, and other allegedly "professional" organizations.
Your average home user will never do any of the above, plug-n-pray is the way it is.
Most small businesses don't fair any better, but at least they might outsource security.
2. Router manufacturers need to up their security game in a massive way.
Agreed, the current state of affairs is a hot mess.
3. IoT devices need to get much more secure. It amazes me how many of them have non-sandboxed, non-restricted write capabilities. If I can write to a device, I can own a device. The reality is that deny-all read-only needs to be the default state on such devices. Moreover, should you wish to have data write capability in the device itself, then that must be segregated from the network capabilities and the only writable user object needs to be internal to the device itself. That user object should not have any access to the networking capabilities of the device. Zero. None. For a updates, a second user object must only accept publicly signed, encrypted, and hashed packages from the device manufacturer itself. No side loading, no third party apps or repos. Ideally, that communication will be done over a VPN with a 64, or greater, character password which uses two factor authentication to try and mitigate package tampering. You'd think this sounds complicated but it isn't. This is something I can do today with an old $5 Pi Nano.
And this is where my eyes roll back in their sockets and drool comes out of both sides of my mouth in equal amounts if I'm sitting level.

The main takeaway I gather is that Joe Napalm needs to level up (which ain't happening) AND Manufacturers need to step up and shoulder the security burden (which I wholeheartedly agree)

Any device that connects to the "net" should have to have security built in and be tested and certified (similar to UL https://www.ul.com ) before it is allowed to send its first packet.

Thanks for the info and knowledge sharing.

This comment was edited on Nov 4, 2018, 12:29.
 
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12. Re: Apple's falling behind Google and Amazon in the smart home race. Nov 4, 2018, 10:21 Burrito of Peace
 
RedEye9 wrote on Nov 4, 2018, 09:34:
So what, in your realm of knowledge, is gonna fix these issues. Few have the know how, money and time to buy or build/setup a pfsense router. But everyone loves gadgets (Hey Alexa, what's the weather in Barbados?)

It has to be a threefold effort to bring up network security in the average home:

1. Users have to educate themselves with hacking, identity theft, and device hijacking on an ever rising curve. It is not enough to simply plug themselves into a network, close their eyes, and hope the magic packet fairies keep them safe. People lock their doors and windows at night, right? Why should your devices be any different? I'm not going to advocate that Joe Walmart learn how to install, config, and administer a pfsense device. That's Dunning-Krueger hitting me square in the face. However, I am going to insist that they at least learn the basics of how their firewall operates, how their network operates, and how to secure the devices they purchase. Use DuckDuckGo to find information, join Facebook groups that often help guide new and/or inexperienced users on how to secure their devices (they exist, I'm in three of them), or they could actually RTFM. Your data is the most precious commodity you have in the modern era. If people can't make the time and educate themselves on how to protect that data, then I really don't have a lot of sympathy for them. However, I do have sympathy when their data is stolen because of the stupidity of corporations, banks, and other allegedly "professional" organizations.

2. Router manufacturers need to up their security game in a massive way. Pretty much every major home router manufacturer you can mention has pitiably weak security for either the admin panel and for the devices themselves. They need to settle around a common core OS for their devices so that security is the first consideration, not the last, and security updates must be guaranteed for a minimum of three years. Since most home users are ignorant, those updates have to be automatic because you can't trust the average user to go find security updates let alone read up on vulnerabilities and exploits. Even if someone wanted to argue the cost argument about users not buying a device if it is over $X, that is easily countered with "if you use a common core for all your devices, then your base development is already done and you can then focus on 'features' to differentiate your products from those of your competitors."

3. IoT devices need to get much more secure. It amazes me how many of them have non-sandboxed, non-restricted write capabilities. If I can write to a device, I can own a device. The reality is that deny-all read-only needs to be the default state on such devices. Moreover, should you wish to have data write capability in the device itself, then that must be segregated from the network capabilities and the only writable user object needs to be internal to the device itself. That user object should not have any access to the networking capabilities of the device. Zero. None. For a updates, a second user object must only accept publicly signed, encrypted, and hashed packages from the device manufacturer itself. No side loading, no third party apps or repos. Ideally, that communication will be done over a VPN with a 64, or greater, character password which uses two factor authentication to try and mitigate package tampering. You'd think this sounds complicated but it isn't. This is something I can do today with an old $5 Pi Nano.

Beamer wrote on Nov 4, 2018, 09:37:
That's not a real Alexa hack. It doesn't operate without notifications. And it's useless.

But that's not what you said. You said:

Beamer wrote on Nov 3, 2018, 17:29:
Show me a single hacking of a Hue, a Sonos, or an Alexa.

I did. You asked for "a single hacking". You did not specify the nature of the hack. Nevertheless, even a cosmetic, trivial hack shows that the device is capable of being compromised. That you are trying to move the goal posts after the fact is irrelevant.
 
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11. Re: Apple's falling behind Google and Amazon in the smart home race. Nov 4, 2018, 09:37 Beamer
 
That's not a real Alexa hack. It doesn't operate without notifications. And it's useless.  
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10. Re: Apple's falling behind Google and Amazon in the smart home race. Nov 4, 2018, 09:34 RedEye9
 
Burrito of Peace wrote on Nov 3, 2018, 23:09:
Beamer wrote on Nov 3, 2018, 17:29:
If you buy shit you get shit. Show me a single hacking of a Hue, a Sonos, or an Alexa.
Buy quality and you get quality. Why trust your router more than an equally solid devices company?

OK.

Alexa hacked.

Sonos hacked with badly configured user network. Which is the norm for the average user, not an outlier.

Hue hacked.

Why trust my router? Easy, because I built it. I can audit every single line of code in it if I wished and there are zero configuration options hidden from me. Can you say the same thing about allegedly "equally solid devices"? No, you can't. Therefore, you can not honestly trust them to be as secure.

I repeat, IoT devices consistently rank as the least secure devices on any network, regardless of manufacturer. Every. Single. Audit. They're shit.
Well you made that look easy.

Uber cheap home routers that never get updates and/or are never updated, plus IoT devices and unpatched/hacked computers are responsible for thousands of DoS attacks everyday.

So what, in your realm of knowledge, is gonna fix these issues.
Few have the know how, money and time to buy or build/setup a pfsense router. But everyone loves gadgets (Hey Alexa, what's the weather in Barbados?)

 
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9. Re: Apple's falling behind Google and Amazon in the smart home race. Nov 3, 2018, 23:09 Burrito of Peace
 
Beamer wrote on Nov 3, 2018, 17:29:
If you buy shit you get shit. Show me a single hacking of a Hue, a Sonos, or an Alexa.

Buy quality and you get quality. Why trust your router more than an equally solid devices company?

OK.

Alexa hacked.

Sonos hacked with badly configured user network. Which is the norm for the average user, not an outlier.

Hue hacked.

Why trust my router? Easy, because I built it. I can audit every single line of code in it if I wished and there are zero configuration options hidden from me. Can you say the same thing about allegedly "equally solid devices"? No, you can't. Therefore, you can not honestly trust them to be as secure.

I repeat, IoT devices consistently rank as the least secure devices on any network, regardless of manufacturer. Every. Single. Audit. They're shit.
 
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8. Re: Apple's falling behind Google and Amazon in the smart home race. Nov 3, 2018, 17:29 Beamer
 
If you buy shit you get shit. Show me a single hacking of a Hue, a Sonos, or an Alexa.

Buy quality and you get quality. Why trust your router more than an equally solid devices company?
 
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7. Re: Apple's falling behind Google and Amazon in the smart home race. Nov 3, 2018, 15:32 Burrito of Peace
 
Beamer wrote on Nov 3, 2018, 10:36:
Do you have any smart devices?

Negative. They are all network security nightmares with IoT devices always being ranked the least secure network devices to be interconnected to or with. Only an idiot would connect them to his or her home network behind some craptastic home grade router and let them talk to the world at large.

Beamer wrote on Nov 3, 2018, 10:36:
With a voice device, a Hue light system (or even cheaper one), a Sonos and a smart outlet or two, combined with IFTT, you can automate a huge amount. You can also just simplify nearly anything. And this doesn't include things like smart thermostats or doors or whatever. It all just adds a huge level of convenience. Yes, I know, with the lights, people always say "are you too lazy to use a light switch," as if every outlet has a light switch.

I'm sure that's all neat on paper and you sound super enthused about it but, from my perspective, all I see is how many devices will be hacked with trivial effort. Smart locks? Enjoy paying cryptoware prices just so you can get in your own home when they're compromised and someone else controls them. Oh, you don't want some bored Chinese, Brazilian, or Russian teenager turning your lights off and on in seizure inducing rapid succession in the middle of the night? Better get used to that light switch. All I see is the huge, flashing, electric red flags that tell me just how many ways those can all be compromised and how little the average user knows on how to prevent that.

Beamer wrote on Nov 3, 2018, 10:36:
I don't believe in the stats that claim that by 202X over half of searches or purchases will be made by voice. But we're basically in year 3 for this stuff, and the ecosystem has exploded. Still its infancy and already solving problems.

You're way, way more optimistic than I am about this, obviously. Yes, the ecosystem has exploded and it is "solving problems" that were never problems in the first place. However, what it is exponentially doing is creating problems. I'm not sure if you regularly read The Register, AnandTech, Ars Technica, and other sites like them but you can't go a week without reading about not just one product, not just a product series, but a whole company's IoT portfolio having about as much security as a wet piece of rice paper. That is far more of a problem than magic hand waving and saying "B..b..but SMART DEVICE". I, and other professionals like me, don't give a flying fuck if the latest $5000 "smart" device knows to wipe my ass while ordering me new toilet paper if there is zero internal security inherent within the device itself. Relying on a user to have a functioning, aggressive, and well configured firewall is not just stupid, it's criminally negligent. Users are fucking idiots. Most of them don't even change the default username and password on their $99 Linksys wireless router and yet because it has "firewall" on the box, they think they are safe.

That's why I disbelieve that "smart homes" are just around the corner. The legal liability for developers who sell them is astronomical. Imagine a whole subdivision being locked out of their homes because the realtor facilitating the sale of these homes forgot to mention that people should change their default passwords from 1234. Or even if they did but the security wrapped around the entire automation is anything less than AES-512-GCM for encryption with SHA2-512/256 PFS using 3072-bit Diffie-Hellman key.

Once you figure out the security problems, you might see mass adoption. But all it takes is one nationally televised and reported nightmare scenario and people will run away in droves because they already inherently distrust having their home automated.
 
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6. Re: Apple's falling behind Google and Amazon in the smart home race. Nov 3, 2018, 10:36 Beamer
 
Burrito of Peace wrote on Nov 2, 2018, 21:01:
Beamer wrote on Nov 2, 2018, 13:28:
Smart homes are going to be the biggest growth area of the 2020s.

Maybe. I have heard this claim since the 80s though they were then called "the automated home". In the 80s, it was going to be the 90s. In the 90s, it was going to be the early 2000s. In the early 2000s, it was 2010. Now it's 2020s. In 2025, it'll be the 2030s.

"Smart Homes" are a lot like flying cars. Lots of promises being made, lots of tech demos being shown off, and there are, what, maybe a handful of either things that have fully complete prototypes. When I see a subdivision show up with 100 homes that are all "smart homes" and fully integrated and automated, I'll believe it has arrived.

Do you have any smart devices? With a voice device, a Hue light system (or even cheaper one), a Sonos and a smart outlet or two, combined with IFTT, you can automate a huge amount. You can also just simplify nearly anything. And this doesn't include things like smart thermostats or doors or whatever. It all just adds a huge level of convenience. Yes, I know, with the lights, people always say "are you too lazy to use a light switch," as if every outlet has a light switch.

I don't believe in the stats that claim that by 202X over half of searches or purchases will be made by voice. But we're basically in year 3 for this stuff, and the ecosystem has exploded. Still its infancy and already solving problems.
 
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5. Re: Apple's falling behind Google and Amazon in the smart home race. Nov 2, 2018, 21:01 Burrito of Peace
 
Beamer wrote on Nov 2, 2018, 13:28:
Smart homes are going to be the biggest growth area of the 2020s.

Maybe. I have heard this claim since the 80s though they were then called "the automated home". In the 80s, it was going to be the 90s. In the 90s, it was going to be the early 2000s. In the early 2000s, it was 2010. Now it's 2020s. In 2025, it'll be the 2030s.

"Smart Homes" are a lot like flying cars. Lots of promises being made, lots of tech demos being shown off, and there are, what, maybe a handful of either things that have fully complete prototypes. When I see a subdivision show up with 100 homes that are all "smart homes" and fully integrated and automated, I'll believe it has arrived.
 
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4. Re: Apple's falling behind Google and Amazon in the smart home race. Nov 2, 2018, 13:28 Beamer
 
Porn-O-Matic wrote on Nov 2, 2018, 13:26:
As if that was a race worth competing in to begin with...

This comment will age like the infamous (and incorrect) 128k of RAM comment.

Smart homes are going to be the biggest growth area of the 2020s.
 
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3. Re: Apple's falling behind Google and Amazon in the smart home race. Nov 2, 2018, 13:26 Porn-O-Matic
 
As if that was a race worth competing in to begin with...  
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2. Re: Morning Metaverse Nov 2, 2018, 12:46 Prez
 
Showtime's 'Halo' Series to Star Master Chief

This had to be confirmed? That's like confirming that Gandalf or Frodo will be in the Lord of the Rings adaptation.

Okay so yeah, Halo isn't quite on par with a literary classic like LOTR, but you get what I mean, right?
 
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“The greatness of a nation and its moral progress can be judged by the way its animals are treated.”
- Mahatma Gandhi
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