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Monster Hunter World PC Performance Explained

The Windows edition of Monster Hunter World will require a beefy PC to run at high resolutions, as noted in a According to a recent story reporting that a GTX 1080 graphics card could not achieve 60 fps at 1440p when running with all the settings maxed out. A post on ResetEra helps explain why (thanks VG247). Capcom's William Yagi-Bacon explains that the game preloads an entire level before playing to avoid intermittent loading, putting a heavy background load on the CPU:

To eliminate interstitial loading during active gameplay, MHW loads the entire level into memory. In addition to managing assets loaded into memory, it keeps track of monster interactions, health status, environment/object changes, manages LOD & object culling, calculates collision detection and physics simulation, and tons of other background telemetry stuff that you don't see yet requires CPU cycle. This is in addition to supporting any GPU rendering tasks.

While the MT Framework engine has been around for ages, it does a good job in distributing CPU cycles and load-balancing tasks across all available cores and threads. The engine itself is optimized for x86 CPU instruction set, is highly scalable, and loosely speaking, is platform agnostic regardless of PC or console platform so as long as it conforms to the x86 instruction set.

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30. Re: Monster Hunter World PC Performance Explained Jul 31, 2018, 01:25 Red886
 
well, you don't ever expect japanese devs to say sorry for shoddy ports, or even admit performance is unusually bad .... so this response is for par for norm

the mindset is that they are doing a service for pc gamers by releasing it on the pc. An even more damaging viewpoint than doing it for higher profits.
 
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29. Re: Monster Hunter World PC Performance Explained Jul 31, 2018, 01:21 HorrorScope
 
Jerykk wrote on Jul 30, 2018, 23:02:
So basically, the CPU is handling the same stuff it handles in every game. Surprisingly, they forgot to mention AI, though maybe that's covered by "monster interactions." "Health status" is a pretty odd one to mention, though. Tracking the health of entities isn't expensive at all. You're basically just checking a variable. In most cases, you don't even need to update it every tick. You just update it when it changes.

Right monster healths are a variable/db entry that the system could handle 10's of thousands with ease, that's what a cpu eats for breakfast. Who knows what these guys are going on about. The best explanation, if they are even being honest with us is, the whole level is loaded and they are tracking/rendering the whole map needlessly.
 
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28. Re: Monster Hunter World PC Performance Explained Jul 31, 2018, 01:16 HorrorScope
 
jacobvandy wrote on Jul 30, 2018, 23:54:
HorrorScope wrote on Jul 30, 2018, 22:27:
jacobvandy wrote on Jul 30, 2018, 20:14:
The CPU is never completely dedicated to whatever game you're playing, that's just not how it works. You have dozens of other processes running in the background even on a barebones configuration, even on consoles. If you put 100% CPU into a handful of game processes, forsaking all the others.. That's how you get a BSOD. It's never supposed to happen,

Ah what are you talking about? You can max the CPU without zero crashes, the stuff it needs to run still runs. How can I test this crazy idea out like right now? Stress Test Benches. I can peg my cpu 100% for as long as I want, I do this periodically to make sure my cooling system is working within reason. Maxing a cpu is game and o/s resources combined.

You misunderstand. I didn't say CPUs can't run at 100%, I said games never use 100% on their own. For your stress test to maybe kinda simulate that, try setting its process to realtime priority and everything else to low priority. I don't think Windows would like it very much.

Right, the net effect though is 100% usage, game taking 95 lets say and the o/s it's 5%. We've all have to be newbs not to get that, I like to think it goes without saying, not even consoles do that.
 
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27. Re: Monster Hunter World PC Performance Explained Jul 30, 2018, 23:54 jacobvandy
 
HorrorScope wrote on Jul 30, 2018, 22:27:
jacobvandy wrote on Jul 30, 2018, 20:14:
The CPU is never completely dedicated to whatever game you're playing, that's just not how it works. You have dozens of other processes running in the background even on a barebones configuration, even on consoles. If you put 100% CPU into a handful of game processes, forsaking all the others.. That's how you get a BSOD. It's never supposed to happen,

Ah what are you talking about? You can max the CPU without zero crashes, the stuff it needs to run still runs. How can I test this crazy idea out like right now? Stress Test Benches. I can peg my cpu 100% for as long as I want, I do this periodically to make sure my cooling system is working within reason. Maxing a cpu is game and o/s resources combined.

You misunderstand. I didn't say CPUs can't run at 100%, I said games never use 100% on their own. For your stress test to maybe kinda simulate that, try setting its process to realtime priority and everything else to low priority. I don't think Windows would like it very much.
 
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26. Re: Monster Hunter World PC Performance Explained Jul 30, 2018, 23:02 Jerykk
 
So basically, the CPU is handling the same stuff it handles in every game. Surprisingly, they forgot to mention AI, though maybe that's covered by "monster interactions." "Health status" is a pretty odd one to mention, though. Tracking the health of entities isn't expensive at all. You're basically just checking a variable. In most cases, you don't even need to update it every tick. You just update it when it changes.  
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25. Re: Monster Hunter World PC Performance Explained Jul 30, 2018, 22:27 HorrorScope
 
jacobvandy wrote on Jul 30, 2018, 20:14:
HorrorScope wrote on Jul 30, 2018, 19:29:
It's not a bad theory, but from what I've heard in this game it is maxing out the GPU's and the CPU's are are at a 1/3's usage, not cpu bound, the opposite of what you write in this case.

The CPU is never completely dedicated to whatever game you're playing, that's just not how it works. You have dozens of other processes running in the background even on a barebones configuration, even on consoles. If you put 100% CPU into a handful of game processes, forsaking all the others.. That's how you get a BSOD. It's never supposed to happen,

Ah what are you talking about? You can max the CPU without zero crashes, the stuff it needs to run still runs. How can I test this crazy idea out like right now? Stress Test Benches. I can peg my cpu 100% for as long as I want, I do this periodically to make sure my cooling system is working within reason. Maxing a cpu is game and o/s resources combined.

From what I read this so far looks to be a gpu bound game and there are games that can be one or the other, typically gpu bound is more predominant, thus people recommend a better GPU than CPU if one has to choose.

You're ideas aren't all that far off though, but it isn't as black and white as you state.
 
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24. Re: Monster Hunter World PC Performance Explained Jul 30, 2018, 21:56 jdreyer
 
jacobvandy wrote on Jul 30, 2018, 20:14:
HorrorScope wrote on Jul 30, 2018, 19:29:
It's not a bad theory, but from what I've heard in this game it is maxing out the GPU's and the CPU's are are at a 1/3's usage, not cpu bound, the opposite of what you write in this case.

The CPU is never completely dedicated to whatever game you're playing, that's just not how it works. You have dozens of other processes running in the background even on a barebones configuration, even on consoles. If you put 100% CPU into a handful of game processes, forsaking all the others.. That's how you get a BSOD. It's never supposed to happen, unlike with the GPU where all it does is accelerate graphics and will sit around doing next to nothing otherwise. You might get a portion of CPU cores/threads running full tilt, but that will still only look like partial utilization from the overall "CPU usage" meter.

Civilization doesn't 100% a CPU, either, yet you will see large gains in how long it takes to crunch the AI turns with a faster CPU compared to a slower one. In Grand Theft Auto IV or V, you see a direct FPS increase because of all the underlying physics, AI, and resource streaming. Same with Bethesda games, and the way they load and unload cells full of objects and actors within a radius of the player. Especially since the only way to truly increase the draw distance in Skyrim or FO4 is to increase that radius, which means exponentially larger portions of the game world being actively simulated. People do it because they want to see more detail off in the distance, but don't realize that their performance is tanking because of their CPU/RAM, not their GPU (or "poor optimization," as is blamed when they have a 1080). All of these games will max out your GPU, but not the CPU... Yet they still perform better with a better CPU.

Edit to add: I noticed the article linked here says "[He] used an Intel i7-4790K with 16GB of RAM so obviously he was not CPU limited." That's exactly what I'm talking about -- even the journalists who write about this sort of thing regularly are still stuck in that mindset that games do not ever and could never conceivably use a lot of CPU power.
There was an article Blue posted a few days ago comparing the first Intel six core proc from nine years ago with the current Intel proc. There was a strong effect on FPS, although less than what you would see from a GPU of that era vs a modern one.
 
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23. Re: Monster Hunter World PC Performance Explained Jul 30, 2018, 20:14 jacobvandy
 
HorrorScope wrote on Jul 30, 2018, 19:29:
It's not a bad theory, but from what I've heard in this game it is maxing out the GPU's and the CPU's are are at a 1/3's usage, not cpu bound, the opposite of what you write in this case.

The CPU is never completely dedicated to whatever game you're playing, that's just not how it works. You have dozens of other processes running in the background even on a barebones configuration, even on consoles. If you put 100% CPU into a handful of game processes, forsaking all the others.. That's how you get a BSOD. It's never supposed to happen, unlike with the GPU where all it does is accelerate graphics and will sit around doing next to nothing otherwise. You might get a portion of CPU cores/threads running full tilt, but that will still only look like partial utilization from the overall "CPU usage" meter.

Civilization doesn't 100% a CPU, either, yet you will see large gains in how long it takes to crunch the AI turns with a faster CPU compared to a slower one. In Grand Theft Auto IV or V, you see a direct FPS increase because of all the underlying physics, AI, and resource streaming. Same with Bethesda games, and the way they load and unload cells full of objects and actors within a radius of the player. Especially since the only way to truly increase the draw distance in Skyrim or FO4 is to increase that radius, which means exponentially larger portions of the game world being actively simulated. People do it because they want to see more detail off in the distance, but don't realize that their performance is tanking because of their CPU/RAM, not their GPU (or "poor optimization," as is blamed when they have a 1080). All of these games will max out your GPU, but not the CPU... Yet they still perform better with a better CPU.

Edit to add: I noticed the article linked here says "[He] used an Intel i7-4790K with 16GB of RAM so obviously he was not CPU limited." That's exactly what I'm talking about -- even the journalists who write about this sort of thing regularly are still stuck in that mindset that games do not ever and could never conceivably use a lot of CPU power.

This comment was edited on Jul 30, 2018, 21:06.
 
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22. Re: Monster Hunter World PC Performance Explained Jul 30, 2018, 19:29 HorrorScope
 
jacobvandy wrote on Jul 30, 2018, 18:38:
What we have is a problem of institutionalized misinformation. In the PS3/360 era, all the focus was on new lighting and shaders and whatever else went into that cookie-cutter Unreal Engine 3 kind of look... For that, you needed a lot of GPU power, but the CPU didn't matter much. New gaming PCs were built with 80% of the budget spent on graphics, and it served well in most games. So everyone tells everyone to just make sure you have a good GPU. "Buy an eMachine and shove a 580 in there, you'll be fine!"

But this new generation has seen those graphics techniques mature and refine rather than completely change, and the PS4/Xbone are more powerful and well-rounded. A lot of PC gaming rigs are not. People have the same CPU they did 10-15 years ago and think simply upgrading the GPU will allow them to max out any new game... They're wrong. More developers are exploring more simulation-heavy game design, it's not just 4X games or Rockstar with their realistic physics in big, open worlds anymore.

They blame it on poor optimization or performance-leeching DRM because that's easier, more comfortable than admitting that maybe they've fallen behind the curve a bit... Consoles are offering better performance than your imbalanced PC gaming rig. Suck it up and get a new processor. A good one! Because developers are going to keep pushing that side of gaming, and I'm glad they are. The worst thing you can do is keep bitching and eventually make them think they shouldn't do what they're doing, 'cause that's how you end up with the same Call of Duty every fucking year using the same engine it did at the turn of the millenium.

It's not a bad theory, but from what I've heard in this game it is maxing out the GPU's and the CPU's are are at a 1/3's usage, not cpu bound, the opposite of what you write in this case.
 
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21. Re: Monster Hunter World PC Performance Explained Jul 30, 2018, 19:27 HorrorScope
 
Steele Johnson wrote on Jul 30, 2018, 16:34:
I remember a day when it was ok to release a game that pushed the graphics knowing that it wouldn't run that great on the latest hardware. I liked it because you got a cool bonus when you upgrade your pc and play the game again. It was as if the game got a graphics upgrade too!

I suppose those days are gone

Because there are so many game, that is what is majorly different in this era, the sheer amount of games. We aren't waiting impatiently, because there's more games than time now, by far.
 
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20. Re: Monster Hunter World PC Performance Explained Jul 30, 2018, 19:25 HorrorScope
 
theyarecomingforyou wrote on Jul 30, 2018, 15:17:
It sounds like a bullshit excuse to me. If it preloads all the content then memory usage will be higher but performance itself would benefit as a result. What they seem to be suggesting is that the CPU is performing calculations for every asset in the game even if it isn't visible or relevant to the player, which is just a shitty lack of optimisation.

+1 to all those thoughts, mine as well.
 
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19. Re: Skyrim Creation Club Launches with Survival Mode Jul 30, 2018, 18:55 Kajetan
 
jacobvandy wrote on Jul 30, 2018, 18:38:
...
*yawn*
 
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18. Re: Monster Hunter World PC Performance Explained Jul 30, 2018, 18:38 jacobvandy
 
What we have is a problem of institutionalized misinformation. In the PS3/360 era, all the focus was on new lighting and shaders and whatever else went into that cookie-cutter Unreal Engine 3 kind of look... For that, you needed a lot of GPU power, but the CPU didn't matter much. New gaming PCs were built with 80% of the budget spent on graphics, and it served well in most games. So everyone tells everyone to just make sure you have a good GPU. "Buy an eMachine and shove a 580 in there, you'll be fine!"

But this new generation has seen those graphics techniques mature and refine rather than completely change, and the PS4/Xbone are more powerful and well-rounded. A lot of PC gaming rigs are not. People have the same CPU they did 10-15 years ago and think simply upgrading the GPU will allow them to max out any new game... They're wrong. More developers are exploring more simulation-heavy game design, it's not just 4X games or Rockstar with their realistic physics in big, open worlds anymore.

They blame it on poor optimization or performance-leeching DRM because that's easier, more comfortable than admitting that maybe they've fallen behind the curve a bit... Consoles are offering better performance than your imbalanced PC gaming rig. Suck it up and get a new processor. A good one! Because developers are going to keep pushing that side of gaming, and I'm glad they are. The worst thing you can do is keep bitching and eventually make them think they shouldn't do what they're doing, 'cause that's how you end up with the same Call of Duty every fucking year using the same engine it did at the turn of the millenium.
 
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17. Re: Monster Hunter World PC Performance Explained Jul 30, 2018, 18:30 ItBurn
 
Agent.X7 wrote on Jul 30, 2018, 18:24:
Steele Johnson wrote on Jul 30, 2018, 16:34:
I remember a day when it was ok to release a game that pushed the graphics knowing that it wouldn't run that great on the latest hardware. I liked it because you got a cool bonus when you upgrade your pc and play the game again. It was as if the game got a graphics upgrade too!

I suppose those days are gone and devs need to make sure that all hardware gets similar performance (i.e. lowest common denominator). There's no wonder why most games that get release today seem to have graphics from 5 years ago.

Yep, everything is developed for console and the PC is an afterthought port. Everything runs well because it can only be as graphically complex as the Xbox or PS4 can handle, so our PCs are light years ahead of the game. Nobody is doing Crysis level games just for PC because console is where the money is at. Sometimes they throw us a bone and we get some effect or something you can't see on the console, or we can run it at a higher resolution, but that is about it.

Star Citizen is doing Crysis level tech
 
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16. Re: Monster Hunter World PC Performance Explained Jul 30, 2018, 18:30 Overon
 
You are telling me that a piece of shit consoles from 5 years ago have the hardware to run the game at a decent framearate but a GTX 1080 does not? Come on, it's an un-optimized piece of shit.  
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15. Re: Monster Hunter World PC Performance Explained Jul 30, 2018, 18:24 Agent.X7
 
Steele Johnson wrote on Jul 30, 2018, 16:34:
I remember a day when it was ok to release a game that pushed the graphics knowing that it wouldn't run that great on the latest hardware. I liked it because you got a cool bonus when you upgrade your pc and play the game again. It was as if the game got a graphics upgrade too!

I suppose those days are gone and devs need to make sure that all hardware gets similar performance (i.e. lowest common denominator). There's no wonder why most games that get release today seem to have graphics from 5 years ago.

Yep, everything is developed for console and the PC is an afterthought port. Everything runs well because it can only be as graphically complex as the Xbox or PS4 can handle, so our PCs are light years ahead of the game. Nobody is doing Crysis level games just for PC because console is where the money is at. Sometimes they throw us a bone and we get some effect or something you can't see on the console, or we can run it at a higher resolution, but that is about it.
 
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14. Re: Monster Hunter World PC Performance Explained Jul 30, 2018, 17:52 necrosis
 
theyarecomingforyou wrote on Jul 30, 2018, 15:17:
It sounds like a bullshit excuse to me. If it preloads all the content then memory usage will be higher but performance itself would benefit as a result. What they seem to be suggesting is that the CPU is performing calculations for every asset in the game even if it isn't visible or relevant to the player, which is just a shitty lack of optimization.
This game sounds like when people evaluated the FFXV demo. Hair effects and other shit being applied not just to mobs and such not being rendered in view. But to items rendered out of view... WAAAYYYYYYYYYYY out of view. For no other reason than bad optimization.
 
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13. Re: Monster Hunter World PC Performance Explained Jul 30, 2018, 16:34 Steele Johnson
 
I remember a day when it was ok to release a game that pushed the graphics knowing that it wouldn't run that great on the latest hardware. I liked it because you got a cool bonus when you upgrade your pc and play the game again. It was as if the game got a graphics upgrade too!

I suppose those days are gone and devs need to make sure that all hardware gets similar performance (i.e. lowest common denominator). There's no wonder why most games that get released today seem to have graphics from 5 years ago.

Aside from that, the vids I'm seeing of the pc version look amazing (way better than the console), and the load times won't be nearly as painful.

This comment was edited on Jul 31, 2018, 01:29.
 
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12. Re: Monster Hunter World PC Performance Explained Jul 30, 2018, 16:26 grudgebearer
 
theyarecomingforyou wrote on Jul 30, 2018, 15:17:
It sounds like a bullshit excuse to me. If it preloads all the content then memory usage will be higher but performance itself would benefit as a result. What they seem to be suggesting is that the CPU is performing calculations for every asset in the game even if it isn't visible or relevant to the player, which is just a shitty lack of optimisation.

Sounds more like they are rendering the level, and caching the assets in VRAM even though the player can't see them, and doesn't need them rendered on screen.
 
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11. Re: Monster Hunter World PC Performance Explained Jul 30, 2018, 16:17 Darks
 
Ozmodan wrote on Jul 30, 2018, 15:02:

You can run this game at 2k on a 1060 with little problem. Personally, I can't really tell the difference between 4k and 2k in most games.

Then that would be because you dont have a good monitor or the monitors screen size is small. Try loading up a game on a 32 inch monitor and I can absolutely guarantee you theirs a difference.

I had a 28 inch 4K and now have a 32 inch 2k 1440P and I can see the difference in colors and how much looser the pixels are on my 32 from the 28.

 
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