"I’d say our early work in... Xbox Live stuff for Windows was well intentioned, but anybody that’s a PC gamer (I play a lot of PC games myself) saw this kind of imposter console work coming over," says Spencer. "You’ve probably seen us slow down on some of the progress we’ve made on some of our apps, and some other things because we’re reworking how we’re thinking about the PC audience to try to be more reflective of the PC community that’s out there instead of trying to pull people into the things that come from the console space."
Spencer also notes that efforts like Discord and Xbox Live integration is an example of "recognizing infrastructure that exists on the PC side, apps that exist, and services that exist and try to be inclusive of the things PC gamers are about." Microsoft is slowing down on changes to its Xbox app right now, but "the long-term goal is for us to be much more native in the PC gaming environment, as opposed to this thing that feels slightly different than what PC gamers are looking for."
Nullity wrote on Jun 14, 2018, 14:14:Kxmode wrote on Jun 14, 2018, 14:05:Yes of course, but I meant that for the most part, PC gamers aren't playing games through the MS store.Nullity wrote on Jun 14, 2018, 13:25:The majority of PC gamers play on Windows, and the majority of Windows gamers play on Steam. Them's the facts.Kxmode wrote on Jun 14, 2018, 12:10:Except we don't, which is the issue.HorrorScope wrote on Jun 14, 2018, 11:39:As many as they want. It's their world (platform). We just play on it.
How many chances does this guy get? How many?
Or maybe we're saying the same thing? I'm not sure.
Slick wrote on Jun 14, 2018, 13:01:
I don't know what you guys are complaining about, what he said is actually right on the money, the only shame is that it's taken them so long to realise this.
The "eureka" moment is when they realised that PC gamers don't want to log into a fucking Xbox app, or manage an Xbox account, or go to the Xbox store on PC. They thought that their existing branding was a feature, but it's always been a bug for PC gamers.
For all their fuckups, I'm pretty happy to be able to finally buy a game once which works on my Xbox and my PC (and migrates save files automatically to boot). I think we've all been there at one time or another, debating whether to have to re-buy a game we already own cause we want to play it on a different platform. There's only a handful of games (mostly first party titles) that use this "play anywhere" program, but it's fucking great and very consumer-friendly. Also, it supports cross-play. I play Gwent on Xbox and PC and I can play PvP against people from either ecosystem. I think Forza 7 works the same way too.
Slashman wrote on Jun 14, 2018, 19:42:
Just for the record, I was not saying that Windows 10 was a shitty OS. I was referring to MS exclusivity regarding it and their games along with DirectX exclusivity.
Although I really don't like the sneaked in updates when I turn my back. Why the hell are you asking me permission for some updates and then totally ignoring my opinion for others MS?
wrlwnd wrote on Jun 14, 2018, 23:27:
I'm still using Visual Studio 2008 and just laugh at how poor their VS offerings have been the last 10 years.
Slick wrote on Jun 14, 2018, 15:44:Slashman wrote on Jun 14, 2018, 14:49:
Slick and several more people on here are acting like MS hasn't done this shit already!
Fallout 3 on Games for Windows Live sure was lovely right? The Arkham games on Games for Windows Live were divine weren't they? I'm sure we all lamented when GFWL got removed from these and Red Faction Guerilla.
This has nothing to do with wanting MS to sell through some one else's store, it has to do with the fact that they keep proving they are shitty at managing their own. And to answer your questions Slick, I do not buy through Origin or play EA games pretty much ever because Origin itself keeps flagging my geographical location incorrectly and charging me stupid extra.
If you want to use the wonderful Windows store, go ahead. I, on the other hand, have no interest and don't want the bother.
The shitty OS and DirectX exclusivity is yet another reason for me to take a step back from this. Jesus Slick, do you just post for the sake of being the contrarian?
I mean I honestly have no idea why I should give a flying frak about poor, downtrodden MS taking whatever hit the other digital stores charge. I'm a consumer. I consume what is best for me. Others have that right and I'm fine with people who use Origin or the Windows store, it just won't be me. And from the looks of things, I'm not alone.
First of all, I like that you said my name 3 times in your post. It's where I draw my power from. I'm like beetlejuice, only less handsome.
Anyways, to your points:
1) I never said their store wasn't shitty, infact I've offered evidence of how shitty it is. That being said, it has improved since the days of GFWL. They're like a big dumb dinosaur, they're slow, but they're learning.
2) There's no love lost for a giant megalithic corporation. I'm just refuting the line that people (one in particular in this thread) say that they'll only buy from Steam. The irony of only buying from one multi-billion $ corp over another is usually lost. My point has always been that devs/bankrollers have the right to sell their own wares. If people GENUINELY want the product, then the store they buy it from shouldn't be too much of an obstacle. If it is, then I'd argue that they didn't REALLY want it that badly in the first place.
III) Also, that sucks about your Origin woes, I never heard of that bug. I know that all the stores have different region pricing. You can always try a VPN or just get a key from a grey-market site like Kinguin. But again, I'd be willing to bet that you prooooobably don't really want to play any of EA's games that badly
D) Windows 10 isn't a shitty OS. It's the best OS for gaming, and I like playing games. Sooooooo that's pretty much a non-starter. Also, DirectX has it's pros and cons, it saved the PC gaming industry from a fragmented scenario and did a better job than OpenGL. If Vulkan gets traction I'm all for that too. I don't really give a flying fuck to be honest. What game doesn't use DirectX? DX12 actually has alot of that good low-level shit developers have been wanting after seeing it with Mantle. The holdup is mostly nVidia with zero fucks given to Async compute, and developers not wanting to re-invent the wheel mid-console cycle. Around 2020 we'll see DX12 take off if Vulkan doesn't beat them to it (they won't), and then we'll see some shit. But really, who the fuck cares about APIs? And how is that a contrarian view? I have actual contrarian views you know... just enjoying PC gaming isn't one of them.
Slashman wrote on Jun 14, 2018, 12:02:
For me it comes to down the fact that there is nothing I really want from Microsoft except non-exclusivity of their games on the console side.
Just make your games and then port them to PC and sell them through Steam, GOG and other established retailers.
What MS keeps trying to make fit is some kind of return to Windows Live that nobody liked or wanted. Your store will never be the cool thing you want us to believe it is. Stop getting involved in aspects that don't matter to us. We have GOG, Steam, GMG and a host of other, better digital retailers.
All MS has to do is decide if they want PC gamers to enjoy the same games they are putting out for console and if so, then just stop getting in the way of that. We don't want your shitty store and its front end.
Mr. Tact wrote on Jun 14, 2018, 18:10:Make a great OS and people will install it for free. Or don't make a great OS and trick peeps into installing it.
Late to the topic... can I assume the response to this announcement is as repetitive as the announcement itself?
As I'm sure someone has said, what MS needs to do is stop talking, and start walking. Make a great game and gamers will beat a path to your door. Or more to the point, STFU.
Rhett wrote on Jun 14, 2018, 17:35:Yep, this is exactly what I was referring to. We had the same issues with both State of Decay 2 and Gears of War 4. SoD2 we at least got working, but as you pointed out, it's a buggy mess. GoW4 we could never get to work and ended up refunding it.
The loops we had to jump through just to play a simple multiplayer game of State of Decay 2 was staggeringly ridiculous. Had to go into the command prompt to disable the Teredo adapter, open ports, enable the windows firewall (ENABLE it... not just allow the game, or disable my firewall, but ENABLE another firewall), restart the computer etc.
Mind you, five different people had to do this or had different problems. Every single person had to do, adjust, or fix something related to the network just to either connect to someone else, or host.
Overon wrote on Jun 14, 2018, 17:54:
Phil Spencer is a bullshitter. How many times has he said this? Why doesn't someone in the bullshit games media call him out on this?
Overon wrote on Jun 14, 2018, 17:54:
Phil Spencer is a bullshitter. How many times has he said this? Why doesn't someone in the bullshit games media call him out on this?
Rhett wrote on Jun 14, 2018, 17:35:
I recently got an Xbox Game Pass trial recently since it was $1/free trial, to try State of Decay 2 (and play Sea of Thieves, because I wouldn't buy it atm)...
The loops we had to jump through just to play a simple multiplayer game of State of Decay 2 was staggeringly ridiculous. Had to go into the command prompt to disable the Teredo adapter, open ports, enable the windows firewall (ENABLE it... not just allow the game, or disable my firewall, but ENABLE another firewall), restart the computer etc.
Mind you, five different people had to do this or had different problems. Every single person had to do, adjust, or fix something related to the network just to either connect to someone else, or host.
Every experience I've had with the Xbox app and the Microsoft Store app has been abysmal and hilariously underwhelming. State of Decay 2, even, is the single buggiest game I've played in years. And it wasn't even early access! At least it's only $30, and it's... playable... to say the least.
I sincerely hope they take a long, hard look at this garbage because I'm seeing more and more people pissed off at MS on PC.
Edit: Also tried Gears of War 4 again (bought it early on), and it's still just filled to the brim with lootboxes.. I thought people were up in arms about that from the start? And you have to buy every map individually for $5 a piece?!
Slick wrote on Jun 14, 2018, 15:12:
If you're referring to the MS store, it's embedded, and very limiting. I bought 2 games from it, and for the life of me I can't figure out where the fuck they are if I delete my desktop shortcut. There doesn't seem to be a "my library" section, I have to search for it like I'm using the android play store then try installing and it's like: "OH WAIT! you totally have this game! nice!" It's garbage.
But I wouldn't count them out, they have unlimited resources, and an unlimited timeline. There's no good reason why they won't turn it into the "app store" equivalent eventually.
Speaking of apps. IMO that's their biggest missed oppertunity. There's so much software sold on PC, and I have to make a new account for each company. just for plug-ins, audio, video, productivity etc. There's no central hub where all that lives like on iOS or Android. If MS was smart and just charged developers a reasonable 5% fee on gross, then they'd take that shit over in no time. And I'd actually be happy to see that happen. No reason I have to make a new account to buy some random whatever from some boutique VST plug-in developer. It's honestly easier to torrent it. That's a problem you'd think devs and consumers would be happy to have fixed.
Cutter wrote on Jun 14, 2018, 14:59:
Slick, you're the one missing the point here. Phil has said this how many times now? Half a dozen or so over the last decade or so? Every couple of years he trots this exact same shit out. How they've dropped the ball but this time they're really gonna' make it work finally! Yeah, this is the one. This time it's really gonna' happen!
VaranDragon wrote on Jun 14, 2018, 15:54:
Yeah I get what you're saying, what I wanted to add to that was that most of the complaints raised here would be moot if MS just made their store work like Origin, or Steam or GOG or whatever.