EA and AI, E-I-E-I-O

Electronic Arts offers details about their work to create actual AI players for video games using Battlefield 1 as a training ground. They offer a Q&A with Magnus Nordin, technical director of their Search for Extraordinary Experiences Division (SEED), who explains these are different from the bots we're used to seeing because they learn to play on their own rather than being pre-programmed to play a certain way. The article includes this video showing early results of their experiments with AI that has learned to play the game from scratch through trial-and-error. Here's a bit more on where this is all going:
What’s the practical use of this technology right now?
Our short-term objective with this project has been to help the DICE team scale up its quality assurance and testing, which would help the studio to collect more crash reports and find more bugs.

In future titles, as deep learning technology matures, I expect self learning agents to be part of the games themselves, as truly intelligent NPCs that can master a range of tasks, and that adapt and evolve over time as they accumulate experience from engaging with human players.

When do you think we will see self-learning AI becoming a mainstream technology in games?
I have no doubt in my mind that neural nets will start to gradually make their way into games in the years to come. Self-learning agents aren’t just a good replacement for old-fashioned bots, you can also apply machine learning to a number of fields, such as procedurally generated content, animation, voice generation, speech recognition and more.

Will self-learning agents ever beat professional FPS-players? If so, when?
With the risk of going out on a limb with a crazy prediction, I think it’s reasonable to expect AI agents capable to defeat human players in a limited competitive game mode—one that features smaller maps, focused teams and clear objectives—in a couple of years from now. However, at SEED we’re not necessarily out to build AI that will defeat human players. Our aim is to help create new experiences that enhance games and make them more fun. Getting owned by a superior AI isn’t necessarily that fun for players in the long run.

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19.
 
Re: EA and AI, E-I-E-I-O
Mar 24, 2018, 13:46
Dev
19.
Re: EA and AI, E-I-E-I-O Mar 24, 2018, 13:46
Mar 24, 2018, 13:46
Dev
 
jdreyer wrote on Mar 23, 2018, 17:41:
Dev wrote on Mar 23, 2018, 06:31:
jdreyer wrote on Mar 23, 2018, 01:45:
maddog wrote on Mar 23, 2018, 00:08:
jdreyer wrote on Mar 22, 2018, 18:57:
Very cool. I've been looking for a BF2 AIX replacement for a decade. This shows promise.

I made navmeshes for some of the maps in the AIX mod (bot name pc_load_letter). Glad to see people are still playing and enjoying the mod.

Was sad that the team broke up shortly after the release.


AIX is the best non-scripted single player experience I've had. I love it and have been looking for a replacement for a decade.

If I've never heard of this, where can I find info, and will it work with my old steam version of BF2?

Hey Dev, AIX 2.0 is at moddb. I'm using it with the Steam version of BF2.
Thanks!
18.
 
Re: EA and AI, E-I-E-I-O
Mar 23, 2018, 21:10
18.
Re: EA and AI, E-I-E-I-O Mar 23, 2018, 21:10
Mar 23, 2018, 21:10
 
eRe4s3r wrote on Mar 22, 2018, 18:44:
I feel like de ja vue... I swear I saw the same dumb AI back in CS 10 years ago in a mod AI......

And if you wanted to you could bump said AI up on games to the point you can't win. Sort of funny acting like this is something we haven't had. Now could it be even wiser? Sure. But to just abandon it like the industry did and then act like it is a fresh idea, hmmmm...
Avatar 17232
17.
 
Re: EA and AI, E-I-E-I-O
Mar 23, 2018, 17:41
17.
Re: EA and AI, E-I-E-I-O Mar 23, 2018, 17:41
Mar 23, 2018, 17:41
 
Dev wrote on Mar 23, 2018, 06:31:
jdreyer wrote on Mar 23, 2018, 01:45:
maddog wrote on Mar 23, 2018, 00:08:
jdreyer wrote on Mar 22, 2018, 18:57:
Very cool. I've been looking for a BF2 AIX replacement for a decade. This shows promise.

I made navmeshes for some of the maps in the AIX mod (bot name pc_load_letter). Glad to see people are still playing and enjoying the mod.

Was sad that the team broke up shortly after the release.


AIX is the best non-scripted single player experience I've had. I love it and have been looking for a replacement for a decade.

If I've never heard of this, where can I find info, and will it work with my old steam version of BF2?

Hey Dev, AIX 2.0 is at moddb. I'm using it with the Steam version of BF2.
I'm a smoldering volcano of virility. At least, that's what I tell myself.
Avatar 22024
16.
 
Re: EA and AI, E-I-E-I-O
Mar 23, 2018, 10:31
16.
Re: EA and AI, E-I-E-I-O Mar 23, 2018, 10:31
Mar 23, 2018, 10:31
 
Died laughing at the AI doing circles of each other..

hahah

Avatar 57660
15.
 
Re: EA and AI, E-I-E-I-O
Mar 23, 2018, 10:27
15.
Re: EA and AI, E-I-E-I-O Mar 23, 2018, 10:27
Mar 23, 2018, 10:27
 
Great! Now we can finally have a Daikatana where Superfly doesn't get stuck on a rock?
Avatar 55616
14.
 
Re: EA and AI, E-I-E-I-O
Mar 23, 2018, 09:25
14.
Re: EA and AI, E-I-E-I-O Mar 23, 2018, 09:25
Mar 23, 2018, 09:25
 
I love any multiplayer game with bots if they are tunable (because telling a human player to suck a little more so you can beat them once in a while doesn't generally work) but the AI thing makes me concerned. Depending on how good the AI is at learning and adapting, it won't be long before the AI bots are owning my old, unskilled ass just as badly as your average 12 year-old does now in Overwatch.

But seriously this would be a major boon for players for older multiplayer only games that have lost their population to the new hotness of newer multiplayer games.
“The greatness of a nation and its moral progress can be judged by the way its animals are treated.”
- Mahatma Gandhi
Avatar 17185
13.
 
Re: EA and AI, E-I-E-I-O
Mar 23, 2018, 09:03
13.
Re: EA and AI, E-I-E-I-O Mar 23, 2018, 09:03
Mar 23, 2018, 09:03
 
Sure is a lot more useful then 'ray tracing' will be ,.... that won't be coded efficiently for maybe 10 years to work on graphics cards we can't buy because of bitminers
Avatar 58495
12.
 
Re: EA and AI, E-I-E-I-O
Mar 23, 2018, 06:31
Dev
12.
Re: EA and AI, E-I-E-I-O Mar 23, 2018, 06:31
Mar 23, 2018, 06:31
Dev
 
jdreyer wrote on Mar 23, 2018, 01:45:
maddog wrote on Mar 23, 2018, 00:08:
jdreyer wrote on Mar 22, 2018, 18:57:
Very cool. I've been looking for a BF2 AIX replacement for a decade. This shows promise.

I made navmeshes for some of the maps in the AIX mod (bot name pc_load_letter). Glad to see people are still playing and enjoying the mod.

Was sad that the team broke up shortly after the release.


AIX is the best non-scripted single player experience I've had. I love it and have been looking for a replacement for a decade.

If I've never heard of this, where can I find info, and will it work with my old steam version of BF2?
11.
 
Re: EA and AI, E-I-E-I-O
Mar 23, 2018, 03:51
Kxmode
 
11.
Re: EA and AI, E-I-E-I-O Mar 23, 2018, 03:51
Mar 23, 2018, 03:51
 Kxmode
 
I for one am ready for our robot farming overlords.
"The present is a veil between anticipation and horror. Lift the veil... and madness may follow." source
Avatar 18786
10.
 
Re: EA and AI, E-I-E-I-O
Mar 23, 2018, 01:45
10.
Re: EA and AI, E-I-E-I-O Mar 23, 2018, 01:45
Mar 23, 2018, 01:45
 
maddog wrote on Mar 23, 2018, 00:08:
jdreyer wrote on Mar 22, 2018, 18:57:
Very cool. I've been looking for a BF2 AIX replacement for a decade. This shows promise.

I made navmeshes for some of the maps in the AIX mod (bot name pc_load_letter). Glad to see people are still playing and enjoying the mod.

Was sad that the team broke up shortly after the release.


AIX is the best non-scripted single player experience I've had. I love it and have been looking for a replacement for a decade.
I'm a smoldering volcano of virility. At least, that's what I tell myself.
Avatar 22024
9.
 
Re: EA and AI, E-I-E-I-O
Mar 23, 2018, 00:26
9.
Re: EA and AI, E-I-E-I-O Mar 23, 2018, 00:26
Mar 23, 2018, 00:26
 
Will self-learning agents ever beat professional FPS-players? If so, when?
With the risk of going out on a limb with a crazy prediction, I think it’s reasonable to expect AI agents capable to defeat human players in a limited competitive game mode—one that features smaller maps, focused teams and clear objectives—in a couple of years from now.
Eh?? Surely building a bot to beat a human is not that hard. Even the most basic bot would have near-zero reaction time and perfect aim.

The challenge so far has been building bots that play like good human players.
8.
 
Re: EA and AI, E-I-E-I-O
Mar 23, 2018, 00:08
8.
Re: EA and AI, E-I-E-I-O Mar 23, 2018, 00:08
Mar 23, 2018, 00:08
 
jdreyer wrote on Mar 22, 2018, 18:57:
Very cool. I've been looking for a BF2 AIX replacement for a decade. This shows promise.

I made navmeshes for some of the maps in the AIX mod (bot name pc_load_letter). Glad to see people are still playing and enjoying the mod.

Was sad that the team broke up shortly after the release.

Avatar 21885
7.
 
Re: EA and AI, E-I-E-I-O
Mar 22, 2018, 22:19
7.
Re: EA and AI, E-I-E-I-O Mar 22, 2018, 22:19
Mar 22, 2018, 22:19
 
necrosis wrote on Mar 22, 2018, 21:28:
I didnt come here to read cleaver titles.

Just here to make spelling mistakes huh?
Avatar 17249
6.
 
Re: EA and AI, E-I-E-I-O
Mar 22, 2018, 21:29
6.
Re: EA and AI, E-I-E-I-O Mar 22, 2018, 21:29
Mar 22, 2018, 21:29
 
Slick wrote on Mar 22, 2018, 20:08:
This is the right approach to take.

Traditional AI bots rely on a small map with preset pathing for the AI to take. It's why AI as far back as Quakebots have been able to "seem" passably realistic.

But anyone who played Bad Company 1 knows that once you bring this into an open world, and ESPECIALLY if you add things like destructable environments, the AI can barely make heads or tails of what's happening, as was evidenced by your 3 friendly AI teammates in the campaign.

DICE lamented how hard it was to do the AI back then, and this change towards machine learning is the right move, and should keep Frostbite as the industry-leading engine.

And it should allow AI to be added easily to any FPS: just plugged in the neural net and let it learn the map.
I'm a smoldering volcano of virility. At least, that's what I tell myself.
Avatar 22024
5.
 
Re: EA and AI, E-I-E-I-O
Mar 22, 2018, 21:28
5.
Re: EA and AI, E-I-E-I-O Mar 22, 2018, 21:28
Mar 22, 2018, 21:28
 
I didnt come here to read cleaver titles.
4.
 
Re: EA and AI, E-I-E-I-O
Mar 22, 2018, 20:08
Slick
 
4.
Re: EA and AI, E-I-E-I-O Mar 22, 2018, 20:08
Mar 22, 2018, 20:08
 Slick
 
This is the right approach to take.

Traditional AI bots rely on a small map with preset pathing for the AI to take. It's why AI as far back as Quakebots have been able to "seem" passably realistic.

But anyone who played Bad Company 1 knows that once you bring this into an open world, and ESPECIALLY if you add things like destructable environments, the AI can barely make heads or tails of what's happening, as was evidenced by your 3 friendly AI teammates in the campaign.

DICE lamented how hard it was to do the AI back then, and this change towards machine learning is the right move, and should keep Frostbite as the industry-leading engine.
For your transgressions you shall be labeled a shill, called an idiot and anytime you mention facts or disagree with a tribe member you will henceforth be known as a troll. The best you can hope for is that the labels won't haunt your offspring. -RedEye9
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3.
 
Re: EA and AI, E-I-E-I-O
Mar 22, 2018, 18:57
3.
Re: EA and AI, E-I-E-I-O Mar 22, 2018, 18:57
Mar 22, 2018, 18:57
 
Very cool. I've been looking for a BF2 AIX replacement for a decade. This shows promise.
I'm a smoldering volcano of virility. At least, that's what I tell myself.
Avatar 22024
2.
 
Re: EA and AI, E-I-E-I-O
Mar 22, 2018, 18:44
2.
Re: EA and AI, E-I-E-I-O Mar 22, 2018, 18:44
Mar 22, 2018, 18:44
 
I feel like de ja vue... I swear I saw the same dumb AI back in CS 10 years ago in a mod AI...... it was notorious for throwing flash-bangs into FRIENDLY groups to stun 1 enemy, and getting stuck on stairs, and it also never entered buildings and then left them, once such AI enters, you can assume it camps 100% of the match there because it can't path out of buildings.

They really didn't advance this concept since then eh?

Also that's not HOW BF1 is actually played so....
Avatar 54727
1.
 
Re: EA and AI, E-I-E-I-O
Mar 22, 2018, 18:42
1.
Re: EA and AI, E-I-E-I-O Mar 22, 2018, 18:42
Mar 22, 2018, 18:42
 
Well, it's a start anyway. I'll believe it when they teach the AI to tea bag opponents and deploy smoke bombs on you while you try to snipe*

*by friendly AI

This comment was edited on Mar 22, 2018, 18:52.
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