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New AMD Drivers (Sort Of)

AMD Support now offers Radeon Software Crimson ReLive Edition 17.11.1 drivers for Windows (thanks Bill). Those paying careful attention may notice this is the same version number as the hotfix drivers released at the start of this month. The difference here is that these are a reissue that is now officially WHQL-certified, so these can be installed on systems using Microsoft Secure boot. The main features of the new drivers is improved Call of Duty: WWII performance on Radeon RX Vega64 (8GB) graphics and support for AMD XConnect technology on Radeon RX Vega56 graphics cards for select eGPU enclosures.

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9. Re: New AMD Drivers (Sort Of) Nov 15, 2017, 19:46 headkase
 
WaltC wrote on Nov 15, 2017, 10:37:
Sheeesh...OK, let's try one more time. The only thing I have said about driver signing is that *all AMD drivers*--beta and whql--are signed drivers. That's it. The argument about driver signing is yours, and only yours...;) The original Post here by Blue stated that only whql drivers supported secure boot--which is in error. All of AMD's drivers support it, beta and whql.

You may very well be right, AMD drivers, non-WHQL ones, may actually be signed in some way. Blue didn't make the mistake though: I'm Bill for the thanks and when I sent in the news *I'm* the one who went on about Secure Boot.
 
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8. Re: New AMD Drivers (Sort Of) Nov 15, 2017, 10:37 WaltC
 
headkase wrote on Nov 14, 2017, 18:37:
WaltC wrote on Nov 14, 2017, 16:44:
headkase wrote on Nov 14, 2017, 01:03:
WaltC wrote on Nov 13, 2017, 21:17:
All of the Crimson drivers install fine with Secure boot on...;) IE, AMD WHQL drivers are not required for secure-boot support. (Where did that come from?...;))
Secure boot is a UEFI feature that goes from cold start to full desktop loaded with a cryptographic chain of signatures from start to end. If a signature fails then the file is not what was signed off by the provider and boot stops. If you're a BIOS system (or have CSM enabled in a UEFI firmware), 32-bit Windows, or have Secure Boot disabled in your firmware THEN you can use non-signed drivers. I believe versions of Windows prior to Windows 10 weren't as strict with Secure Boot. With Windows 10 the three conditions do apply.

The signatures are not limited to Microsoft. Any operating system can have their keys in the firmware to do a Secure Boot. Most mainboards just come with Microsoft keys already in the firmware though, and some mainboards will not let you both change the root signature OR boot without Secure Boot. Those systems, and they do exist, are limited to booting a Microsoft key.

I build my own systems and have for the last 22 years. I Know what secure boot is...;) Have never had an AMD driver refuse to boot into secure boot--AMD beta drivers are not unsigned--I would have thought everyone would know by now...;) I'm using Win10x64 version 1709, build 1705--have been in the Insider's beta-test program since 10/2015--only time I have seen AMD drivers fail to support secure boot in all of that time were when Microsoft changed the security *signature* paradigm in a beta build and AMD simply hadn't caught up, yet--still writing for the official releases of Win10. Last time that happened was many months back, and it was temporary with only a couple of beta builds of Win10. I never boot into a secure-boot off state.

Implication in the original post was that AMD beta drivers were unsigned and wouldn't work with secure boot ON, which isn't the case, and I simply wanted to correct that misapprehension...;) Both the betas and the whqls are fully signed and have no problem supporting secure boot--unless Microsoft changes the SHA requirements suddenly--as happened for a couple of the Win10 beta builds. If you weren't in the IP program you'd never have seen a secure-boot failure even once--the drivers were signed--just not properly for the changes Microsoft put into the betas at the time.

Driver signing in Windows 10.

"Beginning with the release of Windows 10, all new Windows 10 kernel mode drivers must be submitted to and digitally signed by the Windows Hardware Developer Center Dashboard portal. Windows 10 will not load new kernel mode drivers which are not signed by the portal."

Driver signing is a fact in Windows 10. Fact. How signatures are implemented I'll have to give you the benefit of the doubt.

Sheeesh...OK, let's try one more time. The only thing I have said about driver signing is that *all AMD drivers*--beta and whql--are signed drivers. That's it. The argument about driver signing is yours, and only yours...;) The original Post here by Blue stated that only whql drivers supported secure boot--which is in error. All of AMD's drivers support it, beta and whql.
 
Avatar 16008
 
It is well known that I do not make mistakes--so if you should happen across a mistake in anything I have written, be assured that I did not write it!
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7. Re: New AMD Drivers (Sort Of) Nov 14, 2017, 18:37 headkase
 
WaltC wrote on Nov 14, 2017, 16:44:
headkase wrote on Nov 14, 2017, 01:03:
WaltC wrote on Nov 13, 2017, 21:17:
All of the Crimson drivers install fine with Secure boot on...;) IE, AMD WHQL drivers are not required for secure-boot support. (Where did that come from?...;))
Secure boot is a UEFI feature that goes from cold start to full desktop loaded with a cryptographic chain of signatures from start to end. If a signature fails then the file is not what was signed off by the provider and boot stops. If you're a BIOS system (or have CSM enabled in a UEFI firmware), 32-bit Windows, or have Secure Boot disabled in your firmware THEN you can use non-signed drivers. I believe versions of Windows prior to Windows 10 weren't as strict with Secure Boot. With Windows 10 the three conditions do apply.

The signatures are not limited to Microsoft. Any operating system can have their keys in the firmware to do a Secure Boot. Most mainboards just come with Microsoft keys already in the firmware though, and some mainboards will not let you both change the root signature OR boot without Secure Boot. Those systems, and they do exist, are limited to booting a Microsoft key.

I build my own systems and have for the last 22 years. I Know what secure boot is...;) Have never had an AMD driver refuse to boot into secure boot--AMD beta drivers are not unsigned--I would have thought everyone would know by now...;) I'm using Win10x64 version 1709, build 1705--have been in the Insider's beta-test program since 10/2015--only time I have seen AMD drivers fail to support secure boot in all of that time were when Microsoft changed the security *signature* paradigm in a beta build and AMD simply hadn't caught up, yet--still writing for the official releases of Win10. Last time that happened was many months back, and it was temporary with only a couple of beta builds of Win10. I never boot into a secure-boot off state.

Implication in the original post was that AMD beta drivers were unsigned and wouldn't work with secure boot ON, which isn't the case, and I simply wanted to correct that misapprehension...;) Both the betas and the whqls are fully signed and have no problem supporting secure boot--unless Microsoft changes the SHA requirements suddenly--as happened for a couple of the Win10 beta builds. If you weren't in the IP program you'd never have seen a secure-boot failure even once--the drivers were signed--just not properly for the changes Microsoft put into the betas at the time.

Driver signing in Windows 10.

"Beginning with the release of Windows 10, all new Windows 10 kernel mode drivers must be submitted to and digitally signed by the Windows Hardware Developer Center Dashboard portal. Windows 10 will not load new kernel mode drivers which are not signed by the portal."

Driver signing is a fact in Windows 10. Fact. How signatures are implemented I'll have to give you the benefit of the doubt.
 
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6. Re: New AMD Drivers (Sort Of) Nov 14, 2017, 16:44 WaltC
 
headkase wrote on Nov 14, 2017, 01:03:
WaltC wrote on Nov 13, 2017, 21:17:
All of the Crimson drivers install fine with Secure boot on...;) IE, AMD WHQL drivers are not required for secure-boot support. (Where did that come from?...;))
Secure boot is a UEFI feature that goes from cold start to full desktop loaded with a cryptographic chain of signatures from start to end. If a signature fails then the file is not what was signed off by the provider and boot stops. If you're a BIOS system (or have CSM enabled in a UEFI firmware), 32-bit Windows, or have Secure Boot disabled in your firmware THEN you can use non-signed drivers. I believe versions of Windows prior to Windows 10 weren't as strict with Secure Boot. With Windows 10 the three conditions do apply.

The signatures are not limited to Microsoft. Any operating system can have their keys in the firmware to do a Secure Boot. Most mainboards just come with Microsoft keys already in the firmware though, and some mainboards will not let you both change the root signature OR boot without Secure Boot. Those systems, and they do exist, are limited to booting a Microsoft key.

I build my own systems and have for the last 22 years. I Know what secure boot is...;) Have never had an AMD driver refuse to boot into secure boot--AMD beta drivers are not unsigned--I would have thought everyone would know by now...;) I'm using Win10x64 version 1709, build 1705--have been in the Insider's beta-test program since 10/2015--only time I have seen AMD drivers fail to support secure boot in all of that time were when Microsoft changed the security *signature* paradigm in a beta build and AMD simply hadn't caught up, yet--still writing for the official releases of Win10. Last time that happened was many months back, and it was temporary with only a couple of beta builds of Win10. I never boot into a secure-boot off state.

Implication in the original post was that AMD beta drivers were unsigned and wouldn't work with secure boot ON, which isn't the case, and I simply wanted to correct that misapprehension...;) Both the betas and the whqls are fully signed and have no problem supporting secure boot--unless Microsoft changes the SHA requirements suddenly--as happened for a couple of the Win10 beta builds. If you weren't in the IP program you'd never have seen a secure-boot failure even once--the drivers were signed--just not properly for the changes Microsoft put into the betas at the time.
 
Avatar 16008
 
It is well known that I do not make mistakes--so if you should happen across a mistake in anything I have written, be assured that I did not write it!
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5. Re: New AMD Drivers (Sort Of) Nov 14, 2017, 12:43 PacoTaco
 
Beamer wrote on Nov 14, 2017, 09:39:
PacoTaco wrote on Nov 14, 2017, 09:30:
Where are the improvements for CliffyB's Law Breakers - they broke 500 concurrent players during the free weekend! Where is the love AMD, where? Let's move some units you need to keep your finger on the pulse of the industry.

Do you just come here to mock Lawbreakers? Who is more sad, the guy that made a game no one played, or the guy spending so much of his time mocking it based on a grudge that's now over a decade old?

I am always available to do text comedy about Lawbreakers it is always easy, effortless and a lot of fun.

What grudge? Do you think anyone knows who I am? CliffyB knows me? The dream.

Speaking of wasted time: 16443 comments on Blues? Jesus man.

This comment was edited on Nov 14, 2017, 13:08.
 
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4. Re: New AMD Drivers (Sort Of) Nov 14, 2017, 09:39 Beamer
 
PacoTaco wrote on Nov 14, 2017, 09:30:
Where are the improvements for CliffyB's Law Breakers - they broke 500 concurrent players during the free weekend! Where is the love AMD, where? Let's move some units you need to keep your finger on the pulse of the industry.

Do you just come here to mock Lawbreakers? Who is more sad, the guy that made a game no one played, or the guy spending so much of his time mocking it based on a grudge that's now over a decade old?
 
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3. Re: New AMD Drivers (Sort Of) Nov 14, 2017, 09:30 PacoTaco
 
Where are the improvements for CliffyB's Law Breakers - they broke 500 concurrent players during the free weekend! Where is the love AMD, where? Let's move some units you need to keep your finger on the pulse of the industry.  
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2. Re: New AMD Drivers (Sort Of) Nov 14, 2017, 01:03 headkase
 
WaltC wrote on Nov 13, 2017, 21:17:
All of the Crimson drivers install fine with Secure boot on...;) IE, AMD WHQL drivers are not required for secure-boot support. (Where did that come from?...;))
Secure boot is a UEFI feature that goes from cold start to full desktop loaded with a cryptographic chain of signatures from start to end. If a signature fails then the file is not what was signed off by the provider and boot stops. If you're a BIOS system (or have CSM enabled in a UEFI firmware), 32-bit Windows, or have Secure Boot disabled in your firmware THEN you can use non-signed drivers. I believe versions of Windows prior to Windows 10 weren't as strict with Secure Boot. With Windows 10 the three conditions do apply.

The signatures are not limited to Microsoft. Any operating system can have their keys in the firmware to do a Secure Boot. Most mainboards just come with Microsoft keys already in the firmware though, and some mainboards will not let you both change the root signature OR boot without Secure Boot. Those systems, and they do exist, are limited to booting a Microsoft key.

This comment was edited on Nov 14, 2017, 01:14.
 
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1. Re: New AMD Drivers (Sort Of) Nov 13, 2017, 21:17 WaltC
 
All of the Crimson drivers install fine with Secure boot on...;) IE, AMD WHQL drivers are not required for secure-boot support. (Where did that come from?...;))  
Avatar 16008
 
It is well known that I do not make mistakes--so if you should happen across a mistake in anything I have written, be assured that I did not write it!
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