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Morning Interviews

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25. Re: Morning Interviews Sep 17, 2017, 11:32 SlimRam
 
Hate to beat a dead thread buuuut. Regardless of why people may hate Cliff B. the product stands and falls somewhat on it's own merits.

Yes, there are people who hate him for what he is or what he is perceived as (kinda explains any 'celebrity' perception). Is it deserving? Yes or no considering the person's perspective on the individual.

The fact remains that his game is not selling. Regardless of his personal "wealth" as a game designer, he has just released a game that in not popular.

Whether the failing is on him or his team is an unknown until the inevitable 'Why Did Lawbreakers Fail?' article.

I feel for the team at Boss Key because releasing a bomb can't be pleasant and they probably all have families to support. Cliffy IS partially to blame whether people want to admit it or not. Some of his attitude towards PC gamers has been harsh and didn't sit well with certain gamers (myself included). I know that I will NEVER buy a game from his company simply because of who he is. Is this fair, I don't know, but it IS human.

 
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24. Re: Morning Interviews Sep 15, 2017, 19:40 Beamer
 
PacoTaco wrote on Sep 15, 2017, 17:26:
CliffyB has treated many people poorly for decades and made a lot of money despite his shortcomings as a designer, worker, alcoholic, and leader of men. I have no pity for him or the people who follow him.


Beamer wrote on Sep 14, 2017, 22:45:
PacoTaco wrote on Sep 14, 2017, 20:44:
So they followed him to a situation where they got to work on failed project? Are about to get laid off and beg for the jobs at Epic they will never get back? Hmm. Genius.

I will give you a positive spin on it Nexon bought for it to be used outside the western market. Maybe it is doing better there.

As for the US market it had no chance against Blizzard / OverWatch.

Ended up being a B grade me to product they would have done better to take that juicy Tencent money and make another Unreal product not done by the community. With Cliffy leading it with his troop of loyal designers.

A lot of the people that stayed at Epic were super duper happy his drunken ass left. Still happy even after the failure of Fortnight and Paragon. :-)

Cliffy had a chance to be a great designer but the booze and ego ruined him, he also stopped working. The good news is he got a lot of money from the Tencent buy out so he and the other God of Games cover boys are going to be fine, maybe he can join American banging hot Asian chick sailing around China.


I would wager I know more people at Epic than you, and didn't know any who were happy. Which also makes sense, a large, large bulk of the design team quit that day. Some with him, some elsewhere.

You're also moving goalposts here, about the failure of the product. That wasn't your initial statement, it was that he was a drunk and people hated him. Objectively, that isn't true. Not sure what sources you think you have, likely wholly anonymous. I mean, I suppose I am, too, but I've actually been in that building numerous times. Cliff was well liked. Everyone there was well liked.

No, he hasn't, and you seem really angry, offering no proof, not even anecdotes. You can't name people who left, whether due to this or not. You can't name anything specific.

You just hate CliffyB so much you desperately want all of this to be true.
 
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23. Re: Morning Interviews Sep 15, 2017, 17:26 PacoTaco
 
CliffyB has treated many people poorly for decades and made a lot of money despite his shortcomings as a designer, worker, alcoholic, and leader of men. I have no pity for him or the people who follow him.


Beamer wrote on Sep 14, 2017, 22:45:
PacoTaco wrote on Sep 14, 2017, 20:44:
So they followed him to a situation where they got to work on failed project? Are about to get laid off and beg for the jobs at Epic they will never get back? Hmm. Genius.

I will give you a positive spin on it Nexon bought for it to be used outside the western market. Maybe it is doing better there.

As for the US market it had no chance against Blizzard / OverWatch.

Ended up being a B grade me to product they would have done better to take that juicy Tencent money and make another Unreal product not done by the community. With Cliffy leading it with his troop of loyal designers.

A lot of the people that stayed at Epic were super duper happy his drunken ass left. Still happy even after the failure of Fortnight and Paragon. :-)

Cliffy had a chance to be a great designer but the booze and ego ruined him, he also stopped working. The good news is he got a lot of money from the Tencent buy out so he and the other God of Games cover boys are going to be fine, maybe he can join American banging hot Asian chick sailing around China.


I would wager I know more people at Epic than you, and didn't know any who were happy. Which also makes sense, a large, large bulk of the design team quit that day. Some with him, some elsewhere.

You're also moving goalposts here, about the failure of the product. That wasn't your initial statement, it was that he was a drunk and people hated him. Objectively, that isn't true. Not sure what sources you think you have, likely wholly anonymous. I mean, I suppose I am, too, but I've actually been in that building numerous times. Cliff was well liked. Everyone there was well liked.
 
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22. Re: Morning Interviews Sep 14, 2017, 22:45 Beamer
 
PacoTaco wrote on Sep 14, 2017, 20:44:
So they followed him to a situation where they got to work on failed project? Are about to get laid off and beg for the jobs at Epic they will never get back? Hmm. Genius.

I will give you a positive spin on it Nexon bought for it to be used outside the western market. Maybe it is doing better there.

As for the US market it had no chance against Blizzard / OverWatch.

Ended up being a B grade me to product they would have done better to take that juicy Tencent money and make another Unreal product not done by the community. With Cliffy leading it with his troop of loyal designers.

A lot of the people that stayed at Epic were super duper happy his drunken ass left. Still happy even after the failure of Fortnight and Paragon. :-)

Cliffy had a chance to be a great designer but the booze and ego ruined him, he also stopped working. The good news is he got a lot of money from the Tencent buy out so he and the other God of Games cover boys are going to be fine, maybe he can join American banging hot Asian chick sailing around China.


I would wager I know more people at Epic than you, and didn't know any who were happy. Which also makes sense, a large, large bulk of the design team quit that day. Some with him, some elsewhere.

You're also moving goalposts here, about the failure of the product. That wasn't your initial statement, it was that he was a drunk and people hated him. Objectively, that isn't true. Not sure what sources you think you have, likely wholly anonymous. I mean, I suppose I am, too, but I've actually been in that building numerous times. Cliff was well liked. Everyone there was well liked.
 
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Music for the discerning:
http://www.deathwishinc.com
http://www.hydrahead.com
http://www.painkillerrecords.com
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21. Re: Morning Interviews Sep 14, 2017, 21:52 Prez
 
Personally, I admire and dislike Bleszinski in equal measure, but I don't take into account a producer's personality or shortcomings when I'm looking for a game to play. I kind of suspect that the majority of PC gamers are similar in that for most of them who develops what is irrelevant. But Lawbreakers certainly has a lot going against it. It looks pretty bad-ass in motion, and suitably chaotic and fluid, but the whole art direction is kind of 'meh'. Contrasted with Overwatch it just looks utterly bland. It has lots of competition in the FPS competitive shooter genre and it doesn't seem to do anything in particular to set itself apart.

In my specific case, I know I got turned off from Lawbreakers almost immediately with all the talk of how skill-based it is. Reading stories about how it's a "respawn and die" simulator for all but the highest skill veterans of old fashioned first person shooters flat out scared me away from it. I wasn't even that good at twitch shooters in my prime. Now that I'm approaching 50 it's of no interest at all to me. I'm open to playing another multiplayer game besides Overwatch, but I'd like to know going in that I'll be able to contribute in a way other than padding the opposing team's kill count. In Overwatch and Paladins, I always feel I can be of help to the team, even when playing against players with much higher skill levels.
 
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20. Re: Morning Interviews Sep 14, 2017, 20:44 PacoTaco
 
So they followed him to a situation where they got to work on failed project? Are about to get laid off and beg for the jobs at Epic they will never get back? Hmm. Genius.

I will give you a positive spin on it Nexon bought for it to be used outside the western market. Maybe it is doing better there.

As for the US market it had no chance against Blizzard / OverWatch.

Ended up being a B grade me to product they would have done better to take that juicy Tencent money and make another Unreal product not done by the community. With Cliffy leading it with his troop of loyal designers.

A lot of the people that stayed at Epic were super duper happy his drunken ass left. Still happy even after the failure of Fortnight and Paragon. :-)

Cliffy had a chance to be a great designer but the booze and ego ruined him, he also stopped working. The good news is he got a lot of money from the Tencent buy out so he and the other God of Games cover boys are going to be fine, maybe he can join American banging hot Asian chick sailing around China.

 
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19. Re: Morning Interviews Sep 14, 2017, 18:41 Beamer
 
PacoTaco wrote on Sep 14, 2017, 18:08:
Rumor has it that most of the Epic guys had to finish his work for him on Gears and Unreal and do it in a way that didn't make him look bad.

Many of the designers celebrated at Epic the day he left.


I mean, that's an easily disproved rumor fueled solely by people that take things too personally and hate a guy for making games for the wrong platform.

When he quit Epic, so did most of the designers. And, incidentally, a large chunk of them went to work for Boss Key.

Kind of hard to say that he was a terrible alcoholic leader no one wanted to work for when so many followed him out the door to a new company...
 
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http://www.hydrahead.com
http://www.painkillerrecords.com
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18. Re: Morning Interviews Sep 14, 2017, 18:35 The Half Elf
 
Creston wrote on Sep 14, 2017, 16:18:
SlimRam wrote on Sep 14, 2017, 11:20:
"... he said he wants to be "less of a dick" with his interactions with people online."


Wow, you mean that would someday come back to bite you in the ass, cliffy?

I will let Dr Cox and Laverne's choir summarize my feelings.


That was..... AWESOME.....

*adds Scrubs to long list of stuff I want to watch but never will*
 
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17. Re: Morning Interviews Sep 14, 2017, 18:10 jdreyer
 
Slick wrote on Sep 14, 2017, 14:45:
jdreyer wrote on Sep 14, 2017, 13:07:
There are a ton of reasons why this game fails on PC.

1. Too much competition in the FPS realm right now with PUBG, the ever-present CS:GO, TF2, R6, etc.

This is a bullshit argument (most of the rest of your arguments are bullshit too).Every year in gaming is the year with the "most FPS players ever". There is room for more than 4-5 games. I don't remember only 4 Drama movies being released last year because of the "over saturation of the Drama genre in movies". I don't remember only 5 Political Humour books being published in the last year cause everyone only reads one of 5 books.

Only gamers (particularly PC gamers) have this tribal herd mentality. That's why Overwatch has a billion players, and LB has zero. One game isn't fundamentally better than the other, they're 2 different arena games.

I wonder how much of that is people playing thinking they're going to be an e-sports champion with a Bliz game, or somehow make a career as a youtube/twitch streamer. I miss when people just played games for fun. And you can't tell me that from an objective perspective OW is a billion times more fun than LB.
1. Most people are playing for fun. Aspiring esport players/streamers are a tiny fraction.

2. Games and movies have totally different monetary and time requirements. Thus multiple similar movies in a year is entirely possible. That being said, studios are very careful about launch Windows to maximize profits. The same applies to games and Cliffy was not careful.

3. There is no room for four or five more AAA online shooters. That's nuts. There are established franchises that launch yearly or biannually. There are also long running established franchises. Millions of gamers only get a few games a year to play with their friends. Maybe it's CoD, or BF or PUBG. To break into this field you need something special. Lawbreakers may be a fine game, but there's nothing special about it.

4. Despite Cliffy's claims, the game is not doing well on console either. Gamespot couldn't get a game going for two weeks on ps4.

5. And if there is a group of gamers not beholden to group think, it's PC gamers. PC gaming has the most diverse set of games and gamers of any platform.

Lawbreakers is not popular for the reasons I laid out. I'm sure there are others, but they all combine to sink the product, both in terms of sales and players.
 
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16. Re: Morning Interviews Sep 14, 2017, 18:08 PacoTaco
 
Lovely day in the game industry.

Cliffy needs to start streaming Law Donkey so it will have more then 100 viewers on twitch.tv.

The only question left on this "effort" is who did Cliffy's job for him? Had to be tough on the bastards, had to dodge in between his raging alcoholic decisions while in the fetal position avoiding his cry baby attitude.


Rumor has it that most of the Epic guys had to finish his work for him on Gears and Unreal and do it in a way that didn't make him look bad.

Many of the designers celebrated at Epic the day he left.

 
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15. Re: Morning Interviews Sep 14, 2017, 16:45 Redmask
 
It's not a bad game but they marketed it all wrong with the whole ELITE PLAYERS COME HERE bit. We're in a market now where the elites all have kids and are developing RSI & arthritis. The kids are fucking noobs and love their aim assist friendly games. You aren't going to mock them into trying your game by telling them how hard it is, this shit isn't Dark Souls.

Then there's the whole part where its a completely unoriginal effort. When he conceptualized this I get that Overwatch wasn't even out but you need to roll with the punches man. Why is this better than every other FPS out there right now? What is the hook? It has nothing, its just a really competent FPS. Ok cool but no one really cares because its an above average shooter in a market filled with them.
 
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14. Re: Morning Interviews Sep 14, 2017, 16:30 Creston
 
HoSpanky wrote on Sep 14, 2017, 12:51:
Hate him or not, he's actually right on his PS4/PC thing. I swear most PC gamers spend as much time bitching about games as playing them.

Yes, and the PS4 forum are a happy haven of heavenly delight, where everyone waxes poetic about the amazing games they're playing and how much fun they're having?

Also, for all that he claims that "PS4 is fine.", the article itself states, like two paragraphs later: One of the big issues with low player figures is long matchmaking times. Here in Australia, GameSpot has not been able to find a match on PS4 at all over the past two weeks after multiple attempts. We stopped trying the last time after 45+ minutes of matchmaking.

Now, it's Australia, so maybe he means it's fine in the US, but it sure doesn't seem fine.


Also, three random quotes:

"I didn't want to do the exact same stuff everybody else did. The funny thing was, making a character-based, class based shooter

I didn't want to do the same stuff everybody else did, so I made a character-based, class-based shooter, and released it right around the time of Destiny 2.

That's one of the things that I consider my strengths: I am willing to admit when I am wrong.

Haha, good one, Cliff. Oh wait, you were serious? AAAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAA.


"The problem with what we were trying to pull off with this company and this title was shipping a quality product with a team of 65 people without ruining everybody's marriages,"

Okay, you know what? That's awesome. I bow to you, sir.
 
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13. Re: Morning Interviews Sep 14, 2017, 16:18 Creston
 
SlimRam wrote on Sep 14, 2017, 11:20:
"... he said he wants to be "less of a dick" with his interactions with people online."


Wow, you mean that would someday come back to bite you in the ass, cliffy?

I will let Dr Cox and Laverne's choir summarize my feelings.

 
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12. Re: Morning Interviews Sep 14, 2017, 16:16 Creston
 
Or, you know, you could admit that it's not selling, that you made a mistake, and move on.
 
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11. Re: Morning Interviews Sep 14, 2017, 14:49 Slick
 
"There is a situation where players look at numbers on Steam; that doesn't happen on PlayStation 4. I don't have the numbers in front of me, but you look at PC, [concurrent user] health versus PS4, PS4 is doing fine," he said. "People cough up 30 bucks and hop online and they don't overthink it. On PC there is you wanting to declare something a success or a bomb by this internet culture that loves to just observe things."

Say what you want about his prickly demeanour, this guy is one of the only ones in the industry who isn't afraid to call shit like it is. Nobody looks at player counts on consoles. Meanwhile, us PC players just sit here and snipe at the OBVIOUS FAILURE of this game from afar, without most of us having even played it. This is indeed a failure, but really it's a failure of PC gamers.

I'm becoming more and more confident in my Xbox One X pre-order decision every day.
 
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10. Re: Morning Interviews Sep 14, 2017, 14:45 Slick
 
jdreyer wrote on Sep 14, 2017, 13:07:
There are a ton of reasons why this game fails on PC.

1. Too much competition in the FPS realm right now with PUBG, the ever-present CS:GO, TF2, R6, etc.

This is a bullshit argument (most of the rest of your arguments are bullshit too).Every year in gaming is the year with the "most FPS players ever". There is room for more than 4-5 games. I don't remember only 4 Drama movies being released last year because of the "over saturation of the Drama genre in movies". I don't remember only 5 Political Humour books being published in the last year cause everyone only reads one of 5 books.

Only gamers (particularly PC gamers) have this tribal herd mentality. That's why Overwatch has a billion players, and LB has zero. One game isn't fundamentally better than the other, they're 2 different arena games.

I wonder how much of that is people playing thinking they're going to be an e-sports champion with a Bliz game, or somehow make a career as a youtube/twitch streamer. I miss when people just played games for fun. And you can't tell me that from an objective perspective OW is a billion times more fun than LB.
 
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(Regarding SW:Battlefront II) Frostshite is a horrible piece of shit engine that makes games look artificial as if you were playing on a movie set instead of the actual location. -CJ_Parker
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9. Re: Morning Interviews Sep 14, 2017, 14:10 nomoreshite
 
jdreyer wrote on Sep 14, 2017, 13:07:
There are a ton of reasons why this game fails on PC.

1. Too much competition in the FPS realm right now with PUBG, the ever-present CS:GO, TF2, R6, etc.

2. Lack of differentiation. Game looks generic.

3. Lack of vehicles. This is a personal preference on my part, but also ties back to differentiation.

4. No SP-offline or bots. Some of us are anti-social, or would like to know we can play when no one is online.

5. "Edgy" dude-bro attitude of the game. That was 2004. We're past that today.

6. Lack of lore or setting. Those Overwatch shorts have millions of views, and do a great job setting up the world and it's characters, even if none of it shows up in actual gameplay.

7. Cliffy's personality and comments, which has a long history with PC gamers.

8. Lame name. "Lawbreakers?" Really?

you forgot 9. it's shit!
 
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8. Re: Morning Interviews Sep 14, 2017, 14:04 Angrius Maximis
 
""I Have To Keep This Game Alive.""

He did, its called Overwatch
 
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7. Re: Morning Interviews Sep 14, 2017, 13:07 jdreyer
 
There are a ton of reasons why this game fails on PC.

1. Too much competition in the FPS realm right now with PUBG, the ever-present CS:GO, TF2, R6, etc.

2. Lack of differentiation. Game looks generic.

3. Lack of vehicles. This is a personal preference on my part, but also ties back to differentiation.

4. No SP-offline or bots. Some of us are anti-social, or would like to know we can play when no one is online.

5. "Edgy" dude-bro attitude of the game. That was 2004. We're past that today.

6. Lack of lore or setting. Those Overwatch shorts have millions of views, and do a great job setting up the world and it's characters, even if none of it shows up in actual gameplay.

7. Cliffy's personality and comments, which has a long history with PC gamers.

8. Lame name. "Lawbreakers?" Really?
 
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6. Re: Morning Interviews Sep 14, 2017, 12:51 jdreyer
 
SlimRam wrote on Sep 14, 2017, 11:20:
"... he said he wants to be "less of a dick" with his interactions with people online."

No problem Cliff, just never text or interview ever again.

Reminds me of former attorney general Alberto Gonzales.
 
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