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22. Re: Sunday Tech Bits Sep 5, 2017, 09:33 wtf_man
 
Ludomancer wrote on Sep 4, 2017, 11:14:
wtf_man wrote on Sep 3, 2017, 18:57:
Just made the ultimate Windows 10 with NTLITE.

OH, please tell me you documented your process somewhere! This information available for people to follow along? I used to make my own Win2k, WinXP and Win7 installs. I can't upgrade to 10, I refuse to because of the "telemetry".

I really, really miss sub-1GB OS installs that run perfectly find with only a few hundred MB of RAM. Seriously no fucking excuse for today's considerable bloat. I would honestly love you if you shared the software and steps you took to make your build.

I don't have the exact steps written down... but the basics are:

1. buy NTLite
2. get the Enterprise LTSB from MSDN/Visual Studio subscriptions (Or have a friend get the ISO for you) Enterprise LTSB has the least amount of crap in it.
3. use 7-zip to unpack the ISO into a folder.
4. Run NTLite and mount your folder. go into compatibility and uncheck cortana, windows update, windows store and app support, and recommended. ("Compatibility" in NTLite is a safety measure that locks components for removal, so you have to uncheck the relative boxes before you can remove certain components)
5. remove all the components you don't want.
6. build the new ISO.
7. Install it on a VM.
8. install NTLITE and remove the rest of the components that you don't want (Some can only be removed after an installation). Add the software you want to include. (Since I removed Internet Explorer, I added Chrome)
9. sysprep your new image.
10. create a WDS server Virtual Machine (can download server trial from MS for free) to capture the image and have the ability image any of your machines.


That said... it looks like that tool that Redeye9 just linked (MSMG) will do a majority of it for free.
 
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21. Re: Sunday Tech Bits Sep 4, 2017, 18:12 Burrito of Peace
 
NewMaxx wrote on Sep 4, 2017, 10:37:
All my VMs are Linux of course but my server would be, too, if I didn't rely on so much Windows software for the pre-existing setup. Microsoft is at least aware of these issues and supposedly will be changing their approach. I think we've heard that before...

Is there a particular reason why you can't migrate that bare metal install to a VM outside of perhaps a lack of convenience?

Creston wrote on Sep 4, 2017, 12:49:
Though, to be fair, you really should have a BDC or two.

And we do, but the point is that I or my fellow sysadmins shouldn't have to juggle bullshit "active hours" or have our servers reboot without our consent or active involvement.
 
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20. Re: Sunday Tech Bits Sep 4, 2017, 17:56 RedEye9
 
jdreyer wrote on Sep 4, 2017, 11:34:
Logging in.
And this http://www.majorgeeks.com/files/details/msmg_toolkit.html
 
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19. Re: Sunday Tech Bits Sep 4, 2017, 12:49 Creston
 
Burrito of Peace wrote on Sep 4, 2017, 09:30:
Y'all think Win10 is bad about forced reboots? Try Server 2016 which has the same forced reboot policy. "B...b...but you can set active hours!" Yeah, about that, see when you have a PDC and you have users that access your network 24/7/365 from both local and remote locations and you use AD as your authentication schema, that becomes problematic.

LOL, way to go MS. Assclowns.

Though, to be fair, you really should have a BDC or two.
 
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18. Re: Sunday Tech Bits Sep 4, 2017, 12:47 Creston
 
SlimRam wrote on Sep 3, 2017, 16:31:
jdreyer wrote on Sep 3, 2017, 16:12:
Windows 10 has so many annoying intermittent issues that Win 7 never had.
- put to sleep, and it will hang indefinitely with the hard drive running. Have to reboot.
- wakes up from sleep and the network driver is completely missing. Not deactivated, but gone entirely. Have to reboot.
- sometimes it loses the ability to recognize USB devices. Even if I replug them, it won't see them. Have to reboot.

This was a clean install. My hardware is pretty standard. I don't have a lot of software other than games loaded.

There's some nasty malware that has been downloaded to certain computers from a particular website. It apparently does everything you described and more. I remember reading that the executable file was something like StarCitizen.exe.

Hahaha, awesome.

Btw, jd, most of those bugs you described have been in previous versions of Windows as well. They're not just 10 specific, they're Windows specific. Microsoft simply refuses to fix their shitty code. I've had Windows forget that I have a sound card installed since the days of Windows 98

 
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17. Re: Sunday Tech Bits Sep 4, 2017, 11:34 jdreyer
 
Logging in.  
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16. Re: Sunday Tech Bits Sep 4, 2017, 11:14 Ludomancer
 
wtf_man wrote on Sep 3, 2017, 18:57:
Just made the ultimate Windows 10 with NTLITE.

OH, please tell me you documented your process somewhere! This information available for people to follow along? I used to make my own Win2k, WinXP and Win7 installs. I can't upgrade to 10, I refuse to because of the "telemetry".

I really, really miss sub-1GB OS installs that run perfectly find with only a few hundred MB of RAM. Seriously no fucking excuse for today's considerable bloat. I would honestly love you if you shared the software and steps you took to make your build.

 
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15. Re: Sunday Tech Bits Sep 4, 2017, 10:37 NewMaxx
 
Burrito of Peace wrote on Sep 4, 2017, 09:30:
Y'all think Win10 is bad about forced reboots? Try Server 2016 which has the same forced reboot policy. "B...b...but you can set active hours!" Yeah, about that, see when you have a PDC and you have users that access your network 24/7/365 from both local and remote locations and you use AD as your authentication schema, that becomes problematic.

In a way, though, it has been a blessing in disguise. It has finally woken up some of my fellow sysadmins who have had their heads shoved way up MS' ass and we're looking at better, Linux based solutions for a lot of what we do.

Pretty much. I run Enterprise on my main workstation and it's been a pretty poor experience. I unfortunately have a lot of purchased software that runs on Windows so I tossed it on my one server and that has proven to be a mistake, definitely a lot more downtime. All my VMs are Linux of course but my server would be, too, if I didn't rely on so much Windows software for the pre-existing setup. Microsoft is at least aware of these issues and supposedly will be changing their approach. I think we've heard that before...
 
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14. Re: Sunday Tech Bits Sep 4, 2017, 10:34 NewMaxx
 
MeanJim wrote on Sep 4, 2017, 00:27:
So it's the Creators Update that's being pushed out to everyone next month that breaks startup programs? Great, more fun to look forward to...

The upcoming update is the second (Fall) Creators Update. I'm an early adopter and a power user so I have issues that most people won't, but now we have options like the bloatware free edition and Microsoft will be allowing an opt-out on pushed updates which were a large source of concern. The average user won't have too many issues (or really any more than past Windows OS) but it's worth exercising some caution before jumping on updates.
 
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13. Re: Sunday Tech Bits Sep 4, 2017, 09:30 Burrito of Peace
 
Y'all think Win10 is bad about forced reboots? Try Server 2016 which has the same forced reboot policy. "B...b...but you can set active hours!" Yeah, about that, see when you have a PDC and you have users that access your network 24/7/365 from both local and remote locations and you use AD as your authentication schema, that becomes problematic.

In a way, though, it has been a blessing in disguise. It has finally woken up some of my fellow sysadmins who have had their heads shoved way up MS' ass and we're looking at better, Linux based solutions for a lot of what we do.
 
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12. Re: Sunday Tech Bits Sep 4, 2017, 00:27 MeanJim
 
NewMaxx wrote on Sep 3, 2017, 21:27:
MeanJim wrote on Sep 3, 2017, 19:28:
I generally like a clean boot and don't run things on startup, but I do have a couple of programs that I set to run at startup and no update stopped them.

The Creators Update broke a number of methods used for services such as NSSM. As I said we did find workarounds for all the issues but when you're running a server doing tons of things and it reboots from an update with half its shit not running it's a tad inconvenient. I had no problem with it on my main machines but other updates did cause various issues. The USB issue I mentioned was one linked to the Enterprise version (which I run on my workstation) as they didn't roll out the update like they do on consumer machines and the manual update was borked. The backup issue was caused because they essentially use the Windows 7 form of backup but when you work with UEFI it can mess it up.

I never said these were typical issues but for any serious user it's been a drain on resources. Like I said - it's fine for gaming but I'd steer clear of it otherwise. If you use it for a dedicated gaming machine or for light work, sure, but to say the updates haven't been a complete f'n mess (pardon my language) for serious work is a different matter...I could rally off a half dozen other issues in that arena.

So it's the Creators Update that's being pushed out to everyone next month that breaks startup programs? Great, more fun to look forward to...
 
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11. Re: Sunday Tech Bits Sep 3, 2017, 22:57 Beamer
 
jdreyer wrote on Sep 3, 2017, 16:12:
Windows 10 has so many annoying intermittent issues that Win 7 never had.
- put to sleep, and it will hang indefinitely with the hard drive running. Have to reboot.
- wakes up from sleep and the network driver is completely missing. Not deactivated, but gone entirely. Have to reboot.
- sometimes it loses the ability to recognize USB devices. Even if I replug them, it won't see them. Have to reboot.

This was a clean install. My hardware is pretty standard. I don't have a lot of software other than games loaded.

My work pc had all those issues with windows 7. The hanging was a huge issue - I'd close the lid and it would just hang. I'd get into work the next day with a dead laptop.

With windows 10 it all stopped. So weird.
 
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10. Re: Sunday Tech Bits Sep 3, 2017, 21:50 jdreyer
 
NewMaxx wrote on Sep 3, 2017, 21:34:
wtf_man wrote on Sep 3, 2017, 18:57:
So what's the catch? I removed Windows updates. Why? Because it will break the first time one of those stupid cumulative updates tries to install.

Bingo, this guy gets it. Major Geeks's Bloatware Free edition is a good image to start with if anyone is curious.

Very cool. Thanks. I guess we should wait for the next one since there is a major Windows update imminent.
 
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9. Re: Sunday Tech Bits Sep 3, 2017, 21:34 NewMaxx
 
wtf_man wrote on Sep 3, 2017, 18:57:
So what's the catch? I removed Windows updates. Why? Because it will break the first time one of those stupid cumulative updates tries to install.

Bingo, this guy gets it. Major Geeks's Bloatware Free edition is a good image to start with if anyone is curious.
 
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8. Re: Sunday Tech Bits Sep 3, 2017, 21:27 NewMaxx
 
MeanJim wrote on Sep 3, 2017, 19:28:
I generally like a clean boot and don't run things on startup, but I do have a couple of programs that I set to run at startup and no update stopped them.

The Creators Update broke a number of methods used for services such as NSSM. As I said we did find workarounds for all the issues but when you're running a server doing tons of things and it reboots from an update with half its shit not running it's a tad inconvenient. I had no problem with it on my main machines but other updates did cause various issues. The USB issue I mentioned was one linked to the Enterprise version (which I run on my workstation) as they didn't roll out the update like they do on consumer machines and the manual update was borked. The backup issue was caused because they essentially use the Windows 7 form of backup but when you work with UEFI it can mess it up.

I never said these were typical issues but for any serious user it's been a drain on resources. Like I said - it's fine for gaming but I'd steer clear of it otherwise. If you use it for a dedicated gaming machine or for light work, sure, but to say the updates haven't been a complete f'n mess (pardon my language) for serious work is a different matter...I could rally off a half dozen other issues in that arena.
 
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7. Re: Sunday Tech Bits Sep 3, 2017, 20:51 RedEye9
 
wtf_man wrote on Sep 3, 2017, 18:57:
Just made the ultimate Windows 10 with NTLITE.

Took 2016 Enterprise LTSB, and stripped everything out....including cortana (not just disabled... never installed), all windows reporting and telemetry, cloud host experience, one-drive, all metro apps, search, push notifications, internet explorer, edge already gone, windows updates etc. etc. etc.

The thing boots to using around 400MB of RAM, doesn't phone home, and the start menu still works! Installed Chrome since there is no web browser.

So what's the catch? I removed Windows updates. Why? Because it will break the first time one of those stupid cumulative updates tries to install.

However, that's not necessarily a bad thing. One can still get critical updates via the Microsoft catalog.

Right now I'm just using it in a virtual box on my *nix box for being able to vpn and rdp into work.

But I may eventually run it on my gaming rig if there's a point that 7 isn't supported for games anymore.
You truly have L337 skills.
 
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6. Re: Sunday Tech Bits Sep 3, 2017, 19:28 MeanJim
 
NewMaxx wrote on Sep 3, 2017, 16:58:
Windows 10 has so many annoying intermittent issues that Win 7 never had.
- put to sleep, and it will hang indefinitely with the hard drive running. Have to reboot.
- wakes up from sleep and the network driver is completely missing. Not deactivated, but gone entirely. Have to reboot.
- sometimes it loses the ability to recognize USB devices. Even if I replug them, it won't see them. Have to reboot.

This was a clean install. My hardware is pretty standard. I don't have a lot of software other than games loaded.

jdreyer wrote on Sep 3, 2017, 16:12:
I had two major problems with it so far. Well, actually, three. The first was when I upgraded to the first major pack and it removed my USB filters. This wiped all connected USB drives (my eSATA ones were fine) so I had to restore one or two TB manually. Later, when restoring a backup, it wrote to the wrong drive (when it rebooted to the process) and that drive was one of two in a RAID-0. Again, had to restore 1-2 TB of shit because of that. Third, I stupidly put it on my one server, where I discovered that update basically gimped your ability to directly run things on startup. Yes there are ways around that but it's ridiculous that I was cost about a week of work over those issues in the last YEAR. I did get it for gaming reasons but so far there's really no gain for that despite the promises, even on proper DX12 cards (AMD) you don't really gain anything you just lose less.

I've had issues with Win10, but none of those. I put my system to sleep when I'm not home or sleeping myself, and usually reboot only once a month. I've had a few hangs when it tries to sleep, but it has always been caused by a misbehaving program.

I generally like a clean boot and don't run things on startup, but I do have a couple of programs that I set to run at startup and no update stopped them.
 
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5. Re: Sunday Tech Bits Sep 3, 2017, 18:57 wtf_man
 
Just made the ultimate Windows 10 with NTLITE.

Took 2016 Enterprise LTSB, and stripped everything out....including cortana (not just disabled... never installed), all windows reporting and telemetry, cloud host experience, one-drive, all metro apps, search, push notifications, internet explorer, edge already gone, windows updates etc. etc. etc.

The thing boots to using around 400MB of RAM, doesn't phone home, and the start menu still works! Installed Chrome since there is no web browser.

So what's the catch? I removed Windows updates. Why? Because it will break the first time one of those stupid cumulative updates tries to install.

However, that's not necessarily a bad thing. One can still get critical updates via the Microsoft catalog.

Right now I'm just using it in a virtual box on my *nix box for being able to vpn and rdp into work.

But I may eventually run it on my gaming rig if there's a point that 7 isn't supported for games anymore.
 
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Get your games from GOG DAMMIT!
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4. Re: Sunday Tech Bits Sep 3, 2017, 17:27 Jivaro
 
SlimRam wrote on Sep 3, 2017, 16:31:
jdreyer wrote on Sep 3, 2017, 16:12:
Windows 10 has so many annoying intermittent issues that Win 7 never had.
- put to sleep, and it will hang indefinitely with the hard drive running. Have to reboot.
- wakes up from sleep and the network driver is completely missing. Not deactivated, but gone entirely. Have to reboot.
- sometimes it loses the ability to recognize USB devices. Even if I replug them, it won't see them. Have to reboot.

This was a clean install. My hardware is pretty standard. I don't have a lot of software other than games loaded.

There's some nasty malware that has been downloaded to certain computers from a particular website. It apparently does everything you described and more. I remember reading that the executable file was something like StarCitizen.exe.

*spits soda all over keyboard*

lol..awesome...
 
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3. Re: Sunday Tech Bits Sep 3, 2017, 16:58 NewMaxx
 
jdreyer wrote on Sep 3, 2017, 16:12:
Windows 10 has so many annoying intermittent issues that Win 7 never had.
- put to sleep, and it will hang indefinitely with the hard drive running. Have to reboot.
- wakes up from sleep and the network driver is completely missing. Not deactivated, but gone entirely. Have to reboot.
- sometimes it loses the ability to recognize USB devices. Even if I replug them, it won't see them. Have to reboot.

This was a clean install. My hardware is pretty standard. I don't have a lot of software other than games loaded.

I had two major problems with it so far. Well, actually, three. The first was when I upgraded to the first major pack and it removed my USB filters. This wiped all connected USB drives (my eSATA ones were fine) so I had to restore one or two TB manually. Later, when restoring a backup, it wrote to the wrong drive (when it rebooted to the process) and that drive was one of two in a RAID-0. Again, had to restore 1-2 TB of shit because of that. Third, I stupidly put it on my one server, where I discovered that update basically gimped your ability to directly run things on startup. Yes there are ways around that but it's ridiculous that I was cost about a week of work over those issues in the last YEAR. I did get it for gaming reasons but so far there's really no gain for that despite the promises, even on proper DX12 cards (AMD) you don't really gain anything you just lose less.
 
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