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Out of the Blue

Congrats to the NBA champs, as well as the NHL champs, though I'll stick to avoiding spoilers for the DVR crowd. You'd think at some point the NBA and NHL would take measures to keep their postseasons from drowning each other out, but I guess they're okay with things as they are. But it's not like they need to accommodate the weather, as these are both indoor sports.

Championship Links: Thanks Ant and Acleacius.
Play: Color Switch: Challenges.
Link: The Sopranos anniversary: TV's most heartbreaking death explained. Thanks Capella.
Story: Former NBA bad boy Rodman is back in North Korea.
Science: Jupiter Now Has 69 Moons. Thanks Boing Boing.
'Seductive names' make vegetables more appealing.
Media: Best of Mayor Adam West.
Bear Cubs Climb Fence.
Somedays you just can't get rid of a bomb.

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21. Re: Out of the Blue Jun 14, 2017, 14:49 jdreyer
 
MoreLuckThanSkill wrote on Jun 14, 2017, 09:24:
RedEye9 wrote on Jun 14, 2017, 08:09:
I just love guns, if there is one thing America needs it's more of them. Remember to support the outdated 2nd Amendment.

Which well regulated militia(s) have you joined?


Also, you know the world is in a sorry state when Dennis Rodman is the USA's best potential diplomat with North Korea.

Just leave Dennis alone!

 
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20. Re: Out of the Blue Jun 14, 2017, 09:24 MoreLuckThanSkill
 
RedEye9 wrote on Jun 14, 2017, 08:09:
I just love guns, if there is one thing America needs it's more of them. Remember to support the outdated 2nd Amendment.

Which well regulated militia(s) have you joined?


Also, you know the world is in a sorry state when Dennis Rodman is the USA's best potential diplomat with North Korea.
 
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19. Re: Out of the Blue Jun 14, 2017, 08:09 RedEye9
 

I just love guns, if there is one thing America needs it's more of them. Remember to support the outdated 2nd Amendment.
 
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18. Re: Out of the Blue Jun 14, 2017, 07:23 Mr. Tact
 
jdreyer wrote on Jun 14, 2017, 04:05:
Democrats may sweep to power during the 2018 elections, and they might impeach Trump though.
I'd love to see the Ds have a sweeping win in the 2018 elections. However, I'll believe it when I see it.
 
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17. Re: Out of the Blue Jun 14, 2017, 04:09 jdreyer
 
Retired wrote on Jun 13, 2017, 23:27:
2 Things:

I laugh at the thought that Biden is considering running for president, considering (from a drinkers stand point) he hasn't been sober 1 day of his life for the last 20 years.

Can you imagine the level of scrutiny every president would have had if there was internet and anon monkeys everywhere the past 100 years?
Hey, we had an Alzheimer's president. Why not a drunk one too?
 
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16. Re: Out of the Blue Jun 14, 2017, 04:05 jdreyer
 
Flatline wrote on Jun 13, 2017, 16:20:

Considering the amount of water the GOP is carrying for him in the House especially, it's not necessarily "that stupid".

I mean holy hell Paul Ryan actually came out and said basically Trump committed obstruction of justice but come on he's new at this give him a pass.

Party before country: your modern GOP.

So until Paul Ryan and the entire GOP stops carrying water for Trump, he's basically invulnerable.
Fixed.

That being said, if Trump has two neurons in his head and access to unfiltered, honest media coverage, he can see the writing on the wall.
He only watches Fox, so he'll never see honest media coverage.

The GOP, especially in the Senate, are starting to realize that he's toxic to the party. As soon as they repeal the ACA and pass massive tax cuts for the wealthy, his main purpose is largely over with as far as the GOP is concerned. They can dispose of him, *and* blame him publicly for the toxicity of their policies.
I disagree here. Pence would easily be just as pliable, and much less erratic and embarrassing (well, except for calling his wife "mother"). Trump has a solid base that believes he can do no wrong, and Republicans shit on them at their peril.


So if I was a betting man, I'd bet that Trump would be facing impeachment in the next 12 months. It'll go something like this:

1. McConnel has stated he wants the ACA bill voted on before July 4th. If that passes, that's 1/2 of the pet projects they want done.
2. You'll see a tax code overhaul by the end of the year. Trump will sign it to great fanfare and will strut like a peacock.
3. Late end of the year/beginning of 2018 you have many investigations coming to fruition all of a sudden. Trump's cabinet at the very least will be implicated and the GOP all of a sudden will start openly questioning Trump's judgement.
4. Trump gets impeached. It may be pretty quick. He gets booted out in time for the GOP to run in the mid-terms as the adults in the room, so devoted to the country they'd impeach their own president.
5. Pence is sworn in and serves out the first term passing the more cultural GOP agenda, which goes through with less public upheaval because he'll seem absolutely normal compared to the dumpster fire that Trump is. He runs in 2020 as having righted the ship that Trump capsized.
6. If Pence gets impeached too, then we swear in President Paul Ryan. See step 5.

Or...

1. The ACA doesn't pass the Senate and dies.
2. Realizing that the tax cuts are existentially based on the ACA repeal, the GOP pushes through some tax cuts, either middling ones permanently or big ones on a 10 year time frame to take advantage of reconciliation, and then cut their losses and prepare to maintain the house and senate in 2018, and step 3 from above starts in the fall instead of the end of the year.
The Republicans will never impeach Trump. No congress has ever impeached a sitting president of the same party in the history of the USA. Democrats may sweep to power during the 2018 elections, and they might impeach Trump though.
 
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15. Re: Out of the Blue Jun 14, 2017, 03:52 jdreyer
 
NKD wrote on Jun 13, 2017, 15:24:
There's no way Trump can be that stupid can he?

Please post something that demonstrates that Trump is not stupid.

*JDreyer gets a case of Deschutes and starts binging all 28 seasons of The Simpsons. He knows he'll be waiting a while.*
 
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14. Re: Out of the Blue Jun 13, 2017, 23:27 Retired
 
2 Things:

I laugh at the thought that Biden is considering running for president, considering (from a drinkers stand point) he hasn't been sober 1 day of his life for the last 20 years.

Can you imagine the level of scrutiny every president would have had if there was internet and anon monkeys everywhere the past 100 years?

We live in a very strange world.

/We could have impeached every president the last 100 years.....


Somedays you just can't get rid of a bomb.
Use this quote a lot, always have, one of the best moments from the Batman movie.
 
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13. Re: Out of the Blue Jun 13, 2017, 18:02 NKD
 
RedEye9 wrote on Jun 13, 2017, 16:20:
At least President Pence would be a known level of crazy.

This is what I don't understand about people who characterize the opposition to Trump as pure partisan bias. Those of us hoping for a Trump impeachment are hoping for President Mike "Christian Sharia Law" Pence, who by any measure MUST be further to the right than Trump.

I imagine that other than the 2nd Amendment there's basically nothing I agree with Pence on, but at least he wouldn't humiliate our country at every turn through sheer incompetence.

I can't see any valid argument where Trump is better for the Republicans than Pence. The Republican base is never going to go (D) and all the independents are already fleeing to the left. Independents are breaking left at a ratio of like 3:1 or something. I think they are waiting to see if they can time it so that they minimize their losses in 2018.

This comment was edited on Jun 13, 2017, 18:15.
 
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12. Re: Out of the Blue Jun 13, 2017, 17:01 Wallshadows
 
RedEye9 wrote on Jun 13, 2017, 16:20:
At least President Pence would be a known level of crazy.

Whenever I think of Pence I think of Emperor Palps channeling his Force Lightning.
 
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11. Re: Out of the Blue Jun 13, 2017, 16:20 RedEye9
 
Wouldn't the best thing for America be if donnie fired Mueller, that would get us just one step closer to impeachmentville.

Pelosi predicts Trump will just 'self-impeach', while less preferable than self-immolation, it's a huge step in the right direction.

At least President Pence would be a known level of crazy.

This comment was edited on Jun 13, 2017, 17:02.
 
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10. Re: Out of the Blue Jun 13, 2017, 16:20 Flatline
 
NKD wrote on Jun 13, 2017, 15:24:
There's no way Trump can be that stupid can he? If Trump fires Mueller he might as well just resign on the same piece of paper.

Considering the amount of water the GOP is carrying for him in the House especially, it's not necessarily "that stupid".

I mean holy hell Paul Ryan actually came out and said basically Trump committed obstruction of justice but come on he's new at this give him a pass.

The only remedy against a sitting president for anything is pretty much impeachment, because it's questionable if criminal charges can be brought against the executive while in office. And prosecuting any subordinates means that Trump can just pardon them. This is a purely political process. So until Paul Ryan stops carrying water for Trump, he's basically invulnerable.

That being said, if Trump has two neurons in his head and access to unfiltered, honest media coverage, he can see the writing on the wall. The GOP, especially in the Senate, are starting to realize that he's toxic to the party. As soon as they repeal the ACA and pass massive tax cuts for the wealthy, his main purpose is largely over with as far as the GOP is concerned. They can dispose of him, *and* blame him publicly for the toxicity of their policies.

This has been their game all along I believe. I also used to believe that it'd be a race between the GOP getting their pet legislation through vs Trump consolidating his power over government. But now I don't think Trump has the mindset to see that and organize a dictatorial power grab. He literally just reacts in the moment, with little care as to the past or the future.

So if I was a betting man, I'd bet that Trump would be facing impeachment in the next 12 months. It'll go something like this:

1. McConnel has stated he wants the ACA bill voted on before July 4th. If that passes, that's 1/2 of the pet projects they want done.
2. You'll see a tax code overhaul by the end of the year. Trump will sign it to great fanfare and will strut like a peacock.
3. Late end of the year/beginning of 2018 you have many investigations coming to fruition all of a sudden. Trump's cabinet at the very least will be implicated and the GOP all of a sudden will start openly questioning Trump's judgement.
4. Trump gets impeached. It may be pretty quick. He gets booted out in time for the GOP to run in the mid-terms as the adults in the room, so devoted to the country they'd impeach their own president.
5. Pence is sworn in and serves out the first term passing the more cultural GOP agenda, which goes through with less public upheaval because he'll seem absolutely normal compared to the dumpster fire that Trump is. He runs in 2020 as having righted the ship that Trump capsized.
6. If Pence gets impeached too, then we swear in President Paul Ryan. See step 5.

Or...

1. The ACA doesn't pass the Senate and dies.
2. Realizing that the tax cuts are existentially based on the ACA repeal, the GOP pushes through some tax cuts, either middling ones permanently or big ones on a 10 year time frame to take advantage of reconciliation, and then cut their losses and prepare to maintain the house and senate in 2018, and step 3 from above starts in the fall instead of the end of the year.
 
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9. Re: Out of the Blue Jun 13, 2017, 16:07 Flatline
 
BobBob wrote on Jun 13, 2017, 14:09:
Thank you for that well thought out response, Flatline. It's intelligent posts like yours that encourage me to visit this forum on a daily basis. Thumbsup

No sweat this is one of those really weird situations that there are both easy and really goddamn complicated answers.

It's so messed up that Washington Post actually made a flowchart of what could happen.

https://img.washingtonpost.com/news/politics/wp-content/uploads/sites/11/2017/06/StepTwov2.jpg
 
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8. Re: Out of the Blue Jun 13, 2017, 15:24 NKD
 
There's no way Trump can be that stupid can he? If Trump fires Mueller he might as well just resign on the same piece of paper.

There's going to be no one left outside the idiots with the green frog avatars that doesn't think he's a Russian puppet at that point.

Plus it doesn't stop the investigation as Flatline said. They can just rehire Mueller. There's literally nothing Trump can do to stop an investigation into him or his campaign if Congress wants one.
 
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7. Re: Out of the Blue Jun 13, 2017, 14:09 BobBob
 
Thank you for that well thought out response, Flatline. It's intelligent posts like yours that encourage me to visit this forum on a daily basis. Thumbsup  
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6. Re: Out of the Blue Jun 13, 2017, 13:36 Flatline
 
BobBob wrote on Jun 13, 2017, 12:25:
Can Trump fire Mueller or is the story all rumor and spin?

I must admit I'm beginning to dislike even watching the news, other than to keep up to date on what my California politicians are saying or doing.

Yes but it's complicated.

He can repeal the regulations covering Muller and fire him directly. This would basically be a nuclear option. Bipartisan congresspeople have stated they would probably be able to overcome a veto if Trump did this and make Muller an independent prosecutor which would be way, way worse for Trump.

He can also ask the deputy Attorney General Rosenstein to fire Muller. At that point, Rosenstein has the option of requesting a legal and pertinent justification from the President and making a decision based on that, or ignore regulations and fire him. Trump may also decline to give a justification and order the firing.

At that point, Rosenstein would either fire Muller or resign. And then it would fall to the next person in line to either fire him or resign.

That would be another Saturday Night Massacre and would look terrible.

And if memory serves, unless Trump nukes the regulations, even at that point Muller would have 30 days to wrap things up and make a report.

So yeah, sure, but there would be varying levels of consequences depending on how much Congress did it's job.

When Comey vindicated Trump on being right on what was said to him - not being under investigation (after the news repeatedly had stated the opposite) - I'm trusting the mainstream news far less than I have in the past - and that sense of mistrust has been escalating since the total debacle on the election polling results.

I don't know if that's vindication. At the time of Comey's firing, the investigation had not expanded to include Trump. Yet. But they were investigating all the people around him and if dirt was turned up the next logical step is to investigate Trump directly.

And Comey wouldn't state it publicly because he found it entirely possible/plausible that could change at some point and include Trump directly.

As for the polling errors... It depends on how you interpret the polls. There was a significant chance according to 538 of Trump winning the electoral college but losing the popular vote, and that's exactly what happened. They gave the odds to Clinton like everyone else sure, but I think they gave like a 25-35% chance for Trump to win. And if you've ever watched sports... sometimes upsets happen.

A healthy skepticism of the MSM isn't a bad thing because they can go all ZOMG THE SKY IS FALLING over stupid shit, but a lot of them are doing good reporting.
 
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5. Re: Out of the Blue Jun 13, 2017, 12:34 PHJF
 
Whelp, all these sequel announcements can only mean one thing: it's E3 again...  
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4. Re: Out of the Blue Jun 13, 2017, 12:25 BobBob
 
Can Trump fire Mueller or is the story all rumor and spin?

I must admit I'm beginning to dislike even watching the news, other than to keep up to date on what my California politicians are saying or doing.

When Comey vindicated Trump on being right on what was said to him - not being under investigation (after the news repeatedly had stated the opposite) - I'm trusting the mainstream news far less than I have in the past - and that sense of mistrust has been escalating since the total debacle on the election polling results.
 
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3. Re: Out of the Blue Jun 13, 2017, 11:59 RedEye9
 

If NK kept DR would anyone notice?
 
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2. Re: Out of the Blue Jun 13, 2017, 11:06 Tipsy McStagger
 
All these announcements just make me realize more and more that I don't have any time to finish the games I want to play.

I'm not even doing stupid shit like trying to get all achievements either..
 
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