Send News. Want a reply? Read this. More in the FAQ.   News Forum - All Forums - Mobile - PDA - RSS Headlines  RSS Headlines   Twitter  Twitter
Customize
User Settings
Styles:
LAN Parties
Upcoming one-time events:
Chicago, IL 11/17

Regularly scheduled events

Star Citizen Swapping DX12 for Vulkan

A post to the RSI Community Forums explains a change in plans for Star Citizen. In response to a question on the topic, Cloud Imperiumís Alistair Brown explains they are now planning to support the Vulkan graphics API instead of DirectX 12 in their spaceflight game (thanks DSOGaming). Among other advantages, this will not require the use of Windows 10. He explains their reasoning in full here:

Years ago we stated our intention to support DX12, but since the introduction of Vulkan which has the same feature set and performance advantages this seemed a much more logical rendering API to use as it doesn't force our users to upgrade to Windows 10 and opens the door for a single graphics API that could be used on all Windows 7, 8, 10 & Linux. As a result our current intention is to only support Vulkan and eventually drop support for DX11 as this shouldn't effect any of our backers. DX12 would only be considered if we found it gave us a specific and substantial advantage over Vulkan. The API's really aren't that different though, 95% of the work for these APIs is to change the paradigm of the rendering pipeline, which is the same for both APIs.

View
54 Replies. 3 pages. Viewing page 1.
< Newer [ 1 2 3 ] Older >

54. Re: Star Citizen Swapping DX12 for Vulkan Mar 21, 2017, 21:39 jdreyer
 
SpectralMeat wrote on Mar 20, 2017, 07:20:
jdreyer wrote on Mar 20, 2017, 02:09:
Speaking of games stuck in development hell, Josh Parnell dropped a few new screenshots of Limit Theory yesterday.
I thought he kind of gave up on that development.

He says he's still committed to it. Apparently he built the engine in such a way that it wasn't optimized for what he wanted to be, so he's rewriting the core to be more efficient. Sounds like he's making good progress, but the game isn't even in alpha yet. Probably see alpha at the end of the year. He's been showing proof of concepts at a couple of game shows this year. Color me cautiously optimistic, but it's an extremely ambitious game for a single dev to take on.
 
Avatar 22024
 
Stay a while, and listen.
Reply Quote Edit Delete Report
 
53. Re: Morning Mobilization Mar 20, 2017, 22:04 Scottish Martial Arts
 
Beamer wrote on Mar 20, 2017, 10:21:
Scottish Martial Arts wrote:
Rofl, nah, that kind of engineering job is hopefully all in my past now. I actually start my new job with Google's New York office tomorrow morning. By all accounts, Google engineering actually knows what the fuck it's doing. My last job though...

You have a 3 block walk to work? I'm jealous. Also, there's so much damn food in that office, but seriously the worst elevators I've ever used, haha. Then again, nearly every office building I've worked in, even the newest and most modern in NYC, has horrible elevators at 9am, but man, the Google ones in Chelsea...

Basically, yeah. Because of the way Hudson turns into 8th Avenue (but also stays Hudson if you hang a left at Abingdon Square, before turning into 9th Ave), you've got some weird mini-blocks in between, but in terms of numbered streets, Google is on 15th, and the closest numbered street to my apartment is 12th. It's a 10 minute leisurely stroll, and 5 minutes if you're walking at New Yorker pace, ignoring stop lights as is customary. Fortunately, the latter suits me just fine, as I'm tall, with a long stride, and have a default walking pace that is quite fast. In other words, I feel like I fit in well in terms of walking like I have somewhere to be, haha.

And yeah, the elevators get pretty crazy, especially around lunch time. I was at the office on Friday for a pre-start meet and greet between 11am and 2pm, and you had to squeeze in tight for every elevator ride.
 
Reply Quote Edit Delete Report
 
52. Re: Star Citizen Swapping DX12 for Vulkan Mar 20, 2017, 10:37 Kxmode
 
VaranDragon wrote on Mar 20, 2017, 05:22:
SO is it official now? Is Starcitizen now considered to be in development hell?

I think it's safe to say they've been in dev hell since November 2014. They hadn't reached a releasable product phase, and there's no indication of when they would actually reach it. Chris is incapable of reigning in his ridiculous vision and working within a realistic scope. It also didn't help that Chris continually kept throwing out release dates or quarters with nothing to show for it. The project is basically on money support, but once that dwindles, it'll fold. I honestly hope that doesn't happen because Star Citizen has potential, but the path forward doesn't look bright.
 
Avatar 18786
 
William Shakespeare's "Star Wars" Act I, Scene 4: CHORUS: And now, dear viewers, shall our play go to \ A Planet stark and drear for our next scene. \ Imagine sand and rocks within thy view. \ Prepare thy souls - we fly to Tatooine!
Reply Quote Edit Delete Report
 
51. Re: Star Citizen Swapping DX12 for Vulkan Mar 20, 2017, 10:31 Kxmode
 
Agent-Zero wrote on Mar 20, 2017, 04:14:
mass effect andromeda getting slaughtered in press reviews... fucking gamespot gave it a 6... LOL

You know it's bad when IGN of all gaming sites gives it a 7.7. Giggle
 
Avatar 18786
 
William Shakespeare's "Star Wars" Act I, Scene 4: CHORUS: And now, dear viewers, shall our play go to \ A Planet stark and drear for our next scene. \ Imagine sand and rocks within thy view. \ Prepare thy souls - we fly to Tatooine!
Reply Quote Edit Delete Report
 
50. Re: Morning Mobilization Mar 20, 2017, 10:21 Beamer
 
Scottish Martial Arts wrote on Mar 19, 2017, 19:28:
Quboid wrote on Mar 19, 2017, 16:16:
Scottish Martial Arts wrote on Mar 19, 2017, 14:49:
Good software engineering practices are in short supply however. If you're working for the in-house code shop for a company that is in some non-tech related industry, then chances are your software engineering practices consist of "Here's your deadline, regardless of technical feasibility or the time necessary to do it right: get something that (barely) works by then, and we'll fix any problems later (but later will never arrive). Then, as your codebase accumulates more and more problems, and gets more and more neglected, it will become harder and harder to make any forward progress, so in response we'll hire some barely competent contractors to 'help' you out, primarily by committing breaking changes to your production codebase and generally not knowing jack shit about computer science fundamentals or software engineering best practice."

Do ... do you need a hug?

Rofl, nah, that kind of engineering job is hopefully all in my past now. I actually start my new job with Google's New York office tomorrow morning. By all accounts, Google engineering actually knows what the fuck it's doing. My last job though...

You have a 3 block walk to work? I'm jealous. Also, there's so much damn food in that office, but seriously the worst elevators I've ever used, haha. Then again, nearly every office building I've worked in, even the newest and most modern in NYC, has horrible elevators at 9am, but man, the Google ones in Chelsea...
 
-------------
Music for the discerning:
http://www.deathwishinc.com
http://www.hydrahead.com
http://www.painkillerrecords.com
Reply Quote Edit Delete Report
 
49. Re: Star Citizen Swapping DX12 for Vulkan Mar 20, 2017, 07:32 Peeeling
 
Like they said, it's mostly about re-engineering the pipeline feeding the API, not the API itself (not when talking about DX12/Vulkan, anyway). So they're probably not taking any significant hit from this, and ditching DX11/OGL will allow them to focus on optimising for a single target. All in all, it's a better decision than pursuing DX12 would have been.

On the other hand, just because you've picked the best way to do something doesn't necessarily make doing it AT ALL a good idea.
 
Reply Quote Edit Delete Report
 
48. Re: Star Citizen Swapping DX12 for Vulkan Mar 20, 2017, 07:20 SpectralMeat
 
jdreyer wrote on Mar 20, 2017, 02:09:
Speaking of games stuck in development hell, Josh Parnell dropped a few new screenshots of Limit Theory yesterday.
I thought he kind of gave up on that development.
 
Avatar 14225
 
Steam: SpectralMeat
Reply Quote Edit Delete Report
 
47. Re: Star Citizen Swapping DX12 for Vulkan Mar 20, 2017, 06:54 Kosumo
 
What about their installer/patcher software .... still patching the whole 30 gigs at a time while taking out your whole internet.

That's amateur (well even amateurs can do better) and it has been that way for years and years .. wtf .. indie devs do better software.

That's how much Chris Roberts respects his backers. Waste their bandwidth and their money cos the funds they have put in are now being wasted on CIG having to pay for all the bandwidth too.

Development Hell? Not really fair to Satan, I'm sure he runs that place way better than Chris runs CIG
 
Reply Quote Edit Delete Report
 
46. Re: Star Citizen Swapping DX12 for Vulkan Mar 20, 2017, 05:22 VaranDragon
 
SO is it official now? Is Starcitizen now considered to be in development hell?  
Avatar 58327
 
Reply Quote Edit Delete Report
 
45. Re: Star Citizen Swapping DX12 for Vulkan Mar 20, 2017, 04:14 Agent-Zero
 
mass effect andromeda getting slaughtered in press reviews... fucking gamespot gave it a 6... LOL  
Reply Quote Edit Delete Report
 
44. Re: Star Citizen Swapping DX12 for Vulkan Mar 20, 2017, 02:09 jdreyer
 
Speaking of games stuck in development hell, Josh Parnell dropped a few new screenshots of Limit Theory yesterday.  
Avatar 22024
 
Stay a while, and listen.
Reply Quote Edit Delete Report
 
43. Re: Star Citizen Swapping DX12 for Vulkan Mar 20, 2017, 01:57 Hellcinder
 
LOL

Plays like a really nice 3dmark interactive tech demo. :-)
 
Reply Quote Edit Delete Report
 
42. Re: On Sale Mar 19, 2017, 22:56 Kxmode
 
jdreyer wrote on Mar 19, 2017, 22:37:
SlimRam wrote on Mar 19, 2017, 17:42:
Echo Red Park wrote on Mar 19, 2017, 16:54:
Gee, I hope this doesn't push back the game's release date.

LOL, what the hell am I talking about?! Like this game will ever get finished...
They had an office collator, named Milton Waddams, that reportedly lost his stapler, and it set release date back several months.

Well, the actual problem was that they're a paperless office. Took months to rectify the lost stapler with the lack of paper. After that, Milton was giving a place on the testing team.

There was also the problem of several key people dying because apparently, Milton spiked the guacamole with strychnine.
 
Avatar 18786
 
William Shakespeare's "Star Wars" Act I, Scene 4: CHORUS: And now, dear viewers, shall our play go to \ A Planet stark and drear for our next scene. \ Imagine sand and rocks within thy view. \ Prepare thy souls - we fly to Tatooine!
Reply Quote Edit Delete Report
 
41. Re: Morning Mobilization Mar 19, 2017, 22:37 jdreyer
 
SlimRam wrote on Mar 19, 2017, 17:42:
Echo Red Park wrote on Mar 19, 2017, 16:54:
Gee, I hope this doesn't push back the game's release date.

LOL, what the hell am I talking about?! Like this game will ever get finished...
They had an office collator, named Milton Waddams, that reportedly lost his stapler, and it set release date back several months.

Well, the actual problem was that they're a paperless office. Took months to rectify the lost stapler with the lack of paper. After that, Milton was giving a place on the testing team.
 
Avatar 22024
 
Stay a while, and listen.
Reply Quote Edit Delete Report
 
40. Re: Morning Mobilization Mar 19, 2017, 22:34 jdreyer
 
Scottish Martial Arts wrote on Mar 19, 2017, 14:49:
Creston wrote on Mar 19, 2017, 11:58:
Seriously, someone who knows: How much work is it to switch from one API to another?


Good software engineering practices are in short supply however. If you're working for the in-house code shop for a company that is in some non-tech related industry, then chances are your software engineering practices consist of "Here's your deadline, regardless of technical feasibility or the time necessary to do it right: get something that (barely) works by then, and we'll fix any problems later (but later will never arrive). Then, as your codebase accumulates more and more problems, and gets more and more neglected, it will become harder and harder to make any forward progress, so in response we'll hire some barely competent contractors to 'help' you out, primarily by committing breaking changes to your production codebase and generally not knowing jack shit about computer science fundamentals or software engineering best practice."

I'm sure that CIG is applying best practices: 10 automated unit tests for each method written. That's why it's taking them so long!
 
Avatar 22024
 
Stay a while, and listen.
Reply Quote Edit Delete Report
 
39. Re: Star Citizen Swapping DX12 for Vulkan Mar 19, 2017, 22:32 jdreyer
 
Cutter wrote on Mar 19, 2017, 15:58:
So, in a couple of months we'll see the announcement that this is taking a lot more time and costing a lot more than they thought it would and this will set the game back another year or two and they'll need to raise at least another $10 million - initially - to make this happen.

You can bank on this happening. Oh well, fools and their money are soon parted.

They don't have to ask for more money. People keep throwing them cash whether they're asking for it or not.
 
Avatar 22024
 
Stay a while, and listen.
Reply Quote Edit Delete Report
 
38. Re: Star Citizen Swapping DX12 for Vulkan Mar 19, 2017, 22:05 Kxmode
 

What a sovereign wreck
 
Avatar 18786
 
William Shakespeare's "Star Wars" Act I, Scene 4: CHORUS: And now, dear viewers, shall our play go to \ A Planet stark and drear for our next scene. \ Imagine sand and rocks within thy view. \ Prepare thy souls - we fly to Tatooine!
Reply Quote Edit Delete Report
 
37. Re: On Sale Mar 19, 2017, 22:04 Kxmode
 
...  
Avatar 18786
 
William Shakespeare's "Star Wars" Act I, Scene 4: CHORUS: And now, dear viewers, shall our play go to \ A Planet stark and drear for our next scene. \ Imagine sand and rocks within thy view. \ Prepare thy souls - we fly to Tatooine!
Reply Quote Edit Delete Report
 
36. Re: Star Citizen Swapping DX12 for Vulkan Mar 19, 2017, 21:27 CJ_Parker
 
SirKnight wrote on Mar 19, 2017, 21:05:
I am very glad to see these devs go to Vulkan and hope to see more of this.

Same here. Finally some good Shtar Shitizen news after a decade of crap news. Yes, they will probably use it as a lame excuse for more Squadron 42 delays but dropping DX12 in favor of Vulkan is awesome news otherwise.
I would also love to see a monumental shift in game development towards Vulkan. 20 years of DirectX monopolistic dominance is more than enough.
Fuck Microsoft and free the games from their stranglehold! I'd switch to Linux in a heartbeat if there would finally be a free choice of gaming platform.
 
Reply Quote Edit Delete Report
 
35. Re: Star Citizen Swapping DX12 for Vulkan Mar 19, 2017, 21:05 SirKnight
 
Creston wrote on Mar 19, 2017, 11:58:
Squadron 42(41?68?whatever) coming in 2024!

Seriously, someone who knows: How much work is it to switch from one API to another?



I've been programming with both of them for a long time now. I was using Vulkan before it was publicly announced and before it was even called Vulkan.

The two APIs, while they have some slight differences, are VERY similar. Honestly, the two biggest differences are what some things are named and C++ vs C API. Going from one to the other is significantly easier than going from any other API to another. I've been able to create an API wrapper at work that allows me to use either Vulkan or D3D 12 using the same C++ interface and the implementation of this was not hard at all.

There's really no reason to use D3D 12 to be honest. Vulkan supports most OSes, unlike D3D 12 which is stuck to Win10. They both accomplish the same thing and Vulkan has the concept of render passes which was created mainly for mobile, but turns out has good performance wins on desktop as well. Render Passes are something that D3D 12 does not have. Apple's Metal is almost identical to D3D 12 and Vulkan too. Of course this makes sense as Metal and Vulkan both started out as AMD's Mantle.

I am very glad to see these devs go to Vulkan and hope to see more of this. If a developer were to choose which API to use on their own without being bribed (like from MS) they would very very likely choose Vulkan. The only reason anyone would use D3D 12 is because of large bribes from MS.
 
Reply Quote Edit Delete Report
 
54 Replies. 3 pages. Viewing page 1.
< Newer [ 1 2 3 ] Older >




Blue's News is a participant in Amazon Associates programs
and earns advertising fees by linking to Amazon.



footer

Blue's News logo