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Out of the Blue

Watched about five minutes of the Oscars last night, so I didn't manage to catch their Steve Harvey moment. It's okay, I have not seen a single movie that won anything at the ceremony, so it wouldn't have made sense to watch. Sounds like I missed a bit of a circus.

R.I.P.: Bill Paxton Dead: Actor Dies of Surgery Complications. Thanks TheFlyingPenguin.
R.I.P.: Joseph A. Wapner, Judge on ‘The People’s Court,’ Dies at 97.

Slip-up Links: Thanks Ant and Acleacius.
Play: Stick Empires.
Link: Oscar Winners 2017- The Complete List - 89th Academy Awards.
Stories: Storm Chasers Unite to Give Bill Paxton an Epic Tribute.
The wrong envelope please: 'La La Land' mistakenly named best picture, 'Moonlight' really wins.
Oscar Broadcast Flubs In Memoriam Segment.
Science: Cheap plastic film cools whatever it touches up to 10°C. Thanks HARDOCP.
Images: Amazing truck save GIF. Thanks The Flying Penguin.
Media: TEENS REACT TO NINTENDO SWITCH (TRAILERS).
FOR HONOR!!! (React Gaming: College Kids).
Clever creatures! (Cat vs. Man). Thanks Rhialto.
Follow-up: This pre-Oscars commercial for Avatar World is terrifying people.
The Funnies: Brevity.
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47 Replies. 3 pages. Viewing page 1.
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47. Re: On Sale Feb 28, 2017, 17:14 Kxmode
 
Wowbagger_TIP wrote on Feb 28, 2017, 02:29:
That case doesn't seem like a win for free speech. What am I missing here?

In fairness to your question I went back and reviewed more of the case (as best I can since I am not a lawyer) and I believe you're right.

The nuts and bolts is:
- Chaplinski was on a street corner yelling at people and calling them sinners and fascists. (Unfortunately, Witnesses did that back in the early 1900's) Eventually, a mob formed and started a riot.
- Chaplinski was arrested and charged with breach of the peace under a New Hampshire law that made it illegal to call people names.
- Chaplinski was convicted of a violation of the peace. He appealed.
Chaplinski argued that the New Hampshire law was unconstitutional since it infringed on his 1st Amendment right to free speech.
- The US Supreme Court upheld the conviction.
- The US Supreme Court found that Chaplinski’s statements were fighting words (words designed to incite violence against the speaker).
- The Court found that freedom of speech is not absolute and that certain forms of speech (like fighting words, commercial advertising, or obscenities) do not convey ideas and are therefore not covered by the 1st Amendment.
- This decision became known as the two-tier theory because it divides speech into two tiers of constitutional protection.

Interesting. While there are a great many examples of freedom of speech as it relates to Religion, it would appear Chaplinsky v. New Hampshire isn't one. My apologies for that.
 
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William Shakespeare's "Star Wars" Act I, Scene 1: Aboard the rebel ship. / Enter C-3PO and R2-D2. / C-3PO: "Now is the summer of our happiness / Made winter by this sudden, fierce attack!" / R2-D2 — Beep beep, Beep, beep, meep, squeak, beep, whee!
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46. removed Feb 28, 2017, 09:45 RedEye9
 
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“If the facts are against you, argue the law. If the law is against you, argue the facts. If the law and the facts are against you, pound the table and yell like hell.”
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45. Re: I watched more DOOM videos (not all of them [TL;DW]), with a guy's commentaries, from YouTube... Feb 28, 2017, 02:29 Wowbagger_TIP
 
Kxmode wrote on Feb 27, 2017, 22:31:
Agent-Zero wrote on Feb 27, 2017, 21:00:
LOL freedom, yeh

Yes. Freedom. The ability to say things regarded as "hateful" or "fighting words" to a person or group is, in part, thanks to the Witness's Supreme Court victory. I posted the information. You didn't pay attention.

----

03/09/1942, Chaplinsky v. New Hampshire (315 U.S. 568)

FREEDOM: First and Fourteenth Amendment rights to free speech (otherwise know as the "fighting words doctrine")

Justice Frank Murphy delivered the court's decision noting the First Amendment to the United States Constitution prohibits the federal government from making laws that abridge the freedoms of speech, of the press, and of worship. Some forms of expression -- among them obscenity and fighting words -- do not convey ideas and thus are not subject to First Amendment protection. In this case, Chaplinsky uttered fighting words, i.e., words that "inflict injury or tend to incite an immediate breach of the peace." The First Amendment similarly applies to the states, as its protections are within “the fundamental personal rights and liberties which are protected by the Fourteenth Amendment from invasion by state action.” In other words, freedom of speech was designed to protect speech that was unpopular and not the other way around.

Laws applied: U.S. Constitution amend. I; NH P. L., c. 378, § 2 (1941)

----

Anyhow, on behalf of The Witnesses, you're welcome.

That case doesn't seem like a win for free speech. What am I missing here?
 
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"The whole problem with the world is that fools and fanatics are always so certain of themselves, but wiser people so full of doubts." -- Bertrand Russell (I think...)
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44. Re: On Sale Feb 27, 2017, 22:31 Kxmode
 
Agent-Zero wrote on Feb 27, 2017, 21:00:
LOL freedom, yeh

Yes. Freedom. The ability to say things regarded as "hateful" or "fighting words" to a person or group is, in part, thanks to the Witness's Supreme Court victory. I posted the information. You didn't pay attention.

----

03/09/1942, Chaplinsky v. New Hampshire (315 U.S. 568)

FREEDOM: First and Fourteenth Amendment rights to free speech (otherwise know as the "fighting words doctrine")

Justice Frank Murphy delivered the court's decision noting the First Amendment to the United States Constitution prohibits the federal government from making laws that abridge the freedoms of speech, of the press, and of worship. Some forms of expression -- among them obscenity and fighting words -- do not convey ideas and thus are not subject to First Amendment protection. In this case, Chaplinsky uttered fighting words, i.e., words that "inflict injury or tend to incite an immediate breach of the peace." The First Amendment similarly applies to the states, as its protections are within “the fundamental personal rights and liberties which are protected by the Fourteenth Amendment from invasion by state action.” In other words, freedom of speech was designed to protect speech that was unpopular and not the other way around.

Laws applied: U.S. Constitution amend. I; NH P. L., c. 378, § 2 (1941)

----

Anyhow, on behalf of The Witnesses, you're welcome.
 
Avatar 18786
 



William Shakespeare's "Star Wars" Act I, Scene 1: Aboard the rebel ship. / Enter C-3PO and R2-D2. / C-3PO: "Now is the summer of our happiness / Made winter by this sudden, fierce attack!" / R2-D2 — Beep beep, Beep, beep, meep, squeak, beep, whee!
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43. Re: Out of the Blue Feb 27, 2017, 21:00 Agent-Zero
 
LOL freedom, yeh  
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42. Re: Out of the Blue Feb 27, 2017, 20:56 Kxmode
 
BobBob wrote on Feb 27, 2017, 20:07:
Give what a rest? Confused

With respect, I wouldn't recommend engaging in such conversations with RedEye. I still love the guy even if he spews a lot of hateful rhetoric towards my beliefs. It's fine. He has that freedom.
 
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William Shakespeare's "Star Wars" Act I, Scene 1: Aboard the rebel ship. / Enter C-3PO and R2-D2. / C-3PO: "Now is the summer of our happiness / Made winter by this sudden, fierce attack!" / R2-D2 — Beep beep, Beep, beep, meep, squeak, beep, whee!
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41. Re: Out of the Blue Feb 27, 2017, 20:48 Kxmode
 
jdreyer wrote on Feb 27, 2017, 19:40:
Kxmode wrote on Feb 27, 2017, 17:35:
jdreyer wrote on Feb 27, 2017, 16:03:
Most of the Oscar movies aren't blockbusters. Money makers like Secret Life of Pets, Batman v Superman, Finding Dory ($1B!), and Deadpool had no nominations. Other blockbusters like Suicide Squad, Rogue One, and Fantastic Beasts had one or two in minor categories.

The winners were chosen to promote various beliefs Hollywood supports aggressively, and not necessarily because they were the best films. I'm sure in the minds of many any of those blockbusters were award winners. However, most do not promote anything beyond pure entertainment.

I'm just curious what your Best Picture nominees would have been.

I'm biased, but I would've gone with:

Arrival
Zootopia
Captain America: Civil War
Finding Dory
Sully

All five were great and memorable for different reasons and stories told.
 
Avatar 18786
 



William Shakespeare's "Star Wars" Act I, Scene 1: Aboard the rebel ship. / Enter C-3PO and R2-D2. / C-3PO: "Now is the summer of our happiness / Made winter by this sudden, fierce attack!" / R2-D2 — Beep beep, Beep, beep, meep, squeak, beep, whee!
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40. Re: Out of the Blue Feb 27, 2017, 20:07 BobBob
 
RedEye9 wrote on Feb 27, 2017, 20:04:
BobBob wrote on Feb 27, 2017, 19:52:
Yes it does. Thanks. Before people criticize JWs too much, they should look at history and respect their devotion and sacrifice to that belief.

Jehovah's Witnesses developed in the United States in the 1870s.

There were more people of the Jewish faith and others killed than there are jws today, give it a rest.

Give what a rest? Confused
 



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39. Re: Out of the Blue Feb 27, 2017, 20:04 RedEye9
 
BobBob wrote on Feb 27, 2017, 19:52:
Before people criticize JWs too much, they should look at history and respect their devotion and sacrifice to that belief.

There were more people of the Jewish faith and others killed than there are jws today.

Jehovah's Witnesses developed in the United States in the 1870s. They would have done more good fighting in the war, give it a rest.



 
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“If the facts are against you, argue the law. If the law is against you, argue the facts. If the law and the facts are against you, pound the table and yell like hell.”
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38. Re: Out of the Blue Feb 27, 2017, 19:52 BobBob
 
Kxmode wrote on Feb 27, 2017, 19:29:
BobBob wrote on Feb 27, 2017, 18:45:
Does that mean JW's are no longer conscientious objectors? I'm not setting you up for a debate, or contradiction, I'm asking out of curiosity. Apologies if it offends.

Trust me, if I can take strong jabs from others, an honest inquiry is not offensive in the least.

Witnesses still conscientiously object when required. This act only reaffirms our standing to oppose forced conscription to serve in the military against our religious and spiritual conscience. We do not do this out of malice. We respect the superior authorities; we just cannot serve the superior authorities. And joining the military is the number one way people serve their government and country.

The scriptural reason for why we do not comes from our supporting God's Kingdom. This act invalidates the possibility of serving in the military of any nation. The primary principle comes from Jesus when he tells Governor Pilate, "My Kingdom is no part of this world. If my Kingdom were part of this world, my attendants would have fought that I should not be handed over to the Jews. However, as it is, my Kingdom is not from this source." (John 18:36) In other words, Jesus tells the governor that his kingdom is a separate and neutral institution from human governments; and by extensions, his followers would be too on the same basic level of an American Ambassador not running for or getting mired in the politics of another nation. His loyalties lie with his mother country for whom he represents. However, like Witnesses, an ambassador obeys the laws of the region in which he resides.

Witnesses have conscientiously objected in the past and won many Supreme Court cases that provided us (and indeed ALL U.S. citizens) with many First Amendment freedoms (especially in the area of religion). However, in South Korea, where they have no First Amendment freedoms, for the last 30-40 years, young male Witnesses are routinely incarcerated for refusing mandatory military service. As a result, South Korea has one of the largest incarceration rates for Jehovah's Witnesses. Those are my spiritual brothers. I pray for them and their families often.

Hope that clarified.

Yes it does. Thanks. Before people criticize JWs too much, they should look at history and respect their devotion and sacrifice to that belief.
 



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37. Re: Out of the Blue Feb 27, 2017, 19:50 Mr. Tact
 
Popular, large grossing films do occasionally win Oscars. Titanic, Lord of the Rings: The Return of the King to name two. While it is true smaller films tend to dominate, there is a reason. It isn't about the performances liked by the most people. It is about people in the industry judging the quality of the performances. I loved the Matrix films, but the only Oscars those films even deserve a discussion on is the FX awards.

This comment was edited on Feb 27, 2017, 20:07.
 



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36. Re: Out of the Blue Feb 27, 2017, 19:40 jdreyer
 
Kxmode wrote on Feb 27, 2017, 17:35:
jdreyer wrote on Feb 27, 2017, 16:03:
Most of the Oscar movies aren't blockbusters. Money makers like Secret Life of Pets, Batman v Superman, Finding Dory ($1B!), and Deadpool had no nominations. Other blockbusters like Suicide Squad, Rogue One, and Fantastic Beasts had one or two in minor categories.

The winners were chosen to promote various beliefs Hollywood supports aggressively, and not necessarily because they were the best films. I'm sure in the minds of many any of those blockbusters were award winners. However, most do not promote anything beyond pure entertainment.

I'm just curious what your Best Picture nominees would have been.
 
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The land in Minecraft is flat, Minecraft simulates the Earth, ergo the Earth is flat.
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35. Re: Out of the Blue Feb 27, 2017, 19:36 jdreyer
 
Luke wrote on Feb 27, 2017, 17:58:
Pathetic olliwood , whine like the N did last year and caaaboom suddenly many wierd coloured gets a oscar and there movies wins ...its just pathetic

Just out of curiosity, what would your Best Picture nominees be?

And although RT is not the end-all-be-all, I'll just point out that all the movies starring "wierd coloured" are rated as follows:
Moonlight - 98%
Fences - 93%
Hidden Figures - 92%
Lion - 86%

But I'm sure it's all a conspiracy.
 
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The land in Minecraft is flat, Minecraft simulates the Earth, ergo the Earth is flat.
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34. Re: Out of the Blue Feb 27, 2017, 19:29 Kxmode
 
BobBob wrote on Feb 27, 2017, 18:45:
Does that mean JW's are no longer conscientious objectors? I'm not setting you up for a debate, or contradiction, I'm asking out of curiosity. Apologies if it offends.

Trust me, if I can take strong jabs from others, an honest inquiry is not offensive in the least.

Witnesses still conscientiously object when required. This act only reaffirms our standing to oppose forced conscription to serve in the military against our religious and spiritual conscience. We do not do this out of malice. We respect the superior authorities; we just cannot serve the superior authorities. And joining the military is the number one way people serve their government and country.

The scriptural reason for why we do not comes from our supporting God's Kingdom. This act invalidates the possibility of serving in the military of any nation. The primary principle comes from Jesus when he tells Governor Pilate, "My Kingdom is no part of this world. If my Kingdom were part of this world, my attendants would have fought that I should not be handed over to the Jews. However, as it is, my Kingdom is not from this source." (John 18:36) In other words, Jesus tells the governor that his kingdom is a separate and neutral institution from human governments; and by extensions, his followers would be too on the same basic level of an American Ambassador not running for or getting mired in the politics of another nation. His loyalties lie with his mother country for whom he represents. However, like Witnesses, an ambassador obeys the laws of the region in which he resides.

Witnesses have conscientiously objected in the past and won many Supreme Court cases that provided us (and indeed ALL U.S. citizens) with many First Amendment freedoms (especially in the area of religion). However, in South Korea, where they have no First Amendment freedoms, for the last 30-40 years, young male Witnesses are routinely incarcerated for refusing mandatory military service. As a result, South Korea has one of the largest incarceration rates for Jehovah's Witnesses. Those are my spiritual brothers. I pray for them and their families often.

Hope that clarified.
 
Avatar 18786
 



William Shakespeare's "Star Wars" Act I, Scene 1: Aboard the rebel ship. / Enter C-3PO and R2-D2. / C-3PO: "Now is the summer of our happiness / Made winter by this sudden, fierce attack!" / R2-D2 — Beep beep, Beep, beep, meep, squeak, beep, whee!
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33. Re: Out of the Blue Feb 27, 2017, 18:55 Kxmode
 
Mr. Tact wrote on Feb 27, 2017, 18:26:
I thought Casey Affleck's performance in Manchester by the Sea got far more praise than it deserved. I mean, come on -- even I can do dead pan. It certainly wasn't Oscar worthy; someone got robbed.

He won because he perfected the art of deadpan acting and it only took 30 films to do it (he pretty much does the same performance in each movie; watch Ocean's Eleven, Interstellar, etc.). However, I agree, there were many other worthy choices. The judges certainly do love nuanced acting, but I would never say they are good at picking the best. A perfect example of this is Russell Crowe for Best Actor in The Gladiator. The film was fantastic no doubt, but best acting should have gone to Ed Harris for his frantic, fiery role as Jackson Pollock, or Tom Hanks in Cast Away. He carried 80% of the film himself and made my cry over a volleyball. A volleyball! Who does that? Tom Hanks can.
 
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William Shakespeare's "Star Wars" Act I, Scene 1: Aboard the rebel ship. / Enter C-3PO and R2-D2. / C-3PO: "Now is the summer of our happiness / Made winter by this sudden, fierce attack!" / R2-D2 — Beep beep, Beep, beep, meep, squeak, beep, whee!
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32. Re: Out of the Blue Feb 27, 2017, 18:45 BobBob
 
Kxmode wrote on Feb 27, 2017, 18:41:
BobBob wrote on Feb 27, 2017, 17:41:
Kxmode wrote on Feb 27, 2017, 17:35:
...

Off-topic, side question: As a JW what will you do if there is a war and a draft, and they don't care about whole "conscientious objector" thing?

I think you know the answer to that question. Any person willing to be loyal to his or her government is also willing to die for it too.

Does that mean JW's are no longer conscientious objectors? I'm not setting you up for a debate, or contradiction, I'm asking out of curiosity. Apologies if it offends.
 



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31. Re: Out of the Blue Feb 27, 2017, 18:41 Kxmode
 
BobBob wrote on Feb 27, 2017, 17:41:
Kxmode wrote on Feb 27, 2017, 17:35:
...

Off-topic, side question: As a JW what will you do if there is a war and a draft, and they don't care about whole "conscientious objector" thing?

I think you know the answer to that question. Any person willing to be loyal to his or her government is also willing to die for it too.
 
Avatar 18786
 



William Shakespeare's "Star Wars" Act I, Scene 1: Aboard the rebel ship. / Enter C-3PO and R2-D2. / C-3PO: "Now is the summer of our happiness / Made winter by this sudden, fierce attack!" / R2-D2 — Beep beep, Beep, beep, meep, squeak, beep, whee!
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30. Re: Out of the Blue Feb 27, 2017, 18:26 Mr. Tact
 
I saw La La Land, Arrival and Manchester by the Sea -- but none of the others. I do want to see Fences and Hacksaw Ridge. I'll watch Moonlight since it won Best Film, I just hope I am as pleasantly surprised with it as I was when I watched Slumdog Millionaire for the same reason.

I thought Casey Affleck's performance in Manchester by the Sea got far more praise than it deserved. I mean, come on -- even I can do dead pan. It certainly wasn't Oscar worthy, someone got robbed.

Edit: Oh, I saw Nocturnal Animals, Captain Fantastic and Hell or High Water too. And I definitely want to see Lion and Hidden Figures.

Nocturnal Animals deserved an Oscar for most objectionable and unnecessary opening scene.
 



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29. Re: Out of the Blue Feb 27, 2017, 18:15 Mr. Tact
 
BobBob wrote on Feb 27, 2017, 12:50:
Why would you watch the Oscars? It's meant for a wider viewing audience. If you want intellectually stimulating cinema, you won't find it in films attempting to be blockbusters. For example, this film made so little money the producers asked for donations. The dialogue is pure genius and written by one of the greatest science fiction authors of all time, RIP.
That is an excellent film, which many people would not appreciate. I mean it is essentially just a group of 6-8 people sitting in a room talking. Made my sister watch it and despite being a sci-fi fan she didn't like it -- basically due to the format. It is pretty cerebral. I like cerebral films, but on a whole, the public doesn't.
 



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28. removed Feb 27, 2017, 17:58 Luke
 
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This comment was deleted on Feb 27, 2017, 21:28.
 
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