BobBob wrote on Feb 19, 2017, 18:16:
Response:

I get the whole loop thing. But the moment he gave her the phone # means that she didn't have it, meaning at some point she saved the world without the phone #. There must of been a 'primary timeline' before the causal loop was created, otherwise it would cause a paradox (meaning, it couldn't happen .. as paradoxes prevent things from happening, they aren't just a matter of fact issue). Also, the fact she didn't know the phone # meant she existed in a linear timeline (at that scene) up until the point of knowing it, for her past self can know it. Spin... I'm sure I'm overthinking this. When I write a story involving time travel, my main character is always aware of paradoxes and creating divergent timelines, going through great trouble to not disturb an existing timeline, create paradoxes, spawning divergent timelines, or causing total annihilation.

Mr. Tact wrote on Feb 19, 2017, 09:34:

BobBob wrote on Feb 19, 2017, 03:55:
Just saw the movie Arrival.

Spoiler questions / comments:

If she is living non-linear how did she not know about the phone call? She acted surprised. And how did she save mankind the first round if she didn't know the number? Why would she ever need it?

Lastly, lack of knowledge (phone number) would indicate linear thinking, but in the future she is non-linear. So which is it?

Are these a major plot holes?

On the other hand maybe she doesn't realize she's existing in subtle but alternate-divergent timelines or universes. She might simply be delusional.

Super secret
Why doesn't she know about the phone call?

Well -- talking about non-linear events almost always makes for confusing verbiage. My personal spin: She is surprised because she is only just figuring out what's going on. That the visions of a child, her child, are not some fantasy but that she is seeing her future. And realizing she can manipulate her action in that future which enables her to change the present. She isn't "living non-linear", ie... she isn't moving forward and backward in time, she is simply seeing and interacting with her future. Unless I'm misremembering you aren't shown her changing the past.

Now your next question is a standard time travel plot problem. Terminator.. how was John Conner ever born the first time, without Kyle having gone back in time to father him. How can the general be at the party for her to get the phone number, unless she already called him. It is pretty much unavoidable to have a problem like this when you are dealing with time altering events. I don't really understand your "Why would she ever need it?" question.

If you consider this a major plot hole, no film containing any form of time manipulation isn't guilty of it.

Kxmode wrote on Feb 18, 2017, 17:35:
My aunt passed away this morning at 6:09 AM PST.

Kxmode wrote on Feb 18, 2017, 17:35:
My aunt passed away this morning at 6:09 AM PST.

Kxmode wrote on Feb 18, 2017, 17:35:
My aunt passed away this morning at 6:09 AM PST.

BobBob wrote on Feb 19, 2017, 03:55:
Just saw the movie Arrival.

Spoiler questions / comments:

If she is living non-linear how did she not know about the phone call? She acted surprised. And how did she save mankind the first round if she didn't know the number? Why would she ever need it?

Lastly, lack of knowledge (phone number) would indicate linear thinking, but in the future she is non-linear. So which is it?

Are these a major plot holes?

On the other hand maybe she doesn't realize she's existing in subtle but alternate-divergent timelines or universes. She might simply be delusional.

Kxmode wrote on Feb 18, 2017, 17:35:
My aunt passed away this morning at 6:09 AM PST.

jdreyer wrote on Feb 18, 2017, 19:29:
Don't Rear End Minivan Drivers in Dallas, TX.

What's up with that kid?

Kxmode wrote on Feb 18, 2017, 17:35:
My aunt passed away this morning at 6:09 AM PST.

Kxmode wrote on Feb 18, 2017, 17:35:
My aunt passed away this morning at 6:09 AM PST.

Kxmode wrote on Feb 18, 2017, 17:35:
My aunt passed away this morning at 6:09 AM PST.

Cutter wrote on Feb 18, 2017, 17:27:
Unless there are dinosaurs and ancient ruins like Atlantis 'n' stuff - like in movie like The Land That Time Forgot than it's not a real 'lost' continent.

James Churchward (1851–1936) claimed that "more than fifty years ago", while he was a soldier in India, he befriended a high-ranking temple priest who showed him a set of ancient "sunburnt" clay tablets, supposedly in a long lost "Naga-Maya language" which only two other people in India could read. Having mastered the language himself, Churchward found out that they originated from "the place where [man] first appeared—Mu". The 1931 edition states that "all matter of science in this work are based on translations of two sets of ancient tablets": the clay tables he read in India, and a collection of 2,500 stone tablets that had been uncovered by William Niven in Mexico.

Churchward claimed that the landmass of Mu was located in the Pacific Ocean, and stretched east–west from the Marianas to Easter Island, and north–south from Hawaii to Mangaia. He claimed that according to the creation myth he read in the Indian tablets, Mu had been lifted above sea level by the expansion of underground volcanic gases. Eventually Mu "was completely obliterated in almost a single night" after a series of earthquakes and volcanic eruptions, "the broken land fell into that great abyss of fire" and was covered by "fifty millions of square miles of water."

Churchward claimed that Mu was the common origin of the great civilizations of Egypt, Greece, Central America, India, Burma and others, including Easter Island, and was in particular the source of ancient megalithic architecture.