I hear you about a capped connection. That sucks.

1. How is it your friend (whom I assume lives near you so you can sneakernet your games) is uncapped but you are capped? Can't you switch ISPs?

2. GoG, Humble, and D2D all offer standalone executables you could DL at your friend's place and install at home. Steam allows you to move your install game directory (and the install pointer file) then "reinstall" with no files downloaded. EA Origin is the same. Bonus: no viruses or malware.

3. All of these services are either directly archivable or offer an in-menu option to do so.

4. As Beamer points out, even if you're pirating, you could still be purchasing them on the platform of your choice. And if it won't run for you, or you don't like it, this makes refunding even easier, since you won't have any official time in-game. Why aren't you?

5. Consoles are no longer really an option for people with capped connections. There are too many mandatory online updates and patches. Still it's less than a PC.

Simon Says wrote on Aug 31, 2016, 02:24:
Copied pretty much every game I played for the last 5 years or so, with a few exceptions, through someone with an uncapped connection. I have a huge stack of game boxes from prior this epoch during which I would copy here, but mostly buy.

I would've gladly continued to stack bought boxes here and copy there for other titles which I either didn't mind not having modding support for ( back then some games practically required you to be up to date to run the mods you wanted to run ), or other reasons, alas, they either stopped selling them in boxes or made it impractical on a severely capped connection to buy them.

So yeah, not gonna feel a single ounce of guilt because they told me to fuck off at the store and download them online instead, heck the last boxes were pretty much only a code, no data on the disc, or like a third of it. And not only that, but only download them on the computer you play on, not as a package you can put on an USB stick then copy and activate on your own computer ( or download patches as a separate package you can move around on an USB stick ). Not gonna move that computer case around, risking the GPU and mobo on it every time I move it ( snapping because of weight ) each time I want to try a new game and/or patch it. The risk to reward ratio is simply too abysmal to contemplate.

I guess the ISPs also have their part to play in this particular case. Uncapped I would have no problem waiting for steam sales and such or even paying full price for games I am eagerly anticipating, but as it is, the situation is different.

And I'd wager most of you going "holier than thou" around here would've chosen the exact same thing in my overarching situation.

The only recourse left is going back to consoles, and to that I say, over my dead mobo. Or when I'll be bored of mods, either downloading them, or making them myself as I don't care much for FPS shooters anymore and RTS/TBS ( turn based strategy ) support for gamepads has improved much. Time will tell.

Wait, you pirate because you can't have physical boxes?
And you don't feel bad about it because no more mods?

And you think this is sensible, rational, and that anyone should care what you think about video games when you don't pay for any of the entertainment you get out of them because you feel digital distribution is such an affront to you that you deserve hundreds of hours of entertainment for nothing?

And I'd wager most of you going "holier than thou" around here would've chosen the exact same thing in my overarching situation.

And yet, somehow, nearly everyone else here manages to support their hobby, except for you, who thinks you deserve it for free. Y'know, if you have a cap, you could just, I dunno, download some of the games you play. I'm sure there's room in the cap.

Or, perhaps, you could pay for the games and not download for them, so some people still get paid for the hours of entertainment you get.

Instead, you're here whining that physical distribution has died and saying that "I guess the ISPs also have played their part." They're the sole part! You're punishing devs for giving you something you love because ISPs are hurting your access to it. There are a hundred ways you could still support your hobby, instead you think pirating it and whining on the internet is the way to go.

Whatever. You're the first person on my block list. I have no interest in hearing the opinions about games from a person that refuses to compensate anyone for the joy he gets. Especially when, just yesterday, he was bragging about his $600 processor. Stop being a child and pay for your games. Otherwise, stop expecting anyone to listen to you. "Waaah, they don't give me mods any more, and mods are important to me!" Yeah, but you've pirated pretty much every game you've played for 5 years, why should a single dev care what the hell you want in a game? And why should any of us here?

I think you may have forgot to explain your problem...

Though I gather it might have something to do with portability, maybe?

Not gonna move that computer case around, risking the GPU and mobo on it every time I move it ( snapping because of weight ) each time I want to try a new game and/or patch it.

Why do you need to move your computer case around to try new games?

Copied pretty much every game I played for the last 5 years or so, with a few exceptions, through someone with an uncapped connection. I have a huge stack of game boxes from prior this epoch during which I would copy here, but mostly buy.

I would've gladly continued to stack bought boxes here and copy there for other titles which I either didn't mind not having modding support for ( back then some games practically required you to be up to date to run the mods you wanted to run ), or other reasons, alas, they either stopped selling them in boxes or made it impractical on a severely capped connection to buy them.

So yeah, not gonna feel a single ounce of guilt because they told me to fuck off at the store and download them online instead, heck the last boxes were pretty much only a code, no data on the disc, or like a third of it. And not only that, but only download them on the computer you play on, not as a package you can put on an USB stick then copy and activate on your own computer ( or download patches as a separate package you can move around on an USB stick ). Not gonna move that computer case around, risking the GPU and mobo on it every time I move it ( snapping because of weight ) each time I want to try a new game and/or patch it. The risk to reward ratio is simply too abysmal to contemplate.

I guess the ISPs also have their part to play in this particular case. Uncapped I would have no problem waiting for steam sales and such or even paying full price for games I am eagerly anticipating, but as it is, the situation is different.

And I'd wager most of you going "holier than thou" around here would've chosen the exact same thing in my overarching situation.

The only recourse left is going back to consoles, and to that I say, over my dead mobo. Or when I'll be bored of mods, either downloading them, or making them myself as I don't care much for FPS shooters anymore and RTS/TBS ( turn based strategy ) support for gamepads has improved much. Time will tell.

This comment was edited on Aug 31, 2016, 02:56.

Creston wrote on Aug 30, 2016, 20:35:

Beamer wrote on Aug 30, 2016, 19:52:
Sorry, to clarify, they technically bought both, but what made it a multibillion dollar offer was the brand, not the people.

Oh, okay, I just misunderstood.

Yeah, I worded it ambiguously. Stupid text!

Beamer wrote on Aug 30, 2016, 19:52:
Sorry, to clarify, they technically bought both, but what made it a multibillion dollar offer was the brand, not the people.

Oh, okay, I just misunderstood.

jdreyer wrote on Aug 30, 2016, 13:23:

Slashman wrote on Aug 30, 2016, 12:24:

jdreyer wrote on Aug 30, 2016, 05:31:

Slick wrote on Aug 29, 2016, 22:09:
if for any reason I want to try-before-I-buy, then I absolutely have no qualms about going that route. There's MANY reasons to do this, not the least of which is the wide variance of PC titles quality. I also have no reason to get refunded steam credits by returning it (I buy in bitcoin, can't be refunded), I'd rather just buy what I want to buy. If we can take a $40,000 car for a test drive, there's no reason not to do so on a $70 game.

I just stick to the old scene addage that if you enjoy the product, fucking buy it!

While it sounds like you're mostly doing it "right" I'll just point out this: I suppose you swipe some spring rolls, curry, and sticky rice from the new Thai restaurant that just opened nearby to make sure that it's a place you want to patronize. Also, you "borrow" some fresh produce from the farmer's market to make sure it's good and fresh before you actually plunk down $ for your weekly allotment, right? I just want to make sure you're being consistent across all industries.

And your analogy is wrong. Unless he is materializing exact duplicates of the items from the restaurant and supermarket without actually removing anything from their stock, then there is no comparison. And since that's impossible, you really don't have much of a point here.

While it's true they're not completely analogous, someone put work into making that food, and whether we're talking about food or games, if you steal the food or pirate the game, you're not compensating them for their labor. And if labor isn't worth paying for to you, please put your money where your mouth is and come clean my apartment, and I will proceed to not pay you for your labor. PM me for my address. Thanks.

I agree. For almost every business, labor is the number one cost. So a game has no physical substance, so what? A car costs as much as it does because of the hundreds of thousands of hours of labor spent designing it, testing it, writing code for it, and putting it together. Why is a game something that should be free just because there is no physical copy? You are stealing the labor, which is just as bad as stealing a physical copy. In today's age of youtube, instant reviews on gaming sites, instant steam reviews, refund policies, etc., there is no excuse to pirate a game.

Creston wrote on Aug 30, 2016, 17:55:

Beamer wrote on Aug 30, 2016, 09:30:
That is what Microsoft bought. If it bought the company, Notch would have come with it, even if he wasn't very hands-on anymore. But that wasn't what Microsoft was interested in.

Uh...

Mojang is now part of MS and still exists. Notch just quit. I don't know where you get the idea from that MS just bought Minecraft?


As for comparing Witcher 3 to Skyrim, Skyrim has had a ridiculously long tail, sales wise, due to its massive modding community. I think Witcher 3 kept pretty good pace with it for the first 9-12 months.

Sorry, to clarify, they technically bought both, but what made it a multibillion dollar offer was the brand, not the people. I didn't mean to imply that they did not acquire Mojang. Recently, I had some friends buy a house on the beach. Technically, they bought a small two bedroom. Actually, they bought a piece of property, and the house happened to be on it. The house wasn't why they bought it, and it's nice to have for now, but the value of the land is infinitely more than the value of the house.

Beamer wrote on Aug 30, 2016, 09:30:
That is what Microsoft bought. If it bought the company, Notch would have come with it, even if he wasn't very hands-on anymore. But that wasn't what Microsoft was interested in.

Uh...

Mojang is now part of MS and still exists. Notch just quit. I don't know where you get the idea from that MS just bought Minecraft?


As for comparing Witcher 3 to Skyrim, Skyrim has had a ridiculously long tail, sales wise, due to its massive modding community. I think Witcher 3 kept pretty good pace with it for the first 9-12 months.

VaranDragon wrote on Aug 30, 2016, 04:24:
[...]
This. Also you can't really compare Skyrim (or even any TES game) to the Witcher3. They are NOT even in the same genre. The Witcher3 is an open world action/adventure role playing game, Skyrim is an open world CRPG. In the W3 you play as ONE character, one PARTICULAR character actually and that's it. You can't even choose a class, your class is basically "a Witcher". Saying that one game here is better than the other is kind of pointless.
[...]

Skyrim is a CRPG? Wat Ò_ó
Baldur's Gate is a CRPG. Fallout 2 is a CRPG. Pillars of Eternity is a CRPG. Skyrim is more like an open-world action adventure with RPG elements.

Slashman wrote on Aug 30, 2016, 12:24:

jdreyer wrote on Aug 30, 2016, 05:31:

Slick wrote on Aug 29, 2016, 22:09:
if for any reason I want to try-before-I-buy, then I absolutely have no qualms about going that route. There's MANY reasons to do this, not the least of which is the wide variance of PC titles quality. I also have no reason to get refunded steam credits by returning it (I buy in bitcoin, can't be refunded), I'd rather just buy what I want to buy. If we can take a $40,000 car for a test drive, there's no reason not to do so on a $70 game.

I just stick to the old scene addage that if you enjoy the product, fucking buy it!

While it sounds like you're mostly doing it "right" I'll just point out this: I suppose you swipe some spring rolls, curry, and sticky rice from the new Thai restaurant that just opened nearby to make sure that it's a place you want to patronize. Also, you "borrow" some fresh produce from the farmer's market to make sure it's good and fresh before you actually plunk down $ for your weekly allotment, right? I just want to make sure you're being consistent across all industries.

And your analogy is wrong. Unless he is materializing exact duplicates of the items from the restaurant and supermarket without actually removing anything from their stock, then there is no comparison. And since that's impossible, you really don't have much of a point here.

While it's true they're not completely analogous, someone put work into making that food, and whether we're talking about food or games, if you steal the food or pirate the game, you're not compensating them for their labor. And if labor isn't worth paying for to you, please put your money where your mouth is and come clean my apartment, and I will proceed to not pay you for your labor. PM me for my address. Thanks.

jdreyer wrote on Aug 30, 2016, 05:31:

Slick wrote on Aug 29, 2016, 22:09:
if for any reason I want to try-before-I-buy, then I absolutely have no qualms about going that route. There's MANY reasons to do this, not the least of which is the wide variance of PC titles quality. I also have no reason to get refunded steam credits by returning it (I buy in bitcoin, can't be refunded), I'd rather just buy what I want to buy. If we can take a $40,000 car for a test drive, there's no reason not to do so on a $70 game.

I just stick to the old scene addage that if you enjoy the product, fucking buy it!

While it sounds like you're mostly doing it "right" I'll just point out this: I suppose you swipe some spring rolls, curry, and sticky rice from the new Thai restaurant that just opened nearby to make sure that it's a place you want to patronize. Also, you "borrow" some fresh produce from the farmer's market to make sure it's good and fresh before you actually plunk down $ for your weekly allotment, right? I just want to make sure you're being consistent across all industries.

And your analogy is wrong. Unless he is materializing exact duplicates of the items from the restaurant and supermarket without actually removing anything from their stock, then there is no comparison. And since that's impossible, you really don't have much of a point here.

Saboth wrote on Aug 29, 2016, 20:48:
Pirates will do anything to rationalize their grifting, while the rest of us purchase games and keep the industry going. They are the "deadbeat roommate's friend that has been on the couch for a month but hasn't chipped in a dime towards the utilities" of the gaming world. One studio's success despite piracy is not an example that piracy doesn't harm the industry. It's like pointing at Mark Zuckerberg and claiming everyone that creates their own business is going to make it big.

Could not find the +1 button.
Well said.

The Half Elf wrote on Aug 30, 2016, 06:27:
Markus Perrson creates a little game that's 1 part survival, 1 part lego, and 1 part retro ugly. Ends up selling the company for FOUR BILLION DOLLARS!

No, he created an IP. MineCraft sold for so much because MineCraft is a brand. There are MineCraft Lego kits, for godssake. MineCraft shirts and MineCraft hats and MineCraft Halloween costumes and MineCraft card games and Minecraft Stop-Motion Movie Creator Playset.

There will be a MineCraft movie, and probably three or four of them.

And MineCraft is a monstrous user base that's ridiculously devoted and consists heavily of kids 8-16, who are hard to reach but spend lots of money on the things I listed above.

That is what Microsoft bought. If it bought the company, Notch would have come with it, even if he wasn't very hands-on anymore. But that wasn't what Microsoft was interested in.

CD Projekt, by contrast, has one big IP, and they don't own it, they've merely licensed it. They don't own the movie rights and don't own the board game rights and don't own the Halloween costume rights and have fewer players who spend less time and are easily reached via dozens of other methods. The Witcher is worth next to nothing as an asset to them, whereas MineCraft was worth, well, billions.

Not very comparable. Which isn't to take away from CD Projekt, but they're a game development studio, and a large one. MineCraft is a brand. Inadvertently created, but a brand nonetheless. Arguably, getting here as a game studio without an owned IP is even more impressive.

Slick wrote on Aug 29, 2016, 22:09:
If we can take a $40,000 car for a test drive, there's no reason not to do so on a $70 game.

Uh, I can think of one reason: IT'S NOT $40,000!

Cutter wrote on Aug 29, 2016, 23:03:
Pirate does not equate to a lost sale in most cases - unless the game is shit in which case it deserves to be a lost sale. If pirating were impossible for some reason people would simply forgo said game or wait until it hits X price. Actual lost sales due to people pirating a game, playing it, enjoying it, and never buying it is absolutely minimal. The laws favour software developers far too much anyway, they have zero reason to piss and moan about anything.

Wow! I'm sure glad we have you to set the industry straight. I mean, who the fuck do those devs think they are? Writing software they hope sucks just to rip people off? How dare them! I deserve free shit off their months and years of hard work, god dammit! Seriously, just who the fuck do they think they are? It's crazy that they would want to release a shit product just to troll me. And anyway, it's impossible that someone else could like a game that I don't like, so why the fuck shouldn't I deserve free shit since I don't like it in the first place? They just got laid off because the studio wasn't making enough money. What the fuck do I care if they can feed their family or not? They shouldn't piss and moan. Glad I got my free game though.

Or maybe you're really mad at the publishers pushing unfinished products and your anger is extremely misdirected. Most devs don't wish to make a garbage product. That's their livelihood. It's clueless publishers that ruin games.

But yeah, devs have the easiest job in the world! Make a shitty game under extraordinarily stressful conditions, rip people off, get fired, have fun searching months for a new job, rinse, repeat. No reason at all for them to complain. As long as I get my free shit in my slobbering, angsty, self-entitled, ignorant perspective, then all is right with the world.

Congrats, CD Projekt RED. I've spent a minor shitload on gog.com(slowly catching up to my Steam expenditures), with no complaints. I think I own every game they've ever made, as well.

Aside from that, the internet has a LONG memory, people. No need to come clean here.

I have pirated games back in the day when I had no money. Now, I just use THE WEB with its lots and lots of informations (playthrough and review videos and articles) before I buy. I haven't pirated a single game for at least a decade. I don't have to. I got the money and the info, so why pirate?

EDIT: I remember the last game I pirated was a game that was available in my country only heavily censored. Unfortunately, with region locks those pirating days might return when people have to use VPN to not only buy and activate but also play the game they otherwise could not even buy. Also, I buy where it is cheap. This way the people behind the games get some money and I get the games. So, places like G2A are actually preventing piracy - yes, it is hard to swallow, but true.

EDIT2: MoreLuckThanSkill is right, I should not forget to congratulate and thank CD Projekt. This company deserves the success and money!

This comment was edited on Aug 30, 2016, 07:57.

I'm surprised at you guys. Why would you even care if your company/game was compared to Skyrim?
A copy of your previous game was given to the President of the United States when he came to visit. The leader of YOUR country could have given him ANYTHING, and he chose a video game?!? Last time a video game got that much press was Starcraft 2 going to the ISS.
YOUR company started as a NeverWinter Nights mod for a gaming company that is a shell of it's former self, while you just released your THIRD title with more playable hours in the last game then most AAA titles released this year. Not to mention all the free DLC, and the 100's of hours of the fairly cheap (money/gameplay ration) DLC.
YOUR company is confident in it's last project it decides to put it's game up on a gaming service with no DRM. And reguardless of how much money you did or didn't put into marketing.... you company is now worth over.... ONE BILLION DOLLARS!

Markus Perrson creates a little game that's 1 part survival, 1 part lego, and 1 part retro ugly. Ends up selling the company for FOUR BILLION DOLLARS!

The only thing Skyrim really had going for it (and keeping it activily selling) is the community mods. The community is making FREE content for the game, which in turn sells more copies of the game way beyond a normal games shelf life. That's why Beth back down from the community backlash of paid mods.

More and more "smaller" dev teams and making their own games and their own ideas instead of trying to catch up to the next Skyrim, and it seems to be doing pretty well for them.

As for piracy.I have pirated games for one of several reasons:
To see if I really did want to purchase the game
I had already pre-purchased the game but there was a beta/whatever that was leaked Or lastly I just couldn't afford it at the time, and kept playing it until I could purchase it.
But I have always bought the game, or deleted it as soon I realized I wasn't going to play it or enjoy it.
But at the end of the day, anyone can justify anything they want, as Obi-Wan said "From a certain point of view".

Slick wrote on Aug 29, 2016, 22:09:
if for any reason I want to try-before-I-buy, then I absolutely have no qualms about going that route. There's MANY reasons to do this, not the least of which is the wide variance of PC titles quality. I also have no reason to get refunded steam credits by returning it (I buy in bitcoin, can't be refunded), I'd rather just buy what I want to buy. If we can take a $40,000 car for a test drive, there's no reason not to do so on a $70 game.

I just stick to the old scene addage that if you enjoy the product, fucking buy it!

While it sounds like you're mostly doing it "right" I'll just point out this: I suppose you swipe some spring rolls, curry, and sticky rice from the new Thai restaurant that just opened nearby to make sure that it's a place you want to patronize. Also, you "borrow" some fresh produce from the farmer's market to make sure it's good and fresh before you actually plunk down $ for your weekly allotment, right? I just want to make sure you're being consistent across all industries.

Cutter wrote on Aug 29, 2016, 23:03:
Pirate does not equate to a lost sale in most cases - unless the game is shit in which case it deserves to be a lost sale. If pirating were impossible for some reason people would simply forgo said game or wait until it hits X price. Actual lost sales due to people pirating a game, playing it, enjoying it, and never buying it is absolutely minimal. The laws favour software developers far too much anyway, they have zero reason to piss and moan about anything.

Evidence, or you're just spouting a childish uninformed unsubstantiated opinion.