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Re: Evening Legal Briefs
Jul 21, 2016, 20:06
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Re: Evening Legal Briefs Jul 21, 2016, 20:06
Jul 21, 2016, 20:06
 
Oh for fuck's sake. Reading the article, it seems like Genicap(the Dutch company) may actually have a case. Good luck, Hello Games. Probably shouldn't have talked about lifting an algorithm from another source and not paying them.

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Re: Evening Legal Briefs
Jul 21, 2016, 20:50
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Re: Evening Legal Briefs Jul 21, 2016, 20:50
Jul 21, 2016, 20:50
 
Nor does it help Hello that Genicap has tried to contact them and been rrebuffed. I can see the lawyers at Sony gritting their teeth at this one.
"Van Gogh painted alone and in despair and in madness and sold one picture in his entire life. Millions struggled alone, unrecognized, and struggled as heroically as any famous hero. Was it worthless? I knew it wasn't."
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Re: Evening Legal Briefs
Jul 21, 2016, 21:34
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Re: Evening Legal Briefs Jul 21, 2016, 21:34
Jul 21, 2016, 21:34
 
Just as I was seriously considering placing that pre-order...

Say "Hello" to your new Dutch Masters... Deal
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Re: Evening Legal Briefs
Jul 21, 2016, 22:52
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Re: Evening Legal Briefs Jul 21, 2016, 22:52
Jul 21, 2016, 22:52
 
Supreme court already stated that you cannot patent mathematical equations. Hence they have nothing to worry about!

You would think someone at Genicap would have an inkling of patent law.

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Re: Evening Legal Briefs
Jul 21, 2016, 22:55
Kxmode
 
5.
Re: Evening Legal Briefs Jul 21, 2016, 22:55
Jul 21, 2016, 22:55
 Kxmode
 
"We haven't provided a license to Hello Games," Genicap's Jeroen Sparrow told the Dutch Telegraph. "We don't want to stop the launch, but if the formula is used, we'll need to have a talk."

That's a key point worth noting because whether the game ships or not is a non-issue. The license could be retroactive, post launch, to all units sold.
"Listen, Peter... with great horsepower comes... the sickest drifts..." - source
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Re: Evening Legal Briefs
Jul 21, 2016, 23:56
PHJF
 
6.
Re: Evening Legal Briefs Jul 21, 2016, 23:56
Jul 21, 2016, 23:56
 PHJF
 

Supreme court already stated that you cannot patent mathematical equations. Hence they have nothing to worry about!

Good thing they didn't patent an equation, they patented the application of an equation in rendering 2D/3D images and animations.
Steam + PSN: PHJF
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Re: Evening Legal Briefs
Jul 22, 2016, 00:01
Kxmode
 
7.
Re: Evening Legal Briefs Jul 22, 2016, 00:01
Jul 22, 2016, 00:01
 Kxmode
 
PHJF wrote on Jul 21, 2016, 23:56:

Supreme court already stated that you cannot patent mathematical equations. Hence they have nothing to worry about!

Good thing they didn't patent an equation, they patented the application of an equation in rendering 2D/3D images and animations.

How can a company not patent a mathematical formula but they can patent the application of a mathematical formula? That doesn't make sense. Either a math formula is completely patent free or the Supreme Court ruling is meaningless.

Also, does the U.S. Supreme Court's decision have jurisdiction beyond the United States? Hello Games is located in UK and Genicap is located in Nederlands. I'd imagine a matter like this would come before the European Court of Justice; their Supreme Court.

This comment was edited on Jul 22, 2016, 00:06.
"Listen, Peter... with great horsepower comes... the sickest drifts..." - source
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Re: Evening Legal Briefs
Jul 22, 2016, 00:45
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Re: Evening Legal Briefs Jul 22, 2016, 00:45
Jul 22, 2016, 00:45
 
i would hope their legal precedents in this case are similar to ours, because patenting math is bullshit.

this isn't dissimilar to how the NFL tried to go after fantasy sports companies for using player stats without permission. their lawyers know full well you can't patent (or copyright) facts, but they went after them anyway. took a ballsy company that basically told the NFL to screw off and the court sided with said company because it was such a painfully basic example of legal precedent.
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Re: Evening Legal Briefs
Jul 22, 2016, 02:45
9.
Re: Evening Legal Briefs Jul 22, 2016, 02:45
Jul 22, 2016, 02:45
 
Nice to see some people so thirsty to see this game fail. I bet if that was anybody else, the narrative would be more of the usual "f**k the patent trolls".

I hope it will fizzle out, obviously, and that they don`t really have a legal leg to stand on. In this case it`s a good thing Hello are partnered with Sony: a small indie studio on its own could be in severe trouble when faced even with a baseless lawsuit.

As for the game itself, for those still on the fence:
http://www.digitalspy.com/gaming/ps4/feature/a801705/your-biggest-no-mans-sky-questions-answered/

Can`t wait, for the first time in years I`m genuinely excited about a videogame. Yay!
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Re: Evening Legal Briefs
Jul 22, 2016, 05:23
Rilcon
 
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Re: Evening Legal Briefs Jul 22, 2016, 05:23
Jul 22, 2016, 05:23
 Rilcon
 
"patenting math is bullshit"

What's the difference between complex mathematical equations and computer code? What makes the years of study and research to figure out a consistent way of generating certain geographic shapes worth less than the lines of code to make a few pixels move up and down a screen?

This isn't patenting "2+2=4", it's patenting the equivalent of a an instruction manual to build a car.
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Re: Evening Legal Briefs
Jul 22, 2016, 07:40
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Re: Evening Legal Briefs Jul 22, 2016, 07:40
Jul 22, 2016, 07:40
 
Thankfully here in the UK we have a long history of not legally recognising patents in the style of "take x and make it on a computer and that's totally different and new compared to x". I can't see this going far.
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Re: Evening Legal Briefs
Jul 22, 2016, 07:56
PHJF
 
12.
Re: Evening Legal Briefs Jul 22, 2016, 07:56
Jul 22, 2016, 07:56
 PHJF
 
How can a company not patent a mathematical formula but they can patent the application of a mathematical formula? That doesn't make sense. Either a math formula is completely patent free or the Supreme Court ruling is meaningless.

Because patents are ALL ABOUT APPLICATION of an idea, not the idea itself.

You can SAY you're going to invent or create X to accomplish Y, but until you have the specific action or means by which to do it you aren't getting a patent for it.

The problem with patents concerning software is software is so fucking complex and patent offices so not brimming with elite coders that the scope of what is patentable and what isn't is now nebulous at best.
Steam + PSN: PHJF
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13.
 
Re: Evening Legal Briefs
Jul 22, 2016, 08:39
13.
Re: Evening Legal Briefs Jul 22, 2016, 08:39
Jul 22, 2016, 08:39
 
Rilcon wrote on Jul 22, 2016, 05:23:
"patenting math is bullshit"

What's the difference between complex mathematical equations and computer code?

Nothing - hence why software patents are absolute bullshit

Rilcon wrote on Jul 22, 2016, 05:23:
What makes the years of study and research to figure out a consistent way of generating certain geographic shapes worth less than the lines of code to make a few pixels move up and down a screen?

I don't know what planet you live on where effort automatically generates value, but I am curious about the price of an air-fare. It would be fantastic to just do whatever I want and not have to worry about paying the bills.
Or maybe I am misunderstanding the point you are trying to make. You should perhaps just state your argument rather than asking it as a question.


Rilcon wrote on Jul 22, 2016, 05:23:
This isn't patenting "2+2=4", it's patenting the equivalent of a an instruction manual to build a car.

A manual is not patentable.

I know this is likely a troll but I couldn't help myself. There was just so much stupid there, even for a blue news comment.
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Re: Evening Legal Briefs
Jul 22, 2016, 10:29
14.
Re: Evening Legal Briefs Jul 22, 2016, 10:29
Jul 22, 2016, 10:29
 
First off, Genicap isn't a patent troll, they're an actual company.

Second the guy from Hello stole someone's work by his own admission. Period.

Third Genicap tried to reach out to them. And in the face of things they actually sound genial and reasonable. Imagine if someone stole your work and then you attempted to contact them and set things right only to have them purposely ignore you. Yeah, I'd be talking lawsuit at that point as well. I, and many other people, have sued other people for literally a whole lot less.

Fourth, Genicap has a patent for this process. Hello admitted to stealing it. Ergo they are fucked if they go to court because Genicap will get an injunction against the game preventing it from being released until the legal matters are settled which could take years. So Sony is now forced to negotiate from a weak position or cut Hello loose in which case that's likely it for NMS.

Obviously Sony will want to negotiate but I don't know if that's even feasible seeing as there really isn't a game at all with out their process. It would have to be substantial percentage. Guess we'll find out in short order.
"Van Gogh painted alone and in despair and in madness and sold one picture in his entire life. Millions struggled alone, unrecognized, and struggled as heroically as any famous hero. Was it worthless? I knew it wasn't."
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