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Counter-Strike: Global Offensive Gun Nerfed

A post called Damage Control on the Counter-Strike blog has word that Valve has already nerfed the new revolver included in the recent Winter Update for Counter-Strike: Global Offensive, their teamplay shooter. They explain they would normally gather more information before making such a move, but this situation did not require a lot of extra reflection:

While it typically takes more time to generate enough data to drive an update (and gameplay updates are always a bit disruptive), in this case its clear that we got the damage wrong and can respond immediately.

So today were updating the R8 Revolver to bring its values to be more in line with other weapons: among other changes, its damage has been reduced and it takes slightly longer to fire.

As experience with other new weapons (e.g., CZ75a and M4A1-S) has shown us, it may require several iterations over a longer period to find the stable values that create interesting strategic choices for players. Were committed to monitoring usage and adjusting the values as required.

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19. Re: Counter-Strike: Global Offensive Gun Nerfed Dec 13, 2015, 12:17 Sepharo
 
descender wrote on Dec 13, 2015, 11:59:
Obviously they make rule adjustments to the modes separately but do they ever balance weapons or items differently between the two? I don't think so anyway...

Oh I didn't realize you were being specific to weapons.
Pricing on weapons and armor is different.
I want to say total ammo capacity is different.
In casual you automatically get the armor and defuse kits but you need to buy them in competitive.

This comment was edited on Dec 13, 2015, 12:23.
 
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18. Re: Counter-Strike: Global Offensive Gun Nerfed Dec 13, 2015, 11:59 descender
 
Obviously they make rule adjustments to the modes separately but do they ever balance weapons or items differently between the two? I don't think so anyway...  
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17. Re: Counter-Strike: Global Offensive Gun Nerfed Dec 13, 2015, 11:53 Sepharo
 
descender wrote on Dec 13, 2015, 11:41:
I have to completely disagree with Xero, nothing he said actually has anything specifically to do with 'eSports' or any sports at all.

Any/every "game" or "sport" can and does change the rules and players always have one choice, adapt or die. You are always subject to the whims of the governing body or "game developers". Rulesets in every game or competition in existence are constantly adjusted to eliminate deficiencies or exploits. There are positions, players, and "plays" in every sport that have either evolved or become irrelevant over time because of rule changes. The players who adapt the quickest with the highest skill level are simply the elite players... the ones people will pay to watch do it.

Could it have been a PR move? Maybe, but do you really think Valve needs PR for CS for some bizarre reason? They spend practically $0 marketing one of the most popular games on Steam on other media and it continues to be ridiculously successful. CS:GO IS their testbed, there is no beta realm and they don't distinguish between "competitive" and "casual" in any way for any patch. They merely released and adjusted a weapon, it's not a trap :p It was only even newsworthy here because of how laughably bad they messed up the damage.

I pretty much agree with your whole post but that underlined part is just not correct. Read the patch notes.
 
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16. Re: Counter-Strike: Global Offensive Gun Nerfed Dec 13, 2015, 11:41 descender
 
I have to completely disagree with Xero, nothing he said actually has anything specifically to do with 'eSports' or any sports at all.

Any/every "game" or "sport" can and does change the rules and players always have one choice, adapt or die. You are always subject to the whims of the governing body or "game developers". Rulesets in every game or competition in existence are constantly adjusted to eliminate deficiencies or exploits. There are positions, players, and "plays" in every sport that have either evolved or become irrelevant over time because of rule changes. The players who adapt the quickest with the highest skill level are simply the elite players... the ones people will pay to watch do it.

Could it have been a PR move? Maybe, but do you really think Valve needs PR for CS for some bizarre reason? They spend practically $0 marketing one of the most popular games on Steam on other media and it continues to be ridiculously successful. CS:GO IS their testbed, there is no beta realm and they don't distinguish between "competitive" and "casual" in any way for any patch. They merely released and adjusted a weapon, it's not a trap :p It was only even newsworthy here because of how laughably bad they messed up the damage.
 
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15. Re: Counter-Strike: Global Offensive Gun Nerfed Dec 11, 2015, 23:06 Ozmodan
 
Xero wrote on Dec 11, 2015, 18:29:
I read an article that stated why e-Sports can never be considered a sport and this was the key reason being. Your skill is based on the data the company sets down and it is what they want it to be.
If your awesome with 1 particular weapon lets say and it's due to an overpower or technical issue in design, the company can just make the adjustment and gone.
Sure, you can get awesome at a particular game and become great, but in the end, it's the developers that have the final say on how great you can become based on what they want to tweak.

I feel this issue was moreso the developers wanted to create more headlines and get a little CS GO news headlines by adding a new gun but making it absurd enough that you would talk about it. Mission accomplished. After reeling in enough new players/old players, they correct the issue and hope new players/old players stick around a bit longer.

You nailed it.
 
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14. Re: Counter-Strike: Global Offensive Gun Nerfed Dec 11, 2015, 19:16 Sepharo
 
Xero wrote on Dec 11, 2015, 18:29:
I read an article that stated why e-Sports can never be considered a sport and this was the key reason being. Your skill is based on the data the company sets down and it is what they want it to be.
If your awesome with 1 particular weapon lets say and it's due to an overpower or technical issue in design, the company can just make the adjustment and gone.
Sure, you can get awesome at a particular game and become great, but in the end, it's the developers that have the final say on how great you can become based on what they want to tweak.

I feel this issue was moreso the developers wanted to create more headlines and get a little CS GO news headlines by adding a new gun but making it absurd enough that you would talk about it. Mission accomplished. After reeling in enough new players/old players, they correct the issue and hope new players/old players stick around a bit longer.

I was surprised it was in competitive at all, thought it was just a casual addition for now.

But actually in the same patch that added the revolver Valve changed some rules in competitive CS:GO (their matchmaking) to bring it in line with what the leagues and tournaments playing CS:GO were using... the point being that, at least with CS, the eSports leagues can modify the game as they see fit (though admittedly that doesn't cover weapon mechanics, but they could ban a gun).
 
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13. Re: Counter-Strike: Global Offensive Gun Nerfed Dec 11, 2015, 18:43 Retired
 
Xero wrote on Dec 11, 2015, 18:29:
I read an article that stated why e-Sports can never be considered a sport and this was the key reason being. Your skill is based on the data the company sets down and it is what they want it to be.
If your awesome with 1 particular weapon lets say and it's due to an overpower or technical issue in design, the company can just make the adjustment and gone.
Sure, you can get awesome at a particular game and become great, but in the end, it's the developers that have the final say on how great you can become based on what they want to tweak.

I feel this issue was moreso the developers wanted to create more headlines and get a little CS GO news headlines by adding a new gun but making it absurd enough that you would talk about it. Mission accomplished. After reeling in enough new players/old players, they correct the issue and hope new players/old players stick around a bit longer.

Yea, I have a hard time paying out money on a rock/paper/scissors type scenario.
 
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12. Re: Counter-Strike: Global Offensive Gun Nerfed Dec 11, 2015, 18:29 Xero
 
I read an article that stated why e-Sports can never be considered a sport and this was the key reason being. Your skill is based on the data the company sets down and it is what they want it to be.
If your awesome with 1 particular weapon lets say and it's due to an overpower or technical issue in design, the company can just make the adjustment and gone.
Sure, you can get awesome at a particular game and become great, but in the end, it's the developers that have the final say on how great you can become based on what they want to tweak.

I feel this issue was moreso the developers wanted to create more headlines and get a little CS GO news headlines by adding a new gun but making it absurd enough that you would talk about it. Mission accomplished. After reeling in enough new players/old players, they correct the issue and hope new players/old players stick around a bit longer.
 
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Primarily playing ATM: CS Go, DUSK, Ion Maiden, FarCry New Dawn, 20XX
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11. Re: Counter-Strike: Global Offensive Gun Nerfed Dec 11, 2015, 18:12 Sepharo
 
Wallshadows wrote on Dec 11, 2015, 11:23:
Dagnamit wrote on Dec 11, 2015, 10:47:
Relevant:

http://gfycat.com/BoilingSevereGreatdane

Yeah, it was pretty good. LOL

I'll take 'What is hit detection for $500', Alex.

It's fine. Are you paying attention? You can click that gfy and pause if you'd like.

He's using the right click mode on that gun that lets you fire quicker but has worse accuracy, and he's using it while moving.
He missed the first 2 shots, and on the third shot he got a double headshot (not sure why the first guy didn't get the HS icon but you see the sparks from his helmet so that is what he hit). And then on the fourth shot he gets another double HS.

The first double HS was a wild shot due to the inaccuracy of the secondary fire and moving, it's just off to the side of his reticle. The second shot is aimed right on the head because he strafe stops before firing and/or he got lucky with a centered shot during inaccurate firing.

In CS (and really most FPS) the crosshair is aiming where you desire to aim it. The bullets go where they do based on spread of the gun while being modified by your movement. Otherwise you'd have a crosshair bouncing all over the screen as you ran and fired.

Edit: and the exact same thing would have happened with a deagle.
 
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10. Re: Counter-Strike: Global Offensive Gun Nerfed Dec 11, 2015, 17:58 Rhett
 
RedEye9 wrote on Dec 11, 2015, 16:01:
JayDeath wrote on Dec 11, 2015, 13:21:
CS was so great during the beta years. What the hell happened?
We grew up.

Just to spend thousands of dollars on skins for guns, and new hats...

I honestly don't enjoy CS:GO, but I can't get past the fact that people ogle that unnecessarily expensive shit.
 
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9. Re: Counter-Strike: Global Offensive Gun Nerfed Dec 11, 2015, 17:55 Retired
 
Wallshadows wrote on Dec 11, 2015, 11:23:
Dagnamit wrote on Dec 11, 2015, 10:47:
Relevant:

http://gfycat.com/BoilingSevereGreatdane

Yeah, it was pretty good. LOL

I'll take 'What is hit detection for $500', Alex.

Ill take "What does TERRIBLE TACTICS LOOK LIKE for $1000"

This comment was edited on Dec 11, 2015, 18:06.
 
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8. Re: Counter-Strike: Global Offensive Gun Nerfed Dec 11, 2015, 17:00 Zyrxil
 
JayDeath wrote on Dec 11, 2015, 13:21:
CS was so great during the beta years. What the hell happened?

Have you played CS since beta? I haven't, but AFAICT, it's more popular than ever and has converted most of the old guard. And they had new hitboxes put in recently, which was a problem for like a decade. It's one gun from 5 day old patch that got memed all over the place. Don't be a crazy nostalgia dude.
 
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7. Re: Counter-Strike: Global Offensive Gun Nerfed Dec 11, 2015, 16:01 RedEye9
 
JayDeath wrote on Dec 11, 2015, 13:21:
CS was so great during the beta years. What the hell happened?
We grew up.
 
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"The Universe is under no obligation to make sense to you." Neil deGrasse Tyson
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6. Re: Counter-Strike: Global Offensive Gun Nerfed Dec 11, 2015, 15:25 born2expire
 
JayDeath wrote on Dec 11, 2015, 13:21:
CS was so great during the beta years. What the hell happened?

valve happened
 
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5. Re: Counter-Strike: Global Offensive Gun Nerfed Dec 11, 2015, 14:13 jacobvandy
 
Dagnamit wrote on Dec 11, 2015, 10:47:
Relevant:

http://gfycat.com/BoilingSevereGreatdane

Yeah, it was pretty good. LOL

Meh, right there he just got really lucky in how they lined up, any gun would have mowed them down with headshots like that. Maybe it shouldn't kill in one hit to the torso (was that one wearing armor, though?) but if it pierces and hits the other guy in the face, I don't see anything wrong with him being dead.
 
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4. Re: Counter-Strike: Global Offensive Gun Nerfed Dec 11, 2015, 13:21 JayDeath
 
CS was so great during the beta years. What the hell happened?  
Steam: BenRichards
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3. Re: Counter-Strike: Global Offensive Gun Nerfed Dec 11, 2015, 11:23 Wallshadows
 
Dagnamit wrote on Dec 11, 2015, 10:47:
Relevant:

http://gfycat.com/BoilingSevereGreatdane

Yeah, it was pretty good. LOL

I'll take 'What is hit detection for $500', Alex.
 
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2. Re: Counter-Strike: Global Offensive Gun Nerfed Dec 11, 2015, 10:47 Dagnamit
 
Relevant:

http://gfycat.com/BoilingSevereGreatdane

Yeah, it was pretty good. LOL
 
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1. Re: Counter-Strike: Global Offensive Gun Nerfed Dec 11, 2015, 09:28 PHJF
 
They made a gun better than the deagle?!?!  
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Steam + PSN: PHJF
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