Op Ed

GamesIndustry.biz - A red Flag for Greenlight.
If that were true, though, why does Greenlight exist at all? What is Greenlight, after all, if not a holding pen designed to keep the vast tsunami of games - many if not most of them absolutely terrible - off the hallowed Steam service itself? If Valve truly believes in openness, in the intelligence of crowds mediated through the mechanisms of markets, then why doesn't it just let everyone release whatever they want on Steam, subject to rudimentary technical checks to make sure they're not actually distributing viruses or malware? In fact, that's Valve's stated long-term goal; an open Steam, with Greenlight gone and new games pouring onto the platform constantly, to sink or swim according to the pure will of the market.

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21.
 
Re: Op Ed
May 8, 2015, 21:37
21.
Re: Op Ed May 8, 2015, 21:37
May 8, 2015, 21:37
 
Razumen wrote on May 8, 2015, 18:28:
Cutter wrote on May 8, 2015, 17:02:
Open Steam? So no more regional pricing and customers can get refunds on terrible products? No? Didn't think so. Valve is completely full of shit.

I don't think you understand the concept of an "Open" Steam.

Actually, I do. It's Valve that doesn't seem to understand the concept.
"Van Gogh painted alone and in despair and in madness and sold one picture in his entire life. Millions struggled alone, unrecognized, and struggled as heroically as any famous hero. Was it worthless? I knew it wasn't."
20.
 
Re: Op Ed
May 8, 2015, 18:56
20.
Re: Op Ed May 8, 2015, 18:56
May 8, 2015, 18:56
 
Razumen wrote on May 8, 2015, 15:52:
Krovven wrote on May 8, 2015, 15:27:
Task wrote on May 8, 2015, 10:04:
When I went to that article, I admit I read the first first paragraph and quit and then clicked on this other Valve article there instead:

Valve's flat structure leads to cliques, says ex-employee

No wonder they are lagging behind on game development; their production is all over the place like a hyperactive kid that doesn't know what to concentrate on. Jeri's group was working on VR-type hardware glasses, they get laid off, and then Valve announces their VR.
"Hmm, remember that group we fired... working on the VR?" - Employee 1
"Yeah?" - Employee 2
"Let's make the a VR thing now, it should be profitable now." Employee 1
"Hey guys, we need more people over on HL3," - HL3 employee
"Nah, that's not profitable right now," - Employee 1

Ever think of looking up the reason they were released instead of jumping to conclusions?

Valve had 2 different VR teams working on 2 different implementations. They stuck with one, releasing the other AND allowed that leaving team to take their tech with them and continue on their own. Despite the obvious conflict.

What company does that? A good one.


I don't know, Oculus and the Vive are pretty damn similar, and I wouldn't agree it's good business practice to let your employees leave with tech they developed under your roof and become competitors.

I honestly don't know much about the VR/AR options. I think it's a stupid niche thing like 3D glasses for gaming. I have zero interest in wearing headgear while I game, considering how much I do game.

But the AR that the other team was working on, works differently and does different things. Obviously Valve felt they weren't losing out on anything, even if that team did succeed.

I never said it was good or bad for business. I said that's how Valve does things. We also don't know the circumstances they began working on the project. Maybe one or more of the team came in with the concept that was their own and Valve just covered the R&D costs for a year. We don't really know. Valve made their choice and shockingly in this business they didn't screw the employees effected by it.

19.
 
Re: Op Ed
May 8, 2015, 18:28
19.
Re: Op Ed May 8, 2015, 18:28
May 8, 2015, 18:28
 
Cutter wrote on May 8, 2015, 17:02:
Open Steam? So no more regional pricing and customers can get refunds on terrible products? No? Didn't think so. Valve is completely full of shit.

I don't think you understand the concept of an "Open" Steam.
18.
 
Re: Op Ed
May 8, 2015, 18:18
Jivaro
 
18.
Re: Op Ed May 8, 2015, 18:18
May 8, 2015, 18:18
 Jivaro
 
jdreyer wrote on May 8, 2015, 16:11:
Meh, Greenlight is like Youtube for games. Anyone can upload anything, but if it violates TOS, it gets removed. Greenlight <> Steam until Valve approves it, so I think the system is working fine.

This.
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17.
 
Re: Op Ed
May 8, 2015, 18:11
Dev
17.
Re: Op Ed May 8, 2015, 18:11
May 8, 2015, 18:11
Dev
 
Valve openly admitted why they created greenlight in the announcement for it. They were tired of doing the work of approving games for steam and instead wanted the community to do it, which happens to be free.
16.
 
Re: Op Ed
May 8, 2015, 17:36
16.
Re: Op Ed May 8, 2015, 17:36
May 8, 2015, 17:36
 
harlock wrote on May 8, 2015, 17:24:
dont say that to xerox

Haha, yeah I suppose there is always the risk of spawning an Apple.
15.
 
Re: Op Ed
May 8, 2015, 17:24
15.
Re: Op Ed May 8, 2015, 17:24
May 8, 2015, 17:24
 
dubfanatic wrote on May 8, 2015, 17:08:
Razumen wrote on May 8, 2015, 15:52:
I don't know, Oculus and the Vive are pretty damn similar, and I wouldn't agree it's good business practice to let your employees leave with tech they developed under your roof and become competitors.

It is if it's an immature uncharted market. Let someone else make the mistakes and you get free lessons. It worked great for Nintendo.

dont say that to xerox
14.
 
Re: Op Ed
May 8, 2015, 17:08
14.
Re: Op Ed May 8, 2015, 17:08
May 8, 2015, 17:08
 
Razumen wrote on May 8, 2015, 15:52:
I don't know, Oculus and the Vive are pretty damn similar, and I wouldn't agree it's good business practice to let your employees leave with tech they developed under your roof and become competitors.

It is if it's an immature uncharted market. Let someone else make the mistakes and you get free lessons. It worked great for Nintendo.
13.
 
Re: Op Ed
May 8, 2015, 17:02
13.
Re: Op Ed May 8, 2015, 17:02
May 8, 2015, 17:02
 
Open Steam? So no more regional pricing and customers can get refunds on terrible products? No? Didn't think so. Valve is completely full of shit.
"Van Gogh painted alone and in despair and in madness and sold one picture in his entire life. Millions struggled alone, unrecognized, and struggled as heroically as any famous hero. Was it worthless? I knew it wasn't."
12.
 
Re: Op Ed
May 8, 2015, 16:22
12.
Re: Op Ed May 8, 2015, 16:22
May 8, 2015, 16:22
 
There has to be a happy medium between an open distribution platform and a curated one. Just off the top of my head they could implement a ranking system that factors in the average playtime. (ie. Game X is played for average of 0.5 hours).

I really dislike that the Steam store is beginning to look awful lot like the mobile appstores on android and iOS. It is really difficult to know what is a quality game and what is terrible one with the current system.

11.
 
Re: Op Ed
May 8, 2015, 16:11
11.
Re: Op Ed May 8, 2015, 16:11
May 8, 2015, 16:11
 
Meh, Greenlight is like Youtube for games. Anyone can upload anything, but if it violates TOS, it gets removed. Greenlight <> Steam until Valve approves it, so I think the system is working fine.
If Russia stops fighting, the war ends. If Ukraine stops fighting, Ukraine ends. Slava Ukraini!
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10.
 
Re: Op Ed
May 8, 2015, 15:52
10.
Re: Op Ed May 8, 2015, 15:52
May 8, 2015, 15:52
 
Krovven wrote on May 8, 2015, 15:27:
Task wrote on May 8, 2015, 10:04:
When I went to that article, I admit I read the first first paragraph and quit and then clicked on this other Valve article there instead:

Valve's flat structure leads to cliques, says ex-employee

No wonder they are lagging behind on game development; their production is all over the place like a hyperactive kid that doesn't know what to concentrate on. Jeri's group was working on VR-type hardware glasses, they get laid off, and then Valve announces their VR.
"Hmm, remember that group we fired... working on the VR?" - Employee 1
"Yeah?" - Employee 2
"Let's make the a VR thing now, it should be profitable now." Employee 1
"Hey guys, we need more people over on HL3," - HL3 employee
"Nah, that's not profitable right now," - Employee 1

Ever think of looking up the reason they were released instead of jumping to conclusions?

Valve had 2 different VR teams working on 2 different implementations. They stuck with one, releasing the other AND allowed that leaving team to take their tech with them and continue on their own. Despite the obvious conflict.

What company does that? A good one.


I don't know, Oculus and the Vive are pretty damn similar, and I wouldn't agree it's good business practice to let your employees leave with tech they developed under your roof and become competitors.
9.
 
Re: Op Ed
May 8, 2015, 15:44
9.
Re: Op Ed May 8, 2015, 15:44
May 8, 2015, 15:44
 
When it comes to Valve I enjoy jumping to conclusions lately; its cathartic, because as you can see, HL3 is included in the diatribe/joke.
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8.
 
Re: Op Ed
May 8, 2015, 15:27
8.
Re: Op Ed May 8, 2015, 15:27
May 8, 2015, 15:27
 
Task wrote on May 8, 2015, 10:04:
When I went to that article, I admit I read the first first paragraph and quit and then clicked on this other Valve article there instead:

Valve's flat structure leads to cliques, says ex-employee

No wonder they are lagging behind on game development; their production is all over the place like a hyperactive kid that doesn't know what to concentrate on. Jeri's group was working on VR-type hardware glasses, they get laid off, and then Valve announces their VR.
"Hmm, remember that group we fired... working on the VR?" - Employee 1
"Yeah?" - Employee 2
"Let's make the a VR thing now, it should be profitable now." Employee 1
"Hey guys, we need more people over on HL3," - HL3 employee
"Nah, that's not profitable right now," - Employee 1

Ever think of looking up the reason they were released instead of jumping to conclusions?

Valve had 2 different VR teams working on 2 different implementations. They stuck with one, releasing the other AND allowed that leaving team to take their tech with them and continue on their own. Despite the obvious conflict.

What company does that? A good one.

7.
 
Re: Op Ed
May 8, 2015, 13:25
7.
Re: Op Ed May 8, 2015, 13:25
May 8, 2015, 13:25
 
The impression I got was the first team wanted an Augmented Reality focus and everyone else wanted a VR focus. I think that's the most basic and un-nuanced interpretation.
6.
 
Re: Op Ed
May 8, 2015, 10:18
6.
Re: Op Ed May 8, 2015, 10:18
May 8, 2015, 10:18
 
Task wrote on May 8, 2015, 10:04:
When I went to that article, I admit I read the first first paragraph and quit and then clicked on this other Valve article there instead:

Valve's flat structure leads to cliques, says ex-employee

No wonder they are lagging behind on game development; their production is all over the place like a hyperactive kid that doesn't know what to concentrate on. Jeri's group was working on VR-type hardware glasses, they get laid off, and then Valve announces their VR.
"Hmm, remember that group we fired... working on the VR?" - Employee 1
"Yeah?" - Employee 2
"Let's make the a VR thing now, it should be profitable now." Employee 1
"Hey guys, we need more people over on HL3," - HL3 employee
"Nah, that's not profitable right now," - Employee 1

That's exactly what I thought when they announced the Vive. The only sensible reason I can think of that they let those people go earlier was that there was a falling out of sorts, but even then it was rather daft of them to let them leave with the technology they developed.
5.
 
Re: Op Ed
May 8, 2015, 10:04
5.
Re: Op Ed May 8, 2015, 10:04
May 8, 2015, 10:04
 
When I went to that article, I admit I read the first first paragraph and quit and then clicked on this other Valve article there instead:

Valve's flat structure leads to cliques, says ex-employee

No wonder they are lagging behind on game development; their production is all over the place like a hyperactive kid that doesn't know what to concentrate on. Jeri's group was working on VR-type hardware glasses, they get laid off, and then Valve announces their VR.
"Hmm, remember that group we fired... working on the VR?" - Employee 1
"Yeah?" - Employee 2
"Let's make the a VR thing now, it should be profitable now." Employee 1
"Hey guys, we need more people over on HL3," - HL3 employee
"Nah, that's not profitable right now," - Employee 1
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4.
 
Re: Op Ed
May 8, 2015, 09:41
4.
Re: Op Ed May 8, 2015, 09:41
May 8, 2015, 09:41
 
Nevermind, I just checked and apparently half the page didnt even load for me the first time I read through it. Lol.

My apologies to the author, the article makes a lot more sense now.
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3.
 
Re: Op Ed
May 8, 2015, 09:39
3.
Re: Op Ed May 8, 2015, 09:39
May 8, 2015, 09:39
 
Quboid wrote on May 8, 2015, 09:36:
It doesn't say that at all, InBlack. He is advocating more checks and saying that Valve's idea of an open Steam is a bad idea.

Also, I think that game did not get Greenlit. It was on Greenlight, but it was pulled before its campaign had a chance to succeed or fail.

What?? Did we even read the same article?
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2.
 
Re: Op Ed
May 8, 2015, 09:36
Quboid
 
2.
Re: Op Ed May 8, 2015, 09:36
May 8, 2015, 09:36
 Quboid
 
It doesn't say that at all, InBlack. He is advocating more checks and saying that Valve's idea of an open Steam is a bad idea.

Also, I think that game did not get Greenlit. It was on Greenlight, but it was pulled before its campaign had a chance to succeed or fail.
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