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24. Re: etc. Jun 10, 2014, 04:02 Numinar
 
Stormsinger wrote on Jun 10, 2014, 00:24:
Redmask wrote on Jun 9, 2014, 22:44:
Cutter wrote on Jun 9, 2014, 18:51:
Yeah, 1 hit is the very definition of lucky. Guys like Meir, Molyneux, Carmack, CliffyB, Spector, et al. have been knocking out pretty major hits for over 20 years.

Highly debatable. No one said hes an industry authority, he gets to have an opinion like anyone else. If an armchair internet guy like you gets to have one then I think the guy who made millions making a Java voxel game gets to have his opinion too.

No shit...I'd say the one-hit-wonder has infinitely more cred than a no-hit-wonder.

All those guys have a pretty shocking hit rate TBH. Worse than Metalica in some cases if we want to stick with the Music comparison.

It was a Molyneux quote in that Minecraft doco that was my big clue that at least some of these old codgers would have loved to have put their name to it, and I wager each one of them respects MC and Notch more than some of the people here do, though I wouldn't dare speak for them it's a confident guess.

Edit-Well, Sid is fairly unassailable here, and still codes. MtG, Pirates, Railroad Tycoon, Gunsip. Amazing stuff. Ace patrol is one of the only "Real" games IOS has and is well worth a few bucks. But if you need that record to have an opinion on industry trends there would be very few opinions. And even he has a few questionable releases (Still a little upset with how Railroads was a little underbaked, but certainly still worth dozens of hours of my time).

Even he wishes he had made Tetris though, another one hit wonder.

This comment was edited on Jun 10, 2014, 04:37.
 
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23. Re: etc. Jun 10, 2014, 00:24 Stormsinger
 
Redmask wrote on Jun 9, 2014, 22:44:
Cutter wrote on Jun 9, 2014, 18:51:
Yeah, 1 hit is the very definition of lucky. Guys like Meir, Molyneux, Carmack, CliffyB, Spector, et al. have been knocking out pretty major hits for over 20 years.

Highly debatable. No one said hes an industry authority, he gets to have an opinion like anyone else. If an armchair internet guy like you gets to have one then I think the guy who made millions making a Java voxel game gets to have his opinion too.

No shit...I'd say the one-hit-wonder has infinitely more cred than a no-hit-wonder.
 
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22. Re: etc. Jun 9, 2014, 22:44 Redmask
 
Cutter wrote on Jun 9, 2014, 18:51:
Yeah, 1 hit is the very definition of lucky. Guys like Meir, Molyneux, Carmack, CliffyB, Spector, et al. have been knocking out pretty major hits for over 20 years.

Highly debatable. No one said hes an industry authority, he gets to have an opinion like anyone else. If an armchair internet guy like you gets to have one then I think the guy who made millions making a Java voxel game gets to have his opinion too.
 
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21. Re: etc. Jun 9, 2014, 19:49 SlimRam
 
deqer wrote on Jun 9, 2014, 19:39:
harlock wrote on Jun 9, 2014, 15:11:
Rattlehead wrote on Jun 9, 2014, 15:07:
You jelly bro?

am i jealous of a multi-millionaire? fuck yeh, who wouldnt be?
Christians wouldn't be, because that is what's known as sinful jealousy; and God doesn't like that. God only likes what's known as holy jealousy.

You mean i'm going to Hell? Awwwww Dammit!

This comment was edited on Jun 9, 2014, 19:55.
 
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20. Re: etc. Jun 9, 2014, 19:39 deqer
 
harlock wrote on Jun 9, 2014, 15:11:
Rattlehead wrote on Jun 9, 2014, 15:07:
You jelly bro?

am i jealous of a multi-millionaire? fuck yeh, who wouldnt be?
Christians wouldn't be, because that is what's known as sinful jealousy; and God doesn't like that. God only likes what's known as holy jealousy.
 
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19. Re: etc. Jun 9, 2014, 18:51 Cutter
 
Numinar wrote on Jun 9, 2014, 12:58:
Cutter wrote on Jun 9, 2014, 12:12:
If this guy ever moves beyond a one hit wonder and establishes himself as a real designer with some longevity I might give him some credence. The reality is so far he's a punk who got lucky once, so no.

Lucky? Really?

This is a guess, but I wager most "Real Designers" would give up ten of their games to have one Minecraft in their resume. More than one hit? How many designers even have one? Of anything approaching this scale? Until something happens to the worlds supply of 10 year olds this thing will keep rocking because everything else seems cheap, bloated or just stupid by comparison.

Guy gets some hate, and fair enough if he wants to voice opinions he deserves backlash. Better than the usual robotic "Don't piss off the current/future publishers!" devspeak from those souls living contract to contract if you ask me.

Hitting him in the credentials though? Seems a bit of a stretch. Would you get called a hack that nobody should listen to if you only had one highly successful, money vomiting mid sized business to your name?

Yeah, 1 hit is the very definition of lucky. Guys like Meir, Molyneux, Carmack, CliffyB, Spector, et al. have been knocking out pretty major hits for over 20 years. The guy had a game that became the in-thing and tons of people jumped on the bandwagon - just like DayZ and a ton of other titles. You going to say Dean Hall is a genius developer now? Hey, they made a fortune off a game. Bully for them. Plenty of musicians have made a fortune off 1 song. That doesn't give them any kind of cred to talk about the industry like they're authority on it. When you're the fucking Rolling Stones and have been doing it for 50 years, then you can talk and actually have people take you seriously.
 
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"Listen, Iím not the nicest guy in the Universe because Iím the smartest. And being nice is something stupid people do to hedge their bets." - Rick Sanchez
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18. Re: etc. Jun 9, 2014, 18:00 Numinar
 
Fion wrote on Jun 9, 2014, 15:26:
Minecraft was very much a solid and nearly complete game by the time you could buy into it (for $12, lets not forget). Many of these early access titles are charging twice as much as a fully released AAA game for what amounts to a game that barely functions or has any content at all, and too many people are buying into the 'hype' alone of those products. The ever-present bandwagon, I have friends who are throwing $60, $80, $120 at a game and bitching about how broke it is or how it barely has anything to do, and a month later doing it all over again because the bandwagon suddenly says x game is the new 'rising star'.

I kind of disagree, the $5 or whatever it was beta I got in on was a mere shadow of what it is now (Though promising and valuable at 1/4 the price for early adopters). But it is one of my biggest arguments for why Early Access can be a good thing.

But as with this industry and entertainment as a whole, for every Minecraft, Kerbal or Prison Architect there are a thousand phoned in, amateur hour, poorly conceived wastes of time. This is what the bearded one was getting at with his critique I think.
 
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17. Re: etc. Jun 9, 2014, 15:26 Fion
 
Minecraft was very much a solid and nearly complete game by the time you could buy into it (for $12, lets not forget). Many of these early access titles are charging twice as much as a fully released AAA game for what amounts to a game that barely functions or has any content at all, and too many people are buying into the 'hype' alone of those products. The ever-present bandwagon, I have friends who are throwing $60, $80, $120 at a game and bitching about how broke it is or how it barely has anything to do, and a month later doing it all over again because the bandwagon suddenly says x game is the new 'rising star'.  
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16. Re: etc. Jun 9, 2014, 15:11 harlock
 
Rattlehead wrote on Jun 9, 2014, 15:07:
You jelly bro?

am i jealous of a multi-millionaire? fuck yeh, who wouldnt be? same goes for any super-rich asshole

but it doesnt negate any of my other points about notch, either

and its pretty funny when smug little dumbshits think that comment is some kind of ultimate resolution to this issue
 
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15. Re: etc. Jun 9, 2014, 15:07 Rattlehead
 
harlock wrote on Jun 9, 2014, 15:00:
oh i missed that..

yeh, notch is done - we dont need his armchair bullshit

seriously, i played minecraft and enjoyed it, but the majority of his success had a lot more to do with market timing and other x factors like modability, rather than sheer gaming brilliance or some kind of super genius workmanship... so yeh, the idea of him "deserving" millions upon millions for minecraft is definitely questionable to me - and therefore his proclamations about what devs "should and shouldnt" do is laughable imo

fuck off to your mansion, notch, play with your fancy cars or whatever the fuck you spend your cash on.. leave the work to people who are still in the game
You jelly bro?
 
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14. Re: etc. Jun 9, 2014, 15:00 harlock
 
oh i missed that..

yeh, notch is done - we dont need his armchair bullshit

seriously, i played minecraft and enjoyed it, but the majority of his success had a lot more to do with market timing and other x factors like modability, rather than sheer gaming brilliance or some kind of super genius workmanship... so yeh, the idea of him "deserving" millions upon millions for minecraft is definitely questionable to me - and therefore his proclamations about what devs "should and shouldnt" do is laughable imo

fuck off to your mansion, notch, play with your fancy cars or whatever the fuck you spend your cash on.. leave the work to people who are still in the game
 
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13. Re: etc. Jun 9, 2014, 14:51 Creston
 
harlock wrote on Jun 9, 2014, 14:24:
whatever happened to that space game he was supposedly making where you program your own computer and all that shit

He stopped working on it indefinitely. (in other words: it got canceled.)

Apparently the systems worked pretty well, but there was zero fun to be had in any of it.
 
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12. Re: etc. Jun 9, 2014, 14:45 djinn
 
harlock wrote on Jun 9, 2014, 14:24:
whatever happened to that space game he was supposedly making where you program your own computer and all that shit

I guess the question was rhetorical, but in case not - didn't he can that?

Slightly off topic: I remember him dumping all over those unlimited detail guys back in the day, saying the software was a scam. While the owner of that company was super smug and said some incredibly dumb things himself, it seemed fairly premature of Notch to assume it was a scam. I lost a bit of respect for him after that. Even Carmack didn't go that far, he just said it isn't useful for games which was completely correct. http://youtu.be/csvmRgi0gZQ
 
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11. Re: etc. Jun 9, 2014, 14:24 harlock
 
whatever happened to that space game he was supposedly making where you program your own computer and all that shit

notch is just some has been, super-rich retired asshole at this point

minecraft development was one of slowest in history, fuck this guy
 
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10. Re: etc. Jun 9, 2014, 13:51  Verno 
 
Cutter wrote on Jun 9, 2014, 12:12:
If this guy ever moves beyond a one hit wonder and establishes himself as a real designer with some longevity I might give him some credence. The reality is so far he's a punk who got lucky once, so no.

Your bitter jealousy is apparent in your post. He got lucky to the tune of many million dollars. I think all of us could stand to have some of that "luck". If the number of hits is a yard stick for success then by your own words most developers are total failures by comparison.
 
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9. Re: etc. Jun 9, 2014, 12:58 Numinar
 
Cutter wrote on Jun 9, 2014, 12:12:
If this guy ever moves beyond a one hit wonder and establishes himself as a real designer with some longevity I might give him some credence. The reality is so far he's a punk who got lucky once, so no.

Lucky? Really?

This is a guess, but I wager most "Real Designers" would give up ten of their games to have one Minecraft in their resume. More than one hit? How many designers even have one? Of anything approaching this scale? Until something happens to the worlds supply of 10 year olds this thing will keep rocking because everything else seems cheap, bloated or just stupid by comparison.

Guy gets some hate, and fair enough if he wants to voice opinions he deserves backlash. Better than the usual robotic "Don't piss off the current/future publishers!" devspeak from those souls living contract to contract if you ask me.

Hitting him in the credentials though? Seems a bit of a stretch. Would you get called a hack that nobody should listen to if you only had one highly successful, money vomiting mid sized business to your name?
 
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8. Re: etc. Jun 9, 2014, 12:33 Creston
 
Pigeon wrote on Jun 9, 2014, 11:50:
I saw a quote from him explaining it was mostly a jab at 'minimal effort' early release green-light games, but he also acknowledges the inherent hypocrisy seeing as mine-craft was an early access game for years.

Someone should explain to Notch that acknowledging that you're a hypocrit does not, in fact, alleviate said hypocrisy.
 
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7. Re: etc. Jun 9, 2014, 12:26  Prez 
 
Classy. Make millions of bucks off selling an incomplete version of Minecraft, which took roughly five years to actually reach an actual release candidate, then complain at the other guys doing the same thing?

Exactly what I thought. I used to kind of like notch for his cavalier, lone wolf attitude but now I think he's just another hypocritical douche.
 
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6. Re: etc. Jun 9, 2014, 12:12 Cutter
 
If this guy ever moves beyond a one hit wonder and establishes himself as a real designer with some longevity I might give him some credence. The reality is so far he's a punk who got lucky once, so no.
 
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"Listen, Iím not the nicest guy in the Universe because Iím the smartest. And being nice is something stupid people do to hedge their bets." - Rick Sanchez
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5. Re: etc. Jun 9, 2014, 11:50 Pigeon
 
Creston wrote on Jun 9, 2014, 11:27:
Classy. Make millions of bucks off selling an incomplete version of Minecraft, which took roughly five years to actually reach an actual release candidate, then complain at the other guys doing the same thing?

I agree that SOME early access games are a scam, and some are released as nothing but a few rudimentary ideas, but there are also plenty of early access games that are released in roughly the same state as Minecraft was.

The Age of Notch is passing.

I saw a quote from him explaining it was mostly a jab at 'minimal effort' early release green-light games, but he also acknowledges the inherent hypocrisy seeing as mine-craft was an early access game for years.

Frankly my take away from it is, if you're doing early access release something people would want to access early.
 
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