I think there is enough unrest across the western side about battlefield 4 for the Chinese problem to be a small one. Anyone who has bought this piece of shit, wont be buying another from Dice ever again after this episode.

Off topic a bit but is anyone having issues logging into BattleLog? After reading this post and seeing something about the game being better than ever. So I tried to boot it up and was prompted by a plugin install for BattleLog.

So I installed the plugin. And again, again, and again. I Uninstalled BattleLog and reinstalled the shit plugin again. Still can't log into a game server. Awesome. So from my point of view it is not better than ever. It is the same old shit.

dubfanatic wrote on Dec 27, 2013, 23:19:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Whataboutism

If you think about it, "Whataboutism" is the dismission of valid criticism, because it's aimed at one's self, and one's self is 'exceptional', and immune to criticism.

It's the perfect response method for an actor of the kind : do as I say, not as I do.

Mashiki Amiketo wrote on Dec 28, 2013, 06:06:

Silicon Avatar wrote on Dec 28, 2013, 01:22:
China has leadership that restricts its population's choices and uses media control to help it remain in power.

But China isn't stupid. People who say things like that learn hard lessons.

China is stupid. Here's the key reason why: 70% of their current generation has no family prospects, no future life prospects due to the "one child" policy. That means a large swath of their population is going to see one of two things, either a war with them as cannon fodder--or massive civil unrest because they have no future prospects.

Which gets back to China's lack of social safety net, and their culture of "wife moves in with the husband", "Husband inherits parent's property".

If the state won't help you when you're old, you need to depend on your kids. And if you only get to have 1 kid, and the only kind of kid that will stick around is a boy, then you end up with a massive boy bias.


... b.b.b.but they're communist?
In name only.
China is more like the robber-baron era U.S. than anything resembling socialism.
Europe (and the U.S.) is closer to actual socialism than China. (Not a derogatory statement. Just is what it is.)

-scheherazade

This comment was edited on Dec 28, 2013, 12:07.

El Pit wrote on Dec 28, 2013, 07:26:

And the few that start political unrests get political re-education in camps as soon as they raise their heads. China is very much in control of everything, that's a lesson they learned from the Tianamen Revolt. React as soon as possible and as ruthless as possible to prevent another Tianamen incident.

Not really. You need to go spend some time at one of their universities to see exactly how much control they have. Hell the last time they tried to wipe out a fishing village, they had to back down after the international media got wind of it. And that was after trying to starve the 10k or so people out by cutting off all supplies in or out.

They have control, just not as much control as you might think. Not even among the peasant class(aka dirt farmers).

El Pit wrote on Dec 28, 2013, 07:26:
You cannot turn a free thinking human into a loyal citizen too early, I guess.

There's a lot of indoctrination in Canadian schools as well that starts at around 3 years old too.

China is definitely not stupid, they just think very long term in strategy. I would not bet against them to be the next major world power eclipsing the US.

A civil unrest needs intelligent people with open minds to get started. China teaches 3 and 4 year old kids its doctrine. They have to learn sentences by heart like "Taiwan is and will always be a part of China" or "Great Britain stole Hong Kong from us during the Drug Wars" and so on. It's difficult for Chinese people to get rid of this, because their "political education" starts so early. Well, on the other hand there are other countries with pre-school prayers, and elementary school pledges of alliance (not only in the US!!!), and so on. You cannot turn a free thinking human into a loyal citizen too early, I guess.

And the few that start political unrests get political re-education in camps as soon as they raise their heads. China is very much in control of everything, that's a lesson they learned from the Tianamen Revolt. React as soon as possible and as ruthless as possible to prevent another Tianamen incident.

Silicon Avatar wrote on Dec 28, 2013, 01:22:
China has leadership that restricts its population's choices and uses media control to help it remain in power.

But China isn't stupid. People who say things like that learn hard lessons.

China is stupid. Here's the key reason why: 70% of their current generation has no family prospects, no future life prospects due to the "one child" policy. That means a large swath of their population is going to see one of two things, either a war with them as cannon fodder--or massive civil unrest because they have no future prospects.

China has leadership that restricts its population's choices and uses media control to help it remain in power.

But China isn't stupid. People who say things like that learn hard lessons.

Darks wrote on Dec 27, 2013, 12:58:

Task wrote on Dec 27, 2013, 12:39:

Darks wrote on Dec 27, 2013, 12:11:
China is such a stupid country

Care to draw some examples?

China and the U.S. are equally stupid when it comes to their governments. The people however of these countries have little say in what their government does.

Tiananmen Square. Need I say more? I can go on and on about their policies and lack of environmental procedures too. The country is a toxic wasteland.

Sounds like you are describing the USA.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Whataboutism

Hellbinder wrote on Dec 27, 2013, 15:00:
Has anything china done worse than rounding up all the native americans that were left after we slaughtered them all for jesus because this was the new promised land and stuffed them onto reservations?

Yes, you just need to go browse their history. Key things include the mass slaughter of tibetan citizens and the cultural revolution come to the top of my head. You're only looking for 10 to 30 million depending on the figures, and that was in the last 70-80 years.

Task wrote on Dec 27, 2013, 12:39:

Darks wrote on Dec 27, 2013, 12:11:
China is such a stupid country

Care to draw some examples?

China and the U.S. are equally stupid when it comes to their governments. The people however of these countries have little say in what their government does.

Nonsense. While the US is hardly perfect, there are a lot of freedoms here that we take for granted that aren't possible there.

They've got their Internet locked down, and even if you want to send a PERSONAL letter to someone in China you have to have customs papers with it.

China is far more corrupt than the US (not saying we're not corrupt by any means btw)

They're a one party government, and the government is far more intrusive on the everyday lives of people there than they are in the US.

The US has more than it's fair share of issues, but yeah, China is a bit sensitive. I think we're used to being criticized because we've been on the top of the hill since WWII, but China does look idiotic when they whine about a video game "smearing it's image"

Ryan Lange wrote on Dec 27, 2013, 18:12:

4D-Boxing wrote on Dec 27, 2013, 13:42:
Plus I would be insulted to if our Canadian soldier's lateral movement looked like Beiber trying to sidestep wearing skinny jeans 2 sizes to small.

Given everything that's apparently wrong with the game, that seems like a very odd thing to focus on here.

Game is pretty awesome now after the last 2 patches that were released in the last 2-3 weeks.

Given the state that BF4 is in bug wise, are not the Chinese government doing the right thing by it's people?

Point 1: this game was made by a Swedish dev.

Point 2: you could make a game where you play as a Chinese soldier killing Americans. Doubt it would sell well, but it wouldn't be banned.

I wonder if this will prompt the Chinese to make a Chinese-centric BF copycat.

4D-Boxing wrote on Dec 27, 2013, 13:42:
Plus I would be insulted to if our Canadian soldier's lateral movement looked like Beiber trying to sidestep wearing skinny jeans 2 sizes to small.

Given everything that's apparently wrong with the game, that seems like a very odd thing to focus on here.

Yeah you get to kill a bunch of Russkies too. Probably not much consolation to the Chinese.

I hardly had any bugs in single player.. a handful of crashes over the length of the whole campaign. Had more stuff in multi (was amusing when they broke SLI) but still not a huge deal. Guess I'm really lucky and/or forgiving.

Cutter wrote on Dec 27, 2013, 14:09:

Task wrote on Dec 27, 2013, 12:39:

Darks wrote on Dec 27, 2013, 12:11:
China is such a stupid country

Care to draw some examples?

China and the U.S. are equally stupid when it comes to their governments. The people however of these countries have little say in what their government does.

Not so. America is worse because people actually can affect government and its policies. They simply choose not to out of apathy and greed.

And Darks calling someone or something else dumb is the height of irony. Put that clown on ignore.

Kiss my ass Cutter!!

Tom wrote on Dec 27, 2013, 14:46:
Of course China is going to ban this. Anyone who has played through the campaign would expect this. I'm surprised it took this long. You play as US military killing hundreds if not thousands of stupid Chinese soldiers. You help some magically charismatic Chinese pacifist civilian who the Chinese soldiers instantly change sides for without question, with a revolution highly suggested. It's propaganda at its best. If only they'd managed to work in the pollution angle somehow.

Between all the glitches and bugs you can hardly even tell there's a story to the game, and in many levels you're killing Russian soldiers... in China.

At least in multiplayer you can be a Chinese soldier killing stupid American soldiers.

Hellbinder wrote on Dec 27, 2013, 15:00:

Tom wrote on Dec 27, 2013, 14:46:
Of course China is going to ban this. Anyone who has played through the campaign would expect this. I'm surprised it took this long. You play as US military killing hundreds if not thousands of stupid Chinese soldiers. You help some magically charismatic Chinese pacifist civilian who the Chinese soldiers instantly change sides for without question, with a revolution highly suggested. It's propaganda at its best. If only they'd managed to work in the pollution angle somehow.

Imagine if they made a game where you played the Chinese military attacking major US cities and killing countless dumb Americans.

Most of the politicians would implode and the media shitstorm would be legendary

Funny how America never stops to think that maybe other people actually like their country they same way they do theirs. Has anything china done worse than rounding up all the native americans that were left after we slaughtered them all for jesus because this was the new promised land and stuffed them onto reservations?

America has done more evil shit to people than almost any other country on earth in about the shortest amount of time and we think because we had a couple of good years during WWII that nothing else matters.

On that note ... :

Re: The term Redskin (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Redskin_%28slang%29)

"The colonial government paid 50 pounds for scalps of males over 12 years, 25 pounds for scalps of women over 12, and 20 pounds for scalps of boys and girls under 12. Twenty-five British pounds sterling in 1755, worth around $9,000 today —a small fortune in those days when an English teacher earned 60 pounds a year."

Although, in their defense, such acts were par for the course in those times.
Back then you'd have a draw&quarter in the town square, and people were so accustomed to it that such events were only passingly mentioned in journals, etc, dwarfed by content of what one had for dinner.

-scheherazade

This comment was edited on Dec 27, 2013, 17:31.