Nice try, NSA. Other polls show support is much lower for them, around 40%.

56% are stupid idiots.

Rattlehead wrote on Jun 11, 2013, 17:44:

HorrorScope wrote on Jun 11, 2013, 16:09:

RollinThundr wrote on Jun 11, 2013, 13:34:

ASeven wrote on Jun 11, 2013, 13:11:
Techdirt puts some light on this poll.

Republicans and Democrats have had very different views of the two operations. Today, only about half of Republicans (52%) say it is acceptable for the NSA to obtain court orders to track phone call records of millions of Americans to investigate terrorism. In January 2006, fully 75% of Republicans said it was acceptable for the NSA to investigate suspected terrorists by listing in on phone calls and reading emails without court approval.

Democrats now view the NSA’s phone surveillance as acceptable by 64% to 34%. In January 2006, by a similar margin (61% to 36%), Democrats said it was unacceptable for the NSA to scrutinize phone calls and emails of suspected terrorists.

Shocking I tell you. No not really. Like I've said, it's ok if your party of choice is in office, regardless if it's healthy for the nation or not.

Solid point, when GW was in power... all is good, when the other guy is, now it's all bad. Yup.

The big difference is when Obama took office he had the chance to disband all of these spy programs that Bush imposed. Instead Obama is just following in W's footsteps. Too me that's even worse, because he knew of the wrongdoing in the first place, but instead of setting things right he lied to the public and did the same god damn backstabbing dirty spying that W instituted.

Pretty much and I didn't agree with Bush on the patriot act either for the record. Hell I don't even think Junior was a particularly good president either.

I don't give a shit that machines are storing and analyzing my digital life.

What I do care about is how that information is used against me. I'm much more upset that there were cases brought against the government concerning this spying and that they denied the data existed. Make the program public (thanks Mr. Snowden) and give the citizen a chance to fight against misuse of this data when it occurs.

If someone sees you on a message board planning a terrorist attack and they report it to the police, a warrant is obtained and they begin monitoring your communications and building a case. You're innocent until proven guilty. You get a lawyer, you get a jury of your peers. Throw out this secret tribunal shit and be up front with the evidence, how it was obtained and why that was justified. I'm willing to allow this process to begin with a program instead of a concerned informant but there has to be accountability, oversight, and regulation... it has to be fucking voted on by our elected "representatives" and we have to have our day in court.

Creston wrote on Jun 11, 2013, 18:10:

One of the funnier (or perhaps sadder) findings is that partisan loyalty trumps intellectual integrity for many people, with Democrats increasingly approving wholesale spying on Americans when it's their guy doing it, and vice versa:

In other words, the large majority of Americans just parrots whatever bullshit "their" party is spewing.

Or what the media is telling them. Almost all of which is privately owned by companies involved in defense contracting.

saluk wrote on Jun 11, 2013, 19:24:
There is a difference between, "oh yeah, I'm sure the nsa has ways to get at your data" and "here is the method nsa uses to steal private inforation, and the companies they have backroom, non-public, secret deals with".

One thing that a lot of the people who 'think this is ok' don't understand is that a lot of the companies working on this are private corporations.

It's not just the government getting the information, it's all the defense contractors as well.

But what gives the government the right to have our data in the first place? So many people assume they have the right to do so because they make laws allowing it. HELLO?

It would be a different matter if we gave them permission to do so - but what we have is an authoritarian regime taking on power for itself - and anybody old enough, observant enough and educated in history will know that the government cannot be trusted, let alone private corporations.

I wouldn't mind the equipment being there to begin monitoring someone ONCE a judge issues a search warrant - as it is possible to target that individual - but this system of grabbing everyone's data would give J. Edgar Hoover an absolute boner.

Room 641a, this prism crap has been known for quite awhile.

Rattlehead wrote on Jun 11, 2013, 17:44:
The big difference is when Obama took office he had the chance to disband all of these spy programs that Bush imposed. Instead Obama is just following in W's footsteps. Too me that's even worse, because he knew of the wrongdoing in the first place, but instead of setting things right he lied to the public and did the same god damn backstabbing dirty spying that W instituted.

Its even worse than all that as he specifically campaigned against all this secretive bullshit and then went full retard when he got in office. Both "parties" have elected terrible leaders back to back, noone gets to use "told you so" anymore. Speaking as a Canadian here, what we're seeing coming out of your country is scaring us. Partly because its making our government envious!

There is a difference between, "oh yeah, I'm sure the nsa has ways to get at your data" and "here is the method nsa uses to steal private inforation, and the companies they have backroom, non-public, secret deals with".

One of the funnier (or perhaps sadder) findings is that partisan loyalty trumps intellectual integrity for many people, with Democrats increasingly approving wholesale spying on Americans when it's their guy doing it, and vice versa:

In other words, the large majority of Americans just parrots whatever bullshit "their" party is spewing.

Christ almighty this country needs to get rid of the fucking two-party system in a hurry.

Creston

dj LiTh wrote on Jun 11, 2013, 13:05:
What amazes me is that its news in the first place, i mean how daft do you have to be to actually think that things you do on the internet of all places are safe, secure, and private from government spy and security agencies?

It's not just public comments and facebook profiles that are being collected. Everything is being probed, including your search history, emails, private conversations, transaction histories, etc. You know, stuff that generally should be left private.

I guess I'm daft to assume that my emails were not being tapped.

dj LiTh wrote on Jun 11, 2013, 13:05:
What amazes me is that its news in the first place, i mean how daft do you have to be to actually think that things you do on the internet of all places are safe, secure, and private from government spy and security agencies?

Quoted for truth.

HorrorScope wrote on Jun 11, 2013, 16:09:

RollinThundr wrote on Jun 11, 2013, 13:34:

ASeven wrote on Jun 11, 2013, 13:11:
Techdirt puts some light on this poll.

Republicans and Democrats have had very different views of the two operations. Today, only about half of Republicans (52%) say it is acceptable for the NSA to obtain court orders to track phone call records of millions of Americans to investigate terrorism. In January 2006, fully 75% of Republicans said it was acceptable for the NSA to investigate suspected terrorists by listing in on phone calls and reading emails without court approval.

Democrats now view the NSA’s phone surveillance as acceptable by 64% to 34%. In January 2006, by a similar margin (61% to 36%), Democrats said it was unacceptable for the NSA to scrutinize phone calls and emails of suspected terrorists.

Shocking I tell you. No not really. Like I've said, it's ok if your party of choice is in office, regardless if it's healthy for the nation or not.

Solid point, when GW was in power... all is good, when the other guy is, now it's all bad. Yup.

The big difference is when Obama took office he had the chance to disband all of these spy programs that Bush imposed. Instead Obama is just following in W's footsteps. Too me that's even worse, because he knew of the wrongdoing in the first place, but instead of setting things right he lied to the public and did the same god damn backstabbing dirty spying that W instituted.

Doesn't surprise me. Most American's are fat, lazy ignorant slobs who's scope of life is limited to reality TV, tabloids, NASCAR and wrestling. It sickens me as an American that all those people just sit back and willfully are OKAY with trading all their freedoms, liberties, privacy and rights in the name of national security. Isn't that what the troops overseas are fighting for? Freedom? This is not what the founder father's wrote the constitution and bill of rights for.

Sorry but I will not sit back while the tyrannical government tramples my rights as a US Citizen. It's not okay, and someone should have to answer for these crimes which I consider terrorism in it's own way.

I've wrote to Congress, Obama and I plan to join a rally in Boston protesting this. I do not want to live in a police state.

This comment was edited on Jun 11, 2013, 17:51.

I don't pretend to speak for Blue, but of course he should cover stories about, electric gaming technology being wiretapped illegally.

I'm betting 95% of these 56% can't explain what's going on or have any understanding. Think those 56% would still approve if they knew it was a violation of the Constitution 1st and 4th amendments.

It doesn't matter what party is in power, the executive does NOT have legal authority. Even worst is the congress is to utterly incompetent to do their job of reining in the executive. Much less any other responsibility doing their job and running the country budgetary issues.

Not being able to look past political affiliation is just another form of mental illness, just like racism or sexism. It's called a psychosis. Iirc only one senator voted against the Patriot Act every time, sentor Ron Wyden. He has a political affiliation but that doesn't mean his votes are politically based. Believe it or not some people do their job.

Wallshadows wrote on Jun 11, 2013, 17:05:
This whole fiasco reminds me of the experiment with the frog where it would stay put in a slowly boiling cooking pot until it dies.

Yep, take away our privacy inch by inch and most won't complain. I wish there was something that could be done, but we're watching a trainwreck in slow motion. There's no stopping it, because it's already off the tracks. The only hope is that when all is said and done and things hit rock bottom, we'll get a chance to do things better next time.

This whole fiasco reminds me of the experiment with the frog where it would stay put in a slowly boiling cooking pot until it dies.

RollinThundr wrote on Jun 11, 2013, 13:34:

ASeven wrote on Jun 11, 2013, 13:11:
Techdirt puts some light on this poll.

Republicans and Democrats have had very different views of the two operations. Today, only about half of Republicans (52%) say it is acceptable for the NSA to obtain court orders to track phone call records of millions of Americans to investigate terrorism. In January 2006, fully 75% of Republicans said it was acceptable for the NSA to investigate suspected terrorists by listing in on phone calls and reading emails without court approval.

Democrats now view the NSA’s phone surveillance as acceptable by 64% to 34%. In January 2006, by a similar margin (61% to 36%), Democrats said it was unacceptable for the NSA to scrutinize phone calls and emails of suspected terrorists.

Shocking I tell you. No not really. Like I've said, it's ok if your party of choice is in office, regardless if it's healthy for the nation or not.

Solid point, when GW was in power... all is good, when the other guy is, now it's all bad. Yup.

dj LiTh wrote on Jun 11, 2013, 13:05:
What amazes me is that its news in the first place, i mean how daft do you have to be to actually think that things you do on the internet of all places are safe, secure, and private from government spy and security agencies?

I'm out of town for a bit over the week, missed the breaking news, was at a table and this came up. I thought they were just talking about all this in general as this isn't new news, I didn't think. But the media and some people act as this is shocking. This doesn't mean I think it is right or wrong, but I was surprised to see this was really news to a lot of people.

I'm a bit torn, but my bottom line is since I can't trust the gov't, they have unquestionably lied to us before. It should be very difficult to classify anything and as soon as possible all things become declassified. They are just voted in, not some type of "you get to know everything and we know nothing", that isn't part of the deal. Tired of them deciding if we can handle it or not. This needs to change, they weren't given that power, they just took it and it shows again deceit on their end.

Group
Unweighted
sample size Plus or minus …
Total sample 1,004 3.7 percentage points
Republicans 224 7.9 percentage points
Democrats 337 6.4 percentage points
Independents 352 6.3 percentage points
Data from FridaySunday interviews only 743 4.3 percentage points
Republicans 165 9.2 percentage points
Democrats 238 7.6 percentage points
Independents 273 7.1 percentage points

And that mirrors the national breakdown? LOL