InBlack wrote on Apr 9, 2013, 06:07:
Wow I thought I was the only one who loved Ultima8. I dont feel so dirty anymore...thanks Cres

Seriously though, Pagan Ultima 8 was one of those games that drew you in the more you played them, warts and all. It was buggy as hell and had frustrating puzzle and adventure elements but IMO it was probably one of the most atmospheric games ever made.

Hehe. Yeah, I quite enjoyed playing it several times. It starts off pretty poor, but does become really cool and immersive later on, especially once you start getting to the demonic magic.

Creston

eRe4s3r wrote on Apr 9, 2013, 01:35:

datachasm wrote on Apr 8, 2013, 18:29:

Garriot mentioned the possibility of having to type to NPC's instead of just choosing from menus... we will see!

That is the DUMBEST thing I ever heard (no offense to you, i mean that feature). Even assuming it wouldn't be major pain in the ass because of a stupid interpreter that can't handle misspellings and short-hand, even assuming the game were only 5 hours long and had only 3 characters. I would not, ever, type a conversation like the one I am having with you, to a brain dead computer interpreter.

Heck, you would be stuck just using keywords too. So complex dialog with certain tone and attitude would be impossible.

It's how the old Ultimas did dialogues. Worked just fine for me, to be honest. Yes, it's obviously keyword based, but I always thought it was pretty fun.

Creston

Creston wrote on Apr 8, 2013, 15:04:

eRe4s3r wrote on Apr 8, 2013, 14:26:
Anyhow.. if he makes this another Ultima 8 or 9 disaster it's gonna be a laugh. And considering he MADE ULTIMATE 8 I am more surprised people believe this dude can make a proper RPG at all...

Ultima 8 really wasn't as bad as some people make it out to be. It seems that after U9, people automatically made up their minds that U8 had been terrible as well. It was a very deep and complex RPG that unfortunately tried to incorporate some arcade elements and failed to do so properly. (though some of them were later fixed in a patch.)

By Ultima 9, RG apparently had little to do with the series anymore, and you can thank that cockwallet producer from C&C (Ed diCastillo, if memory serves) for making such a fucking mess of it.

Still, Ultima was made because he had a terrific team of designers. Spector, Long, Loubet, Zurovec, Roberts, etc, and none of those guys are coming back, so it'll remain to be seen how good this'll be.

I figured I've had enough fun out of the Ultima series over the years (and especially during the 80s and early 90s. I played them almost constantly,) that I can front RG 30 bucks and hope this turns out well.

Creston

Wow I thought I was the only one who loved Ultima8. I dont feel so dirty anymore...thanks Cres

Seriously though, Pagan Ultima 8 was one of those games that drew you in the more you played them, warts and all. It was buggy as hell and had frustrating puzzle and adventure elements but IMO it was probably one of the most atmospheric games ever made.

I pledged low then went too high... but my last minute drunken pledge increase wasn't ok'd by the credit card company which is a good thing since my tired mind wasn't thinking clearly. I advised my wife the next morning how much I had pledged and she did her best not to blow a gasket. Then after breakfast I checked my e-mail to find the pledge was not authorized by American Express. She was very happy. So I'm in but wishing the house deeds were at a lower price point.

Also if you're looking for another nice looking European cRPG with turn based combat which ships with the editor here you go...

http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/larianstudios/divinity-original-sin

datachasm wrote on Apr 8, 2013, 18:29:

Garriot mentioned the possibility of having to type to NPC's instead of just choosing from menus... we will see!

That is the DUMBEST thing I ever heard (no offense to you, i mean that feature). Even assuming it wouldn't be major pain in the ass because of a stupid interpreter that can't handle misspellings and short-hand, even assuming the game were only 5 hours long and had only 3 characters. I would not, ever, type a conversation like the one I am having with you, to a brain dead computer interpreter.

Heck, you would be stuck just using keywords too. So complex dialog with certain tone and attitude would be impossible.

It's named unity because it runs natively on windows XP to Windows 8, mac and linux...

The reason Unity engine games look a bit average is because Indy developers don't have any kind of money to push AAA visuals.. which should be pretty obvious!

datachasm wrote on Apr 8, 2013, 18:29:
Torment has no multiplayer... it will very likely plummet in price/value after release.

Would you care to expand on that topic, I'm curious as to how you think the secondary market for Star Citizen might work. As many early adopters have permanent exemptions from fees/insurance that many might want to have. Much like the "Founder's Deeds" in SotA.

He's already spent millions of his own cash getting the new dev studio and the project off the ground, and he'll probably spend more if the game goes over budget. I'd rather he included RPG fans on some of the decisions, than made them all himself. This way he Taylor the game more towards what the customers want, since they have a stake in the project too.

Again... I'm sure this will prove if he still can design games or not.

Cutter wrote on Apr 8, 2013, 10:03:
I sure as shit wasn't going to back a fat cat like Garriot

I've have to completely agree, if a guy won't put his own money behind it and he has lots....I don't think Garriott is confident in this project being successful.

I'm voting this Kickstarter 'most likely to be spent on hookers and blow' out of all of the recent gaming ones that successfully funded

noticed this on day one, backed at $25, and upped my pledge 4 times or so to finally hit $150. i have only backed this and Star Citizen.

dumped my Torment pledge about halfway to add to SotA. Torment has no multiplayer... it will very likely plummet in price/value after release.

it was a great kickstart, excellent use of the streaming camera, with Garriot even dungeon mastering some d&d, being interviewed, and being very transparent with the backers and answering tons of questions.

i was surprised no news over here about it...

anyways, for me it was a no brainer. a good rpg with a chance of standing out from the pack and being innovative and unique? count me in! Garriot mentioned the possibility of having to type to NPC's instead of just choosing from menus... we will see!

It's nice to see Kickstarter put to good use in giving a small start-up the chance to fulfill a dream.

BIGtrouble77 wrote on Apr 8, 2013, 16:08:
Anyone concerned with them using the Unity Engine?

The list of games released on prior and current Unity engine versions is unimpressive and you could argue, uncharitably, that they are merely .NET based flash games serving the lowest common visual denominator.

Check out Battlestar Galactica and Guns of Icarus On-Line, which are both Unity developed. Unity itself claims improvements with DirectX 11 support with version 4 but it is intended to be a web/mobile based engine and I share your concerns that 'console-itis' might now be replaced with 'smartphone-itis'.

The engine was not named Unity to highlight the exclusive and superior capacity of power desktop gaming rigs.

Ultima VI and VII/SI were absolutely outstanding games. Unfortunately it's rare for such success to be repeated and I just had a bad feeling about this whole venture. It also didn't seem right to give a donation to someone rich enough to be one of the first space tourists. But hey, prove me wrong LB. Show the world you still got it. Then I'll gladly give you my hard earned buckazoids and we can all be happy! (This sentiment goes ten-fold for Chris Roberts...)

Btw I wouldn't worry too much about them using Unity. It seems to have a growing rep for quality and it works great for Kerbal Space Program at least. And it's a very wise decision to use a third-party engine if you need to deliver a cross-platform game, which is par for the course for most KS games. In the FTL mini-post-mortem in this month's Game Developer magazine, they cited cross-platform as one of the biggest things that went wrong for them. I expect a large part of that had to do with writing their own game engine.

I'm giving Garriot one more shot with this so I hope he goes all out. Ultima 5 was my personal favorite. I thought 5, 6, and 7 were the best of the entire series.

It's funny how so many people have a different favorite Ultima. My personal favorite is Ultima VI and Savage Empire at a close second. It's mostly nostalgia, but I was absolutely blown away by how wide open ultima VI was and how deep the storyline was. Ultima VII is also fantastic... Currently playing through Ultima IV and V on my ipad.

I pledged $62 for Shroud of the Avatar, really wish I could have gone for the $125 package, but with a little one on the way my wife would have killed me.

Anyone concerned with them using the Unity Engine? I've made some basic games with Unity, but it always felt like a toy engine. Graphically it's not the greatest, but they should be able to get everything done on time, especially if the community gets involved in building assets.

Actually, I really liked the Ultima Underworld series much better than any of the U7, 8, or 9 series of games.

Underworld was one of the first to add a 3d world camera similar to the older Eye of the Beholder games. I had a lot of fun with that older series.

Nah, there are few SNES RPGs better than U8. U8's world is really deep. It has four completely different magic systems, all of which work really well, and can be used for some great combos. It also has really cool dungeon that originally were ruined by fucking TERRIBLE jumping sequences, a really good story, and a pretty expansive world.

But even so, U8 is nowhere near the level of the Ultima 7 series, or even U4 / U5. U7 Black Gate and Serpent Isle are still the finest RPGs around in my book.

Creston

Well yeah, I only ever got to Ultima by the time 9 released, so my first impression was disastrous. Then I checked back 1 (so Ultima 8) because people said that was better, and it was horrible ;p

Not because it was really bad, but because I had played Baldurs Gate 1 before... and since then and Infinity Engine, I could NEVER go back. To Infinity, and beyond!

And after that, with Baldurs Gate 2, NWN and Torment.. I never bothered with Ultima again. I guess it is one of those generational things. I never really grew up with the old RPG's, I only played the "old" SNES rpgs and such around 2006... but even they were better than Ultima 8 or 9....

eRe4s3r wrote on Apr 8, 2013, 14:26:
Anyhow.. if he makes this another Ultima 8 or 9 disaster it's gonna be a laugh. And considering he MADE ULTIMATE 8 I am more surprised people believe this dude can make a proper RPG at all...

Ultima 8 really wasn't as bad as some people make it out to be. It seems that after U9, people automatically made up their minds that U8 had been terrible as well. It was a very deep and complex RPG that unfortunately tried to incorporate some arcade elements and failed to do so properly. (though some of them were later fixed in a patch.)

By Ultima 9, RG apparently had little to do with the series anymore, and you can thank that cockwallet producer from C&C (Ed diCastillo, if memory serves) for making such a fucking mess of it.

Still, Ultima was made because he had a terrific team of designers. Spector, Long, Loubet, Zurovec, Roberts, etc, and none of those guys are coming back, so it'll remain to be seen how good this'll be.

I figured I've had enough fun out of the Ultima series over the years (and especially during the 80s and early 90s. I played them almost constantly,) that I can front RG 30 bucks and hope this turns out well.

Creston

After several interviews with more info, I backed this. Hopefully he can recreate the Ultima4 - Ultima 7 magic.

Creston