Agrajag wrote on May 2, 2012, 07:04:Beamer wrote on May 1, 2012, 14:40:
There's no provision in kickstarter that says your product has to come out.
From the Kickstarter FAQs:If you are unable to fulfill the promises made to backers, cannot complete the project as advertised, or decide to abandon the project for any reason, you are expected to cancel funding. A failure to do so could result in damage to your reputation or even legal action on behalf of your backers.
Beamer wrote on May 1, 2012, 14:40:
There's no provision in kickstarter that says your product has to come out.
If you are unable to fulfill the promises made to backers, cannot complete the project as advertised, or decide to abandon the project for any reason, you are expected to cancel funding. A failure to do so could result in damage to your reputation or even legal action on behalf of your backers.
Krovven wrote on May 1, 2012, 21:43:Highly unlikely. Even the highest video game kickstarter with a few million isn't anywhere close to what EA would need to spend on something like dungeon keeper.MisterBenn wrote on May 1, 2012, 19:43:
I also wonder whether the larger studios will try to get in on the act in some way.
I can only hope that EA or LucasArts would do this with Dungeon Keeper and Outlaws.
painless42 wrote on May 1, 2012, 21:08:
Just give me my cardboard and no one gets hurt!![]()
Kickstarter-OGRE
Kicksarter-Zombicide
MisterBenn wrote on May 1, 2012, 19:43:
I also wonder whether the larger studios will try to get in on the act in some way.
xXBatmanXx wrote on May 1, 2012, 11:18:I have fond memories of Phantom/Infinium Labs, mostly because they gave out some nice t-shirts (glow in the dark, no less) one year at E3. I still wear mine, so do 2 other people I gave 'em too.
I remember thinking this one looks supspicious when it was announced. oh well. Just the way it goes. Hay whatever happened to the Phantom Console system?![]()
CommunistHamster wrote on May 1, 2012, 10:19:Of what? Everyone knew (or should have) that there are crap (and/or scam) projects on kickstarter. Fortunately, a lot of people seem to have a clue. Also, things like no funding unless it hits the goal are countermeasures against crap projects.
Naysayers of kickstarter now have a small shred of evidence.
Creston wrote on May 1, 2012, 18:01:
Because if you're going to make it hard to detect, you're going to have to actually, like, you know, have an actual PROJECT you're working on, and you're going to have to show updates to that project throughout the projected development window, and basically... work on the actual project.
Which is typically a helluva lot more work than scammers really want to do.
Beamer wrote on May 1, 2012, 17:35:
Obviously there's a big difference, I'm saying it's hard to prove that difference.
And anyway, my point isn't "OMG, everyone is going to scam this!" my point is "if you're going to scam this why make it so damn obvious and scammy? Why not make it ambiguous and hard to detect?" ASeven, read.
Also, it's hard for people to sue for their $20 back individually, and it's not like it'll be a class action lawsuit.
Creston wrote on May 1, 2012, 15:51:Beamer wrote on May 1, 2012, 14:40:Creston wrote on May 1, 2012, 14:18:Beamer wrote on May 1, 2012, 13:08:
I don't even get why these guys did this much of a scam.
Just discuss an awesome idea, show some concept art, put the figure low by saying you have some personal financing, and get $10k-$20k of free money.
Then say the project fell through. No one can really do anything to prove otherwise, and I don't believe there's any accountability.
It's still fraud, and thus you can still get criminal charges filed against you. So yay for running from the FBI for 20K?
Creston
It isn't entirely fraud. There's no provision in kickstarter that says your product has to come out. The risk is that a product won't come out.
It doesn't sound like a hard system to game. These guys clearly committed fraud by making lots of untrue claims. But if you were to not make those claims, how is it fraud? Let's say you get the $20k and use it to buy some computers and ipads to develop, then the money is gone and you fold the company. What are you accountable for, bad planning? How is it any different from any of the other companies that have had kickstarters, taken the cash and are no longer moving forward with the project?
There's a huge difference between trying to do a project and failing, and obviously from day one never actually intending to do anything and just taking the money and running. Even legally.
The FBI does not take kindly to that latter one. Now whether they'd investigate when the total damages would have been < 5K is doubtful, but risking becoming the target of an investigation for that kind of chump change would be really stupid.
Creston
Beamer wrote on May 1, 2012, 14:40:Creston wrote on May 1, 2012, 14:18:Beamer wrote on May 1, 2012, 13:08:
I don't even get why these guys did this much of a scam.
Just discuss an awesome idea, show some concept art, put the figure low by saying you have some personal financing, and get $10k-$20k of free money.
Then say the project fell through. No one can really do anything to prove otherwise, and I don't believe there's any accountability.
It's still fraud, and thus you can still get criminal charges filed against you. So yay for running from the FBI for 20K?
Creston
It isn't entirely fraud. There's no provision in kickstarter that says your product has to come out. The risk is that a product won't come out.
It doesn't sound like a hard system to game. These guys clearly committed fraud by making lots of untrue claims. But if you were to not make those claims, how is it fraud? Let's say you get the $20k and use it to buy some computers and ipads to develop, then the money is gone and you fold the company. What are you accountable for, bad planning? How is it any different from any of the other companies that have had kickstarters, taken the cash and are no longer moving forward with the project?
CommunistHamster wrote on May 1, 2012, 15:18:Beamer wrote on May 1, 2012, 14:40:
How is it any different from any of the other companies that have had kickstarters, taken the cash and are no longer moving forward with the project?
Please name some of these "target reached" kickstarters that took the money and ran. I have not heard of them.
Beamer wrote on May 1, 2012, 14:40:
How is it any different from any of the other companies that have had kickstarters, taken the cash and are no longer moving forward with the project?