Flatline wrote on Apr 29, 2012, 21:26:
I'll pass on Tir. It's too close to Seattle.

Chicago would be nice, but I'll probably end up voting for Berlin. There's a *large* following of Shadowrun in Germany of all places, and not only would Berlin be a cool tip to them for helping keep SR alive, but is a vastly different city than Seattle.

But Berlin is just another city. It's basically like Seattle, only the food is better. (and I assume that in 2052, it's still a giant fucking construction pit.)

Tir Tairngire is basically magical fairy land put in the modern world. It's at least DIFFERENT.

I still want to see Bug City, though.

Creston

saluk wrote on Apr 29, 2012, 22:31:
I think I agree with WarpCrows hope that this game would give the Shadowrun license enough cred for more games in the universe. A NWN type engine, or a bethesda style open world game would both make me happy, after the first turn based game. If I had any faith that an MMO would be good, I would want that, but I can't see it.

Cliffhanger Productions is creating one as noted here.

I also have high hopes for Jordan's other IP, Battletech making a solid impression with MechWarrior Online, it's a shame they couldn't get the funding to do a full fledged title as that demo they shopped around a couple years ago was impressive.

I'm hoping crimson sky sequel is in the cards...but I doubt that'll be cheap.

nin wrote on Apr 29, 2012, 14:33:
Now where's my Two Guys kickstarter???

Two guys from andromeda?

saluk wrote on Apr 29, 2012, 22:31:
I think I agree with WarpCrows hope that this game would give the Shadowrun license enough cred for more games in the universe. A NWN type engine, or a bethesda style open world game would both make me happy, after the first turn based game. If I had any faith that an MMO would be good, I would want that, but I can't see it.

Still, I think if the same team just keeps making more games in this same vein it will be great as well. As long as nothing like the Microsoft project ever happens again...

Here's to hoping. I chipped my 60 in, can't wait for this and hope it turns out being fantastic. I also have high hopes for Jordan's other IP, Battletech making a solid impression with MechWarrior Online, it's a shame they couldn't get the funding to do a full fledged title as that demo they shopped around a couple years ago was impressive.

Hoping MW:O feels like Multiplayer Battletech 3025, if that ends up being the case I may never need to by another game again.

I think I agree with WarpCrows hope that this game would give the Shadowrun license enough cred for more games in the universe. A NWN type engine, or a bethesda style open world game would both make me happy, after the first turn based game. If I had any faith that an MMO would be good, I would want that, but I can't see it.

Still, I think if the same team just keeps making more games in this same vein it will be great as well. As long as nothing like the Microsoft project ever happens again...

Creston wrote on Apr 29, 2012, 14:14:

JediPunisher wrote on Apr 29, 2012, 14:05:
Now for the hard part... we wait.

UGH, tell me about it.
I can't believe it'll be another YEAR before we see this. But I think it'll be worth it.

And we got the SNES/Genesis tie-in mission, AND we got the SNES and Genesis guys to do music, AND we got a second city (Tir Tairngire or Bug City?), AND we got Riggers, AND we got Physical Adepts, AND we got a better editor. Holy shit this is gonna rock so fucking hard.

*hops up and down in glee until game comes out.*

Creston

I'll pass on Tir. It's too close to Seattle.

Chicago would be nice, but I'll probably end up voting for Berlin. There's a *large* following of Shadowrun in Germany of all places, and not only would Berlin be a cool tip to them for helping keep SR alive, but is a vastly different city than Seattle.

WarpCrow wrote on Apr 29, 2012, 15:39:
MShadowrun Returns will be a turn-based tactical RPG, yes. And that'll be great, because if anyone can do it justice then the original creators of the setting should be able to. All I'm saying is -maybe- it could open the door for something bigger and deeper, something with more freedom and more opportunities for exploration, something that Kickstarter so far has been unable to muster the cash for. If it could be done through Kickstarter then great, if not, well, there are still half-decent publishers out there who might spring for it if SR is a success. That's what I'm interested in, my fantasy for the long term. YMMV.

Much better would be a new NWN that you can plug any D20 system into. It would also have the abilty to do turn-based combat. A CRPG creator like that would be a natch KS project because the big publishers won't touch a game like that anymore if they can't monetize any and all content. That's why these sort of KS projects are good and you'll never see anything like it from any major publisher.

Wowbagger_TIP wrote on Apr 29, 2012, 20:31:

Dmitri_M wrote on Apr 29, 2012, 17:30:

killer_roach wrote on Apr 29, 2012, 17:18:
That's why Kickstarter is interesting to me - not only is it a disruptive technology, it's allowing for all kinds of grand experiments.

It sounds like you're treating games like some high concept art project. I'm simply looking for a return to decent gameplay driven titles. I don't see KS as a build-up or a first step towards something "bigger". We've seen where "bigger" leads. Bigger means wide appeal and simpler titles with graphic styles and gameplay that appeal to the masses. From what I've seen the KS titles are driven by old gamers, the sorts of people current COD only playing "modern gamers" would dismiss as nerds. These people created the titles I grew up with, it's very clear to me what they aim to produce. Good new titles. My expectations begin and end with the result of these games. Hopefully they'll turn out decent.

When you think of bigger, I think you're still getting trapped in the binary choice he was referring to. It's not a choice between a game created to satisfy the 30-50K people that funded it and a game that must sell 5 million copies to be a success. There is a LOT of middle ground in there. If the game does well and they do a Shadowrun Returns 2, they could maybe raise twice the money and create a game with more depth and more content. Maybe they actually implement a matrix interface rather than just giving deckers the ability to manipulate the world via their own "magic" ways. There are all kinds of possibilities out there.

I'm not talking about specific gameplay elements. I was referring to talk about these titles causing a flood of high quality "open world high budget" titles. Which is odd since it contradicts everything the KS devs have said regarding publishers and the games industry.

Jerykk wrote on Apr 29, 2012, 20:26:
Apparently the game is supposed to be released in January? Nine months seems pretty short for an RPG. Granted, it will be a 2D RPG so asset creation will take significantly less time but still. Oh well, guess we'll see how it turns out.

I think the swag is coming in January. They said the game would take about a year, IIRC. And a year without having to hop and jump to a publisher's "daily needs/wants" is probably plenty of time to make a game that doesn't feature 900GB of art assets.

Creston

Dmitri_M wrote on Apr 29, 2012, 17:30:

killer_roach wrote on Apr 29, 2012, 17:18:
That's why Kickstarter is interesting to me - not only is it a disruptive technology, it's allowing for all kinds of grand experiments.

It sounds like you're treating games like some high concept art project. I'm simply looking for a return to decent gameplay driven titles. I don't see KS as a build-up or a first step towards something "bigger". We've seen where "bigger" leads. Bigger means wide appeal and simpler titles with graphic styles and gameplay that appeal to the masses. From what I've seen the KS titles are driven by old gamers, the sorts of people current COD only playing "modern gamers" would dismiss as nerds. These people created the titles I grew up with, it's very clear to me what they aim to produce. Good new titles. My expectations begin and end with the result of these games. Hopefully they'll turn out decent.

When you think of bigger, I think you're still getting trapped in the binary choice he was referring to. It's not a choice between a game created to satisfy the 30-50K people that funded it and a game that must sell 5 million copies to be a success. There is a LOT of middle ground in there. If the game does well and they do a Shadowrun Returns 2, they could maybe raise twice the money and create a game with more depth and more content. Maybe they actually implement a matrix interface rather than just giving deckers the ability to manipulate the world via their own "magic" ways. There are all kinds of possibilities out there.

Apparently the game is supposed to be released in January? Nine months seems pretty short for an RPG. Granted, it will be a 2D RPG so asset creation will take significantly less time but still. Oh well, guess we'll see how it turns out.

If you contributed and aren't listed, send them an email asking about it. Likely, they'll fix you right up.

One question regarding Kickstarter: I have supported Shadowrun Returns and Wasteland 2, via Paypal. Now I've read among some comments on Kickstarter that others also pledged via Paypal and are listed as supporters on KS. Granting them the ability to comment etc.

In my case I'm not listed as a supporter for any of both projects. Did I miss something? My mail accounts are identical for Paypal and KS, so that should allow them to identify me.

Any ideas? Did anyone else use Paypal and is (not) listed?

Im happy for them, Im a backer and ill get a copy of the game + other goodies!

killer_roach wrote on Apr 29, 2012, 17:33:
I'm an economist - anything that toys with how production, supply, demand, and pricing operate is bound to capture my interest.

Same here. KS is pretty much like watching a social experience being conducted with interesting implications for economics. Hell, I would venture that KS has defied some established definitions and conventions regarding pricing and business models. For me this is the equivalent of the physicists at the HLC waiting for results.

killer_roach wrote on Apr 29, 2012, 17:33:
I'm an economist - anything that toys with how production, supply, demand, and pricing operate is bound to capture my interest.

Ah ok, from that perspective it is novel.

Dmitri_M wrote on Apr 29, 2012, 17:30:

killer_roach wrote on Apr 29, 2012, 17:18:
That's why Kickstarter is interesting to me - not only is it a disruptive technology, it's allowing for all kinds of grand experiments.

It sounds like you're treating games like some high concept art project. I'm simply looking for a return to decent gameplay driven titles. I don't see KS as a build-up or a first step towards something "bigger". We've seen where "bigger" leads. Bigger means wide appeal and simpler titles with graphic styles and gameplay that appeal to the masses. From what I've seen the KS titles are driven by old gamers, the sorts of people current COD only playing "modern gamers" would dismiss as nerds. These people created the titles I grew up with, it's very clear to me what they aim to produce. Good new titles. Beyond that I have no expectations.

I'm an economist - anything that toys with how production, supply, demand, and pricing operate is bound to capture my interest.

killer_roach wrote on Apr 29, 2012, 17:18:
That's why Kickstarter is interesting to me - not only is it a disruptive technology, it's allowing for all kinds of grand experiments.

It sounds like you're treating games like some high concept art project. I'm simply looking for a return to decent gameplay driven titles. I don't see KS as a build-up or a first step towards something "bigger". We've seen where "bigger" leads. Bigger means wide appeal and simpler titles with graphic styles and gameplay that appeal to the masses. From what I've seen the KS titles are driven by old gamers, the sorts of people current COD only playing "modern gamers" would dismiss as nerds. These people created the titles I grew up with, it's very clear to me what they aim to produce. Good new titles. My expectations begin and end with the result of these games. Hopefully they'll turn out decent.

Dmitri_M wrote on Apr 29, 2012, 17:07:

WarpCrow wrote on Apr 29, 2012, 15:06:
In my dreams, this game will be a huge commercial success and inspire a publisher like Bethesda to invest in a big budget open world RPG. Complete freedom of character development, combined with a party system, set in the Shadowrun universe with two or three diverse cities/regions to explore, a deep, fleshed out Matrix and Astral Plane...

I think that's what we're actually going to get with the KS titles..?

I really cannot wait for the old school top down perspectives these KS titles will offer without the 3D resource heavy "open world" FPS titles dressed up as RPGs.

Really, what I like about all of these Kickstarter projects, at a variety of different approaches, is that we're seeing some fundamental re-thinking of what a development studio and a development process is. For too long, it's been a binary choice - do you want a small, simple game with little production value, or do you want a large, highly-produced title that likely skimps on content as a sacrifice to the realities of the market your publisher is having to play to? Over the last couple of years, we've seen people try to chip away at that boundary, but Kickstarter is allowing people to accelerate this process by getting word out there of what they want to do and how they plan on getting there.

Have we figured it out yet? Of course not - that's sheer hubris. However, once this first wave of titles reaches fruition, we'll see what works, what doesn't, why they did what they did, and the process will iterate.

That's why Kickstarter is interesting to me - not only is it a disruptive technology, it's allowing for all kinds of grand experiments.