Jerykk wrote on Apr 11, 2012, 01:06:Time after time you guys focus on the corporate bigwigs making profits and ignore the closed developers and failed franchises. The bigwigs are gonna make their money no matter what, that is never in doubt.
Piracy has a real effect on jobs and what is made.
To assume that piracy is the reason why studios and games fail is just silly. You'd have to ignore all the more obvious and logical factors to believe that. That said, the fundamental problem with debates about piracy is that there are no irrefutable statistics to draw upon. You can't prove or disprove the exact impact of piracy on sales. Piracy also evokes a strong ethical response and a person's moral fiber tends to be deeply ingrained. If someone believes piracy is inherently right or wrong, no amount of reasoning, logic or evidence will sway them. That's why we continue to have these exact same debates over and over and over again.
Dmitri_M wrote on Apr 10, 2012, 22:05:
I think these statements of piracy are aimed at publisher shareholders and boardrooms of spiky haired MBAs and PR people. A believable excuse for devs to explain away poor sales on the stepchild platform.
StingingVelvet wrote on Apr 11, 2012, 04:08:
Indeed, and the rate of piracy I see in the people around me gives me cause to believe it has a much greater impact than you are comfortable thinking about.
Kajetan wrote on Apr 11, 2012, 02:53:ASeven wrote on Apr 10, 2012, 21:59:And therefore we need more unbiased studies and research on that topic. Right now we can only make an educated guess about the potential influence of casual, non-commercial copyright infringement. We also have to look at cultural influences and social influences, not narrowing our view only on the economic ramifications in a small market.
in the end what we're talking about is non-commercial piracy of Bulletstorm and though commercial piracy does hurt, non-commercial piracy is a complex beast and not easily broken down into numbers.
StingingVelvet wrote on Apr 11, 2012, 04:08:Your perception may be flawed or incomplete, not considerung all facts and influences. Thats why we need hard and provable facts. To KNOW and not to ASSUME. I can assume anything i want. But when i start making laws based only on assumptions, thats when things go wrong.
Indeed, and the rate of piracy I see in the people around me gives me cause to believe it has a much greater impact than you are comfortable thinking about.
Jerykk wrote on Apr 11, 2012, 01:06:
To assume that piracy is the reason why studios and games fail is just silly. You'd have to ignore all the more obvious and logical factors to believe that. That said, the fundamental problem with debates about piracy is that there are no irrefutable statistics to draw upon. You can't prove or disprove the exact impact of piracy on sales. Piracy also evokes a strong ethical response and a person's moral fiber tends to be deeply ingrained. If someone believes piracy is inherently right or wrong, no amount of reasoning, logic or evidence will sway them. That's why we continue to have these exact same debates over and over and over again.
ASeven wrote on Apr 10, 2012, 21:59:And therefore we need more unbiased studies and research on that topic. Right now we can only make an educated guess about the potential influence of casual, non-commercial copyright infringement. We also have to look at cultural influences and social influences, not narrowing our view only on the economic ramifications in a small market.
in the end what we're talking about is non-commercial piracy of Bulletstorm and though commercial piracy does hurt, non-commercial piracy is a complex beast and not easily broken down into numbers.
Beamer wrote on Apr 10, 2012, 22:56:I know what a semi colon is, and I think I'm going to take in the people's advice now and put you on ignore now finally. Grats.
oh Jesus. Learn what a semi colon is
Time after time you guys focus on the corporate bigwigs making profits and ignore the closed developers and failed franchises. The bigwigs are gonna make their money no matter what, that is never in doubt.
Piracy has a real effect on jobs and what is made.
Bhruic wrote on Apr 10, 2012, 23:50:also, more people here need to fucking learn that when someone says "Probably" they are not stating a fact. Both sides keep saying "where do you get your numbers, douche" to shit that is clearly speculation.
Then don't be a douche? There's a difference between numbers that are likely accurate, but not backed up by hard facts, and numbers that are nothing but pure guesses. What you've done here is the latter.
Or, to put it differently, you can claim that 10% of the people who pirate games would buy them, and I could claim that 0.00001% of the people who pirate games would buy them, and there's no way either of us could be proven wrong. So why invent numbers in the first place? If you want to argue, you bring facts. If you want to speculate, well, fine, but don't expect anyone to take your argument seriously.
EricFate wrote on Apr 10, 2012, 20:15:
Why does EA find it so hard to believe that a buggy console port which contained less than eight hours worth of gameplay and one-note multiplayer that got boring after 5 rounds didn't garner many sales at their $60 dollar price point? The game was fun, but not $60 worth of fun. More like $15 worth of fun.
Eirikrautha wrote on Apr 10, 2012, 16:48:
Dear God! I've been lurking on this site for ten years, and your comment finally made me sign up!
I don't know what's worse... your faulty analogy or your appeal to it in order to support restricting human freedom! First, it wouldn't take you more than five minutes to research the "Wild" West and find out that it was far from "wild." The most homicides ever recorded in Tombstone, AZ in one year? Three (and that was so extraordinary/infamous that they have made books and movies about it ever since). How about Dodge City? Five. Deadwood? Seven. Hell, seven murders is a slow WEEKEND in Detroit!
So, you conclude, based on a false, media-driven stereotype turned analogy, that people cannot be expected to behave on the internet, so we need to regulate it?!?! Please!
also, more people here need to fucking learn that when someone says "Probably" they are not stating a fact. Both sides keep saying "where do you get your numbers, douche" to shit that is clearly speculation.
Verno wrote on Apr 10, 2012, 13:51:
A fairly lame comparison, people aren't murdering each other to steal copies of the latest Kelly Clarkson album on rapidshare. Your anecdotal account doesn't really justify internet wide censorship by corporations, many of which continue to post record profits year after year.
Has the internet made things easier to share? Sure but that's always been a problem. Sometimes that sharing is perfectly innocent, sometimes its "piracy". People love to create and we love to share. Most entertainment industries real problem with piracy was their continued obsession in fighting technological change in the face of consumer demand.
Dmitri_M wrote on Apr 10, 2012, 22:05:*DING*DING*DING*
I think these statements of piracy are aimed at publisher shareholders and boardrooms of spiky haired MBAs and PR people. A believable excuse for devs to explain away poor sales on the stepchild platform.
deqer wrote on Apr 10, 2012, 18:43:Beamer wrote on Apr 10, 2012, 17:59:That's not what this thread's title is saying.
For clarification, he's not saying piracy doomed Bulletstorm 2