StingingVelvet wrote on Apr 11, 2012, 17:20:ASeven wrote on Apr 11, 2012, 16:54:
Though you saying everyone has an agenda is hilarious since you did say earlier in this thread that the internet should be regulated by laws to fight piracy. Once someone says such enormous aberration out of their mouths anything else they may say on the current discussion is rendered moot and worthless. The whole internet didn't fight SOPA and PIPA and now ACTA just because they were in a mood.
I didn't say it should be, I said it will be, which makes sense overall because things always go down this way. And I didn't say any current model is right or proper.
As for the whole internet fighting it, 90% were sheep. Most of them didn't even have a clue it only applied to foreign based websites, they were all saying youtube was gonna fall.
Anyway, my main point is that when people take advantage of freedoms to do shit that hurts those in power creating jobs the government is gonna smack that freedom down. Happens over and over and over again.
Chromius wrote on Apr 11, 2012, 17:23:
So now we are flagrantly abusing our freedom? Whoa back the train up, so that means we need to have our freedom removed because of other peoples flagrant abuse. There is a loophole in everything yet when its abuse by a small amount it equals our freedom removed. A person shoots someone with a gun it an excuse to start a vendetta to take away gun rights.
Hey the rich use and abuse loopholes in a great many things do you see their freedoms being removed? Or any Bills or Laws passed to rein it in. We lose our freedom whenever the wealthy or govt feels insecure about its hold on domination and or mostly greed. Like profit loopholes to not pay billions or even a trillion in taxes and we are worried about pirating a 20 dollar console port. lol. Yes Congress please convene so we can pass a new Bill.
StingingVelvet wrote on Apr 11, 2012, 13:30:
I don't really see how it's different from any other cause of regulation. Sure big companies push it for money reasons, but in the end they can only do so because people are so flagrantly abusive of the freedom offered.
Pretty much every regulation comes from similar abuses.
Prez wrote on Apr 11, 2012, 16:27:Everyone has a fucking agenda. Everyone.
So... what's yours?
ASeven wrote on Apr 11, 2012, 16:54:
Though you saying everyone has an agenda is hilarious since you did say earlier in this thread that the internet should be regulated by laws to fight piracy. Once someone says such enormous aberration out of their mouths anything else they may say on the current discussion is rendered moot and worthless. The whole internet didn't fight SOPA and PIPA and now ACTA just because they were in a mood.
StingingVelvet wrote on Apr 11, 2012, 16:21:ASeven wrote on Apr 11, 2012, 14:41:
That kind of idiotic shit, making up fake data without any evidence whatsoever, turns you into a fucking apologist. Want to gain respect from everyone here? Stop making shit up to defend a decaying industry, it's that simple.
And the people on the other side aren't doing the same exact thing, disregarding piracy and acting like it's not a big deal so that the companies always look wrong?
Everyone has a fucking agenda. Everyone.
Prez wrote on Apr 11, 2012, 16:11:You know, trolls and corporate lapdogs inflating posts with fallacies everywhere, rational people offering logical responses, cycle repeats. That and people are pissed for the piracy card being used again on the same phrase they say the PC port was not that good.
You could have just said 'Beamer'. Biggest troll on the site. Truthfully I am not really interested in any more debate about piracy. While it is an utterly insignificant factor in how well a title performs, publishers and their shills will continue to use it as the go-to crutch to point to when their flawed, poorly marketed game sells like crap. That's not going to change. Been there, done that, yadda yadda yadda.
ASeven wrote on Apr 11, 2012, 14:41:
That kind of idiotic shit, making up fake data without any evidence whatsoever, turns you into a fucking apologist. Want to gain respect from everyone here? Stop making shit up to defend a decaying industry, it's that simple.
You know, trolls and corporate lapdogs inflating posts with fallacies everywhere, rational people offering logical responses, cycle repeats. That and people are pissed for the piracy card being used again on the same phrase they say the PC port was not that good.
Speculation is based upon assumption
Beamer wrote on Apr 11, 2012, 14:07:ASeven wrote on Apr 10, 2012, 10:55:
And Beamer once again being the fucking industry apologetic. No surprises there either.
What baffles me here is that I don't get how what I'm saying makes me an apologist.
To break down my points:
1) Piracy is not a good thing
2) Piracy leads to lost sales
3) Piracy is inevitable
4) Piracy does not break many games, if any
5) Piracy estimates should possibly be built into sales estimates, but more likely don't need to be as it's kind of independent
6) Developers hate piracy from an emotional standpoint and their opinions about piracy aren't always rational for that reason, much like a parent often doesn't react rationally to a child being picked on by another child
Somehow this is apologizing, most likely because you seem to think piracy leads to higher revenues.
ASeven wrote on Apr 10, 2012, 10:55:
And Beamer once again being the fucking industry apologetic. No surprises there either.
StingingVelvet wrote on Apr 11, 2012, 13:30:
I don't really see how it's different from any other cause of regulation. Sure big companies push it for money reasons, but in the end they can only do so because people are so flagrantly abusive of the freedom offered.
Pretty much every regulation comes from similar abuses.
Bhruic wrote on Apr 11, 2012, 12:51:
I'm not the only one people are doing it to. Others are putting their own speculation out there as discussion points. How about challenging it with your own speculation rather than stupidly acting like it's being stated as fact?
There's nothing wrong with speculation. There's something wrong with baseless speculation. When you said "If a game is pirated a million times I think it's safe to say that's 100,000 lost sales.", you had nothing to back that up with. You were just making up figures out of thin air.
If I were to say "I think 98% of pirates donate to animal shelters", I'd really hope that you would think I'm in no position to make claims about what 98% of pirates would do. In the same way, you are in no position to make claims about what 10% of pirates would do.Speculation is meant to be debated.
Lies, damn lies, and statistics. Which category did your fall into again? There's no point debating made-up numbers, because they are just that - made-up.Just look at how many people think Mike Capps said "PC piracy canceled Bulletstorm 2" when he never actually said that
Ok, I looked. One person. And even that is a bit of a stretch of what they actually said.He said low sales canceled Bulletstorm. He also said piracy lowered PC sales.
Really, and connecting the dots is too much for you? If they aren't making a sequel because of low sales, and piracy lowered sales, then at least part of the reason they aren't making a sequel is because of piracy. That doesn't mean it's the only reason, but you'd have to be truly clueless to believe that he's not suggesting it's a significant factor.
Verno wrote on Apr 11, 2012, 09:11:StingingVelvet wrote on Apr 11, 2012, 04:08:
Indeed, and the rate of piracy I see in the people around me gives me cause to believe it has a much greater impact than you are comfortable thinking about.
No one really has a problem with that, it's when people start talking about censoring the entire internet because the audience "cant be responsible" that becomes borderline self parody.
Prez wrote on Apr 11, 2012, 13:08:
I was very surprised at how enjoyable the game was for me. It wasn't the most memorable game ever, had a ton of console concessions, and it was just as lazily ported as most all other games, and yet I found the game fun. Lots of neat ideas going on.
What really got me in here, though, was a genuine curiosity about what in the world about this news warrants a 200-post thread.
I'm not the only one people are doing it to. Others are putting their own speculation out there as discussion points. How about challenging it with your own speculation rather than stupidly acting like it's being stated as fact?
Speculation is meant to be debated.
Just look at how many people think Mike Capps said "PC piracy canceled Bulletstorm 2" when he never actually said that
He said low sales canceled Bulletstorm. He also said piracy lowered PC sales.